Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Well we've certainly successfully convinced business to adopt open source. To the point that they make open source for everyday computer users seem insignificant by comparison. Christine Hall Publisher & Editor FOSS Force: Keeping tech free http://fossforce.com On 7/3/19 8:55 PM, John Cowan wr

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

I 100% agree. I'll point to Red Hat, SUSE, and Nextcloud as shining examples. Christine Hall Publisher & Editor FOSS Force: Keeping tech free http://fossforce.com On 7/3/19 7:42 PM, VanL wrote: Hi Christine, Don't paint with too broad a brush. I understand your concern - open source is not a

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Yup. If something like the cloud comes along and suddenly an open source business plan that was working isn't working, that means you'll have to figure out a way to change your business plan to deal with the changing sand beneath your feet. Christine Hall Publisher & Editor FOSS Force: Keeping

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Thanks John for having an accurate memory! On Thu, Jul 4, 2019 at 1:56 AM John Cowan wrote: > There was a time when the OSI believed that the more licenses the merrier, > as long as they all complied with the OSD. At that time we were trying to > encourage companies to release their code as FLO

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

There was a time when the OSI believed that the more licenses the merrier, as long as they all complied with the OSD. At that time we were trying to encourage companies to release their code as FLOSS, no matter what annoying conditions they put on it. Only later did the costs to both developers a

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 7:43 PM VanL wrote: > > Hi Christine, > > there are businesses and business plan that are fully aligned with the goals > of the community. Which ones? Thanks, James ___ License-discuss mailing list License-discuss@lists.opensou

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Hi Christine, Don't paint with too broad a brush. I understand your concern - open source is not a business plan! - but there are businesses and business plan that are fully aligned with the goals of the community. Thanks, Van __ Van Lindberg van.lindb...@gmail.com m: 214

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 3:43 PM Christine Hall wrote: > It's vendors/developers seeking enterprise customers who want to continue > calling their software open source, but be able to use non open source > restrictions because their business plan doesn't work. That's correct. And one point I make

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

It's my understanding that OSI has always campaigned against license proliferation. Christine Hall Publisher & Editor FOSS Force: Keeping tech free http://fossforce.com On 7/3/19 5:29 PM, James wrote: On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 5:17 PM Bruce Perens wrote: James, I understand the problem of the

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On second thought, it's not the enterprise, or enterprise users, who want restrictive licenses. It's vendors/developers seeking enterprise customers who want to continue calling their software open source, but be able to use non open source restrictions because their business plan doesn't work.

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Yup. And don't blame open source for your business plan. Christine Hall Publisher & Editor FOSS Force: Keeping tech free http://fossforce.com On 7/3/19 5:05 PM, Bruce Perens via License-discuss wrote: On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:00 PM Christine Hall > wrote: as

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 5:17 PM Bruce Perens wrote: > > James, I understand the problem of the companies pushing for that, but a > license that everyone can use except Amazon, or SaaS companies, or SaaS > companies over a certain size, isn't copyleft and isn't "strong" copyleft. > It's just rest

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

James, I understand the problem of the companies pushing for that, but a license that everyone can use except Amazon, or SaaS companies, or SaaS companies over a certain size, isn't copyleft and isn't "strong" copyleft. It's just restrictive. Heather and Kyle came up with "Polyform", which IMO soun

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 5:06 PM Bruce Perens via License-discuss wrote: > > On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:00 PM Christine Hall wrote: >> >> as long as there are permissive licenses, the enterprise is quite happy >> with the way things are. > > > Well, obviously, it's restrictive licenses they want fr

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:00 PM Christine Hall wrote: > as long as there are permissive licenses, the enterprise is quite happy > with the way things are. Well, obviously, it's *restrictive *licenses they want from us now. And they can have them from Polyform and co., we don't and can't restric

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Agreed! And OSI must never see its job as helping grease the wheels of commerce. There are other open source foundations doing that all too well, thank you. Besides, I think that as long as there are permissive licenses, the enterprise is quite happy with the way things are. Christine Hall Pub

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 12:20 PM Scott Peterson wrote: > Helping lawyers is one thing; the OSI does this. > License creation efficiency maximization is another; a trade association > might do this. > Yes. Having an organization that efficiently approved Open Source licenses until there were hundr

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

On 2019-07-03 1:34 p.m., Scott Peterson wrote: If the Open Source Initiative was a trade association tasked with providing efficient, clear determinations of what did and did not conform to some standard that had been agreed among competitors in an industry, then it would be important for the

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

I have failed to communicate my point clearly enough. I am not saying that OSI is precluded from any particular helpful-to-lawyers activity. Helping lawyers can very well be valuable to the OSI. It's a matter of how choices are made as to what actions OSI decides to undertake. Unlike what a trade

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Van, The by-laws give OSI a great deal of latitude to determine what it wishes to do, and how. I can think of very many ways in which it might help attorneys craft Open Source licenses, for example by running a training program. It is certainly not required to select any particular method. Th

Re: [License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

Respectfully, I disagree. The purposes of the OSI, per the bylaws, are: Section 2. *SPECIFIC PURPOSES.* Within the context of the general purposes stated above, this corporation shall: (1) educate the public about the advantages of open source software; (2) encourage the software community to part

[License-discuss] OSI is not a trade association

If the Open Source Initiative was a trade association tasked with providing efficient, clear determinations of what did and did not conform to some standard that had been agreed among competitors in an industry, then it would be important for the organization to have detailed processes by which det