On 16/05/25 02:22, Justin Zobel wrote:
[...]
Using a mobile phone cannot be compared to the power used by data
centres to train AI in the slightest.
Just straight off the top of my head, your phone and computer
automatically go to sleep by default. Servers do not.
It's also a matter of h
On 26/05/25 20:52, Christoph Cullmann wrote:
Hi,
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/syntax-highlighting/-/merge_requests/698
would still benefit from some input on how to proceed in this very
concrete case.
I see it pragmatically - it just another "tool" that helps you to
generate/auto-comp
El dilluns, 26 de maig del 2025, a les 20:52:26 (Hora d’estiu d’Europa
central), Christoph Cullmann va escriure:
> Hi,
>
> https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/syntax-highlighting/-/merge_requests/698
>
> would still benefit from some input on how to proceed in this very concrete
> case.
Google cl
Hi,
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/syntax-highlighting/-/merge_requests/698
would still benefit from some input on how to proceed in this very concrete
case.
Greetings
Christoph
On Sunday, May 18th, 2025 at 16:56, Christoph Cullmann
wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
> On Sunday, May 18th, 2025 at 09
Sorry for swooping in this conversation as a regular contributor.
>> From my understanding (what others have told me), AI generally does not
>> produce good quality code though. So how is that a benefit to society?
>
> Well, in that case, those “others” are using them wrong or are just spreading
On 19/05/2025 19:15, Ilya Bizyaev wrote:
On Monday, May 19th, 2025 at 02:34, Justin Zobel wrote:
On 18/05/2025 16:41, Albert Vaca Cintora wrote:
On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code
that was used to generate t
On Montag, 19. Mai 2025 07:48:42 Mitteleuropäische Sommerzeit Justin Zobel
wrote:
> On 19/05/2025 15:01, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
> > Another example is I had to rewrite some project from one language to
> > another at work. This is tedious task, so I similarly used AI to
> > create a scratch,
On Monday, May 19, 2025 02:51:37 AM Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> Ingo's suggestions to train a model with KDE code might help. But of
> course to train a model will need a huge lot of resources according to
> what I know.
From the peanut gallery:
I know very little about training an AI, but, from
On Mon, May 19, 2025, at 11:45, Ilya Bizyaev wrote:
> If you really care about the licensing aspect, focus on it instead of
> diverting this thread into other topics with statements like this one.
I strongly agree with this statement. "AI" as a term is a nothing-burger, it
needs to be broken dow
On Monday, May 19th, 2025 at 02:34, Justin Zobel wrote:
> On 18/05/2025 16:41, Albert Vaca Cintora wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
> >
> > > If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code that was
> > > used to generate the code, then it's lite
Akseli Lahtinen 于2025年5月19日周一 16:14写道：
> My original point is to try to get rid of the low-hanging fruit, as in
> people who spam bug reports with obviously "AI" generated things.
I'm basically with you. That's why I began my first reply with "I
assume this doesn't include...", i.e. just a casual
On 19/05/2025 15:28, Jin Liu wrote:
Justin Zobel 于2025年5月19日周一 13:52写道：
I understand that it makes everything easier. That doesn't matter in the
slightest when you cannot verify the original license of the code allows you to
use said code or that the license is compatible with KDE.
I don't th
On Monday 19 May 2025 10:26:19 Eastern European Summer Time Jin Liu wrote:
> Martin Steigerwald 于2025年5月19日周一 14:56写道：
>
> > Everyone: I suggest to assume good intentions.
>
> My suggestion is to avoid making assessments on "people", and focus on
> code or legal or other aspects.
>
> - Jin Liu
Martin Steigerwald 于2025年5月19日周一 14:56写道：
> Everyone: I suggest to assume good intentions.
My suggestion is to avoid making assessments on "people", and focus on
code or legal or other aspects.
- Jin Liu
On Sunday, 18 May 2025 09:11:35 Central European Summer Time Albert Vaca
Cintora wrote:
> On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
> > If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code that was
> > used to generate the code, then it's literally gambling that this code
> > wasn'
Hi.
Jin Liu - 19.05.25, 07:58:50 CEST:
> > It's clear a lot of people don't care about theft or the environment
> > and are happy to use AI without thinking about the true impact.
>
> Insult taken. Is that KDE's official stance that because I use AI in
> coding, so "I don't care about theft or the
On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 15:18 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
>
>
>
>
> On 19/05/2025 15:01, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
>
> >
> > On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 14:53 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 19/05/2025 14:35, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
Hi.
Justin Zobel - 19.05.25, 07:52:05 CEST:
> I understand that it makes everything easier. That doesn't matter in the
> slightest when you cannot verify the original license of the code
> allows you to use said code or that the license is compatible with KDE.
>
> What this all boils down to, is
Justin Zobel 于2025年5月19日周一 13:52写道：
> I understand that it makes everything easier. That doesn't matter in the
> slightest when you cannot verify the original license of the code allows you
> to use said code or that the license is compatible with KDE.
I don't think a few (<10) lines of code ar
On 19/05/2025 15:10, Jin Liu wrote:
Justin Zobel 于2025年5月19日周一 08:34写道：
From my understanding (what others have told me), AI generally does not
produce good quality code though. So how is that a benefit to society?
From my personal experience (what I, not others, have personally used
Github
On 19/05/2025 15:01, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 14:53 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
On 19/05/2025 14:35, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 10:03 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
On 18/05/2025 16:41, Albert Vaca Cintora wrote:
On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justi
Justin Zobel 于2025年5月19日周一 08:34写道：
> From my understanding (what others have told me), AI generally does not
> produce good quality code though. So how is that a benefit to society?
>From my personal experience (what I, not others, have personally used
Github Copilot for months), AI makes codin
On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 14:53 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
>
> On 19/05/2025 14:35, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
>
> >
> > On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 10:03 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 18/05/2025 16:41, Albert Vaca Cintora wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
On 19/05/2025 14:35, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 10:03 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
On 18/05/2025 16:41, Albert Vaca Cintora wrote:
On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code that
was used to generate the
On Mon, 2025-05-19 at 10:03 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
>
> On 18/05/2025 16:41, Albert Vaca Cintora wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code
> > > that was used
On 19/05/2025 05:02, Ingo Klöcker wrote:
On Sonntag, 18. Mai 2025 16:52:00 Mitteleuropäische Sommerzeit Christoph
Cullmann wrote:
On Sunday, May 18th, 2025 at 09:12, Albert Vaca Cintora
wrote:
On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) o
On 18/05/2025 16:41, Albert Vaca Cintora wrote:
On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code that
was used to generate the code, then it's literally gambling that
this code wasn't taken from another project by Gemini a
Hi,
>
>
> On Sonntag, 18. Mai 2025 16:52:00 Mitteleuropäische Sommerzeit Christoph
> Cullmann wrote:
>
> > On Sunday, May 18th, 2025 at 09:12, Albert Vaca Cintora
>
> albertv...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > > On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, jus...@1707.io wrote:
> > >
> > > > If the
On Sonntag, 18. Mai 2025 16:52:00 Mitteleuropäische Sommerzeit Christoph
Cullmann wrote:
> On Sunday, May 18th, 2025 at 09:12, Albert Vaca Cintora
wrote:
> > On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
> > > If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code that was
> > > used t
Hi,
On Sunday, May 18th, 2025 at 09:00, Justin Zobel wrote:
> On 17/05/2025 01:40, Christoph Cullmann wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > just as a concrete example: what to do with
> >
> > https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/syntax-highlighting/-/merge_requests/698
> >
> > That is no AI spam but so
Hi,
On Sunday, May 18th, 2025 at 09:12, Albert Vaca Cintora
wrote:
> On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
>
> > If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code that was used
> > to generate the code, then it's literally gambling that this code wasn't
> > taken fro
Hello,
I don't know if it was mentioned, but there are already rules for this.
"Think Twice before Committing"
and
"Don't commit code you don't understand"
https://community.kde.org/Policies/Commit_Policy
Best regards,
Juraj
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Justin Zobel 于2025年5月18日周日 15:03写道：
> I would even be for adding a checkbox in the Merge Request template requiring
> users to declare that no AI was used in this contribution. The same can go in
> the Bugzilla tickets.
>
> Justin
Well, I hereby declare that AI (Github Copilot specifically) was
On Sun, 18 May 2025, 08:59 Justin Zobel, wrote:
> If the contributor cannot tell you the license(s) of the code that was
> used to generate the code, then it's literally gambling that this code
> wasn't taken from another project by Gemini and used without their
> permission or used in a way that
On 17/05/2025 02:20, Nate Graham wrote:
you skillfully adapted or re-wrote its output using your human brain
to fit the context, then the result was fine and no policy could
prevent this, so that part is sort of moot IMO.
It still possibly contains code that is against KDE's licenses. And if
On 17/05/2025 01:40, Christoph Cullmann wrote:
Hi,
just as a concrete example: what to do with
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/syntax-highlighting/-/merge_requests/698
That is no AI spam but something that doesn't look broken and the submitter did
do manual work.
Can I now accept that just
Nate Graham 于2025年5月17日周六 00:50写道：
> This is a complex topic that could go on for ages.
If this is a complex (social / political) topic, (and from the length
of this discussion, it obviously is), then "not taking a (firm /
aggressive) stance" is just what I feel KDE might do in contrast to
some "
On Freitag, 16. Mai 2025 18:10:11 Mitteleuropäische Sommerzeit Christoph
Cullmann wrote:
> Hi,
>
> just as a concrete example: what to do with
>
> https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/syntax-highlighting/-/merge_requests/698
>
> That is no AI spam but something that doesn't look broken and the sub
On Friday 16 May 2025 19:50:14 Eastern European Summer Time Nate Graham wrote:
> This is a complex topic that could go on for ages.
>
> For me, if I can tell you used AI for something, it's because the result
> wasn't good, and had that "obviously AI" flavor to it. You wasted both
> of our time an
This is a complex topic that could go on for ages.
For me, if I can tell you used AI for something, it's because the result
wasn't good, and had that "obviously AI" flavor to it. You wasted both
of our time and some of the planet's resources.
For this reason, we already have written guidance
Hi,
just as a concrete example: what to do with
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/syntax-highlighting/-/merge_requests/698
That is no AI spam but something that doesn't look broken and the submitter did
do manual work.
Can I now accept that just as MIT?
Greetings
Christoph
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Hi.
Justin Zobel - 16.05.25, 02:22:54 CEST:
> The way I see it, AI has three main problems, legal, ethical and
> environmental.
I just want to throw in an impression I had when reading through posts of
this discussion – more as a bystander:
It seemingly went pro and contra in kind of a loop. Ei
On 16/05/2025 19:42, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Fri, 2025-05-16 at 09:52 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
On 16/05/2025 00:48, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Fri, 2025-05-16 at 00:29 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
Ethical issues aside, AI has other impacts as well, most notably
environmental via
On Fri, 2025-05-16 at 09:52 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
> On 16/05/2025 00:48, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
> > On Fri, 2025-05-16 at 00:29 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
> > > Ethical issues aside, AI has other impacts as well, most notably
> > > environmental via the huge amounts of energy required t
On 16/05/2025 00:48, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Fri, 2025-05-16 at 00:29 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
On 15/05/2025 23:57, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Thu, 2025-05-15 at 16:09 +0200, Felix Ernst wrote:
Late reply, but I also wanted to mention that I am 100% in
support of
On Thu, May 15, 2025, at 9:28 PM, Alexander Potashev wrote:
> Hi Benson, (everyone,)
>
>> Code contributions made using AI trained on unknown data is problematic.
>
> Is this purely a legal/intellectual property concern?
>
This is a concern. People have pointed out others.
>
> If we can gene
Hi Benson, (everyone,)
> Code contributions made using AI trained on unknown data is problematic.
Is this purely a legal/intellectual property concern?
If we can generalize this concern as
"a contributor submits code incompatible with the project's license,
thus breaching the license"
, n
I think KDE developers shouldn`t use AI
чт, 15 мая 2025 г. в 17:39, Benson Muite :
>
> Code contributions made using AI trained on unknown data is problematic.
> KDE does also create a lot of data that could be used to improve KDE. It
> may be good to see if AI or ML tools could use some of this
On Fri, 2025-05-16 at 00:29 +0930, Justin Zobel wrote:
>
> On 15/05/2025 23:57, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
>
>
> >
> > On Thu, 2025-05-15 at 16:09 +0200, Felix Ernst wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Late reply, but I also wanted to mention that I am 100% in
> > > support of
> > > a
May 15, 2025 09:10:39 Felix Ernst :
> I wouldn't even mind if we went one step further and actively promoted e.g.
> Plasma as "free of AI". This does not need to be fully true, but this would
> be more of an activism and marketing angle I would like to see. There is a
> good chance though that
On 15/05/2025 23:57, Konstantin Kharlamov wrote:
On Thu, 2025-05-15 at 16:09 +0200, Felix Ernst wrote:
Late reply, but I also wanted to mention that I am 100% in support of
any anit-AI messaging and policies we might choose.
The wording as linked by Akseli in their first post seems like a goo
Code contributions made using AI trained on unknown data is problematic. KDE
does also create a lot of data that could be used to improve KDE. It may be
good to see if AI or ML tools could use some of this data to improve KDE in an
ethical manner.
On Thu, May 15, 2025, at 5:09 PM, Felix Erns
On Thu, 2025-05-15 at 16:09 +0200, Felix Ernst wrote:
>
>
>
> Late reply, but I also wanted to mention that I am 100% in support of
> any anit-AI messaging and policies we might choose.
>
> The wording as linked by Akseli in their first post seems like a good
> starting point in that regard:
>
Late reply, but I also wanted to mention that I am 100% in support of any
anit-AI messaging and policies we might choose.
The wording as linked by Akseli in their first post seems like a good starting
point in that regard:
>Other projects have already done something similar, see for example
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