On Thu, Nov 03, 2005 at 08:34:21AM -0500, Nathan L. Adams wrote:
> Almost all of them publish 'errata'. That is why I suggest a single
> place for all technical info such as the recent apache upgrade:
>
> http://errata.gentoo.org/
>
> i.e. Upgrade/migration stuff would go there as opposed to 'fre
Thierry Carrez wrote:
But it's a good idea to have some kind of automatic replication of
frontpage announcements to gentoo-announce and the forums, this will
help getting important messages through. However, I'm not sure *all*
frontpage contents should get replicated to gentoo-announce and the
fo
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Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Tue, 2005-11-01 at 12:11 +0900, pclouds wrote:
>
>>Just curious how other distros deliver important news to their users?
>
>
> Red Hat has you subscribe to RHN, which sends you errata based on your
> installed configurat
Hello. First time posting; hope the message isn't ugly.
Anyway, from a generic point of view, I think the different suggestions
mentioned are all nice. One argument that seems to have cropped up in the latter
messages regards those users who do not keep up with news, break their system
and then cr
On Tuesday 01 November 2005 15:29, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Tue, 2005-11-01 at 03:21 +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > On Tue, 1 Nov 2005 12:11:37 +0900 pclouds <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > | Just curious how other distros deliver important news to their
> > | users?
> >
> > By sticking out a
On Tue, 2005-11-01 at 03:21 +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Tue, 1 Nov 2005 12:11:37 +0900 pclouds <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> | Just curious how other distros deliver important news to their users?
>
> By sticking out a new "everything is incompatible" release once or
> twice a year.
Yeah, t
On Tue, 2005-11-01 at 12:11 +0900, pclouds wrote:
> Just curious how other distros deliver important news to their users?
Red Hat has you subscribe to RHN, which sends you errata based on your
installed configuration. When you add packages via up2date, Red Hat
knows.
Others just use mailing list
On Tue, 1 Nov 2005 12:11:37 +0900 pclouds <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
| Just curious how other distros deliver important news to their users?
By sticking out a new "everything is incompatible" release once or
twice a year.
--
Ciaran McCreesh : Gentoo Developer (Vim, Shell tools, Fluxbox, Cron)
Ma
Just curious how other distros deliver important news to their users?
On 10/30/05, Chris White <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It has made somewhat painfully obvious as of late as to the lack of a
> centralized source of updates for users. This has recently become true
> moreso with the apache2 conf
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Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 01:42 +, Stuart Herbert wrote:
>
>>There is *only one time* we can guarantee that we'll have a user's
>>attention. That's right after the message that tells a user how many
>>CONFIG_PROTECT files th
On Monday 31 October 2005 09:17 am, Lance Albertson wrote:
> Implementing --news will take time. Implementing more news on our site
> now takes little work and can be easily done. Outside of these two
> options, what is better? I'd say a constant reminder in the GWN would be
> helpful. Maybe we cou
On Mon, Oct 31, 2005 at 03:56:08PM -0500, Dave Shanker wrote:
> What about Portage auto generating a upgrade file
> (/usr/portage/notices (like it does with it's cache) and then
> providing a notice at the end of an emerge than lets the user know
> it's there and how to read it. We could even provi
Hi,
On 10/31/05, Dave Shanker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What about Portage auto generating a upgrade file
> (/usr/portage/notices (like it does with it's cache) and then
> providing a notice at the end of an emerge than lets the user know
> it's there and how to read it. We could even provide a
On Monday 31 October 2005 21:07, David Morgan wrote:
> Why not log all the e{info,warn}s into a file, and then tell the user
> about them at the end of the emerge (in the same way they are told about
> changes in /etc)? Said file should then be safe to delete if desired.
>
> Mailing this info inste
What about Portage auto generating a upgrade file
(/usr/portage/notices (like it does with it's cache) and then
providing a notice at the end of an emerge than lets the user know
it's there and how to read it. We could even provide a switch in
portage to read the file and display the notices (emerg
On 19:05 Mon 31 Oct , Stuart Herbert wrote:
> > Maybe we could add a big news warning in the next minor portage
> > update that when you tells you about the new news features (perhaps a
> > big einfo after you upgrade.
>
> The problems of einfo messages not reaching our users have been well
>
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 19:07 +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> So that every user will be spammed with news items about PHP changes,
> even if they don't use PHP?
Only if I can spam you twice :P
Best regards,
Stu
--
Stuart Herbert [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Gentoo Dev
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 19:03 +, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 19:55:40 +0100 Xavier Neys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> | Simon Stelling wrote:
> | > Reading gentoo-announce should be mandatory. If a user breaks his
> | > system because he didn't know about an important fact due to
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 19:55 +0100, Xavier Neys wrote:
> Number of users subscribed to gentoo-announce: 7,988
> Total number of GETs on our home page and news feed in a *single day*: 75,302
> from 19,240 different IPs (on Sunday 2005-10-30).
Do you have any *useful* stats for www.g.o, like the num
Stuart Herbert wrote:
Hi,
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 18:11 +0100, Simon Stelling wrote:
Doesn't make much sense to me. The biggest benefit from --news over other,
traditional channels would be that it's linked to the tree, meaning, if you
emerge a new kernel version which doesn't contain devfs any
On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 18:56:19 + Stuart Herbert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
| You're talking about a reactive news system, telling users about the
| consequences of their actions. I'm after a pro-active news system,
| telling users about what will change, so that they have the
| information they
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 11:17 -0600, Lance Albertson wrote:
> Implementing --news will take time.
It'll take time to get a Portage release out which supports this
functionality, sure. Implementing the functionality wouldn't take very
long at all.
> Implementing more news on our site
> now takes l
On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 19:55:40 +0100 Xavier Neys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
| Simon Stelling wrote:
| > Reading gentoo-announce should be mandatory. If a user breaks his
| > system because he didn't know about an important fact due to his
| > lazyness, that's not our problem. Of course they will stil
Hi,
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 18:11 +0100, Simon Stelling wrote:
> Doesn't make much sense to me. The biggest benefit from --news over other,
> traditional channels would be that it's linked to the tree, meaning, if you
> emerge a new kernel version which doesn't contain devfs anymore, the ebuild
>
Simon Stelling wrote:
Reading gentoo-announce should be mandatory. If a user breaks his system
because he didn't know about an important fact due to his lazyness,
that's not our problem. Of course they will still bitch, so let's
introduce RESOLVED RTF_ML_.
Number of users subscribed to gentoo
Stuart Herbert wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 08:40 -0600, Lance Albertson wrote:
>
>>>Well, I think that if users knew that information would be on these
>>>places, they might actually check them. Currently, little to no
>>>information ever makes it to either of these locations, so users never
>
Hi,
Stuart Herbert wrote:
It would be great if emerge --news displayed the same news as www.g.o.
Doesn't make much sense to me. The biggest benefit from --news over other,
traditional channels would be that it's linked to the tree, meaning, if you
emerge a new kernel version which doesn't co
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 08:40 -0600, Lance Albertson wrote:
> > Well, I think that if users knew that information would be on these
> > places, they might actually check them. Currently, little to no
> > information ever makes it to either of these locations, so users never
> > bother to check them.
Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 01:42 +, Stuart Herbert wrote:
>
>>There is *only one time* we can guarantee that we'll have a user's
>>attention. That's right after the message that tells a user how many
>>CONFIG_PROTECT files they need to fix by running etc-update.
>
>
> I
Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Sun, 2005-10-30 at 16:42 +0900, Chris White wrote:
>
>>3) I think it would be a good idea for gentoo-announce to also include front
>>page announcements. This would work well for people that are more email
>>oriented (they use email a lot for business) and would kee
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 01:42 +, Stuart Herbert wrote:
> There is *only one time* we can guarantee that we'll have a user's
> attention. That's right after the message that tells a user how many
> CONFIG_PROTECT files they need to fix by running etc-update.
I definitely like the --news idea.
>
On Sun, 2005-10-30 at 10:06 +0100, Wernfried Haas wrote:
> 4) Forums. We have the News and Announcements box on the forums and we
>will set sticky threads upon request. In fact we even stick threads
>and posts announcements if we encounter something worth mentioning
>in our opinion. Sin
On Sun, 2005-10-30 at 16:42 +0900, Chris White wrote:
> 3) I think it would be a good idea for gentoo-announce to also include front
> page announcements. This would work well for people that are more email
> oriented (they use email a lot for business) and would keep things
> centralized for t
Sven Vermeulen wrote:
On Sun, Oct 30, 2005 at 04:52:39PM +0100, Thierry Carrez wrote:
The reason why the front page and the gentoo-announce ML (the two
official media for Gentoo -> users information) are under-used is that
approximately 5% of the developers know how to post to them. We should
p
On Sun, Oct 30, 2005 at 04:52:39PM +0100, Thierry Carrez wrote:
> The reason why the front page and the gentoo-announce ML (the two
> official media for Gentoo -> users information) are under-used is that
> approximately 5% of the developers know how to post to them. We should
> probably make them
On Mon, 2005-10-31 at 13:24 +0900, Chris White wrote:
> To be technical, neither will emerge --news. None of the solutions presented
> here will be a 100% effective means of resolving the problem. There will
> always be the one user that doesn't want to listen, and will complain at is.
> What
On Monday 31 October 2005 10:42, Stuart Herbert wrote:
[snip]
> Some of those who hold the keys to those places have actively resisted
> this in the past. Personally, I don't think the front page or
> gentoo-announce will reach many more users than the Forums et al already
> do.
Yes it will, be
Hi,
On Sun, 2005-10-30 at 16:52 +0100, Thierry Carrez wrote:
> Random thoughts about this important subject...
>
> Yes, there is a need to push non-obvious upgrade information to our
> users, and no, we can't rely on the GWN alone to convey that "official"
> message.
We can't rely on it *at all*
Qian Qiao wrote:
>/signed, :)
>
>The emerge --news is quite worth considering, and on p.g.o, stuart
>mentioned having emerge to produce outputs like this after a sync:
>
>
># emerge sync
>
>
>* Important: 3 config files in /etc need updating.
>* Type emerge --help config to learn how to update con
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Thierry Carrez wrote:
| But it's a good idea to have some kind of automatic replication of
| frontpage announcements to gentoo-announce and the forums, this will
| help getting important messages through. However, I'm not sure *all*
| frontpage conten
On 10/30/05, Michiel de Bruijne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Sunday 30 October 2005 10:06, Wernfried Haas wrote:
> > 4) Forums. We have the News and Announcements box on the forums and we
> >will set sticky threads upon request. In fact we even stick threads
> >and posts announcements if
On Sunday 30 October 2005 10:06, Wernfried Haas wrote:
> 4) Forums. We have the News and Announcements box on the forums and we
>will set sticky threads upon request. In fact we even stick threads
>and posts announcements if we encounter something worth mentioning
>in our opinion. Since
Chris White wrote:
> It has made somewhat painfully obvious as of late as to the lack of a
> centralized source of updates for users. This has recently become true
> moreso with the apache2 config file changes and the step to php5.
Random thoughts about this important subject...
Yes, there is
4) Forums. We have the News and Announcements box on the forums and we
will set sticky threads upon request. In fact we even stick threads
and posts announcements if we encounter something worth mentioning
in our opinion. Since we may not notice everything feel free to
contact us in cas
It has made somewhat painfully obvious as of late as to the lack of a
centralized source of updates for users. This has recently become true
moreso with the apache2 config file changes and the step to php5. A couple
of things I'd like to bring out:
1) Currently, our gentoo.org front page is v
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