Colin D Bennett wrote:
>> "mask" has nowhere near the same information content. IMHO, it
>> is not worth the space savings. Maybe "s.mask" would be better?
>
> Perhaps it would be best to make the displayed name of the solder mask
> layer a user preference.
+1
Just treat it as any other layer
On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 9:47 AM, Peter Clifton wrote:
>> Often I want to see one layer alone, so it would be convenient to be
>> able to hide all and then show a single layer, using just 2 clicks.
>> In your example artwork there are 14 layers, going from all visible to
>> just one visible would
On Mon, 2011-08-22 at 23:45 -0700, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 20, 2011 at 04:41:05PM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> > Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> Relatedly, why do we let the user select the 'rats' layer?
> Can you actually draw with it?
You can draw new connections between components an
On Tue, 2011-08-23 at 10:36 +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
> A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> > On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 09:52:19AM +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
> >> A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> >> * Hide all layers button
> >>
> >> * Show all layers button
> >
On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 02:41:53 -0700
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 02:22:25AM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> > Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> >
> > > I have implemented the italicized/separated
> > > suggestion. You can see it here:
> > >
> > > http://www.wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump
On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 10:36:33 +1000
Stephen Ecob wrote:
> A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> > On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 09:52:19AM +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
> >> A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> >> * Hide all layers button
> >>
> >> * Show all layers button
>
On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 10:36:33 +1000
Stephen Ecob wrote:
> Often I want to see one layer alone, so it would be convenient to be
> able to hide all and then show a single layer, using just 2 clicks.
> [...and eventually, re-show all...]
> Does this idea appeal to any of you other PCB users out there
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 02:22:25AM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > I have implemented the italicized/separated
> > suggestion. You can see it here:
> >
> > http://www.wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup4.png
>
> Nice.
> I note, that the longest layer name is "solder
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> I have implemented the italicized/separated
> suggestion. You can see it here:
>
> http://www.wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup4.png
Nice.
I note, that the longest layer name is "solder mask". Why not shorten
it to "mask" to save screen estate for the canvas?
---<)kaim
Stephen Ecob wrote:
> * Hide all layers button
>
> * Show all layers button
I don't think, that I would use these much.
> * Layer visibility memory - this would have a Store button and a
> Recall button. "Store" just stores the current visibility state,
> "Recall" changes it to the stored val
A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 09:52:19AM +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
>> A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>> * Hide all layers button
>>
>> * Show all layers button
>
> These would be easy enough to add to the widget. Just tack an
> `Al
> Relatedly, why do we let the user select the 'rats' layer?
> Can you actually draw with it?
Yes. That's how you enter the netlist when you don't have a
schematic.
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On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 09:52:19AM +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
> A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > Nope, uploaded it wrong :-}. The URL works now.
>
> Looks good, a definite improvement on what we have now!
>
> This may be out of scope for the current work, but I have some
A few hours in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> Nope, uploaded it wrong :-}. The URL works now.
Looks good, a definite improvement on what we have now!
This may be out of scope for the current work, but I have some related
items on my PCB wish list:
* Hide all layers button
* Show all lay
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 09:33:28AM +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
> > With this in mind, I have implemented the italicized/separated
> > suggestion. You can see it here:
> >
> > http://www.wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup4.png
>
> 404 error - did you get the URL wrong ?
>
Nope, uploaded it wrong :-}
> With this in mind, I have implemented the italicized/separated
> suggestion. You can see it here:
>
> http://www.wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup4.png
404 error - did you get the URL wrong ?
--
Stephen Ecob
Silicon On Inspiration
Sydney Australia
www.sioi.com.au
On Sat, Aug 20, 2011 at 04:41:05PM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > What we need to do with the treeview/swatch widget, is to indicate
> > that the swatch still works for toggling visibility, but you can't
> > actually select the layer for drawing.
>
> Complex relatio
On Sat, Aug 20, 2011 at 04:41:05PM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
>
> Complex relationships cannot be indicated by simple graphical means.
> What can easily be done, is an optical hint that these layers do not
> belong to the same class as the upper layers. Simply add some separating
> space betwe
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> This might work. So might coloring the text. But this has the
> same problem as putting text in parentheses: at first glance,
> this visual indicator might mean -anything-.
At first glane a lock means something that is not the case here.
Pins/pads, farside and mask are n
Steven Michalske wrote:
>> Put the item names in parenthesis.
>>
> A little padlock icon is universal as a locked thingy.
>
> (name) can mean anything..
A lock can mislead, too. Locking implies the ability to be unlocked.
I like the parenthesis proposal.
(And I generally dislike tiny icon
On Sat, 20 Aug 2011 08:09:37 -0700
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 01:46:24PM -0700, Steven Michalske wrote:
> >
> > On Aug 19, 2011, at 1:39 PM, Vanessa Ezekowitz wrote:
> >
> > >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:41:58PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
> > > [...]
> > >> Though, I am stil
If you had an icon that meant "you're editing this one" (a pencil?)
simply putting an X in that spot for non-editable layers would prevent
you from thinking you could click there.
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3 hours and 55 minutes ago, Vanessa Ezekowitz
wrote:
> Another thought comes to mind: How about a simple horizontal rule separating
> the read-only layers from the rest?
Good idea.
3 hours and two minutes in the future, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> This might work. So might coloring the text. But
On Sat, 20 Aug 2011 09:55:17 +0100
Peter Clifton wrote:
> On Sat, 2011-08-20 at 08:09 -0700, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> > On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 01:46:24PM -0700, Steven Michalske wrote:
> > >
> > > On Aug 19, 2011, at 1:39 PM, Vanessa Ezekowitz wrote:
> > >
> > > >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:4
On Sat, Aug 20, 2011 at 09:55:17AM +0100, Peter Clifton wrote:
>
> Also, try italicised text. That might make them appear distinct.
>
This might work. So might coloring the text. But this has the
same problem as putting text in parentheses: at first glance,
this visual indicator might mean -anyth
On Sat, 2011-08-20 at 08:09 -0700, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 01:46:24PM -0700, Steven Michalske wrote:
> >
> > On Aug 19, 2011, at 1:39 PM, Vanessa Ezekowitz wrote:
> >
> > >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:41:58PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
> > > [...]
> > >> Though, I am still
On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 01:46:24PM -0700, Steven Michalske wrote:
>
> On Aug 19, 2011, at 1:39 PM, Vanessa Ezekowitz wrote:
>
> >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:41:58PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
> > [...]
> >> Though, I am still unsure how to indicate that the last 4
> >> layers can't be used for dra
On Fri, 19 Aug 2011 13:46:24 -0700
Steven Michalske wrote:
>
> On Aug 19, 2011, at 1:39 PM, Vanessa Ezekowitz wrote:
>
> >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:41:58PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
> > [...]
> >> Though, I am still unsure how to indicate that the last 4
> >> layers can't be used for drawing.
On Aug 19, 2011, at 1:39 PM, Vanessa Ezekowitz wrote:
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:41:58PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
> [...]
>> Though, I am still unsure how to indicate that the last 4
>> layers can't be used for drawing.
>
> Put the item names in parenthesis.
>
A little padlock icon is univer
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:41:58PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
[...]
> Though, I am still unsure how to indicate that the last 4
> layers can't be used for drawing.
Put the item names in parenthesis.
--
"There are some things in life worth obsessing over. Most
things aren't, and when you learn t
On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 12:41:58PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
>
> Do we need any core changes to support any new functionality we've
> decided on? I know people ask about making sug-group layers
> separately controllable, and/or making narrower classes of objects
> visible.
>
Not with the current
> I can't use Shift without making assumptions about what character
> Shift+1 corresponds to on the user's keyboard. So that's out.
The lesstif hid traps the events before they're translated, so it can
do this.
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Do we need any core changes to support any new functionality we've
decided on? I know people ask about making sug-group layers
separately controllable, and/or making narrower classes of objects
visible.
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On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 05:22:57PM +0100, Peter Clifton wrote:
>
> Cool.
>
> Here's a fun idea - had you considered using the tree view's _tree_
> feature to show layer groups?
>
> That might let us allow switching off entire layer groups, or individual
> layers within them.
>
Oooh. I had not c
Thanks for all of your input, guys. I've done the fun parts
now (i.e., writing the widget) and still have to hook it into
the Gtk menu system. It looks like it won't be too hard, once
I understand everything that's going on in there.
I have a busy weekend, so I won't be posting anything you can
pl
On Fri, 2011-08-19 at 16:32 -0700, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> Yes, I found one -- and it is not actually that dirty. You can
> intercept the button-press-event signal, use the function
>
> gtk_tree_view_get_path_at_pos ()
>
> to figure out what cell is clicked on, then prevent the propagation
>
On Fri, Aug 19, 2011 at 01:01:07PM +0100, Peter Clifton wrote:
> On Thu, 2011-08-18 at 18:57 -0700, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > That is how I would like it to work. But clicking the swatch
> > also selects the layer, which is undesirable behavior. There
> > is no clean way to prevent this with a
On Thu, 2011-08-18 at 18:57 -0700, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> That is how I would like it to work. But clicking the swatch
> also selects the layer, which is undesirable behavior. There
> is no clean way to prevent this with a GtkTreeView widget.
Is there any dirty way to prevent it? ;)
I note tha
Felix Ruoff wrote:
>> Ctrl- doesn't toggle visibility? That's what the lesstif HID uses.
<..snip..>
> I would not like to use ctrl+n for this because for GTK+ (and propably
> other GUI frameworks) this is the default action for 'New...'. (as
> actually set in gpcb-menu.res).
This meant "contr
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> I have increased the swatch size. Take a look at:
>
> http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup3.png
Nice. Although the font is larger than with the current widget,
the whole stack is still significantly smaller. And it looks less
crowded, too :-)
> The swatches are f
On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 22:22:11 -0700
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 11:34:04PM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> > Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> >
> > > I like KMK's
> > >>click/double-click idea if possible.
> > >
> > > Very possible. But you would still be unable to toggle visib
On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 23:12:57 +0200
Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> Colin D Bennett wrote:
>
> > I really dislike the double-click idea. I often need to quickly
> > enable/disable visibility of multiple layers,
>
> Nothing beats accel-keys for fast actions. In this case [ctrl-N] or
> [shift-N] woul
Hello all,
Am 19.08.2011 02:47, schrieb Andrew Poelstra:
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 01:13:37PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
Ctrl- doesn't toggle visibility? That's what the lesstif HID uses.
No. There is code in there to do this, but (to the best of my
knowledge) it has never worked. The current acc
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 11:34:04PM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > I like KMK's
> >>click/double-click idea if possible.
> >
> > Very possible. But you would still be unable to toggle visibility
> > independent of selection using the mouse.
>
> Why is this so?
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> I like KMK's
>>click/double-click idea if possible.
>
> Very possible. But you would still be unable to toggle visibility
> independent of selection using the mouse.
Why is this so? Are double clicked items automatically selected
in GTK widgets?
> How important i
Colin D Bennett wrote:
> I really dislike the double-click idea. I often need to quickly
> enable/disable visibility of multiple layers,
Nothing beats accel-keys for fast actions. In this case [ctrl-N] or
[shift-N] would be the natural choice.
> and the last thing I need is to have to doubl
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 11:49:22AM -0700, Colin D Bennett wrote:
> On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 18:57:33 -0700
> Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 09:50:25AM -0700, Colin D Bennett wrote:
> > > I like the color swatch and how it shows a small
> > > rectangle of the layer color when the
On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 18:57:33 -0700
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 09:50:25AM -0700, Colin D Bennett wrote:
> > I like the color swatch and how it shows a small
> > rectangle of the layer color when the layer is hidden; if this
> > swatch were the show/hide toggle, that would be
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 09:50:25AM -0700, Colin D Bennett wrote:
>
> I really dislike the double-click idea. I often need to quickly
> enable/disable visibility of multiple layers, and the last thing I need
> is to have to double-click each button. I would much prefer a small
> region on the but
On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 09:25:06 -0700
Jared Casper wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 3:56 PM, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > 2. Whenever you hide a layer, the selector would jump to the
> > previously-selected layer. I haven't tried it yet, but I
> > think that from a user's perspective that
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 01:13:37PM -0400, DJ Delorie wrote:
>
> > Very possible. But you would still be unable to toggle visibility
> > independent of selection using the mouse. How important is this
> > to people? It bothers me, but only because there is no keyboard
> > shortcut in Gtk for toggli
> Very possible. But you would still be unable to toggle visibility
> independent of selection using the mouse. How important is this
> to people? It bothers me, but only because there is no keyboard
> shortcut in Gtk for toggling visibility.
Ctrl- doesn't toggle visibility? That's what the less
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 09:25:06AM -0700, Jared Casper wrote:
>On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 3:56 PM, Andrew Poelstra <[1]as...@sfu.ca>
>wrote:
>
> 2. Whenever you hide a layer, the selector would jump to the
>
> previously-selected layer. I haven't tried it yet, but I
> t
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 3:56 PM, Andrew Poelstra <[1]as...@sfu.ca>
wrote:
2. Whenever you hide a layer, the selector would jump to the
previously-selected layer. I haven't tried it yet, but I
think that from a user's perspective that would make the
visibility
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 08:29:13AM +0200, Krzysztof Kościuszkiewicz wrote:
> 2011/8/18 Andrew Poelstra :
>
> > Kai (and others), what do you think of this mockup?:
> >
> > http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup.png
>
> Looks good. It resembles GtkTreeView and that raises a question - will
> it
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 04:12:34AM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > Kai (and others), what do you think of this mockup?:
> >
> > http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup.png
>
> Layer names with white background are much easier to read than white
> on color we have
Bert Timmerman wrote:
> BTW, we could truncate layernames in buttons:
ack.
> "pins/pads" --> "leads"
Better: Divide these. Pads are different from pins. Pads reside on only
one layer while pins are spanning all layers. During my recent multilayer
layout it would have been handy to disable pad
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> Kai (and others), what do you think of this mockup?:
>
> http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup.png
Layer names with white background are much easier to read than white
on color we have now. If it were me, the colored squares could be a
tad larger without increasig t
Steven Michalske wrote:
> I really like this one. Bonus points for setting layer color by
> clicking on the colored rectangle.
This should be part of a "properties dialog" for the respective layer.
Properties may include attributes like "skip-DRC", DRC rules specific
to this layer, layer name,
On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 07:48:31 +0200
"Bert Timmerman" wrote:
> > I think such a thing would look like:
> > http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/selector.png
> >
> > What do people think of this?
>
> IMHO, the former proposal with visibilty buttons without "rectangles"
> is the improvement we are loo
On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 01:05:33 +0200
Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
> Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> > I think such a thing would look like:
> > http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/selector.png
> >
> > What do people think of this?
>
> Invisibility by greyed out buttons is much more easily grasped
> on a gl
2011/8/18 Andrew Poelstra :
> Kai (and others), what do you think of this mockup?:
>
> http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup.png
Looks good. It resembles GtkTreeView and that raises a question - will
it still be possible to toggle visibility without changing the active
layer (moving the select
Hi Andrew and all,
> -Original Message-
> From: geda-user-boun...@moria.seul.org
> [mailto:geda-user-boun...@moria.seul.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Poelstra
> Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2011 9:52 AM
> To: k...@familieknaak.de; gEDA user mailing list
> Subject: Re: gEDA-
Hi Andrew and all,
> -Original Message-
> From: geda-user-boun...@moria.seul.org
> [mailto:geda-user-boun...@moria.seul.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Poelstra
> Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2011 8:02 AM
> To: gEDA user mailing list
> Subject: Re: gEDA-user: Layer button backg
Am 18.08.2011 09:52, schrieb Andrew Poelstra:
Kai (and others), what do you think of this mockup?:
http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup.png
Very good!
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Kai (and others), what do you think of this mockup?:
[1]http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup.png
I like this one also. It seems compact and easy to understand.
Matthew
--
My homepage.
[2]http://sites.google.com/site/matthewsager/home
References
1. http://wpsoftwa
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 11:23 AM, Steven Michalske wrote:
>> http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/mockup.png
>>
>
> I really like this one. Bonus points for setting layer color by clicking on
> the colored rectangle.
Er, maybe shift-click for that. I would have assumed that clicking
would toggle
On Aug 18, 2011, at 12:52 AM, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 12:08:34AM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
>>
>> This advantage wears off as the user uses the feature more often.
>> Using layers is very basic to PCB. Typical use switches layers
>> very often in a session. Becaus
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 12:08:34AM +0200, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote:
>
> This advantage wears off as the user uses the feature more often.
> Using layers is very basic to PCB. Typical use switches layers
> very often in a session. Because of this, long term aspects become
> more important, like eff
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> I think such a thing would look like:
> http://wpsoftware.net/andrew/dump/selector.png
>
> What do people think of this?
Invisibility by greyed out buttons is much more easily grasped
on a glance than presence or abcense of an eye icon. I'd prefer to
not have eye icons
On Wed, 17 Aug 2011 23:01:30 -0700
Andrew Poelstra wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 07:31:24AM +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
> > > Good point. I do like the full color fill you show, Andrew.
> > > However, I think we need a better way of indicating which layers
> > > are visible. Perhaps a little
Stephen Ecob wrote:
> Photoshop (and also GIMP) use a small on/off icon that looks like an
> eye to control layer visibility.
In gimp, this is inside a dedicated layer dialog, not in a side bar.
> This may or may not be a good way to
> do it, but it is certainly a familiar UI to many people.
T
However you change the buttons, please ensure that it is VERY obvious
what selection is made/mode it is currently in. I've seen far to many
sw products where pushing a button to engage some action or select a
mode failed to notify the user (either noticeable visual change, audio
sou
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 07:31:24AM +1000, Stephen Ecob wrote:
> > Good point. I do like the full color fill you show, Andrew. However,
> > I think we need a better way of indicating which layers are visible.
> > Perhaps a little "X" or checkbox icon on the button? I already dislike
> > the curre
On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 01:14:46PM -0700, Colin D Bennett wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Aug 2011 20:48:48 +0200
> Felix Ruoff wrote:
>
> > I personally like the new style you created. Its very nice! I think
> > the reason for adding this small rectangles is, that its easier to
> > see, if the button is pre
> Good point. I do like the full color fill you show, Andrew. However,
> I think we need a better way of indicating which layers are visible.
> Perhaps a little "X" or checkbox icon on the button? I already dislike
> the current buttons' indication of which layers are visible (change of
> fill c
On Wed, 17 Aug 2011 20:48:48 +0200
Felix Ruoff wrote:
> I personally like the new style you created. Its very nice! I think
> the reason for adding this small rectangles is, that its easier to
> see, if the button is pressed.
Good point. I do like the full color fill you show, Andrew. However,
I personally like the new style you created. Its very nice! I think the
reason for adding this small rectangles is, that its easier to see, if
the button is pressed.
Am 18.08.2011 04:00, schrieb Andrew Poelstra:
Hey all,
I am working on moving the Gtk layer-selector into its
own widget (see
The lesstif layer buttons are solid like you propose too
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On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 7:00 PM, Andrew Poelstra wrote:
>
> Hey all,
>
> I am working on moving the Gtk layer-selector into its
> own widget (see bug 699482, for example), and cleaning
> up the code.
>
> A question I have for the group is: why are the backgrounds
> of the layer buttons in little r
Hey all,
I am working on moving the Gtk layer-selector into its
own widget (see bug 699482, for example), and cleaning
up the code.
A question I have for the group is: why are the backgrounds
of the layer buttons in little rectangles? Is there
opposition to making the background fill the whole b
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