On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:26 PM, Daniel Phelps wrote:
> On Jun 2, 2010, at 9:40 PM, phoebe ayers wrote:
>
>> Also as I'm sure you're aware it's definitely time to update
>> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/File:Org_Chart_Without_Names.png !
>> (from [[wmf:staff]]
>>
>> -- Phoebe
>
>
> Hi Phoebe
On Jun 2, 2010, at 9:40 PM, phoebe ayers wrote:
> Also as I'm sure you're aware it's definitely time to update
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/File:Org_Chart_Without_Names.png !
> (from [[wmf:staff]]
>
> -- Phoebe
Hi Phoebe,
I was waiting for the new C level hires to be announced before
Hello,
2010/6/3 James Alexander :
> Ahh this is what I was looking for
> http://www.chillingeffects.org/responses/notice.cgi?NoticeID=1048#QID132 (at
> least us legal requirements for a counter notice) and their counter-notice
> generator http://www.chillingeffects.org/dmca/counter512.pdf that may
Hi Noein,
With no comment on the issue you were interested in, you raise good
questions about internal communication, which has indeed been chaotic
for as long as I've been around, but is -- if you can imagine --
better than it used to be!
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 4:23 PM, Noein wrote:
> -BEGI
Obligatory: I'm not a lawyer (or an expert) but did try to poke around a bit
for you.
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 12:18 AM, Yann Forget wrote:
>
>
1. Did Gallimard send a lawsuit? If yes, the Wikisource community, and
> probably many other contributors might be interested to know about it.
> If not,
Ahh this is what I was looking for
http://www.chillingeffects.org/responses/notice.cgi?NoticeID=1048#QID132 (at
least us legal requirements for a counter notice) and their counter-notice
generator http://www.chillingeffects.org/dmca/counter512.pdf that may help
you at least start
James Alexander
j
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: Sue Gardner
> Date: 2 June 2010 19:08
> Subject: Announcing new Chief Global Development Officer and new Chief
> Community Officer
> To: wikimediaannounc...@lists.wikimedia.org
>
>
> Hi folks,
>
> I am really happy to announce two important new Wik
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 12:13 AM, K. Peachey wrote:
> @James: Do we really need this? Announce is/should be apparently set
> to forward any announcements as necessary already via the MM admin
> interface, although when the previous announcements were sent it was
> still a baby/new list and experie
2010/6/3 Yann Forget :
> 2. Is there on-going negotiations with Gallimard?
Forget about that. I just read your mail after sending mine.
Regards,
Yann
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Hello,
2010/6/3 Mike Godwin :
> On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:15 PM, Nathan wrote:
>
>> Yann suggests that he (and the Wikisource community) did not know
>> about the takedown in a timely manner; anyone not watching the files
>> or the deletion logs might have missed it if the only note was in the
>>
@Sue: Announce would be a restricted list most likley, so it probably
bounced, hence why you didn't see it.
@James: Do we really need this? Announce is/should be apparently set
to forward any announcements as necessary already via the MM admin
interface, although when the previous announcements wer
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 8:08 PM, John Vandenberg wrote:
>
> It sounds like you are suggesting that there is ongoing dialog between
> WMF and Gallimard.. ?
>
There is not.
> And what is the process _after_ the takedown?
>
The takedown is normally the end of the process. Unless you are asking
so
On 3 June 2010 00:54, Mike Godwin wrote:
> Yes, it is correct that I will comply with a DMCA (or equivalent) takedown
> notice. In this respect, I'm like just about every lawyer everywhere who
> represents a service provider. Perhaps they are all bad lawyers, but at
> least I'm in good company i
On 3 June 2010 00:13, Klaus Graf wrote:
> For me there is no reason to believe that Mr. Godwin is a good lawyer.
>
> If he receives a formal (blah-blah) correct take-down-notice he will
> take OFFICE ACTION.
>
> It was clearly un-lawful to take down the TU Munich logo which isn't
> protectable acc
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 10:56 AM, wrote:
>
> Do we really want every contributor to be an expert in the copyright laws of
> any particular nation that might have a company exerting some obscure claim?
We want every contributor who is going to be submitting non-original
content (whether texts for
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:00 AM, Mike Godwin wrote:
>
> We cannot inform you about all the details communicated in an ongoing
> negotiation with parties threatening us with litigation. Apart from whether
> doing so would be consistent with legal ethics, it would also provide a
> disincentive for c
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 8:49 AM, George Herbert wrote:
>
> The appropriate response to this might be a Quebec Wikisource project
> (or, pick another French-speaking location, with a very non-French
> copyright policy which is more friendly to us in this circumstance).
The hope was that the Wikimed
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:23 PM, Sue Gardner wrote:
> I am really happy to announce two important new Wikimedia Foundation
> hires. Zack Exley will be Wikimedia's new Chief Community Officer,
> and Barry Newstead will be our Chief Global Development Officer. Both
> will start just before Wikima
Mike.lifeguard wrote:
>
> On 37-01--10 03:59 PM, Sue Gardner wrote:
>
>
>> During the hiring process, Zack pointed out to me that the CDO job as
>> then-structured didn't support that vision. He argued that by siloing
>> off donors into a separate department, we were making it more
>> difficult
hmm very weird, I would assume it should say "you are already subscribed" or
something along those lines as well.. oh well hopefully we can fix it
eventually so that I don't have to subscribe to both to satisfy my desire to
know right away ;).
James Alexander
james.alexan...@rochester.edu
jameso..
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On 37-01--10 03:59 PM, Sue Gardner wrote:
> I am really happy to announce two important new Wikimedia Foundation
> hires. Zack Exley will be Wikimedia's new Chief Community Officer,
> and Barry Newstead will be our Chief Global Development Officer.
C
On 2 June 2010 19:35, James Alexander wrote:
> Sending this separately so it isn't in the hiring announcement thread :) Per
> Ignore All Rules (which I guess doesn't really exist here so I'm ignoring
> it's absence to) I went ahead and subscribed foundation-l to
> WikimediaAnnouncements-l . So ass
Sending this separately so it isn't in the hiring announcement thread :) Per
Ignore All Rules (which I guess doesn't really exist here so I'm ignoring
it's absence to) I went ahead and subscribed foundation-l to
WikimediaAnnouncements-l . So assuming the list admins are getting a "click
here to con
Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>
> Finally as it seems to be necessary to understand Latin in order to read
> your rant, I want to use that language with "Cave canum". What I know of
> that language is thanks to those fine Gauls immortalised by Underzo and
> Goscinny. Brassica is translated in apekool in m
Hi folks,
Forwarding from the announce list, since it does not yet auto-forward :-)
Thanks,
Sue
-- Forwarded message --
From: Sue Gardner
Date: 2 June 2010 19:08
Subject: Announcing new Chief Global Development Officer and new Chief
Community Officer
To: wikimediaannounc...@list
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 8:09 PM, Aryeh Gregor
> wrote:
> Is this probable? What are people's reasons for using interlanguage
> links? How many people miss them now that they're collapsed -- among
> the readership as a whole, not the extremely vocal and committed
> editors who read foundation-l a
-Original Message-
From: Mike Godwin
To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Sent: Wed, Jun 2, 2010 4:54 pm
Subject: [Foundation-l] Office action
>> It is a shame that WMF hasn't a policy of TRANSPARENCY regarding
>> office actions. The right of the community to get all informat
I hope you don't think that an individual contacting a company is going to do
anything to change their minds about what is perceived about their frivolous
claim.
You didn't address my extension of that notice which would read something like
"If you believe this material IS in the public doma
Sorry for not saving the previous text, formatting was getting to be a
bit of a mess.
I do see that the page Yann linked to was created around the same time
action was taken, by Cary, and lists the reason for the deletions and
the content deleted. I'll assume this page was linked in several other
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 8:24 PM, Mike Godwin wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 5:08 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> What harm do you foresee in replacing deleted pages with a declaration like
>> YouTube uses, "This Video has been deleted
>>
>> based on a copyright claim by The Disney Corporation" ? And then
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 6:30 PM, Aryeh Gregor
wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 5:51 PM, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
>> You can attempt a weighted cost comparison: Num_interwiki_users *
>> Cost_of_hiding vs Everyone_else * Cost_of_clutter. But even
>> that will inevitably lead to bad conclusion
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 5:08 PM, wrote:
>
>
> What harm do you foresee in replacing deleted pages with a declaration like
> YouTube uses, "This Video has been deleted
>
> based on a copyright claim by The Disney Corporation" ? And then an
> extension of "If you believe this is public domain mat
Klaus Graf writes:
For me there is no reason to believe that Mr. Godwin is a good lawyer.
>
I certainly don't require that you believe I'm a good lawyer. I'd be a very
poor lawyer indeed, however, if I invited publishers to embroil us in
expensive copyright lawsuits that we might not win when bot
Hoi,
The question is not so much what you believe but very much the reputation Mr
Godwin has. In my appreciation he has an excellent reputation based on the
many relevant jobs that he has had in the past. There are not many people
who are associated with a "law" that is named after them.
When you
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 7:13 PM, Klaus Graf wrote:
> For me there is no reason to believe that Mr. Godwin is a good lawyer.
>
> If he receives a formal (blah-blah) correct take-down-notice he will
> take OFFICE ACTION.
>
> It was clearly un-lawful to take down the TU Munich logo which isn't
> prot
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 4:13 PM, Klaus Graf wrote:
> For me there is no reason to believe that Mr. Godwin is a good lawyer.
>
> If he receives a formal (blah-blah) correct take-down-notice he will
> take OFFICE ACTION.
>
> It was clearly un-lawful to take down the TU Munich logo which isn't
> prote
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On 37-01--10 03:59 PM, George Herbert wrote:
> The appropriate response to this might be a Quebec Wikisource project
> (or, pick another French-speaking location, with a very non-French
> copyright policy which is more friendly to us in this circumstan
On 3 June 2010 00:13, Klaus Graf wrote:
> It was clearly un-lawful to take down the TU Munich logo which isn't
> protectable according German copyright law but WMF has done so.
Of course it is lawful for the WMF to remove something from a WMF
site. It may not be legally necessary, but that doesn'
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I've been watching the dialogues between the WMF and this mailing list
for a while now and most of the conflicts are the same: bad
communication. This is apparently not due to individuals but institutional.
I'm still ignorant of many aspects of the i
For me there is no reason to believe that Mr. Godwin is a good lawyer.
If he receives a formal (blah-blah) correct take-down-notice he will
take OFFICE ACTION.
It was clearly un-lawful to take down the TU Munich logo which isn't
protectable according German copyright law but WMF has done so.
It
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 3:04 PM, Mike Godwin wrote:
> Gerard writes:
>
> Hoi,
>> When I read: "Wikisource content in the French language targets the French
>> public, and therefore, under French conflict of laws principles, the
>> copyright law of France applies to this content." I do read the Fre
Hoi,
Thanks for a nice and adequate response.
GerardM
On 3 June 2010 00:04, Mike Godwin wrote:
> Gerard writes:
>
> Hoi,
> > When I read: "Wikisource content in the French language targets the
> French
> > public, and therefore, under French conflict of laws principles, the
> > copyright law of
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 5:51 PM, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> You can attempt a weighted cost comparison: Num_interwiki_users *
> Cost_of_hiding vs Everyone_else * Cost_of_clutter. But even
> that will inevitably lead to bad conclusions for some issues because
> the costs are usually not line
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When you enter your car and drive to your destination, you make hundreds
of gestures but use only once the key, at the beginning. Yet without an
easy, obvious access to the keyhole, you wouldn't drive at all.
My point? Frequency of click is not the ult
Gerard writes:
Hoi,
> When I read: "Wikisource content in the French language targets the French
> public, and therefore, under French conflict of laws principles, the
> copyright law of France applies to this content." I do read the French
> public. Wikisource does not target the French public p
Gerard Meijssen wrote:
> When I read: "Wikisource content in the French language targets the French
> public, and therefore, under French conflict of laws principles, the
> copyright law of France applies to this content." I do read the French
> public. Wikisource does not target the French publ
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 3:48 PM, Aryeh Gregor
wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:50 PM, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
>> Who cares if people click them a lot? The space they formally
>> occupied is filled with nothing now.
>
> Interface clutter is not psychologically free. Empty space is better
> than s
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:15 PM, Nathan wrote:
>
> Yann suggests that he (and the Wikisource community) did not know
> about the takedown in a timely manner; anyone not watching the files
> or the deletion logs might have missed it if the only note was in the
> deletion log.
But of course, the d
Hoi,
Elsewhere Mike Godwin explained that there is a procedure that needs to be
followed when a legitimate takedown notice is served. Please look for this
and reply in that thread if things are still not clear.
Thanks,
GerardM
On 2 June 2010 19:54, Klaus Graf wrote:
> I cannot see any reaso
It's a shame that exchanges like this end up as back-and-forth
arguments, instead of normal discussions.
I think the Foundation should be as open as possible with project
communities about legal action, even if in some cases that poses an
obstacle to negotiation. The spectre of legal jeopardy can
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 1:45 PM, wrote:
>
>
> It's not about what you cannot do, it's about what you CAN do.
> In light of the evidence that some of the works are in the public domain in
> France, are you willing to stop taking down the material? That's the real
> issue here.
>
> We can simply re
In a message dated 6/2/2010 1:09:49 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
mnemo...@gmail.com writes:
> Please understand that if you have problems with French copyright law,
> there's nothing I can do about that from here in California. >>
It's not about what you cannot do, it's about what you CAN do.
In l
I would like to know as follows
* the data mentioned
* differences between language groups: does every language group use
interlanguage links rarely or some of them use it often? For instance,
in a small wikis?
* Is there any way to choose if those hiding-by-default boxes are
visible by user prefe
I would like to know as follows
* the data mentioned
* differences between language groups: does every language group use
interlanguage links rarely or some of them use it often? For instance,
in a small wikis?
* Is there any way to choose if those hiding-by-default boxes are
visible by user prefe
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 12:21 PM, Yann Forget wrote
>
>
> I didn't know you narrowed Gallimard's takedown demand. AFAIK you
> never informed me nor Wikisource about this.
>
We cannot inform you about all the details communicated in an ongoing
negotiation with parties threatening us with litigation
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:50 PM, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> Who cares if people click them a lot? The space they formally
> occupied is filled with nothing now.
Interface clutter is not psychologically free. Empty space is better
than space filled with mostly-useless controls. Whether these
parti
Hoi,
When I read: "Wikisource content in the French language targets the French
public, and therefore, under French conflict of laws principles, the
copyright law of France applies to this content." I do read the French
public. Wikisource does not target the French public per se.
Thanks,
Ger
2010/6/2 Mike Godwin :
> Yann Forget writes:
>
>> In addition, I receive a personal letter, as "the main editor" of
>> these texts, according to Gallimard. We didn't receive any information
>> from the Wikimedia Foundation, and I know the details only because I
>> have been personally involved.
>
>
2010/6/2 Gregory Maxwell
>
> On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:13 PM, Amir E. Aharoni
> wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > For part 1, see [1].
> >
> > In his reply to User experience feedback [2], Howief says: "the language
> > links were used relatively infrequently based on tracking data".
> >
> > Is there any
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 3:13 PM, Amir E. Aharoni
wrote:
> In his reply to User experience feedback [2], Howief says: "the language
> links were used relatively infrequently based on tracking data".
Hiding interlanguage links by default is simply annoying, especially
if you translate articles or y
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:13 PM, Amir E. Aharoni
wrote:
> Hello,
>
> For part 1, see [1].
>
> In his reply to User experience feedback [2], Howief says: "the language
> links were used relatively infrequently based on tracking data".
>
> Is there any data about their usage since the switch to Vecto
Thanks MZMcBride for your note -- I absolutely sympathize with anyone who's
trying to keep up to speed on everything going on at Wikimedia. We're all
trying to strike a good balance in terms of what's useful, relevant,
interesting, and I hope we are generally getting it fairly close to correct.
Hello,
For part 1, see [1].
In his reply to User experience feedback [2], Howief says: "the language
links were used relatively infrequently based on tracking data".
Is there any data about their usage since the switch to Vector?
[1]
http://www.mail-archive.com/wikipedi...@lists.wikimedia.org/m
I cannot see any reason to delete texts of authors who are dead more
than 70 years (the Europe-wide copyright term). There is no reason to
think that the France-only world-war-rule is compatible with European
law.
Klaus Graf
___
foundation-l mailing lis
Yann Forget writes:
>
> In addition, I receive a personal letter, as "the main editor" of
> these texts, according to Gallimard. We didn't receive any information
> from the Wikimedia Foundation, and I know the details only because I
> have been personally involved.
>
Yann seems to be suggesting
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On 06/02/2010 09:42 AM, Cary Bass wrote:
> Languages still needing at least some work are: German, French,
> Japanese, Dutch, Polish, Russian, Portuguese, and Spanish. Thanks
> to Marco 27 for the work he put in on the Italian Wiki.
Make that Russian.
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Hi all!
In advance of the Vector rollout to the remaining top ten languages,
the UX team can use some help translating some pages from the English
Wikipedia; including central notice, a local PR page, and not least, a
local feedback page.
Languages s
Gerard Meijssen wrote:
> The notion that French is spoken only in France is factually wrong.
> Consequently the claim that French literature targets the French public is
> arguably wrong as well. Either French is a world language or it is only
> spoken by the French public, you cannot have it bot
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:54 PM, Eugene Zelenko
wrote:
> I think it's reasonable to account country of origin copyrights laws
> too as Commons does, especially with Wikisource editions other then
> English, where majority of text most likely originated outside of USA.
> And majority of audience al
Hello,
2010/6/2 Eugene Zelenko :
> Hi!
>
> On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 5:43 AM, Yann Forget wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> Just a few days before these texts were deleted, I asked Cary what was
>> the official opinion of Wikimedia Foundation about texts which are in
>> the public domain in USA, but not in Fra
Hoi,
The notion that French is spoken only in France is factually wrong.
Consequently the claim that French literature targets the French public is
arguably wrong as well. Either French is a world language or it is only
spoken by the French public, you cannot have it both ways.
Not only in my opin
Hi!
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 5:43 AM, Yann Forget wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Just a few days before these texts were deleted, I asked Cary what was
> the official opinion of Wikimedia Foundation about texts which are in
> the public domain in USA, but not in France. I was told that "the
> community is ent
Hi Eugene,
thanks for the explanation, I think the whole banning was quite justified.
But besides that, as I also asked in an earlier email, I can understand
geniice's feeling that it is unclear what the topics are (which can be
solved by an agenda as he suggests or a description of what tend to b
Hello,
In the beginning of March 2010, a few hundreds files have been deleted
on the French Wikisource following a request from Gallimard, a leading
French publisher. [1] The Wikimedia Foundation received a request from
Editions Gallimard to takedown content from the French Wikisource.
This reques
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