[org-cite] next steps for documentation?

We have some initial documentation for org-cite included in the manual to accompany the release of Org 9.5. https://orgmode.org/manual/Citation-handling.html#Citation-handling But it still needs a fair bit of work. Questions: 1. What else should/must be added to the manual? 2. What might we ins

Re: [org-cite] Testing on macOS, XML file missing

It looks like that /etc/csl directory isn't included in the emacs source tree. On Fri, Oct 1, 2021 at 4:57 AM Rudolf Adamkovič wrote: > > Hi there, > > I compiled Emacs from "master" (2e92f90a5d) to try the new > citations. > > > ./configure --with-json > > make > > make install > > (per usual, n

Re: [org-cite] Testing on macOS, XML file missing

Actually, that whole etc directory is outdated. On Fri, Oct 1, 2021 at 8:33 AM Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > It looks like that /etc/csl directory isn't included in the emacs source tree. > > On Fri, Oct 1, 2021 at 4:57 AM Rudolf Adamkovič wrote: > > > > Hi th

Re: [org-cite] Testing on macOS, XML file missing

On Sat, Oct 2, 2021 at 1:24 AM Kyle Meyer wrote: > Is there a reason to avoid updating to the latest version? No; updating them makes sense. Bruce

Re: [org-cite] Testing on macOS, XML file missing

On Sat, Oct 2, 2021 at 1:46 AM Kyle Meyer wrote: > > [reordering top-posting...] > > Bruce D'Arcus writes: > > > On Fri, Oct 1, 2021 at 8:33 AM Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > >> > >> It looks like that /etc/csl directory isn't included in the e

Re: [org-cite] How to cite page number(s) in APA Style?

On Sun, Oct 3, 2021 at 6:35 AM Rudolf Adamkovič wrote: > I use APA (via CSL) to cite and would like to write > > > According to Someone (2021), foo-bar (p. 42). > > I can almost do it with > > > Accordint to [cite/text:@someone-2021], foo-bar > > . > > Any ideas? In APA, this pattern comes up oft

Re: [org-cite] How to cite page number(s) in APA Style?

On Sun, Oct 3, 2021 at 9:18 AM Rudolf Adamkovič wrote: > > "Bruce D'Arcus" writes: > > > ATM, your only option is to do "(p. 42)." > > Bummer. You could put in a feature request though ;-) Aside: the other way to handle this, which has been

Re: "Unknown processor biblatex"

On Sun, Oct 3, 2021 at 4:57 PM autofrettage wrote: > > Hi all, > > I have really seen forward to the release of org mode 9.5 with > its new and shiny support for citations. The initial frenzy of > experimentation has lead to mixed results. > > Right now I am trying to use the biblatex processor, b

Re: Citation in footnote not expanded/exported to LaTeX (using Org-ref-cite)

On Sun, Oct 3, 2021 at 6:23 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > Elias Bounatirou writes: > > > Just to clarify the BUG: > > Citations in a footnote in the following environment are not exported to > > LaTeX: when the footnote follows two or more citations, of which one has a > > suffix, i.e.

Re: Citation in footnote not expanded/exported to LaTeX (using Org-ref-cite)

On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 10:11 AM Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > On Sun, Oct 3, 2021 at 6:23 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > > > Hello, > > > > Elias Bounatirou writes: > > > > > Just to clarify the BUG: > > > Citations in a footnote in the foll

Re: Bare oc-csl author variants?

On Tue, Oct 5, 2021 at 1:35 AM Timothy wrote: > Is there any reason why we haven’t added `a/b', `a/bc', `a/bf', `a/bcf' ? There is a reason, though it may not be the strongest. It's just odd to have a name without any other citation marker. How would a reader know it's a citation? Is it for ca

Re: Bare oc-csl author variants?

On Tue, Oct 5, 2021 at 9:19 AM Timothy wrote: > > It’s just odd to have a name without any other citation marker. How > > would a reader know it’s a citation? > > For context, I’m basically just using this as a way to insert the author’s > name > without any chance of typos. Right. I don't see

Re: [org-cite] How to cite page number(s) in APA Style?

On Tue, Oct 5, 2021 at 10:42 AM John Kitchin wrote: > > How would this work? > > Does [cite/locators:@someone-2021]. > > imply a specific field in a bibliography entry, e.g. pages, or location? and > then CSL is responsible for formatting it to something like "p. 42" or "pp. > 42-44", etc? As R

Re: Bare oc-csl author variants?

On Tue, Oct 5, 2021 at 11:04 AM Timothy wrote: > Sounds like the general attitude is “why not?”. So I’ve turned my snippet > into a > patch and unless any concerns are raised in the next few days I’ll push it to > main. For parity, it would probably make sense to add the equivalent to oc-natbib

Re: cite page number

On Tue, Oct 5, 2021 at 3:57 PM Ypo wrote: > I think that already works. For me it was overkilling when I tried to use it > for my personal notes. It was too much work and it cluttered my "global" > references.bib with an item for each cited page. > > But maybe that would be the correct way? Sin

Re: Citations: Locale specific adaptions?

On Fri, Oct 8, 2021 at 12:38 PM M. ‘quintus’ Gülker wrote: > I am not entirely sure if this is a bug, a missing feature (if so, I > would like to request it), or a user error on my side. Please enlighten > me. >From reading the code, it looks like you need to set org-cite-csl-locales-dir. Have

[org-cite] allow citations in captions?

Is there any technical reason citations aren't allowed in captions? If not, could that restriction be removed? I do note LaTeX requires special handling for that though; \protect\cite{ref} or {\cite{ref}}. https://stackoverflow.com/questions/4487728/latex-inserting-a-reference-in-a-figures-capti

Re: [org-cite] allow citations in captions?

On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 8:00 AM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > "Bruce D'Arcus" writes: > > > Is there any technical reason citations aren't allowed in captions? > > Yes, there is. Captions are somewhat fragile: they may or may not be > inc

Re: Expanding how the new cite syntax is used to include cross-references - thoughts?

Can we go back to this question of whether internal links are adequate for cross-references, and if not, what's missing? On Fri, Aug 13, 2021 at 11:22 AM Eric S Fraga wrote: > > Hello John & co., > > I need to chime in when it comes to the UI: > > On Thursday, 12 Aug 2021 at 13:19, John Kitchin w

Re: [org-cite] add convention for direct commands, process for adding mappings to export processor(s)?

Just bumping this. Nicolas, in particular, any thoughts? On Thu, Sep 9, 2021 at 2:37 PM Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > The current list of styles and variants included in the oc export > processors was a first step, with a goal to provide a solid starting > point, and citations that

Re: [org-cite] add convention for direct commands, process for adding mappings to export processor(s)?

On Sun, Oct 10, 2021 at 4:41 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > >> And if we were to add this, we'd still need to answer my first > >> question: when and how to add specific style/variant mappings to the > >> oc processors. > > It is possible to send a patch if it is something useful. Some > processors

Re: A minor suggestion about formatting citations

On Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 5:40 AM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > Vikas Rawal writes: > > > I find it works better for me if I insert spaces between multiple > > citations. For example: [cite: @john56; @john35; @bruce2021] rather > > than [cite:@john56;@john35;@bruce2021]. > > > > The of adva

Re: A minor suggestion about formatting citations

On Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 10:28 AM John Kitchin wrote: > > you should probably trim each key, and re-add spaces where you want them in > the function that does these kinds of things. I realize that's an option, but something about that feels wrong to me. We're adding a single space as prefix, not

Re: A minor suggestion about formatting citations

On Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 11:54 AM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > "Bruce D'Arcus" writes: > > > On Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 10:28 AM John Kitchin > > wrote: > >> > >> you should probably trim each key, and re-add spaces where you wan

Re: Citations: non-page locators placed in front of citation

On Mon, Oct 11, 2021 at 1:57 PM M. ‘quintus’ Gülker wrote: > As explained, the positioning is now correct. However, instead of the > section § sign it now has two pilcrow signs ¶¶. It should be just one > sign, and it should be a section sign rather than a pilcrow one. Looks like § is currently

Re: Expanding how the new cite syntax is used to include cross-references - thoughts?

On Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 5:16 PM John Kitchin wrote: > > I think the existing link capability of org-mode is completely adequate for > cross-references. LaTeX exports are almost completely covered in org-ref. I > made a refproc > (https://github.com/jkitchin/org-ref/blob/org-ref-3/org-ref-refpro

Re: Expanding how the new cite syntax is used to include cross-references - thoughts?

On Tue, Oct 12, 2021 at 7:28 PM John Kitchin wrote: > > I am not sure it really fits the model of the exporters that are in org, > since it is basically just a pre-processing hook. [snip] > It also is (IMO) a part of org-ref since it uses the links that are defined > in org-ref. I see it as mo

Re: Manual suggestion and experience report from a new user (citation processors, 9.5)

Forgot to reply-all ... On Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 11:36 AM Leszek Wroński wrote: > I've been using Emacs for about 20 years, but I'm only now starting to > seriously explore the Org-mode, since I read about the new citation > options. I'd like to report my initial experience since maybe this > cou

Re: Manual suggestion and experience report from a new user (citation processors, 9.5)

On Wed, Oct 13, 2021, 1:41 PM Leszek Wroński wrote: > Thank you very much! I will explore more. The keys are correct. On > reopening the .org file, the behavior is now consistent: clicking on > any citation does nothing :-) Try org-open-at-point. That at least should work. Bruce

Re: New user experience ct'd: exporting citations into LaTeX (9.5)

Try adding this where you want the bibliography. #+print_bibliography: On Wed, Oct 13, 2021 at 5:27 PM Leszek Wroński wrote: > > Guys, > > thank you very much for your responses to my previous query. (I will > study the ebib package more closely; as of now it does not seem to > work with the fil

[PATCH] org-manual.org: org-cite additions

load a package. Bruce From bdd33dd4efc1cd237dd90dc1a5c5741604cfd807 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Bruce D'Arcus Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2021 18:04:20 -0400 Subject: [PATCH] org-manual: minor org-cite additions * doc/org-manual.org (Handling citations): Add note and example to load a processor

Re: the tangled web of org-cite, selectrum, completing-read, ...

Eric - since you're using selectrum, any reason why not just use oc-bibtex-actions? Performance should be better, and it has a template system like bibtex-completion. On Tue, Oct 19, 2021 at 1:18 PM Eric S Fraga wrote: > > Hello all, > > TL;DR: how can I format the suggestions listed by selectru

Re: the tangled web of org-cite, selectrum, completing-read, ...

The cool thing about embark-act in this context is it provides actions both in the minibuffer and in the buffer at point (in this case, when on a citation). So it's like merging ivy-actions and a hydra. On Tue, Oct 19, 2021, 3:54 PM Eric S Fraga wrote: > Nicolas & Bruce, > > thank you for the

Re: the tangled web of org-cite, selectrum, completing-read, ...

On Tue, Oct 19, 2021 at 4:09 PM Eric S Fraga wrote: > > On Tuesday, 19 Oct 2021 at 22:04, Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > >> 1. set =org-cite-basic-author-column= to a larger number > > > > You can ignore this step, which is useful (but is not as you report) > > only when using `basic' insert processor

Re: [PATCH] oc-bibtex.el: add :follow property from oc-basic

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 10:29 AM Eric S Fraga wrote: > > Hello all, > > I may be violating some coding convention but the attached patch re-uses > the org-cite-basic-goto function from the basic org-cite processor to > implement the follow directive for the bibtex processor. Seemed like an > obvi

Re: re-scanning bibliography for org-cite

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 10:12 AM Eric S Fraga wrote: > > Dear all, > > simple question: how can I get org-cite to rescan my bibliography (.bib) > file when it changes? When I'm writing a paper, as I'm doing now, I add > entries to my bibliography as I write but org-cite is not aware of any > new

Re: [PATCH] oc-bibtex.el: add :follow property from oc-basic

On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 11:58 AM Eric S Fraga wrote: > > Hi Bruce, > > thank you for the quick response. > > On Thursday, 21 Oct 2021 at 11:27, Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > Maybe I'm missing something, but why is that necessary? > > It's highly likely that

Re: Keyword completion list: uppercase or lowercase? (was: Shower thought: submit an IETF RFC to register Org as a MIME type)

On Sat, Oct 23, 2021 at 9:41 AM Ihor Radchenko wrote: > > Carlos Pita writes: > > >>> But then c-a-p is very lenient since it lists lower and upper case block > >>> variants even when I typed a lower case prefix, and upper case usually > >>> will go first in the list, hence promoting a seemingly

[PATCH] oc-basic: support biblatex date field

This is a tiny change that just checks for a 'date' field if 'year' is nil, and if present, grabs the first four characters. Bruce From feee2ca6d54d3495050de334c258438950494372 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Bruce D'Arcus Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2021 08:17:43 -0400 Subject:

[PATCH] oc-basic: add shorten-name function

replying to the earlier one; is that correct? From c1b634f5c8a31ad98f7453b77fd45ab9322f9cf2 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Bruce D'Arcus Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2021 08:42:27 -0400 Subject: [PATCH] oc-basic: Add function to shorten names * lisp/oc-basic.el (org-cite-basic--shorten-names): new function to shorten author

Project name change: bibtex-actions -> citar

For those of you who have been using oc-bibtex-actions with org-cite, two relevant name changes: First, packages are now "citar" and "citar-org", and the melpa recipe simply "citar". Naturally all related variable and functions names also change accordingly. Second, the org-cite processor name i

Re: [PATCH] oc-basic: support biblatex date field

On Tue, Nov 2, 2021 at 1:44 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > "Bruce D'Arcus" writes: > > > This is a tiny change that just checks for a 'date' field if 'year' is > > nil, and if present, grabs the first four characters. >

Re: re-scanning bibliography for org-cite

On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 12:21 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > oc-basic relies on a cache. The cache key contains a hash of the > contents of the bib file. So whenever the bib file is modified, the > cache is invalidated, and oc-basic parses again the file. Of course; clever! Bruce

Re: [PATCH] oc-basic: support biblatex date field

On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 11:16 AM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > I pushed a change along these lines in bugfix branch. Thank you! > Please let me know if it works for you. This returns the correct result. (org-cite-basic--get-year "kohn2005" nil) How do I get that in the basic activate processor too

Re: [PATCH] c-csl : accept relative CSL filenames

On Thu, Nov 4, 2021 at 6:20 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > I think there are two ways forward when a relative file name is used: > > 1. First check `org-cite-csl-styles-dir' and, if it is nil, expand >against `default-directory'; > > 2. Drop `org-cite-csl-styles-dir' and always expand against >

Re: Project name change: bibtex-actions -> citar

On Fri, Nov 5, 2021 at 10:23 AM Eric S Fraga wrote: > > On Sunday, 31 Oct 2021 at 18:49, Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > For those of you who have been using oc-bibtex-actions with org-cite, > > two relevant name changes: > > > > First, packages are now "cita

Re: [org-cite] CSL processor, APA Style, and no-date citations

On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 9:59 AM Rudolf Adamkovič wrote: > I would like to start using the new citations with the APA Style. To cite in > APA, I use a CSL file. Everything works well with Pandoc, but with Org, all > citations with no "date" BibTeX field render as "$AUTHOR" instead of "$AUTHOR >

Re: [org-cite] CSL processor, APA Style, and no-date citations

On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 12:47 PM Rudolf Adamkovič wrote: > In the meantime, can I use the BibLaTeX backend (or something else) for > *HTML* export? I don't believe so, unless there's some good latex -> html solution I'm not aware of. Bruce

Re: [DISCUSSION] Refactoring fontification system

On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 9:11 AM Ihor Radchenko wrote: > WDYT? I don't understand all the technical details, but it sounds like a GREAT idea to me in general! Bruce

org-cite support merged for Doom biblio module

Just a head's up that org-cite support for the Doom Emacs biblio module is now merged. Currently works best with the new, and now default, vertico completion module, which uses my citar package. So basically, make sure the following are uncommented in your init.el file: - biblio - vertico - org

Re: insert automatically a reference to a section header and a link

On Wed, Nov 17, 2021 at 12:18 PM Uwe Brauer wrote: > > I type "As we have seen in section [[*Intro]]" (literally, I tend to > > not use any keybindings or function to insert the link). This (the > > "*Intro" inside double square brackets) is called an internal link to > > headlines and they are a

[oc-basic] fontification weirdness

I can't fully pin this down, but I and a couple of others I've discussed this with are seeing the following behavior. With this example: a citation [cite:@couper2014] and another [cite:@kohn2006] ... the first citation is highlighted, and the second (and any subsequent) is not. In some way I ca

Re: [oc-basic] fontification weirdness

On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 4:57 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > "Bruce D'Arcus" writes: > > > I can't fully pin this down, but I and a couple of others I've > > discussed this with are seeing the following behavior. > > > &

Re: [oc-basic] fontification weirdness

On Fri, Nov 26, 2021 at 5:48 AM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > It should now be fixed. Thanks. Confirmed; thanks! Bruce

Re: oc-biblatex too aggressive in replacing styles

On Sun, Nov 28, 2021, 12:04 PM Rasmus wrote: However, I think it is currently too aggressive in overwriting styles. > > Could it perhaps accept any style that is given in > ‘org-cite-biblatex-options’ / ‘org-latex-packages-alist’ and only > overwrite it if another style is explicitly specified in

Re: [oc-csl] org-cite-csl-styles-dir and default-directory

On Sun, Nov 28, 2021, 11:25 AM Rasmus wrote: > One frustration with oc-csl.el is that is does not like relative dirs, > which I guess is fine overall as one would probably store styles > centrally, somewhere, similarly to LaTeX. > > However, one niece that would seem useful is to simply dump some

Re: oc-biblatex too aggressive in replacing styles

On Sun, Nov 28, 2021 at 12:19 PM Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2021, 12:04 PM Rasmus wrote: > >> However, I think it is currently too aggressive in overwriting styles. >> >> Could it perhaps accept any style that is given in >> ‘org-cite-biblate

Re: "Orgdown", the new name for the syntax of Org-mode

On Sun, Nov 28, 2021 at 4:34 PM Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: > > Considering the total incompatibility between markdown and org-mode it does > not seem to me that ’orgdown’ is a useful name. It will only confuse people > and generate useless comments and counter-comments wherever org-mode synta

[org-cite] autoload oc processors?

Is there any reason not to autoload the processors? Bruce

Re: [org-cite] autoload oc processors?

On Sun, Nov 28, 2021 at 5:19 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > "Bruce D'Arcus" writes: > > > Is there any reason not to autoload the processors? > > I am not sure about what you mean. Could you elaborate? Primarily I am asking if there's

Re: [ANN] ox-pandoc, revived

On Tue, Nov 30, 2021 at 7:50 AM Alex Fenton wrote: > The current version includes initial support for org citations in Org 9.5. > This feature is experimental and I welcome feedback and reports on this or > any other aspect of the package. Did pandoc get support for org-cite? There's been bas

Re: [ANN] ox-pandoc, revived

On Tue, Nov 30, 2021 at 9:27 AM Alex Fenton wrote: > > On 30/11/2021 15:09, Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > AFAIK pandoc still doesn't support the official Org Mode syntax. > > ox-pandoc relies on the fact that it first exports to an intermediate > org file before handing o

Re: Concrete suggestions to improve Org mode third-party integration :: an afterthought following Karl Voit's Orgdown proposal

On Sun, Dec 5, 2021 at 8:42 AM Tim Cross wrote: > I think your working off a false premise. Your view is that org mode > should be available in other editors/software so that others can realise > the power and benefits it provides. I can understand that position. > > However, the FSF position wou

Re: Org-cite stuck in Helm minibuffer [9.5.1 (9.5.1-g36086a @ /home/dan/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.5.1/)]

Presumably you're using the default "basic" org-cite-insert-processor? If yes, that's just how it's designed, using completing-read. Perhaps you could customize the keybinding for exiting to get the behavior you want? On Mon, Dec 6, 2021 at 7:56 AM Daniel Nemenyi wrote: > > > Hello, > > I'm fin

Re: Org-cite stuck in Helm minibuffer [9.5.1 (9.5.1-g36086a @ /home/dan/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.5.1/)]

On Mon, Dec 6, 2021 at 8:09 AM Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > Perhaps you could customize the keybinding for exiting to get the > behavior you want? Or perhaps a better solution is for someone to write an insert-processor for helm-bibtex. It's not hard to write them. Bruce

Re: Org-cite stuck in Helm minibuffer [9.5.1 (9.5.1-g36086a @ /home/dan/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.5.1/)]

On Mon, Dec 6, 2021 at 8:51 AM John Kitchin wrote: > org-ref should not get any credit for this. Certainly not, but I don't believe anyone mentioned org-ref in this thread? Bruce

Re: Org-cite stuck in Helm minibuffer [9.5.1 (9.5.1-g36086a @ /home/dan/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.5.1/)]

On Mon, Dec 6, 2021 at 9:33 AM Daniel Nemenyi wrote: > Apologies, I did ('Thanks org-ref I'm done...'), slip of the tongue. Oh, I missed that; sorry John. > Could have a go though if someone could give me a pointer? But if this is > left to the user, perhaps we should include a line in the docu

Re: Org-cite stuck in Helm minibuffer [9.5.1 (9.5.1-g36086a @ /home/dan/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.5.1/)]

On Wed, Dec 8, 2021 at 8:17 AM Daniel Nemenyi wrote: > > With Selectrum, ... (don't know what the keybinding here is) > > Just installed Selectrum to find out. C-j (selectrum-submit-exact-input) does > the trick. If you like Selectrum (Vertico is another recent, similar, alternative), you might

[org-cite] pandoc adds initial read/write support

John MacFarlane merged initial support for org-cite to the pandoc org reader and writer. Only available in master ATM, but could use real-world testing, including of the org-ref -> org-cite conversion, which you can get by using org as both input and output format. Bruce

Re: Bibliographies on export with ox-context and ox-epub

On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 11:42 AM juh wrote: > > On 12.01.22 15:53, Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Note that Org Cite and Org Ref are, unfortunately, incompatible > > projects. Org Cite defines citations as a new kind of object, whereas > > Org Ref extends links to create citations. In short, you canno

oc-basic load performance

I've seen a number of people note how slow loading of BibTeX files is in oc-basic. Just wondering: do we know why, and whether there are opportunities to improve it? For comparison, parsebib (which I use in citar) is much faster. Bruce

Re: oc-basic load performance

sure why scrolling would be impacted. On Sun, Mar 13, 2022 at 7:28 PM Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > I've seen a number of people note how slow loading of BibTeX files is in > oc-basic. > > Just wondering: do we know why, and whether there are opportunities to > improve it?

Re: [BUG] org-cite: 10 second hang opening a ~4k org file with 10MB bibtex library [9.5.2 (9.5.2-g91681f @ /home/jdm204/.config/emacs/straight/build/org/)]

Thanks for posting this! For Nicolas et al, my more general question about performance with oc-basic was related to this, so you can ignore that. On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 1:01 PM Jamie Matthews wrote: > > # Issue > Starting emacs with emacs -Q, then navigating to a minimal example org file > wit

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 8:09 AM Vikas Rawal wrote: > What is the general view of the community about this? Is there a > comprehensive discussion of pros and cons of each? Not really, but there's John's summary here: https://github.com/jkitchin/org-ref#what-about-org-cite The high-level discus

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 10:08 AM Vikas Rawal wrote: >> >> > What is the general view of the community about this? >> >> I don't know about the general view of the community, but, as a data >> point, I find it very sad. > > > Exactly how I feel. Particularly so because org-cite was indeed inspired

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 9:42 AM Ihor Radchenko wrote: > For citar, why not simply using ivy-bibtex? It supports org-cite, AFAIK. Not really; or rather minimally. Ivy-bibtex supports, for example, inserting of org-cite citations, but not via org-cite-insert. So there are currently no org-cite p

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 4:21 PM Dominik Schrempf wrote: > For what it’s worth, I use `org-ref` because fine-grained citation export with > LaTeX (using BibTeX or BibLaTeX) only works with `org-ref`, and not with > `org-cite`. Part of the challenge is this isn't an apples-apples comparison; org-c

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 4:24 AM Dominik Schrempf wrote: > I am trying out `org-cite' right now. It works much better than the last time > (I > am using the `biblatex' backend right now). However, I can not find any > documentation about the available /styles/. > > They are mentioned here:

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 8:23 AM John Kitchin wrote: >> A package could be created, say `org-cite-literal-biblatex' which is just a >> copy >> of `oc-biblatex.el' with a different default `org-cite-biblatex-styles' and >> `org-cite-biblatex-style-shortcuts' (or just sets those variables in >> `or

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 8:41 AM Dominik Schrempf wrote: > > Thank you, I can use `citar-insert-edit` to perform this action. You can actually just use org-cite-insert, which is context aware. > Now, I failed to create a full citation in the text. This corresponds to the > `\fullcite{}' command i

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 9:13 AM Dominik Schrempf wrote: > > “Bruce D’Arcus” writes: > > > On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 8:41 AM Dominik Schrempf > > wrote: > >> > >> Thank you, I can use `citar-insert-edit` to perform this action. > > > > You can actually just use org-cite-insert, which is context awa

Re: =org-cite= links do not work in the =#+title=

There are restrictions on where citations are allowed, and this is one of them. Citar, and I think the oc-basic, insert processors won't allow you to insert citations in those places. Usually there are technical reasons for the restrictions (IIRC having to do with fontification?), but sometimes N

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 10:41 AM Max Nikulin wrote: ... > A bit of routine work will alleviate some user issues: > - add missed styles The initial list of style-command mappings was pretty comprehensive, but we left out some of the more obscure biblatex commands because unsure if they were need

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Tue, Mar 22, 2022 at 10:42 AM Max Nikulin wrote: > > On 21/03/2022 22:19, Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 10:41 AM Max Nikulin wrote: > > > >> A bit of routine work will alleviate some user issues: > >> - add missed styles > > >

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Wed, Mar 23, 2022 at 8:52 AM Max Nikulin wrote: > > On 23/03/2022 00:20, Bruce D'Arcus wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 22, 2022 at 10:42 AM Max Nikulin wrote: > >> > >> John Kitchin, this thread, Sun, 20 Mar 2022 20:31:29 -0400. > >> https://list.orgmode.org

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Wed, Mar 23, 2022 at 5:27 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > Dominik Schrempf writes: > > > (add-to-list ’org-cite-biblatex-styles ’(“full” nil “fullcite” nil nil)) > > > > (This or something similar should be added upstream). > > I can add it, but "full" is already the name of a variant

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Wed, Mar 23, 2022 at 6:04 PM Nicolas Goaziou wrote: > > Hello, > > "Bruce D'Arcus" writes: > > > On Wed, Mar 23, 2022 at 5:27 PM Nicolas Goaziou > > wrote: > > >> I can add it, but "full" is already the name of a variant

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Wed, Mar 23, 2022 at 1:19 PM Max Nikulin wrote: > My point was that it should not be unconsciously ignored. Since the > message was long enough, this particular complain may remain unnoticed. > I can not say that I fully agree with your decision, but I respect it. I > had no intention to upset

Re: #2 Org mode profiling meetup on Sat, Mar 26 (was: Org mode profiling meetup on Sat, Feb 26 (was: profiling latency in large org-mode buffers (under both main & org-fold feature)))

On Wed, Mar 23, 2022 at 7:10 AM Ihor Radchenko wrote: > > Dear all, > > There were several people who came to the last meetup looking for > information about debugging Org mode. The last meetup was rather > unhelpful in this regard since we dove into a specific use-case. > > I plan to try once mor

[oc] provide style/citation preview?

This is an idea related to an issue John Kitchin and I were trying to sort out a few months back, that he mentioned in another thread. https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/2022-03/msg00274.html The question is how to help users understand the relation between oc styles and target outp

Re: [oc] provide style/citation preview?

On Thu, Mar 24, 2022 at 12:33 PM Vikas Rawal wrote: >> So I'm just wondering how best to dynamically generate those previews, >> perhaps even just using a pre-selected reference*, and if maybe oc >> could make that easier? >> > > Some kind of overlay that shows citations as they would (at least a

Re: [oc] provide style/citation preview?

On Fri, Mar 25, 2022 at 8:55 AM John Kitchin wrote: > I think this kind of preview is well-suited for external packages. You may be right. > There is a subtle point I ran into with this preview approach though, > and that is what is the backend export you want to see? People expect > one source

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

I obviously can't speak for John, but on this: On Fri, Mar 25, 2022 at 1:11 PM Max Nikulin wrote: > > On 21/03/2022 18:51, John Kitchin wrote: > > > > citenum and bibentry are the only two I am not sure have a CSL analog. As I said in an earlier message, it's no problem to add these. Someone can

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Sun, Mar 27, 2022 at 3:41 PM John Kitchin wrote: ... > Regarding that org-cite adds an abstraction layer, how else could one > interpret this (from > https://blog.tecosaur.com/tmio/2021-07-31-citations.html#cite-syntax) > other than abstraction: > > [cite/na/b:@key] or [cite/noauthor/bare:@ke

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Sun, Mar 27, 2022 at 12:00 PM John Kitchin wrote: > > > Nicolas Goaziou writes: > > > Hello, > > > > Max Nikulin writes: > > > >> Nicolas, concerning a new thread, I have an impression that you are > >> busy with over activities since you are participating in discussions > >> not so frequentl

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Mon, Mar 28, 2022 at 8:37 AM Max Nikulin wrote: > > On 28/03/2022 02:40, John Kitchin wrote: > > Max Nikulin writes: > >> On 21/03/2022 18:51, John Kitchin wrote: > > > > Rather than rehash a lot of experiences, I really encourage you to try > > writing a processor that can support this. Or eve

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Tue, Mar 29, 2022 at 11:23 AM Max Nikulin wrote: ... > >> You even have managed to convince me that, besides adding missing style > >> names, some existing ones should be adjusted. noauthor/bare for citeyear > >> example makes for me much more sense ... > > > > This does need some attention, b

Re: org-cite styles as flags (idea)

ies, so the code discards ones > inconsistent with provided criteria. E.g. (:bare t :author nil :noauthor > t :full nil) for \citeyear, :caps does not matter. > > As at was suggested earlier, /year modifier existing in oc-csl should be > implemented for oc-natbib. > > [cite/author/no

Re: citations: org-cite vs org-ref 3.0

On Thu, Mar 31, 2022 at 11:27 AM Max Nikulin wrote: > >> Emphasis and bold markers may appear in plain text export. Behavior of > >> styles is > >> not uniform in respect to adding (unbreakable?) space before citation. > > > > Sorry; not following here again. Isn't the space before a citat

Re: org-cite and text/Unicode export

On Sat, Apr 2, 2022 at 10:50 AM Max Nikulin wrote: > I am unsure to what degree it is Org issue, it may be partially > citeproc.el or CSL style issues. One quick way to narrow this down is to run it through pandoc, which supports org-cite. It uses a different, haskell-based, CSL processor. Bru

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