Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status updates

Thanks for the update Jude. I'm still experimenting with vdev with an LFS build as well as a Slackware build. Really hoping we can finally cut off udev eventually for something compatible. Thanks for the update Jude. Keep up the great work. Sent from my Windows Phone ___

Re: [Dng] acpi and systemd

Having watched other systems transitioning to systemd, I wouldn't be surprised if they did, or the projects get pushed into forced deprecation as ConsoleKit did before it was revived. -Jim > Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 08:19:25 -0400 > From: hend...@topoi.pooq.com > To: dng@lists.dyne.org > Subjec

Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status updates

>From my personal knowledge, having built LFS a few times, though this doesn't >compare with other distributions as the purposes of /(root), /usr, /opt, and >/usr/local have changed over the years: /(root) is where boot-time software is to be installed that must be readily available when the s

Re: [Dng] About (k)dbus in LKML

The discussion has not been favorable towards the adoption from current reading on LKML. Past tests have not proven reliability, nor any significant increase of speed of messaging across the IPC. Linus seems to be of no love for it. IMO from the collective discussion, kdbus doesn't seem to be r

Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status updates

re.html > > Anyway, symlinking /bin to /usr/bin is quite strange. > > Nik > > Am Donnerstag, 30. April 2015 schrieb James Powell: > > From my personal knowledge, having built LFS a few times, though this > > doesn't compare with other distributions as the purpos

Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status updates

I respectfully like the aspect of the FHS. While parts of it are dated and could use a recasting, the core logic of separating kernel, admin, and user tools, libraries, and having them available in stages. It shouldn't be scrapped by any means, or unified. Tools as certain stages need to be mad

Re: [Dng] Debian Dev: anti-systemd people hate women; thus respectable people should not support anti-systemd stance.

Sorry, for my input here, but the title says nothing but laughable bullshit. There is no evidence anywhere scientific or not that being anti-systemd makes you a woman hater. I'm anti-systemd and have been happily married for 12 years. This seems more of a spin mastering by radicals wanting to pu

Re: [Dng] still failing to install Devuan through debootstrap

Has there been any inkling yet of a Devuan iso or bootdisk that we can unpack something similar to a Gentoo-like stage3 tarball that needs minimal configuring? -Jim > Date: Sat, 2 May 2015 18:47:46 +0200 > From: arya...@chello.at > To: dng@lists.dyne.org > Subject: Re: [Dng] still failing to in

Re: [Dng] Linux boot documentation

Just some points: 1. The kernel loads the initramfs or ondisk init depending on which is found first in order by initramfs>init-prog. 2. No mentioning of bsd-style init which simplifies sysvinit usages. 3. S6, perp, and daemontools-encore are service supervisors only, not true init, as they st

Re: [Dng] A novice attempt to speed up Devuan development

Technically eudev is udev that is preextracted from the source. There is no real difference between it and the systemd-udev code... yet. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Anto Sent: ‎5/‎5/‎2015 12:02 PM To: Peter Maloney

Re: [Dng] why someone might want systemd on devuan

Plus, libsystemd is also a static library which everything has to link against. I haven't messed with systemd for a while, but last I remember there was no dynamically shared object version of the library. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Edward Bartolo

Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status updates

Yes, we need another MacroShaft screwing us over a barrel... NOT. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Laurent Bercot Sent: ‎5/‎5/‎2015 3:21 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status updates

Re: [Dng] Please stop vain discussion

When it comes to building packages, you can always run "rm" with an option against the temporary directory where the packer is targeting to remove any files related to systemd, use sed or patches against existing scripts or import custom scripts and configurations, and then allow the packager to

Re: [Dng] Is it useful to create a .so file to replace functions imported from libsystemd & Co.?

LoginKit supposedly implements parts of the libsystemd IPC against DBus while passing the remainder of logind function calls back to ConsoleKit2. LoginKit only covers the "inhibit()" function while everything else is covered by ConsoleKit2, for now at least. In LoginKit it only uses what the aut

Re: [Dng] A novice attempt to speed up Devuan development

Yes. Eudev should be the target goal for now until Jude can get vdev stabilized. There's also the aspect of using Busybox-mdev (mdev-like-a-boss project has a lot of insight on this for generalized usages) though this would forgo any allowances of evdev drivers for input devices and require the

Re: [Dng] Which source version fo systemd are you stripping code from?

Practically every part of systemd has been modularized or supplemented out. Some of which aren't needed at all. systemd-init - uselessd cloned the entire init and service supervisor. Other init programs of a similar nature include sysvinit/sinit+perp/runit/s6/daemontools-encore, runit (standalo

Re: [Dng] Which source version fo systemd are you stripping code from?

Etcnet was very involved with scripts which was always a problem for Red Hat. Many Red Hat scripts have been known for being substandard in quality and reliability, possibly a reason why they wanted systemd so bad. However, any daemon can work well if proper scripting is applied and mistakes ar

Re: [Dng] Which source version fo systemd are you stripping code from?

ailto:ja...@realitysend.com> Sent: ‎5/‎7/‎2015 7:46 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: Re: [Dng] Which source version fo systemd are you stripping code from? On 05/07/2015 09:59 PM, James Powell wrote: > Etcnet was very involved with scripts which was always a p

Re: [Dng] Which source version fo systemd are you stripping code from?

I actually like netplug myself. Although it duplicates ifup/ifdown and acts as a dhcp/static IP client and is fairly autonomous, it's a very sane project that does it's job, does it well, and isn't intrusive. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Isaac Dunham

Re: [Dng] Suckless init and friends

As a co-submission, the Runit-for-LFS project over at Bitbucket is freely available. We also have a subproject called init-shim which duplicates many of the sysvinit software. https://bitbucket.org/ReaperX7/runit-for-lfs If Devuan can find it useful, by all means clone and redevelop as needed.

Re: [Dng] A novice attempt to speed up Devuan development

> And on the other side, anything actually committed by the author means > it is part of/a fix for eudev development alone. Here's an example of > such a commit: > > https://github.com/gentoo/eudev/commit/93fc111c3c701a588f6ba7c39e514f8ffec425a4 > > Fix builds on gcc 4.5? Yeah, I can see sys

[Dng] Systemd discussions at LinuxQuestions.

Unfortunately the moderators at LinuxQuestions have closed off discussing the Devuan stance topic that had been open and participate in over the repeated squabbling, though honestly, very little was done other than the people who seemed offended by the choice of Devuan's developers lack of choic

Re: [Dng] Systemd discussions at LinuxQuestions.

ence I can understand why other moderators like unSpawn prefer not to see anything like that anymore. Too bad that the Devuan thread was closed down, but IMHO it was not because of Devuan as such: somebody, apparently, is not willing to clean up heaps of trolls' rubbish once again. Best, Phi

Re: [Dng] Systemd discussions at LinuxQuestions.

I agree T. J. The problem is too much "thinking" about problems, rather than offering a clear solution other than scrapping the fore and replacing it entirely seems to be the source of the problem. One argument I stand by adamantly is that while sysvinit was imperfect in design, it left room t

Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status update (2015-05-03)

Thanks Jude. The Slackware package is delayed, but only due to the lack of a Slackware style script. I might try to ask one of the Slackware team for assistance when I resume work. However, the package is fairly much completed in terms of installation points and directory setup. Sent from my W

Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status update (2015-05-03)

dows Phone From: Jude Nelson<mailto:jud...@gmail.com> Sent: ‎5/‎14/‎2015 12:33 AM To: James Powell<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com> Cc: dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: Re: [Dng] [dng] vdev status update (2015-05-03) Hi James, On T

Re: [Dng] A novice attempt to speed up Devuan development

Not exactly. Eudev is free of systemd, but it shares nearly 99.5% of it's code base with systemd-udev, plus some minor fix ups from the Gentoo developers. It's name technically means Extracted udev. You get the same udev if you build the systemd-udev with an extraction kit as eudev, minus the f

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

Hey guys, let me clarify the Slackware position on systemd. Patrick has no intent on enforcing the usage of systemd upon Slackware and it's users unless it becomes an unavoidable issue. So far, this has not been the case in the slightest, and we doubt it will be. Slackware intends to keep the b

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

slacking. - Original Message - From: "James Powell" To:"Anto" , , Cc: Sent:Tue, 19 May 2015 14:18:40 -0700 Subject:RE: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe? Hey guys, let me clarify the Slackware position on systemd. Patrick has no intent on enforcing

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

y way to add another init to your system. These two init systems are much easier to add to uncontaminated distros like Slackware and Devuan. SteveT Steve Litt May 2015 featured book: Quit Joblessness: Start Your Own Business http://www.troubleshooters.com/startbiz On Wed, 20 May 2015 21:25:51 +

[Dng] Suggestion for vdev

Jude, when vdev gets mature enough, could you submit an init script to the OpenRC project, please? Thanks, Jim ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

True, but developers are banding together to resist this as well, and fork projects as needed. Sent from my Windows Phone From: toki Sent: ‎5/‎22/‎2015 8:27 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: Re: [Dng] Slac

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

ct: Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe? On 23/05/2015 05:18, James Powell wrote: > True, but developers are banding together to resist this as well, and fork > projects as needed. But what happens when one has to fork everything from Firefox to Enkive to Hadoop to Tryton? I&#

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

3 May 2015 07:29:56 + toki wrote: > > > On 23/05/2015 05:18, James Powell wrote: > > True, but developers are banding together to resist this as well, > > and fork projects as needed. > > But what happens when one has to fork everything from Firefox to > Enkive to

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

OpenRC supports a lot of platforms. Technically, OpenRC solves the problem of sysvinit in every way. Centralized scripts, tree based dependencies, service supervision on some level, and parallel start up of multiple service trees. Nothing systemd offers other than mediocre code, bad designs, an

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

SMF is more akin to uselessd, s6, and runit. It's an init system only. I think even launchd is only an init system as well. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Dragan FOSS Sent: ‎5/‎23/‎2015 3:42 PM To: Nuno Magalhães

Re: [Dng] The more things change, the more they remain the same

Mediocre developers who are arrogant end up in the unemployment lines... Beautiful phrase. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Steve Litt Sent: ‎5/‎23/‎2015 3:17 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: [Dng] The

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

y Windows Phone From: Dragan FOSS<mailto:dragan.f...@gmx.com> Sent: ‎5/‎23/‎2015 4:55 PM To: James Powell<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com>; dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe? On 05/24/15 01:44 AM, James Powell wrot

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

Remember Lennart's remarks about BSD? "BSD isn't relevant anymore. It's a toy OS." Sent from my Windows Phone From: Hendrik Boom Sent: ‎5/‎23/‎2015 7:02 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: Re: [Dng] Slackwar

Re: [Dng] Everyone's favorite DE: GNOME3

I wonder if gnome-logs could be patched to work with loginkit and rsyslog/syslog-ng/sysklogd rather than just systemd-journald? If it's just a log parser/viewer, it must be possible. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Jaret Cantu Sent:

Re: [Dng] automounting in a window manager

Automounting is strictly done via udisks and udisks2 which work with udev (udev-classic, eudev, or systemd-udev) with modern DEs. There are scripts than can automount devices using the classic method that can be inserted into the startup routine of a WM though, or you can assign them to be mount

Re: [Dng] Lennart reacts to the release of Devuan

OMG!!! LMAO @ video. Spot on, spot on. Of course this was one of many parodies of that scene, but still it's hilarious. To whoever edited that *standing ovation* -Jim > Date: Sun, 31 May 2015 21:47:48 +0200 > From: phi...@posteo.de > To: dng@lists.dyne.org > Subject: Re: [Dng] Lennart react

Re: [Dng] Lennart reacts to the release of Devuan

Though I do have to admit, someone should edit in that Jude Nelson was developing vdev and Slackware was still against the adoption and just recently got a full import of OpenRC on the SBo for further hilarity. All in good fun guys. -Jim From: james4...@hotmail.com To: phi...@posteo.de; dng@li

[Dng] New systemd release notes regarding udev.

https://github.com/systemd/systemd/blob/master/NEWS It seems udev is getting split up between several projects within systemd and GNOME. It seems gudev is being handed off in the future to GNOME and parts of udev are being pushed deeper into systemd. I'm not surprised at this, since kdbus didn'

Re: [Dng] New systemd release notes regarding udev.

ers. -Jim From: Jude Nelson<mailto:jud...@gmail.com> Sent: ‎6/‎1/‎2015 6:58 PM To: James Powell<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com> Cc: dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: Re: [Dng] New systemd release notes regarding udev. Hi Jim, > It seems udev is getting sp

Re: [Dng] automounting in a window manager

Doesn't udevil have a port on BSD? Off kilter question but if the answer is yes, then I can expand the idea I have. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Rob Owens Sent: ‎6/‎1/‎2015 10:30 AM To: shraptor Cc: dng@lists.

Re: [Dng] automounting in a window manager

automounting in a window manager James Powell wrote: > Doesn't udevil have a port on BSD? Off kilter question but >if the answer is yes, then I can expand the idea I have. A Google search turned up this: http://ftp4.se.freebsd.org/pub/ubuntu/pool/universe/u/udevil/ Not sure if that is w

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

If the firmware aids in compatibility and driver support then yes, include it. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Arnt Gulbrandsen Sent: ‎6/‎3/‎2015 1:50 AM To: dng@lists.dyne.org; Daniel Reurich

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

While keeping to the libre creed is nice, at least having the option for firmware will help compatibility with hardware that requires it. Sadly, this is becoming more commonplace as newer hardware is released. More and more modern hardware requires firmware. The question isn't about including i

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

. Nothing else. Sent from my Windows Phone From: KatolaZ<mailto:kato...@freaknet.org> Sent: ‎6/‎3/‎2015 6:43 AM To: James Powell<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com> Cc: KatolaZ<mailto:kato...@freaknet.org>; Daniel Reurich<mailto:dan...@centurion.net.nz&

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

Firmware is part of the kernel in a sense because it is loaded by the kernel at boot. It only interacts with the kernel and the kernel modules to provide any missing functionality, like a header file does, except rather than C code, it's prebuilt binary language code. It is not technically soft

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

I agree that there should be a scan ran to inform the system user that binary firmware is needed at boot, but likewise, if the system needs it, it should be an offered option at installation time also, just not offered by default as enabled. The user must at least select the option to install

Re: [Dng] Need some advice to compile consolekit2 for amd64

Polkit, Eudev, and dbus should be okay to install. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Edward Bartolo Sent: ‎6/‎4/‎2015 11:49 PM To: dng Subject: [Dng] Need some advice to compile consolekit2 for amd64 I am trying t

Re: [Dng] straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

I think this might be the best option... Have firmware only for networking devices and scsi/sata/ide controllers on the net installation disk. At least let the system support vectors be 100% or as close to 100% compatible as possible. If it is needed post-install the have it offered. Why? Devu

Re: [Dng] Puppy Linux, Devuan Puppy & hardware - Re: straw poll, non-free firmware for installers

>From my limited knowledge on licensing agreements, I think as long as there >are no restrictions on redistribution from the original people who provide the >firmware, it can be freely redistributed as long as the firmware isn't >decompiled or disassembled. I don't know, off hand, of any manufa

Re: [Dng] Hal and Vdev

DRM is provided by libhal.so. Many people have used a special Hal package called halflash over a Slackware. It works with Freshplayerplugin(libpepflashplayer) and FlashPlayer-Plugin. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Jude Nelson Sent: ‎6/‎

Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared ....

The problem is, kdbus isn't just an IPC, it's proprietary to systemd, and is the only software capable of utilizing it. Greg Hartman as the lead-takeover for Linus? Hell no. He'd give it to Lennart and Kay without batting an eye, and then shut out every developer save their own. Dare I say it,

Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared ....

Forking the kernel will be difficult, but honestly, it's the sane choice. I'm often reminded of the story of the pig who tried to eat everything. He popped and got turned into bacon after he ate too much. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Clarke Sideroad

Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared ....

Then this without a doubt is clear evidence that kdbus is in fact a systemd proprietary IPC. Has anyone heard of any software otherwise that will use kdbus at all, even in the least? Lennart is desperate to get kdbus in, but is making a critical error in judgment with this. No distribution has

Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared ....

r Kryn<mailto:k...@in2p3.fr> Sent: ‎6/‎20/‎2015 2:49 AM To: dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared Le 20/06/2015 11:06, James Powell a écrit : > Then this without a doubt is clear evidence that kdbus is in fact a > systemd proprie

Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared ....

Linus isn't stupid. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Jude Nelson Sent: ‎6/‎23/‎2015 6:20 PM To: KatolaZ Cc: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: Re: [DNG] We Must be Prepared Looks like L

Re: [DNG] Linus answers a question about systemd

Linus actually makes perfect sense on the question. "Doing things better" doesn't always mean "doing things right" or "doing things correctly". Systemd does things in a better way than traditional ways, but that doesn't necessarily make them the best options, the best choices, or the right ones

Re: [DNG] Linus answers a question about systemd

True, but at the same time one has to as, where is the kdbus daemon independent of systemd that can be used by non-systemd systems to accurately test how well it works? DBus currently has no such abilities to my knowledge. Sent from my Windows Phone From: KatolaZ

[DNG] ZFS root help needed.

Hey guys. I know this is out of the norm, and yes I know all about the CDDL, Btrfs, and other things, but I'm working with ZFS and need some help. I'm try to get my root file system which is at mountpoint=legacy with zpool ztank/linux/root dataset able to boot with the kernel. I have spl and zf

Re: [DNG] Testing - Please ignore and delete this email

Me either, but I just got the notice also. What are bounces anyway? Dead email addresses? Sent from my Windows Phone From: Anto Sent: ‎7/‎5/‎2015 1:50 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: [DNG] Testing - Please ig

Re: [DNG] systemd in wheezy, was: Re: bummer

I'm still hoping some of our user friendly non-systemd distributions remain systemd-free. My main concern is vdev. If Jude can miraculously break the seemingly indestructible spine of systemd, which is technically udev, the whole thing will collapse. Without udev, what hold does systemd even ha

Re: [DNG] vdev status update: performance, bugfixes, and udev events

Having this news brings us many steps closer to a full udev replacement. One step closer to shattering the stranglehold of udev forever. I just wish I could be at the Linux Conference when vdev goes RTM and completely shatters the hopes and dreams of systemd. I'd be, or try to be, the first to g

Re: [DNG] systemd in wheezy, was: Re: bummer

J. Duchene<mailto:t.j.duch...@gmail.com> Sent: ‎7/‎8/‎2015 11:06 AM To: 'James Powell'<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com>; 'dng'<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: RE: [DNG] systemd in wheezy, was: Re: bummer From: James Powell [mailto:james4...@hotmail.com

Re: [DNG] systemd in wheezy, was: Re: bummer

g the same work. Sent from my Windows Phone From: T.J. Duchene<mailto:t.j.duch...@gmail.com> Sent: ‎7/‎8/‎2015 11:06 AM To: 'James Powell'<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com>; 'dng'<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: RE: [DNG] sy

Re: [DNG] systemd in wheezy, was: Re: bummer

I don't care about the context of the formatting, as my mobile can receive any type of email and I never use a client on my computer other than a web browser, but I do care for the message itself and it's content. But I'll revamp what my points were: 1. GNU is an operating system, and Linux is

Re: [DNG] I am not using systemd and plan to avoid it

Look at the number who use it and dislike it... Sent from my Windows Phone From: Alberto Zuin - liste Sent: ‎7/‎15/‎2015 2:14 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: Re: [DNG] I am not using systemd and plan to avo

Re: [DNG] I am not using systemd and plan to avoid it

Calculated up: I use systemd and like it: 624 (36%) I use systemd and dislike it: 214 (12%) I am not using systemd and plan to use it: 87 (5%) I am not using systemd and plan to avoid it: 600 (35%) Other: 203 (12%) That means roughly only 711 people like and want to use systemd. That also mea

Re: [DNG] systemd in wheezy, was: Re: bummer

The thing about OpenEC scripts are is that they can be generalized for any distribution and work off of configuration files. Nobody ever said any init script is supposed to be easy. Init is complex, but it is supposed to have some complexity due to the fact you are starting and stopping critica

Re: [DNG] dng@lists.dyne.org

If the goal of Devuan is Debian sans-systemd, then no changes other than rebuilding packages to exclude systemd support is needed. No changes need to be made to anything other than the init couplings. There is no debating vi or nano. That's just B.S. What we should be concerned with is what to

Re: [DNG] dng@lists.dyne.org

And if ANY alternative init system is offered, COMPLETE script sets should be offered. No more throwing users to the wolves. There is no excuse for this. This crap caused enough problems leading many people I've known to avoid alternatives. Throwing users to the wolves is not an option, and neve

Re: [DNG] dng@lists.dyne.org

lly, I think that is Debian's POV too. Since they are switching to Systemd, no one is maintaining the S5 scripts, so in all likelihood they will be dropped in the future. I don't blame them for that, but it is unfortunate. Systemd still has some annoyances. On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 9:08 PM

Re: [DNG] devuan LTS

An LTS branch isn't needed if you do version controlled releases and sponsor support for versioned releases for at least 3-4 versions back. To be fair, I've used Slackware long enough to see how maintaining a versioned release can go right, and seen enough of Ubuntu to see how it can go horribly

Re: [DNG] devuan LTS

organization is institutionally incompetent. On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 12:57 AM James Powell wrote: > An LTS branch isn't needed if you do version controlled releases and > sponsor support for versioned releases for at least 3-4 versions back. > > To be fair, I've used Slack

Re: [DNG] devuan LTS

It's about sanity really and keeping things as simple as possible, but as sane as possible in the long term. Read that right... The long term. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Gregory Nowak Sent: ‎7/‎16/‎2015 10:44 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org<

Re: [DNG] devuan LTS

Phone From: Stephanie Daugherty<mailto:sdaughe...@gmail.com> Sent: ‎7/‎17/‎2015 2:25 AM To: dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: Re: [DNG] devuan LTS On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 1:50 AM James Powell wrote: > There is one thing I would recommend different that the sta

Re: [DNG] I am not using systemd and plan to avoid it

I care that my PID1 isn't going to have an instance where it could crash by doing something it shouldn't, and bloat itself in my virtual memory. Sent from my Windows Phone From: KatolaZ Sent: ‎7/‎17/‎2015 1:13 AM To: Gregory Nowak

Re: [DNG] Mate

If they don't use systemd dependencies then yes, otherwise, no. Sent from my Windows Phone From: Stanley Webb Sent: ‎7/‎17/‎2015 11:17 AM To: Dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: [DNG] Mate Will it be possible to instal

Re: [DNG] dng@lists.dyne.org

It's not just that, but why are there so many broken down packages? -bin, -dev, -meta, -src, -lib, -doc, etc. my God do we need this many? Many distributions use just one all inclusive package to avoid problems unless its a temporary dependency build time only. Yes, I'd say it broken, far worse

Re: [DNG] dng@lists.dyne.org

o final packaging, they can be moved and linked as needed. That's why you can insert various arguments into ./configure. From: KatolaZ<mailto:kato...@freaknet.org> Sent: ‎7/‎17/‎2015 1:47 PM To: James Powell<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com> Cc:

Re: [DNG] dng@lists.dyne.org

t; Sent: ‎7/‎17/‎2015 3:45 PM To: James Powell<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com> Cc: KatolaZ<mailto:kato...@freaknet.org>; T.J. Duchene<mailto:t.j.duch...@gmail.com>; dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Subject: Re: [DNG] dng@lists.dyne.org On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 0

Re: [DNG] startup scripts (was dng@lists.dyne.org)

The boot scripts can be somewhat universal, but not always. Runit and s6 require some very special and specific service and boot scripts for init, plus a lot of custom service scripts. These are what need the most attention. The init stage scripts are going to be unique to each init system as we

Re: [DNG] Newbie's lennard-gnomed

The PC-BSD system-BS-D was an April Fools joke. However, launchd is a completely different beast than systemd is. Launchd is more akin to SMF on Solaris/Illumos and s6 on GNU/Linux being init and service supervisors only, which are forward thinking. They still require other daemons to manage th

Re: [DNG] Upcoming Kali Linux 2.0 - systemd?

Oh wow. I've used Kali for testing security on networking routers and firewalls myself. I hope they can switch out to Devuan also. Be a real shame to see them get plagued by systemd. Often at times I forget how many specialized distributions for R&D and testing are Debian based. ___

Re: [DNG] openRC

Devuan appears to want to stick to sysvinit for the initial release. Afterwards however, is debatable, but regardless, sanity in init is going to be probably prevalent. I too favor OpenRC as well as it is really a sane way to extend sysvinit. From: Antonio Trkdz.

[DNG] Jeep Cherokee hacked

http://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/2015/07/21/hackers-discover-way-to-remotely-control-jeeps/?cmpid=cmty_twitter_fb It appears, from the looks of things, Ashley Madison isn't the only one getting hacked. I'm wondering how this is happening so rampantly recently, but I'm trying hard not to po

Re: [DNG] Will there be a MirDevuan "WTF"?

D-Bus isn't great, but currently it is still a cross-UNIX IPC in userspace. BSD uses it, Illumos uses it, and so does GNU/Linux. D-Bus is way down my list of software to steer clear of any more. From: miro.ro...@croatiafidelis.hr

Re: [DNG] Ashley Madison hack

The problem with some of these known attacks are the effectiveness of each. Example: Last night I was thinking about how it could have happened, but actually during a system evaluation I did in my head, I actually hit a large wall. Shadow can use cryptographic algorithms of at least 512-bit key

Re: [DNG] Multi-seat on Devuan, do we actually need that useless curiosity?

There is ConsoleKit2... From: Vlad Sent: ‎7/‎22/‎2015 5:49 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: [DNG] Multi-seat on Devuan, do we actually need that useless curiosity? I think that the pretty useless feature which

Re: [DNG] Will there be a MirDevuan "WTF"?

itch hunt on software projects. From: miro.ro...@croatiafidelis.hr<mailto:miro.ro...@croatiafidelis.hr> Sent: ‎7/‎22/‎2015 9:43 PM To: dng@lists.dyne.org<mailto:dng@lists.dyne.org> Cc: James Powell<mailto:james4...@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [DNG] Will there be a MirD

Re: [DNG] Will there be a MirDevuan "WTF"?

be running a dbus- or a poetterware- nothing. But I hope you at Devuan will be working to get a distro that can be installed hardened, no-dbus, no-any-poetterware and associates, and maybe one of the ways might be forking the MirDebian WTF to MirDevuan WTF for Devuan needs... But I am really n

Re: [DNG] A better default windows manager

CDE is a classic UNIX desktop, but it has long been since viable for modern usages. Xfce, in truth, was a modern replacement for it using Xforms since Motif was, at the time, under a different license. It bears the same classic layout minus some differences. However, last I had heard CDE was s

Re: [DNG] A better default windows manager

ject: Re: [DNG] A better default windows manager On 2015-07-24 20:48, James Powell wrote: > CDE is a classic UNIX desktop, but it has long been since viable for > modern usages. > > Xfce, in truth, was a modern replacement for it using Xforms since > Motif was, at the time, under a diff

Re: [DNG] A better default windows manager

CDE was the defacto desktop for many UNIX branded systems like IRIX, Solaris, HP-UX, and others until many replaced it with Gnome2, Xfce, KDE, and others. Sun/Oracle replaced CDE with Java Desktop Environment back on Solaris 10 I believe when OpenSolaris was still being developed. I think Solari

Re: [DNG] A better default windows manager

I seriously doubt Xfce will go fully into systemd since they forked ConsoleKit2 and have been updating it to perform all the work of logind. I just wish Xfce would write their own automount utility to replace udisks. From: Teodoro Santoni

Re: [DNG] automount, mount, and USB sticks

Eventually, and I kinda realized this, work may be needed to write a udisks replacement for vdev that can work off vdev without loosing functionality to udisks using applications and file managers, especially for non-Linux systems. Nothing fancy, but as long as it works and allows for some level

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