Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> *but* please undersatdn with your argumentation a lot of maintainers > could claim that their packages are in CORE for several reasons > because they are expected to be used from most users > please leave core be what core means > and as i clearly statet that i have open-vm-tools on nearly any

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Am 07.05.2013 19:48, schrieb Ravindra Kumar: > If there are strong use cases that don't require that functionality > then probably it makes sense to not be part of core, otherwise, I think > it makes more sense to make open-vm-tools part of @core because sooner > or later users will end up instal

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Am 07.05.2013 19:39, schrieb Ravindra Kumar: >> and why? > > open-vm-tools are required for anything that requires > co-ordination with the guest. Here are a few examples, > clean shutdown of guest from VM management interface, > guest consistent snapshots, collection/display of guest > resource

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> Well, no, that means it precisely *is* an issue :) that adds > open-vm-tools to the list of reasons we might want to have two > virt-agents groups, call them virt-agents and virt-agents-x or > something. You'd want open-vm-tools to be in one and open-vm-tools-x to > be in the other. I meant crea

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Tue, 2013-05-07 at 14:45 -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > >> Perhaps a virt-agents group that contains open-vm-tools, hypervkvpd, > >> qemu-guest-agent, etc? > > > Right, I was just thinking down those lines. Create such a group, and > > have it installed by default. Makes sure the tools are avai

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

>> Perhaps a virt-agents group that contains open-vm-tools, hypervkvpd, >> qemu-guest-agent, etc? > Right, I was just thinking down those lines. Create such a group, and > have it installed by default. Makes sure the tools are available in most > cases, but not in minimal installs, and allows them

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Tue, May 07, 2013 at 16:48:39 -0400, Matthew Miller wrote: On Tue, May 07, 2013 at 11:39:16AM -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > Keep in mind that @standard is just that -- installed as part of every > normal install. Ok, I think it should work open-vm-tools. Do I make the changes to comps or

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Tue, May 07, 2013 at 11:39:16AM -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > > Keep in mind that @standard is just that -- installed as part of every > > normal install. > Ok, I think it should work open-vm-tools. Do I make the changes to comps > or do I need to raise a bug for 'comps' maintainer? Yeah, I th

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Tue, 2013-05-07 at 14:45 -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Ravindra Kumar (ravindraku...@vmware.com) said: > > > @core is supposed to be the minimum functional install. It is my > > > understanding that, even under VMWare, open-vm-tools is not required for > > > the system to be functional, so o

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Ravindra Kumar (ravindraku...@vmware.com) said: > > @core is supposed to be the minimum functional install. It is my > > understanding that, even under VMWare, open-vm-tools is not required for > > the system to be functional, so open-vm-tools does not belong in @core. > > It is not required for

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> Keep in mind that @standard is just that -- installed as part of every > normal install. Ok, I think it should work open-vm-tools. Do I make the changes to comps or do I need to raise a bug for 'comps' maintainer? Thanks, Ravindra -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://adm

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Tue, May 07, 2013 at 10:48:01AM -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > If there are strong use cases that don't require that functionality > then probably it makes sense to not be part of core, otherwise, I think > it makes more sense to make open-vm-tools part of @core because sooner > or later users w

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Tue, May 07, 2013 at 10:48:01 -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: It is not required for system to be functional, but it also leaves a significant gap in the VM to be fully operational unless Tools are installed. I listed out a bunch of functionality that depends on open-vm-tools in my other resp

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> @core is supposed to be the minimum functional install. It is my > understanding that, even under VMWare, open-vm-tools is not required for > the system to be functional, so open-vm-tools does not belong in @core. It is not required for system to be functional, but it also leaves a significant

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> and why? open-vm-tools are required for anything that requires co-ordination with the guest. Here are a few examples, clean shutdown of guest from VM management interface, guest consistent snapshots, collection/display of guest resource usage information in VM management interface, guest automat

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Once upon a time, Ravindra Kumar said: > If someone can come up with any other bad side effects, I will be happy > to address that. @core is supposed to be the minimum functional install. It is my understanding that, even under VMWare, open-vm-tools is not required for the system to be functiona

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Am 07.05.2013 19:05, schrieb Ravindra Kumar: >> It might help to elaborate your reasoning. @core is going to be used by >> people trying to make minimal installs (with exactly what they need on >> top). It is hard to see why open-vm-tools would be considered necessary >> to every Fedora install.

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> It might help to elaborate your reasoning. @core is going to be used by > people trying to make minimal installs (with exactly what they need on > top). It is hard to see why open-vm-tools would be considered necessary > to every Fedora install. @standard would seem to make more sense I feel

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Tue, May 07, 2013 at 09:23:44 -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: Thinking more about it. I believe ideal will be to add 'open-vm-tools' to the @core group and add 'open-vm-tools-desktop' to the @standard group. It might help to elaborate your reasoning. @core is going to be used by people tryi

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> I think it's probably really better in the "@standard" package group, which > is one step up from core. People who want a minimal installation but know > they'll be in vmware can add it directly. Thanks Matthew. I think @standard package should work. Could you please help me with the process? I

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> I think it's probably really better in the "@standard" package group, which > is one step up from core. People who want a minimal installation but know > they'll be in vmware can add it directly. Thanks Matthew. I think @standard package should work. Could you please help me with the process? I

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 08:31:38PM -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > 1. Add open-vm-tools to the core package group I think it's probably really better in the "@standard" package group, which is one step up from core. People who want a minimal installation but know they'll be in vmware can add it di

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Mon, May 06, 2013 at 03:12:52PM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > On Mon, 2013-05-06 at 15:04 -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > > > If it is absolute no, I would proceed with the Anaconda patch if > > there is a good explanation/alternative to the 3 issues I have > > listed above. > > Talk to the a

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Mon, 2013-05-06 at 15:04 -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > If it is absolute no, I would proceed with the Anaconda patch if > there is a good explanation/alternative to the 3 issues I have > listed above. Talk to the anaconda devs first. I'm no expert on anaconda internals, but I play one on TV,

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Just picking the latest mail on this thread. >> I don't see why we would add this by default, the VM will function >> without is (unlike storage) and we don't add ovirt-guest-agent and >> other virt vendor's agents by default. > We do, in fact, include the SPICE agent stuff by default now. (Which

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Fri, 2013-05-03 at 11:59 +0100, Peter Robinson wrote: > On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 6:51 PM, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > Ravindra Kumar (ravindraku...@vmware.com) said: > >> (Batching a bunch of replies) > >> > >> > Install and uninstall looks a bit weird to me; what could be > >> > done is to make t

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Am 03.05.2013 13:30, schrieb Nicolas Mailhot: > Le Ven 3 mai 2013 01:46, Adam Williamson a écrit : > >> I don't really hate the 'let's just install it everywhere and make sure >> it doesn't run unless it's necessary' approach, but it is kinda lazy >> engineering, and it *does* waste space on tho

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On 3 May 2013 01:46, Adam Williamson wrote: > On Thu, 2013-05-02 at 22:44 +0200, Simone Caronni wrote: > > I think is already a bit too late, unfortunately. On my laptop: > > > > xorg-x11-drv-vmmouse-13.0.0-1.fc18.x86_64 > > xorg-x11-drv-vmware-12.0.2-3.20120718gite5ac80d8f.fc18.x86_64 > > xorg-x

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Le Ven 3 mai 2013 01:46, Adam Williamson a écrit : > I don't really hate the 'let's just install it everywhere and make sure > it doesn't run unless it's necessary' approach, but it is kinda lazy > engineering, and it *does* waste space on those small-space cases Peter > is always reminding us ab

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 6:51 PM, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Ravindra Kumar (ravindraku...@vmware.com) said: >> (Batching a bunch of replies) >> >> > Install and uninstall looks a bit weird to me; what could be >> > done is to make the package conditionally whether it's running >> > in a VMware VM or

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Thu, 2013-05-02 at 22:44 +0200, Simone Caronni wrote: > On 2 May 2013 22:24, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > I'm a bit worried that this might make it harder to produce > generic > cloud images [eg. using Oz]. But then again, perhaps people > making > generi

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Am 02.05.2013 22:45, schrieb Simone Caronni: > > > > On 2 May 2013 22:29, Reindl Harald > wrote: > recent and for fedora relevant kernels are including any server > relevant drivers, with 3.9 even vsock and vmci are in the upstream > kernel, for F19

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On 2 May 2013 22:29, Reindl Harald wrote: > drivers are a total different topic > > recent and for fedora relevant kernels are including any server > relevant drivers, with 3.9 even vsock and vmci are in the upstream > kernel, for F19 there is a 3.9 kernel available which works also > on F18 and

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On 2 May 2013 22:24, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > I'm a bit worried that this might make it harder to produce generic > cloud images [eg. using Oz]. But then again, perhaps people making > generic cloud images should use kickstarts and specify the precise > list of packages they want ... > I thi

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On 2 May 2013 21:44, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > VMWare is sure shooting itself in the foot (I've seen vmware consultants > force the removal of rpm-ized vmware tools from system images only to > discover they had no mean to update the non-rpm version three monhs later > when the image was largely d

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Am 02.05.2013 21:41, schrieb Nicolas Mailhot: > > Le Jeu 2 mai 2013 19:49, Ravindra Kumar a écrit : I can't see, how this can happen anyways. Anaconda just runs once (at installation), afterwards it can safely be removed (correct me, if I'm wrong). Could you please expla

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Thu, May 02, 2013 at 01:51:30PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Ravindra Kumar (ravindraku...@vmware.com) said: > > (Batching a bunch of replies) > > > > > Install and uninstall looks a bit weird to me; what could be > > > done is to make the package conditionally whether it's running > > > in

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Le Jeu 2 mai 2013 14:34, Rahul Sundaram a écrit : > Hi > > > On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 8:17 AM, Matthias Runge wrote: > >> How does this work together with VMwares hint, to remove open-vm-tools >> distributed by linux distributions at all? >> >> >> http://kb.vmware.com/selfservice/microsites/search.d

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Le Jeu 2 mai 2013 19:49, Ravindra Kumar a écrit : >> > I can't see, how this can happen anyways. Anaconda just runs once (at >> > installation), afterwards it can safely be removed (correct me, if I'm >> > wrong). >> > >> > Could you please explain, why this should be useful for all our users? >>

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On 2 May 2013 19:40, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > I'm Ravindra's sponsor. > > Just to clarify a few points: > > - VMware are trying to work better with Fedora, and to help this along > I've been supervising him adding open-vm-tools to Fedora. > > - Because this is just starting out, there are a

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> the open-vm-tools should be generally be splitted in packages > with and without X11 deps - below my personal SPEC file for > a fedora infrastructure on top of vSphere with all things you > need for "VMware DataRecovery"-backups and VMware-HighAbility > > you do not want any X11-deps and HGFS stu

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Am 02.05.2013 19:40, schrieb Richard W.M. Jones: > On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 08:31:38PM -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: >> Hi, >> >> It is going to very useful for users if we install open-vm-tools inside a VM >> on VMware always. >> >> For this, I'm proposing following design: >> 1. Add open-vm-t

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Ravindra Kumar (ravindraku...@vmware.com) said: > (Batching a bunch of replies) > > > Install and uninstall looks a bit weird to me; what could be > > done is to make the package conditionally whether it's running > > in a VMware VM or not, much like it happens now for the EFI > > packages (only

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

> > I can't see, how this can happen anyways. Anaconda just runs once (at > > installation), afterwards it can safely be removed (correct me, if I'm > > wrong). > > > > Could you please explain, why this should be useful for all our users? I > > think it's more sensible to install, when running on

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

(Batching a bunch of replies) > Install and uninstall looks a bit weird to me; what could be > done is to make the package conditionally whether it's running > in a VMware VM or not, much like it happens now for the EFI > packages (only installed on an EFI system) or the spice agent > (IIRC) if it

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 08:31:38PM -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > Hi, > > It is going to very useful for users if we install open-vm-tools inside a VM > on VMware always. > > For this, I'm proposing following design: > 1. Add open-vm-tools to the core package group > 2. Modify Anaconda to un

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Hi On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 8:17 AM, Matthias Runge wrote: > How does this work together with VMwares hint, to remove open-vm-tools > distributed by linux distributions at all? > > > http://kb.vmware.com/selfservice/microsites/search.do?language=en_US&cmd=displayKC&externalId=1013096 > > Yeah. T

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Thu, May 02, 2013 at 02:17:27PM +0200, Matthias Runge wrote: > On 05/02/2013 05:31 AM, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > > Hi, > > > > It is going to very useful for users if we install open-vm-tools inside > > a VM on VMware always. > > > > For this, I'm proposing following design: > > 1. Add open-vm-t

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On Wed, 2013-05-01 at 20:31 -0700, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > Hi, > > > It is going to very useful for users if we install open-vm-tools > inside a VM on VMware always. > > > For this, I'm proposing following design: > 1. Add open-vm-tools to the core package group > > 2. Modify Anaconda to unins

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

On 05/02/2013 05:31 AM, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > Hi, > > It is going to very useful for users if we install open-vm-tools inside > a VM on VMware always. > > For this, I'm proposing following design: > 1. Add open-vm-tools to the core package group > 2. Modify Anaconda to uninstall open-vm-tools a

Re: Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Hello, On 2 May 2013 05:31, Ravindra Kumar wrote: > 1. Add open-vm-tools to the core package group > 2. Modify Anaconda to uninstall open-vm-tools after installation if > install is not running on a VM on VMware > Install and uninstall looks a bit weird to me; what could be done is to make the

Adding open-vm-tools to core group

Hi, It is going to very useful for users if we install open-vm-tools inside a VM on VMware always. For this, I'm proposing following design: 1. Add open-vm-tools to the core package group 2. Modify Anaconda to uninstall open-vm-tools after installation if install is not running on a VM on V