On Thu, Jan 31, 2019 at 11:57:24AM +0300, Alexander Krotov wrote:
> https://learnbchs.org/
clang/llvm LOL (this is one of the worst piles of c++ cr*p out there, a near
perfect factory of digital hate).
sqllite LOL (better think of using this 10 times over before actually using it)
For the web, t
The thing I really don't understand, is this mailing list attracting some
random group of guys, at regular time intervals, almost totally missing the
point of "suckless", and though, pretending to get it while bringing on the
table _abominations_ like c++/go/whatever. Namely software perfectly alie
Hi,
As some of you may know already, mesa, the gl/vulkan open source project did
drop the garbage which are the perl based gnu autotools for another piece of
garbage, python based meson. A few years ago, I was a fan boy of python, omfg I
do regret that, a f... lot.
As a user of my own custom buil
On Sat, Feb 02, 2019 at 07:46:37AM -0500, Greg Reagle wrote:
> I completely agree with these criticisms of C.
I don't like C.
Its syntax is way too rich already.
C is by far the most reasonable "compromise", namely, which "suckless".
--
Sylvain
Hi,
I am looking at xml parsers.
I am about to go expat, but I am wondering if there are some interesting
alternatives I did miss?
--
Sylvain
On Sat, Feb 02, 2019 at 01:20:16PM -0500, Sean MacLennan wrote:
> Json? Not sure what you need the xml parser for... but does it have to
> be xml?
Unfortunately, the source file is utf-8 xml.
--
Sylvain
On Sat, Feb 02, 2019 at 07:31:24PM +0100, Silvan Jegen wrote:
> https://sillymon.ch/posts/slcon3.html
Thx!
Based on you results, I guess I'll give a shot at ezxml and yxml. Stream("sax")
or DOM("XPath"), don't know which one is easier to use in my case, yet.
I did notice some "XML entities" in t
On Sun, Feb 03, 2019 at 09:36:22AM +0100, Markus Wichmann wrote:
> At work, we're using libxml2. Since we are also using static linking,
> this has caused our firmware package to go from 20MB to 60MB unzipped.
> So I hope this helps you find a good package, by showing you where it
> isn't.
DOM lib
On Mon, Feb 04, 2019 at 08:03:56PM +0100, Laslo Hunhold wrote:
> echo -n -e "GET / HTTP/1.1\r\nHost: localhost\r\n\r\n" | \
"My 2c": I would prefer shell "printf" than "echo -n -e"
--
Sylvain
On Tue, Feb 05, 2019 at 05:01:57AM -0500, Martin Tournoij wrote:
> as soon as you start doing more than printing raw strings.
Not even raw strings, but raw "lines" (\n added by echo).
My 3c.
--
Sylvain
Hi,
I am coding a little/simple custom language parser, and I was wondering if there
are "suckless" grade alternatives to flex and bison, anyone? But wait...
That said and as of today, I still don't agree with myself on the usefullness
of lex/yacc in the first place. For instance, I am puzzled by
On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 06:17:16AM +0100, Markus Wichmann wrote:
> Well, other people have made that point before: Why use a regex to
> identify a token when a simple loop will do?
>
> So for lexing, usually a simple token parser in C will do the job
> better. And for parsing, you get the problem
Hi,
For a 2D toolkit with _global scope_, the only really hard part is proper
unicode text rendering.
Since there is no suckless grade of such rendering engine, then there is zero
chance to get a suckless _globally scoped_ toolkit.
The one and only open source component dealing with this issue i
On Mon, Mar 25, 2019 at 10:08:28AM +0200, ab wrote:
> Expect a thousand conflicting opinions. If you're truly interested in
> programming, your best bet is to look at as many ideas as possible then
> working on your ability to sort the bullshit out.
"opinions" is the right term: subjective person
On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 10:28:35AM +0100, Thuban wrote:
> Hi,
> I want to learn C. I mean, sane C.
> What i read before was based on big IDE such as codeblocks. So, I don't
> know how to write Makefiles from scratch. (just an example).
> As an example, I found gobyexample [1] great. But it's go.
>
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 08:37:18PM +0100, Quentin Rameau wrote:
> > * do not use enum (hard rule)
> > * do not use typedef (hard rule)
> > * use sized types: u8 u16 i64 float32 etc... you can use the C
> > preprocessor to fix that, but in some case, as a good tradeof (for
> > instance in
> > "
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 08:56:07PM +0100, Kurt Van Dijck wrote:
> I agree with most of your arguments
>
> > * use sized types: u8 u16 i64 float32 etc... you can use the C
> > preprocessor to fix that, but in some case, as a good tradeof (for
> > instance in
> > "object oriented C code"), add
On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 07:43:04AM -0700, Evan Gates wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 11:21 AM wrote:
> > C has already a syntax way too rich and flexible. Most of the
> > linux coding guidelines is nice.
>
> There is also a style page[0] at suckless. But again style is subjective
> and the most
On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 01:19:23PM -0700, Evan Gates wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 12:40 PM wrote:
> >
> > On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 07:43:04AM -0700, Evan Gates wrote:
> > Style and the amount of actually used syntax is different.
>
> I'd disagree. Once you choose a language, any choices about
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 10:45:04PM -0700, Louis Santillan wrote:
> There's options. Have you tried Lemon Parser [0] or miniyacc + qbe
> [1][2]? ucpp [3] lexes/parses C-like languages with C pre-processing.
> re2c [4] is a great lexer. Crockford prefers Pratt's Top-Down
> Operator Precedence [5][
Dear David,
You are of the type of human being I, genuinely, sort of dislike. Namely a
syntax
kludge and excessive abstraction lover.
Your first sentence is already an insult to "suckless" people: "won't you write
in assembly next time?"
--
Sylvain
Nice April Fool's joke.
--
Sylvain
God! I barely did notice we were the first of April... and I was surprised to
see ideas
so much remote from suckless stated here.
Got me guys. I fell for it.
doh!
--
Sylvain
On Mon, Apr 01, 2019 at 07:34:20PM +0200, Markus Wichmann wrote:
> you aren't exactly a beacon of sunshine either. You like to make
> normative claims all over the place, but when asked to defend them, you
> only have names to call people. Maybe C++ is genuinely as horrible as
> you say. I have see
> What a strange reply. Clearly *some* abstractions are good, otherwise
> we'd all be writing assembly. *How many* abstractions exactly is a
> matter of contention and personal taste. But as soon as someone
> slightly disagrees with you on a fairly minor point you resort to
> insults and "bruh huh
On Tue, Apr 02, 2019 at 05:44:35AM +0200, Markus Wichmann wrote:
> I was being quite serious. Not everything posted on April 1st is a joke.
> I eventually got fed up with harmful.cat-v.org, because all it listed
> was derision, but no actual justification. Just like you.
In a suckless context, tho
On Sun, May 19, 2019 at 08:41:38PM -0700, Michael Forney wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I know there are a number of small C compilers out there in various
> states of completion, but recently I've been working on another to add
> to the mix:
>
> https://git.sr.ht/~mcf/cc
>
> It is a C11 compiler based on
On Mon, May 20, 2019 at 02:55:17PM -0400, LM wrote:
> Another thing I'd want is at least minimal internationalization support
> (enough to be able to handle display and input of characters in the UTF-8
> character set).
Hi,
The only really tough thing with a GUI toolkit (C or anything else) is w
On Mon, May 20, 2019 at 11:12:04PM -0700, Michael Forney wrote:
> Yes, I tested building gcc-9.1 with gcc-4.7.4 built by my compiler. I
> have not tried gcc-8.
It's very good news (actually less worse news than usual from the gcc world).
> At least gcc tracks the autotools-generated files in the
On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 09:27:19AM +0200, Daniel Cegiełka wrote:
> wt., 21 maj 2019 o 08:14 Michael Forney napisał(a):
> >
> > On 2019-05-20, sylvain.bertr...@gmail.com
> > wrote:
> > > Sadly, gcc-4.7 does not have an aarch64 backend and it's a pain to
> > > configure
> > > without breaking anyt
On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 08:27:48PM +0200, Daniel Cegiełka wrote:
> https://releases.linaro.org/archive/13.05/components/toolchain/gcc-linaro/4.7/
It was based on 4.7.3 and included the arm64/aarch64 branch. There is gcc 4.7.4
and it seems the aarch64 branch is more recent.
--
Sylvain
On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 03:19:40PM -0400, LM wrote:
> ...
If you code your own toolkit, you can decide to handle only a few "unicode
scripts". You may add a few limitations on top, and it can become way simpler
to code. This is what I did with the drop-in replacement of harfbuzz: only
basic left-t
Hi,
After xml, json.
Do you know of a light json parser lib? Or json seeming being very simple,
better write a parser directly?
I have libjq from the jq command line, but this is quite a beast and don't think
it fits anymore in the suckless frame.
--
Sylvain
On Wed, Jun 05, 2019 at 03:12:11PM +0200, Antenore Gatta wrote:
> - [0] https://github.com/vurtun/nuklear
Looks great... till you don't go support of global unicode scripts and
non pre-combined glyphs (pre-combined glyphs are deprecated in unicode)
How do you want to create a reasonable suckless
On Wed, Jun 05, 2019 at 03:05:21PM +0200, Mattias Andrée wrote:
> Hi!
>
> What do you need from the library? If I recall correctly,
> jsonc is good enough, and have all the functionality you
> will need. If you only need to be able to parse into
> struct:s, writing a small parser is simple (assumi
Hi,
Try to follow roughly the coding guideline from the linux kernel.
lower case, no typedefs, sized types (u8, u32, s32...) and cast in case of the
use of an external API, use of goto for "very sequential code error
management", etc.
I do even remove keywords from the already way too rich synt
As foreseen, json is kind of a no brainer.
I did write my own parser following like an idiot the specs.
The only trick was to be carefull that the root "element" is not a
normal "element".
It's callbacks based, like the xml parser from hijo.
json almost deserves a promotion to suckless format.
-
Hi,
For those who might be interested:
I did write a lean/suckless-ish sendmail like program:
https://rocketgit.com/user/sylware/syncsm
It is meant for devs/advanced sysadmins/very advanced users dealing themselves
with their "email server". I am currently using it (not on _this_ email address
On Tue, Sep 10, 2019 at 06:48:17PM +0200, Mattias Andrée wrote:
> What is the point of doing your own mini-libc within the
> program? Aren't you just making it less portable and
> adding more code to read?
More code to read? Have you read the code of a standard libc? Not to mention
the SDK deps? M
On Tue, Sep 10, 2019 at 11:07:02PM +0200, Mattias Andrée wrote:
> I mean that if you always use same libc you only have to read it once,
> but if every problem have its own you have to read all of them. I do
> not think it changes it sucklessness. I just wasn't sure whether the
> reason was to have
Hi,
I know I am walking on eggs: it seems st monospace font rendering with freetype
(I use dejavu mono) has some vertical and/or horizontal gaps (whatever the
rendering size).
To illustrate, with lynx web browser:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Box-drawing_character#Examples
I don't know what i
On Thu, Dec 05, 2019 at 11:28:30AM -0800, Varun Iyer wrote:
> You might be looking for something like the boxdraw patch:
> http://st.suckless.org/patches/boxdraw/, which performs custom rendering
> of box-drawing characters for gapless alignment.
This patch is limited to some unicode blocks. And a
On Fri, Dec 06, 2019 at 10:55:27AM -0800, Eric Pruitt wrote:
> I've had this same problem since I upgraded to Debian 10. I believe this
> is due to changes in character bounding box sizes because you can fix
> this by adjusting cwscale and chscale. On my systems, I only have
> vertical gaps, and se
On Fri, Dec 06, 2019 at 08:01:41PM +0200, anigger@national.shitposting.agency
wrote:
> but i use liberation mono.
I gave a shot at liberation mono and noto mono. Both have still issues at
various scales. The best rendering seems from liberation mono, my version of
noto is quite old though.
I am
Just tested with a vte based terminal with noto mono regular, no rendering pb.
Then now it is sure, something is slightly wrong somewhere.
--
Sylvain
On Tue, Dec 10, 2019 at 04:09:24PM +, sylvain.bertr...@gmail.com wrote:
> Then now it is sure, something is slightly wrong somewhere.
I started to update my "font rendering" related components and while updating
fontconfig, I did trash their build system for my own and got a closer look at
fon
On Wed, Dec 18, 2019 at 06:23:03PM +0600, Enan Ajmain wrote:
> ...
> ... /etc/pam.d folder ...
> ...
pam? paaam? PAAM?? Really?
--
Sylvain
On Fri, Dec 20, 2019 at 08:47:18AM +0100, Laslo Hunhold wrote:
> ... Slock does not have pam implemented ...
REALLY?!!! How is this even possible? pam is amazing! pam is beautiful!
pam makes coffee!
--
Sylvain
Hi,
When I run dota2, the game, in "desktop friendly fullscreen" when I alt-tab out
and back the borders are drawn again and I have to re-enable the "desktop
friendly fullscreen" in dota2.
fullscreen is ok with mplayer though.
anyone?
--
Sylvain
On Wed, Jan 01, 2020 at 11:03:21PM +, sylvain.bertr...@gmail.com wrote:
> anyone?
I did investigate the issue with xprop:
something is clearing dota2 _NET_WM_STATE(ATOM) to an empty value after tabbing
out and back.
mplayer is fine with _NET_WM_STATE(ATOM) = _NET_WM_STATE_FULLSCREEN.
Anyone?
Hi,
Coded the first iteration of a lil suckless-ish terminal audio file player
based on ffmpeg and alsa. Ofc, it's taylored for my needs. Might be of use to
some in suckless community.
It's here: https://repo.or.cz/nyanmp
--
Sylvain
Hi,
As some may already know I am sueing the french administration which recently
(a couple of years) broke the support of no js web browsers.
The follow up would be to deal with this issue at the EU administration level
and the local W3C representatives.
I am currently trying to get a lawyer al
Hi,
Out of the blue: I recently did switch from the "compiled" version of
youtube-dl to the use of it's raw code straight from the git repository,
because it felt starting significantly faster.
(nobody should have to use youtube-dl to get the video/dash url)
--
Sylvain
For many projects, you can use the "One Compilation Unit" way: one root source
file
for one end result (shared lib/module/exe/etc).
The source tree is static and code selection happens with the C preprocessor.
--
Sylvain
On Fri, Mar 27, 2020 at 08:00:58PM +, Tait Hoyem wrote:
> I would also like to avoid Warnock's dilemma.
+1
On this very mailing list we already had some exchange of thoughts about the
unicode grapheme cluster.
One question which was stuck into my head after this exchange was: how many of
uni
On Fri, Mar 27, 2020 at 10:24:52PM +0100, Laslo Hunhold wrote:
> ... This will cover 99.5% of all cases...
What do you mean? They managed to add in grapheme cluster definition some weird
edge cases up to 0.5%??
About string comparison: if I recall well, after utf-8 normalization (n11n),
strings
On Fri, Mar 27, 2020 at 09:46:29PM +0100, Laslo Hunhold wrote:
> thanks for your feedback! I'm glad you like it. This is still at
> version "0", so if you have any suggestions for the API that might come
> to mind, let me know.
Huho!
How about making it "work" with "One Compilation Unit" projects
Hi,
I was p*ssed off by this kludge which is xset (including SDK, deps, deps SDKS)
being the "only way" to turn off/on the global x11 key autorepeat (xserver
command
line option does not work, and xorg keyboard driver option does not work).
I wrote a minimal tool to do so, using xcb, some suckle
OMG!
Replying to myself: I use the client libxcb, which has inapropriate and
disgusting python code generators not to mention the horrible gnu autotools.
For such basic command line, I should have connected to the xserver unix socket
and should have sent directly the request.
This tool is not su
On Sat, Apr 04, 2020 at 03:19:13PM +, sylvain.bertr...@gmail.com wrote:
> For such basic command line, I should have connected to the xserver unix
> socket
> and should have sent directly the request.
Done (no xcb lib) then fixed. Same location on the web.
regards,
--
Sylvain
Hi,
I may have some projects of interests for people concerned with
suckless.org philosophy:
http://code.google.com/p/charfbuzz/ :
As you may know, the GTK+ stack has a unicode layout engine
called pango, which was made hard dependent on harfbuzz, a c++
component. To keep GTK+ in the C realm and
> I dislike initramfs conception - it make system more complicated. For
> mount root on usb storage I use attached patch. With it you can pass
> label to kernel parameters. Example: root=LABEL=root_usb
With early userspace, you would load the root filesystem modules
first then mount the real root.
> On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 01:45:05AM +0200, Sylvain BERTRAND wrote:
>> Is linux able to provide the UUID of a partition? I have never
>> looked into it. If so, I would use linux instead of a port of
>> blkid!
>
> ls -l /dev/disk/by-uuid
>
> You obviously need s
>>and use CPIO text description to avoid being root to create the
>
> You can use paxmirabilis/MirCPIO for that (it’s packaged as “pax”
> in Debian wheezy and newer, in case you wonder). Example:
>
> find * | sort | paxcpio -oC512 -Hsv4cpio -Mdist | xz -2e >initrd
>
> -Mdist normalises all uid:g
>>> -Mdist normalises all uid:gid to 0:0 (and some other things that
>
>>Strange, I though this feature was available with basic CPIO utils.
>
> No, it’s not, it’s implementation-specific extension.
I think there is something related to this in the linux kernel
distribution.
> But then, paxtar
> On Wed, 23 Oct 2013 15:00:42 +0200 sin wrote:
>> On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 01:45:05AM +0200, Sylvain BERTRAND wrote:
>>> Is linux able to provide the UUID of a partition? I have never
>>> looked into it. If so, I would use linux instead of a port of
>>> b
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 02:33:39PM +, Mihail Zenkov wrote:
> 2013/10/23, Sylvain BERTRAND :
>> Oh! Then, I'm sure not to port blkid. But, like the do_mount in
>> linux init code, is the linux mount syscall able to mount a
>> partition with "UUID=..." inste
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 03:46:05PM +0200, koneu wrote:
> >I'm a GNU GPL guy
> oh, fuck no...
:P
gnutls?
--
Sylvain
>> gnutls?
>
> I'm guessing to say that, you must have never used the horror that is
> GnuTLS :-)
I used it a long time ago, nothing bad to say about it though. I
haven't read its code.
> PolarSSL is okay-ish, it's GPL though.
Good for me, I thought it was *BSD-like.
--
Sylvain
On Sun, Nov 03, 2013 at 12:24:38PM -0500, Bobby Powers wrote:
> There is a rather nice and complete looking SSH implementation in go:
> http://godoc.org/code.google.com/p/go.crypto/ssh
Unfortunately, this is not C, this is a high level language (a
naughty one: its syntax depends on an internal gar
On Mon, Nov 04, 2013 at 06:41:25PM +0100, Andreas Krennmair wrote:
> * Alexander Huemer [2013-11-04 15:30]:
> >The only interface to the kernels the suckless.org software runs on is
> >in C, the same is true for the standard librar{y,ies}. Software written
> >in any other language is an indirectio
Is there any remaining good c++ compiler/runtime which can
boostrap using a C compiler/minimal runtime?
Since its 4.8 version, gcc cannot bootstrap with a C
compiler/minimal runtime, it needs a c++ compiler and runtime.
Making gcc 4.7 series the last "clean" gcc.
I heard about openwatcom (but it
On Fri, Dec 20, 2013 at 04:35:36PM +0100, Paul Onyschuk wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Dec 2013 13:49:43 +0100
> Sylvain BERTRAND wrote:
>
> > Is there any remaining good c++ compiler/runtime which can
> > boostrap using a C compiler/minimal runtime?
> >
> > Since, it
On Fri, Dec 20, 2013 at 08:22:03AM -0700, Anthony J. Bentley wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 20, 2013 at 5:49 AM, Sylvain BERTRAND wrote:
> > There is also the question of finding a new C99 optimizing
> > compiler written properly in C of course.
> >
> > tinycc is interesting.
On Fri, Dec 20, 2013 at 11:36:17AM -0500, Bobby Powers wrote:
> Sylvain BERTRAND wrote:
> > Since its 4.8 version, gcc cannot bootstrap with a C
> > compiler/minimal runtime, it needs a c++ compiler and runtime.
> > Making gcc 4.7 series the last "clean" gcc.
>
On Fri, Dec 20, 2013 at 06:12:45PM +0100, Paul Onyschuk wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Dec 2013 17:31:26 +0100
> Sylvain BERTRAND wrote:
>
> >
> > Oh! What openbsd uses for its man page terminal renderer? I'm
> > stuck with the buggy heirloom tools.
> >
>
> Man
Additionnally, pango pulls by force harfbuzz which is a c++
object oriented brain damaged component. That would make dwm hard
dependent... on c++!
However I did a _partial_ port of harfbuzz with C... but hey.
--
Sylvain
On Thu, Jan 09, 2014 at 03:24:59PM +0100, Markus Teich wrote:
> Heyho,
>
> are there plans to port surf to gtk3, so it can be used under
> wayland?
>
> --Markus
>
It's a bit on the side of the topic but GTK+ is now hard
dependent through pango on harfbuzz, a c++ component (object
oriented cluster
On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 01:09:01AM +0100, Markus Teich wrote:
> Markus Teich wrote:
> > I am confused. Are you talking about NetSurf [0] or surf [1]?
>
> And here are the links I knew I would forget…
>
> [0]: https://www.netsurf-browser.org/
> [1]: http://surf.suckless.org/
Ooops! I read netsurf
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