2022, ഏപ്രിൽ 20 2:19:21 AM IST, Bastian Blank ൽ എഴുതി
>> Similarly, I think it would be reasonable for someone to want to provide
>> entirely free Debian media along with a libre laptop.
>
>Does this exist in the real world? Which hardware would such a system
>contain?
liberated.computer it is
On Tue, 2022-04-19 at 11:33 +0200, Christian Kastner wrote:
> Here's a somewhat radical idea: I propose that we make option (1) and
> (2) conditional on all Debian infra switching to hardware entirely free
> of binary firmware/microcode blobs.
>
> Because if *we* can't do it, then imposing this s
On Tue, 2022-04-19 at 01:27 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> We have a small set of Free firmware binaries included in Debian main, and
> these are included on our installation and live media. This is great - we all
> love Free Software and this works.
There is a list of libre firmware projects on
On 2022/04/20 08:25, j...@debian.org wrote:
2022-01-12 - Milestone 1 - Transition and toolchain freeze 2022-02-12 -
Milestone 2 - Soft Freeze 2022-03-12 - Milestone 3 - Hard Freeze - for key
packages and packages without autopkgtests To be announced - Milestone 4
- Full
Freeze
Oops, that w
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 12:55:44PM +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
> >> Similarly, I think it would be reasonable for someone to want to provide
> >> entirely free Debian media along with a libre laptop.
> >
> >Does this exist in the real world? Which hardware would such a system
> >contain?
>
> lib
2022, ഏപ്രിൽ 19 5:57:46 AM IST, Steve McIntyre ൽ എഴുതി
>This tension extends to our installation and live media. As non-free is
>officially not considered part of Debian, our official media cannot include
>anything from non-free. This has been a deliberate policy for many years.
>Instead, we hav
2022, ഏപ്രിൽ 20 1:14:14 PM IST, Andrey Rahmatullin ൽ എഴുതി
>On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 12:55:44PM +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
>> >> Similarly, I think it would be reasonable for someone to want to provide
>> >> entirely free Debian media along with a libre laptop.
>> >
>> >Does this exist in the r
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 01:25:31PM +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
> >> >> Similarly, I think it would be reasonable for someone to want to provide
> >> >> entirely free Debian media along with a libre laptop.
> >> >
> >> >Does this exist in the real world? Which hardware would such a system
> >> >co
On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 12:55 +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
> liberated.computer it is refurbished and some components like wifi
> cards replaced so it works with 100% free software.
No, it doesn't. It just *hides* the fact that you use non-free
software. If you are happy with that, fine, but please
Package: ftp.debian.org
Severity: normal
Control: affects -1 src:ruby-ghi
X-Debbugs-CC: debian-devel@lists.debian.org
Please remove "ruby-ghi" from "unstable".
The package is obsolete and no longer maintained upstream.
Thanks.
--
All the best,
Dmitry Smirnov
GPG key : 4096R/52B6BBD953968D1B
Quoting Russ Allbery (2022-04-19 23:57:21)
> Jonas Smedegaard writes:
> > Quoting Russ Allbery (2022-04-19 19:29:09)
>
> >> We need some way to clearly label non-free firmware packages so
> >> that you can apply whatever installation or upgrade policy locally
> >> that you want to apply, but so
Package: wnpp
Severity: normal
X-Debbugs-CC: debian-devel@lists.debian.org
Package "dropwatch" needs new maintainer.
I have no understanding with upstream and unable to spare any time for this
package any more. Please adopt this package if you care for it.
--
Regards,
Dmitry Smirnov
GPG key :
Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Sudip Mukherjee
X-Debbugs-Cc: debian-devel@lists.debian.org, sudipm.mukher...@gmail.com
* Package name: genimage
Version : v15
Upstream Author : many
* URL : https://github.com/pengutronix/genimage
* License : GPL-2.0
P
I recently tried to install Debian onto my new laptop. It's an HP
Pavilian (can't remember the exact model sorry) with an AMD Rizon 5500
processor with integrated Radion graphic. All seemed to work well, until I
came to the detecting Internet stage of the install. It couldn't detect my
Wi-fi card.
Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Dmitry Shachnev
X-Debbugs-Cc: debian-devel@lists.debian.org
* Package name: pyqt6-webengine
Version : 6.3.0
Upstream Author : Riverbank Computing Limited
* URL : https://riverbankcomputing.com/software/pyqtwebengine/intro
* Lice
On Tue, Apr 19, 2022 at 01:43:39PM +0200, Christian Kastner wrote:
In case my own wasn't clear, what I meant was: (a) all of the x86_64
hosts in our infrastructure use CPUs that utilize non-free microcode,
and (b) unless we're crazy, those hosts also use the non-free
intel-microcode or amd64-micr
Hi Steve,
Thank you for raising this issue and writing about it so clearly.
On Tue, Apr 19, 2022 at 01:27:46AM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
5. We could split out the non-free firmware packages into a new
non-free-firmware component in the archive, and allow a specific
exception only to al
On 19/4/22 10:27, Steve McIntyre wrote:
5. We could split out the non-free firmware packages into a new
non-free-firmware component in the archive, and allow a specific exception
only to allow inclusion of those packages on our official media. We would
then generate only one set
On 2022-04-20 04:06, Andrey Rahmatullin wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 01:25:31PM +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
>> Similarly, I think it would be reasonable for someone to want to provide
>> entirely free Debian media along with a libre laptop.
>
> Does this exist in the real wo
Answer bellow this awful piece of text from someone who doesn't know how
to make a space between line.
On 2022-04-20 06:04, Devin Prater wrote:
> I recently tried to install Debian onto my new laptop. It's an HP
> Pavilian (can't remember the exact model sorry) with an AMD Rizon 5500
> processor w
bwt !
1st I've always saw Debian having brltty support from the start
2nd Just install the firmware instruction here and your problem will be
solved.
https://wiki.debian.org/Firmware
Stop blaiming other people when the problem is a lack of research on
your part and expectation all work "out of the
On Tue, 2022-04-19 at 01:27 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> There are a number of issues here that make developers and users unhappy:
There are a couple more issues related to unredistributable firmware:
Some firmware is only available in the operating system preinstalled on
the device and needs
Hello,
Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside, le mer. 20 avril 2022 08:32:13 -0400, a ecrit:
> Answer bellow this awful piece of text from someone who doesn't know how
> to make a space between line.
For information, reading mails with a speech synthesis doesn't
necessarily render spaces between lines.
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 08:28:25AM -0400, Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside wrote:
> I think you lack pretty much of seeing more than you own self and use case.
No, everything I write in these threads I write for our potential users
who don't have enough knowledge to find things they need or to dismi
Hi,
On 2022-04-20 08:39, Samuel Thibault wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside, le mer. 20 avril 2022 08:32:13 -0400, a
> ecrit:
>> Answer bellow this awful piece of text from someone who doesn't know how
>> to make a space between line.
>
> For information, reading mails with a s
Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside, le mer. 20 avril 2022 09:07:47 -0400, a ecrit:
> On 2022-04-20 08:39, Samuel Thibault wrote:
> > Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside, le mer. 20 avril 2022 08:32:13 -0400, a
> > ecrit:
> >> Answer bellow this awful piece of text from someone who doesn't know how
> >> t
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 09:07:47AM -0400, Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside wrote:
When you talk or read a text out loud, you make pauses ?
Why wouldn't they apply then you write a text ?
Are we again in the world of "Everyone must adapt because I'm different" ?
We ain't gonna go back to this WOKE
2022, ഏപ്രിൽ 20 1:52:45 PM IST, Ansgar ൽ എഴുതി
>On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 12:55 +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
>> liberated.computer it is refurbished and some components like wifi
>> cards replaced so it works with 100% free software.
>
>No, it doesn't. It just *hides* the fact that you use non-free
Pirate Praveen, le mer. 20 avril 2022 19:47:31 +0530, a ecrit:
> 2022, ഏപ്രിൽ 20 1:52:45 PM IST, Ansgar ൽ എഴുതി
> >On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 12:55 +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
> >> liberated.computer it is refurbished and some components like wifi
> >> cards replaced so it works with 100% free software
On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 19:47 +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
> 2022, ഏപ്രിൽ 20 1:52:45 PM IST, Ansgar ൽ എഴുതി
> > On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 12:55 +0530, Pirate Praveen wrote:
> > > liberated.computer it is refurbished and some components like
> > > wifi
> > > cards replaced so it works with 100% free softw
Oh, so that's the kind of person you are. Good. I can dismiss your cranky
attitude then. Okay, so the common way of doing this *is* to put a blank
space between paragraphis then? I was told otherwise, but I'm so used to
working with Markdown that I still do it. I just thought I'd make things
look l
Jeremy Stanley wrote:
>On 2022-04-19 01:27:46 +0100 (+0100), Steve McIntyre wrote:
>[...]
>> Along with adding non-free firmware onto media, when the installer
>> (or live image) runs, we should make it clear exactly which
>> firmware packages have been used/installed to support detected
>> hardw
Hi Polyna-Maude,
Polyna-Maude R.-Summerside wrote:
>bwt !
>1st I've always saw Debian having brltty support from the start
>2nd Just install the firmware instruction here and your problem will be
>solved.
>https://wiki.debian.org/Firmware
>
>Stop blaiming other people when the problem is a lack of
Paul Wise wrote:
>
>On Tue, 2022-04-19 at 01:27 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>
>> There are a number of issues here that make developers and users unhappy:
>
>There are a couple more issues related to unredistributable firmware:
Oh, I'm quite sure there are more than that even! :-)
>Some firmware
Russ Allbery wrote:
>Jonas Smedegaard writes:
>
>In other words, rather than having to do what one does now and choose
>between the free installer and the non-free installer, my understanding of
>option #5 is that there would be one install image, but there could then
>be a prompt asking you wheth
Hi Steve,
On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 17:11 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> > Russ Allbery wrote:
> > 1. Purely free installation.
[ Other options ]
> > 4. Enable non-free firmware and enable normal upgrades, [...]
[...]
> Now, the *default* is going to be the hard choice for us to make.
Do you think th
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 09:51:01AM -0500, Devin Prater wrote:
> Anyways, if we want to gatekeep Debian, then fine.
The person you're replying to is not a member of the Debian Project and does
not speak for us.
We are not all accessibility experts, but Debian as a community has always
supported th
Hey Ansgar!
Ansgar wrote:
>On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 17:11 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>> > Russ Allbery wrote:
>> > 1. Purely free installation.
>[ Other options ]
>> > 4. Enable non-free firmware and enable normal upgrades, [...]
>[...]
>> Now, the *default* is going to be the hard choice for us to
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 05:04:13AM -0500, Devin Prater wrote:
> So then, I found the Non-free section and got the CD version? I guess
> that's what I should have gotten? The DVD one is the live environment
> right? See how confusion this can be?
Yes, the variety of our ISOs and the poor way they a
Steve McIntyre writes:
> Thanks! That's a really good question, and one that we should also
> include on the GR. I'd split my option 5 into two:
> 5. Include non-free firmware but do not enable it by default
> 6. Include non-free firmware and enable it by default
> In either case, we'd make the
Sorry, that was rather strongly worded. Although, I think if we just keep
accessibility in mind, from the desktop environment to the boot process,
Debian is already far beyond other distros. Arch comes close, but one has
to know when the boot process begins in order to press Down arrow then
Enter t
Hi folks,
As of glibc 2.32, upstream has split out RPC support; if you want RPC
functionality, you now need to link against libtirpc instead, which is a
superior, more featureful implementation.
This is a good thing architecturally, but one of the side effects for us is
that, via PAM, we are now
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 12:53:46PM -0500, Devin Prater wrote:
> But back on topic, would the nonfree DVD ISO's have more firmware on them
> than the CD version? Or is that just for offline installs?
As far as I understand it there is just one set of non-free firmware for
including in the ISOs and s
Thanks for starting this discussion, Steve, I appreciate the care you've put
into laying out the options.
On Tue, Apr 19, 2022 at 01:27:46AM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> 3. We could stop pretending that the non-free images are unofficial, and
> maybe move them alongside the normal free ima
The Debian Social Contract begins with "Debian will remain 100% free".
Changing that is a pretty big deal. Debian's principled stance on free
software has been one of the main reasons I've been using it for almost
a decade. I really appreciate the peace of mind of knowing that the
system is 100%
Hi,
在 2022-04-20星期三的 10:57 -0700，Steve Langasek写道：
> Hi folks,
>
> As of glibc 2.32, upstream has split out RPC support; if you want RPC
> functionality, you now need to link against libtirpc instead, which is a
> superior, more featureful implementation.
>
> This is a good thing architecturally
Hi,
On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 10:57:58AM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
> So I'd like to take a step back and challenge an underlying assumption by
> asking: do any of our users actually *need* this functionality? The RPC
> functionality is only used for NIS and NIS+. NIS is historically quite
> in
> "Russ" == Russ Allbery writes:
Russ> I agree with this option split, but that reminds me of a
Russ> different procedural note.
Russ> While I recognize and respect the desire to create a
Russ> comprehensive ballot, I'm still going to advocate for
Russ> proposing a GR onl
On Tue, 2022-04-19 at 01:27 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> TL;DR: firmware support in Debian sucks, and we need to change this.
After some discussion on #debian-www with sney (author of the
current auto-download page) and larjona (web team), my preferred
solution to this issue looks somewhat like
On Wed, 2022-04-20 at 15:32 +0800, Paul Wise wrote:
> what other support Debian could give to libre/open firmware projects.
Some ideas for this:
We could package the libre/open firmware projects that are missing.
We could lobby hardware vendors to release their existing proprietary
firmware and
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