I am really saddened to see that this happened.
I have been an active Debian user for several years. Although I have not
contributed directly to Debian, but I admire Debian's ideal, and have
been pushing Debian relentlessly in my own company, my custormers, and
friends. I also made a Chinese ve
On Sun, May 09, 2004 at 08:19:54AM +0200, Denis Barbier wrote:
>
> I proposed some changes to countrychooser before this discussion
> was moved to debian-devel and made an unofficial branch to seek
> for comments; a PO file is temporarily available at
> http://people.debian.org/~barbier/tmp/zh_C
On Wed, May 05, 2004 at 08:07:55AM +1000, Herbert Xu wrote:
> So be it.
>
> Free software extremists I can live with. But this is too much.
> I will resign from this project in two weeks time.
>
> In the mean, please send me offers to maintain my packages in *private*.
> Any packages which are n
On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 07:29:55AM +0200, Christian Perrier wrote:
> Quoting Denis Barbier ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
>
> > This is plain wrong, my opinion is that we do not have to get stuck to
>
> This is not "plain wrong", Denis. This is a proof that we
> disagree..:-)
You wrote in your previous ma
Quoting Christian Perrier:
In the Taiwan case, one solution proposed has been asking the
taiwanese developer (there's only one).
This is a possible solution, sure. But what if this one individual is
indeed biased himself, who can tell?
(I do not suggest our Taiwanese DD is.I just raised a coun
(Feel free to drop the -devel crosspost when replying)
Jean-Michel POURE wrote:
Le jeudi 6 Mai 2004 19:40, Roger So a Ãcrit :
So theorectically you have six combinations here:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Yes, but no
Le jeudi 6 Mai 2004 19:40, Roger So a Ãcrit :
> OK, here's my take.
Thanks for discussing about language issues.
> People in Hong Kong speak Cantonese. People in Taiwan speak Mandarin.
> People in mainland China speak Putonghua. (Yes, I know Putonghua and
> Mandarin are essentially the same thin
> http://www-306.ibm.com/software/globalization/topics/writing/references.jsp
Really interesting reference with good argumentation.
I take the following point:
In particular, do not use references or include them in lists that
suggest they are countries. Using âcountry or regionâ as a title in
Quoting Steve Langasek ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> > What makes you think that will never change ? Why not imagine having a
> > "version quebecoise" at some time ?
>
> I have not claimed that it won't change; I'm merely pointing out that
> the existing design does accomodate regional language variant
> Same as above if the considered french is not actually french, but
> french-speaking canadian.
For technical things, our Quebec cousins speaks the same language than
us, thankfully...more or less...:-)
>
> The main point is that making people choose a "country" is definitely
> not a natural
This is first a followup on a specific topic, which further derives in
more general design considerations. Please followup to -boot.
Quoting Steve Langasek ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> ... which is a problem, because what you really want is
>
> 1) Choose Brazilian Portuguese
> 2) Be presented
Quoting Denis Barbier ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> This is plain wrong, my opinion is that we do not have to get stuck to
This is not "plain wrong", Denis. This is a proof that we
disagree..:-)
By the way, this is also a proof that though we disagree we appreciate
each other's work anyway.
> a standa
On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 10:59:20AM +0900, Mike Hommey wrote:
> Steve Langasek wrote:
> >And this is not what it's used for. There is only *one* French
> >translation for d-i, and likewise only one German, Japanese, or Spanish.
> What makes you think that will never change ? Why not imagine having
Steve Langasek wrote:
And this is not what it's used for. There is only *one* French
translation for d-i, and likewise only one German, Japanese, or Spanish.
What makes you think that will never change ? Why not imagine having a
"version quebecoise" at some time ?
The other problem is that it se
On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 09:05:48AM +0900, Mike Hommey wrote:
> Christian Perrier wrote:
> >Brazilian in Japan:
> > 1) Chooses Portuguese (other countries)
> > 2) Is presented with all countries with valid pt_XX locales:
> > -Portugal
> > -Brazil
> > -Other
> > 3) Chooses Other. Then
Christian Perrier wrote:
Brazilian in Japan:
1) Chooses Portuguese (other countries)
2) Is presented with all countries with valid pt_XX locales:
-Portugal
-Brazil
-Other
3) Chooses Other. Then get all countries and pick "Japan"
Then the problem is that this person won't get th
> Why? You're never going to make China happy by calling it Taiwan, or
> Taiwan happy by calling it Taiwan, Province of China. So use the same
> code zh_TW and let people call the display name whatever the hell they
> want to call it.
how about there just not be a display name for this region A
On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 03:44:12PM -0700, William Ballard wrote:
> On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 05:34:41PM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:
> > On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 11:03:29AM -0700, William Ballard wrote:
> > > How nutty would it be to have *both* options available and some sort of
> > > switch to Togg
On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 05:34:41PM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 11:03:29AM -0700, William Ballard wrote:
> > How nutty would it be to have *both* options available and some sort of
> > switch to Toggle between the two? Or at least a patchset or something.
>
> Very.
>
>
> Changing the standard *is* participate in this (political) issue.
Unfortunately so is *not* changing the standard, which is presumably how
this debate got started.
Ben.
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On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 11:03:29AM -0700, William Ballard wrote:
> On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 01:44:55AM +0800, Wang WenRui wrote:
> > Around 18 o'clock on 06 May, Dale Amon wrote:
> > > On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 12:19:05AM +0800, Wang WenRui wrote:
> > >
> > > Just make sure you have the options avail
On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 05:32:02PM +0200, Christian Perrier wrote:
> Quoting Mike Hommey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> > Huh ? From your explanation, I understood that the bresilian will pick
> > portuguese and then will choose between japan and brasil, depending on
> > what he understands from "choose
On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 07:38:22AM +0200, Christian Perrier wrote:
[...]
> Finding an internationnaly recognised standard for these highly
> sensitive topics such as country names is *very* difficult. Up to now,
> I'm still convinced that the less bad list is iso-3166 (Denis Barbier
> proposal is a
On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 01:44:55AM +0800, Wang WenRui wrote:
> Around 18 o'clock on 06 May, Dale Amon wrote:
> > On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 12:19:05AM +0800, Wang WenRui wrote:
> >
> > Just make sure you have the options available.
> What the text(Taiwan, Province of China) is must be decided in d-i
On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 01:44:55AM +0800, Wang WenRui wrote:
> > Likewise anyplace else where nationality is an
> Do NOT assume it as a matter of course when you say "Likewise". The case
> in China is not like the one in UK.
People are the same everywhere. They have a right to
decide for themselve
Around 18 o'clock on 06 May, Dale Amon wrote:
> On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 12:19:05AM +0800, Wang WenRui wrote:
>
> Just make sure you have the options available.
What the text(Taiwan, Province of China) is must be decided in d-i.
>
>
> We'd have two options. UK and Ireland. You'll
> see one flag
Quoting Dale Amon ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> The only authority on what is a nation are the people
> who live there. When in doubt, ask them.
Which ones, catholics or orangists (I don't remember the common
name)? No offense intended here, but I think you get the point. Same
for Basque Country, by the
On Fri, May 07, 2004 at 12:19:05AM +0800, Wang WenRui wrote:
> Around 16 o'clock on 06 May, Dale Amon wrote:
> > The only authority on what is a nation are the people
> > who live there. When in doubt, ask them.
> Can you ask them all? vote?
Just make sure you have the options available.
> > D.A
Around 16 o'clock on 06 May, Dale Amon wrote:
> On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 10:09:41AM +0200, Jean-Michel POURE wrote:
>
> The only authority on what is a nation are the people
> who live there. When in doubt, ask them.
Can you ask them all? vote?
>
> D.Amon, Belfast, Northern Ireland
>
signature.
Quoting Mike Hommey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Huh ? From your explanation, I understood that the bresilian will pick
> portuguese and then will choose between japan and brasil, depending on
> what he understands from "choose your country". The french will choose
> between japan and eventually fran
On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 10:09:41AM +0200, Jean-Michel POURE wrote:
> Le mercredi 5 Mai 2004 22:16, Humberto Massa a ?crit :
> > Google is always our friend; Taiwan and Hong Kong are countries at least
> > in the definitions ## 2, 3, 5, 7 *and* 9 below. If it's in the Web, it
> > ougha be true.
>
>
Christian Perrier wrote:
Quoting Mike Hommey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
So there's a configuration path difference between a French in Japan, an
American English in Japan and a Brasilian in Japan...
No
Huh ? From your explanation, I understood that the bresilian will pick
portuguese and then will cho
Christian Perrier wrote:
In the case you cite here, the chosen "country" is only used by
further packages which need a "location" such as the timezone
configuration step and (but not yet implemented) the mirror settings.
So there's a configuration path difference between a French in Japan, an
Amer
Quoting Mike Hommey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> So there's a configuration path difference between a French in Japan, an
> American English in Japan and a Brasilian in Japan...
No
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Christian Perrier wrote:
(...)
Finally, on this short screen, you can choose "Other" which will drop
you into the world "country" list (the iso-3166 list). Choosing a
country there will only set the country value, but NOT the locale
value because this will be an unsupported locale.
What is the mean
Quoting Colin Watson ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> of setting up /etc/apt/sources.list after the first reboot. It could
> also be used to produce a reasonable default choice of timezone,
> although I'm not sure if it actually is at the moment.
It is used for this.
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Quoting Mike Hommey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Christian Perrier wrote:
> (...)
> >Finally, on this short screen, you can choose "Other" which will drop
> >you into the world "country" list (the iso-3166 list). Choosing a
> >country there will only set the country value, but NOT the locale
> >value bec
Le jeudi 6 Mai 2004 12:42, Miles Bader a écrit :
> Stop refering to Google. The only world authority are the United-Nations.
> Only because we didn't have google.
I see, you are refering to "Google-Nations".
Jean-Michel POURE <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Stop refering to Google. The only world authority are the United-Nations.
Only because we didn't have google.
-miles
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On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 04:12:17AM -0400, Nathanael Nerode wrote:
> Adam Majer wrote:
> > Indeed. The word "country" needs to be replaced by "locale" or
> > similar.
>
> That's a good choice, actually, especially given that the technical
> name for the thing which this selection is used for is ind
Quoting Mike Hommey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Okay, but in all these steps, what is actually done by localechooser and
> by countrychooser ? I read the thread (well, I must say I didn't read
> ALL the thread...) but I still can't figure out which is which and what
> it does. Also note that it's be
Quoting Jean-Michel POURE ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> The only critic about this ISO definition is that it does not make a clear
> difference between traditionnal Chinese and simplified Chinese.
Well, this is another debate : I have the feeling that both languages
should rather have different ISO (63
Christian Perrier wrote:
(...)
Please please please have a real look on how Debian Installer works
before throwing ideas in the wild, if possible.
The above case is perfectly dealt with by d-i. English speaking
Canadians will choose "English (other countries)" at first screen,
then "Canada" at seco
Christian Perrier wrote:
> (please followup to -boot)
>
> Quoting John Hasler ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> > Why not just say 'Area'?
> >
> > Like this:
> >
> > /---[Choose area]\
> > | Based on your language, you are probably in one of these |
> >
Le mercredi 5 Mai 2004 22:16, Humberto Massa a écrit :
> Google is always our friend; Taiwan and Hong Kong are countries at least
> in the definitions ## 2, 3, 5, 7 *and* 9 below. If it's in the Web, it
> ougha be true.
Stop refering to Google. The only world authority are the United-Nations.
Adam Majer wrote:
> Indeed. The word "country" needs to be replaced by "locale" or similar.
That's a good choice, actually, especially given that the technical name for
the thing which this selection is used for is indeed "locale". Despite the
"language_country" form of locales (which was misguid
> > /---[Choose area]\
> > | Based on your language, you are probably in one of these |
> > | areas. If you are elsewhere, choose "other". |
>
> This is a good suggestion though I fear a bit that the main menu would
> then beco
Quoting Adam Majer ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Indeed. The word "country" needs to be replaced by "locale" or similar.
> It might be best to drop the word country in to avoid any "international
> incidents". For example, Canada has two locales, English and French. You
> don't say,
>
> Choose your c
>"Country or area" is maybe the best possibility which comes to my mind.
I think an alternative suggestion worth considering instead is 'Residence'.
Peter.
(please folloup to -boot)
Quoting Henning Makholm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Scripsit Petter Reinholdtsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > As the listing is in fact a map from the second part of locales to
> > names, it should probably ask the user to select "country or region".
>
> How about just calling
> Just say "choose location" and get over with it...
There has been at least one report that "location" (it has been used
in the past) may sound too vague.
My opinion has been that as long as we use iso-3166 the best is using
the wording of iso-3166 for designating the entries in the list.
> I
(please followup to -boot)
Quoting John Hasler ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Why not just say 'Area'?
>
> Like this:
>
> /---[Choose area]\
> | Based on your language, you are probably in one of these |
> | areas. If you are elsewhere, choose "
Steve Langasek wrote:
On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 07:05:00AM +0800, David Palmer wrote:
@ 05/05/2004 11:40 : wrote Wang WenRui :
The 2nd screen of d-i:
/-[Choose *country*]-\
| Choose your country: |
|
Why not just say 'Area'?
Like this:
/---[Choose area]\
| Based on your language, you are probably in one of these |
| areas. If you are elsewhere, choose "other". |
|
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