Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread Kerim Aydin
But the Treasuror doesn't hold eir office via pledge. CuddleBeam can't have it both ways. If e makes a pledge with the expectation that the pledge's responsibilities grant em some legal privilege, and e is accused of breaking the responsibilities of the pledge, standards of proof are appropr

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread D Margaux
The Treasuror is required to keep records of coins, but not every day or minute. E breaks the rules only if e hasn’t updated the records weekly in a report. Cuddle Beam has no required report for the information for which e has pledged to be recordkeepor. So maybe there is no violation for eir

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Tue, 2 Oct 2018, ais...@alumni.bham.ac.uk wrote: > On Tue, 2018-10-02 at 03:04 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > Actually, if real-world currencies are mapped via contract to being > > Agoran currencies, there *IS* a reporting requirement: > >The recordkeepor of a class of assets is

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread ais...@alumni.bham.ac.uk
On Tue, 2018-10-02 at 03:04 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > Actually, if real-world currencies are mapped via contract to being > Agoran currencies, there *IS* a reporting requirement: >The recordkeepor of a class of assets is the entity (if any) >defined as such by, and bound by, it

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread Kerim Aydin
Actually, if real-world currencies are mapped via contract to being Agoran currencies, there *IS* a reporting requirement: The recordkeepor of a class of assets is the entity (if any) defined as such by, and bound by, its backing document. That entity's report includes a lis

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Tue, 2 Oct 2018, Alex Smith wrote: > On Tue, 2018-10-02 at 07:43 +0200, Cuddle Beam wrote: > > Ok don't freak out now, but you have exactly $8,008,135 by the way. > > Do we have to CoE this to stop it self-ratifying? Or can we ratify an > Agoran legal fiction that G. has that much? Would an

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Tue, 2 Oct 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote: > Ok don't freak out now, but you have exactly $8,008,135 by the way. y'know, I think I'm just going to let that one self-ratify.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-02 Thread Kerim Aydin
I agree. You are not required to show what you are tracking as part of your pledge. However, if I allege (via finger-pointing) that you have failed in your task, the Referee is required to make a finding of fact on whether you are indeed doing the tracking. So I have alleged that you have fai

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Cuddle Beam
It's not an explicit formal obligation anywhere right now as far as I'm aware, but feel free to CFJ it to confirm that I actually have to. On a more very super duper important note: It's recordKEEPor, not recordGIVEor - my records of all existence are mine, mine!!! On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 8:06 AM

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Aris Merchant
No one said anything about CuddleBeam's report being self ratifying. Also, CuddleBeam, the same very strong custom which says that a recordkeepor tracks something indicates that they have to report on it somehow, either by request or in a regular report. Someone with more expirence can correct me

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Alex Smith
On Tue, 2018-10-02 at 07:43 +0200, Cuddle Beam wrote: > Ok don't freak out now, but you have exactly $8,008,135 by the way. Do we have to CoE this to stop it self-ratifying? Or can we ratify an Agoran legal fiction that G. has that much? Would an actual bank acknow ledge the resulting self-ratific

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Cuddle Beam
Ok don't freak out now, but you have exactly $8,008,135 by the way. Yeah, I know, I'm amazing - how does Cuddles do it? Pshe. It's child's play for someone as dapper and swagg'n as me. On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 1:16 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > On Mon, 1 Oct 2018, Cuddle Beam wrote: > > I pledge th

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Cuddle Beam
Aha! I was ready for this. I am required to track - but not to show what I'm tracking! These are unreasonable demands! Now, please leave me alone as I perform my godly duty, there's a lot to track out there. On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 1:34 AM D Margaux wrote: > > I think that once a person have be

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread D Margaux
Maybe you can re-break it because “the time window of a pledge is 60 days” (unless otherwise specified), not “the earlier of 60 days and when it is broken.” So maybe the pledge stays in effect. The same conduct cannot give rise to repeated fines, but different breaches of the same pledge maybe can.

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Kerim Aydin
The crime isn't "failure to track", it's "breaking a pledge" (by failing to track). Once a pledge is broken, it's broken...? Can you re-break it? On Mon, 1 Oct 2018, D Margaux wrote: > > I think that once a person have been punished for breaking a pledge, the > > pledge is done (as e can't be

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread D Margaux
> I think that once a person have been punished for breaking a pledge, the > pledge is done (as e can't be punished twice, there's no requirement > anymore). So the result of the finger-point, if e is punished, is to end > the pledge. (Whether this is true is a general question about pledges, > m

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Aris Merchant
On Mon, Oct 1, 2018 at 2:23 PM D Margaux wrote: > > Your argument is something like saying that since we only > > defined what foo(int x) does, you are free to interpret the entity > > "foo" to mean the separate, hitherto by rules undefined function > > foo(char c). > > I think this is on the rig

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread D Margaux
> Your argument is something like saying that since we only > defined what foo(int x) does, you are free to interpret the entity > "foo" to mean the separate, hitherto by rules undefined function > foo(char c). I think this is on the right track for why it doesn’t work. Putting it slightly diffe

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Cuddle Beam
Oh hello there! And, don't worry about butting from the outside! I am too pretty lol. I get what you mean with "king of a country", but the issue is that the term used is simply "king", not "king of country". It's a recordkeepor of assets, not a plain recordkeepor, and a plain "recordkeepor" is th

DIS: Re: BUS: humble agoran farmer becomes a demiruge of a sort

2018-10-01 Thread Jonatan Kilhamn
On Mon, 1 Oct 2018 at 19:13, Cuddle Beam wrote: > > I pledge the following: I pledge to be the recordkeepor of absolutely > everything. > > I then CFJ the following: Non-regulated actions cannot be performed. > > Grat. Arguments for that CFJ: > - From R2125: (3) the action would, as part of its ef