Re: Is this the new digital? Or, prosumer digital #2?

[T Rittenhouse]

Well, sightly more than an inch , anyway.

Ciao,
Graywolf
http://pages.prodigy.net/graywolfphoto


- Original Message -
From: "Herb Chong" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: Is this the new digital? Or, prosumer digital #2?


> i think you mean 4/3.
>
> Herb
> - Original Message -
> From: "T Rittenhouse" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 08:13
> Subject: Re: Is this the new digital? Or, prosumer digital #2?
>
>
> > We have heard about this before. (5/4's DSLR mock up shown at
Photokina).
> >
>
>

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Bob Blakely]

Clearly, you are not a pilot, and certainly you have no commercial or
military experience flight experience. It's ok. Not everyone has. Further,
it this has nothing to do with Pentax or photography. I was not commenting
on your views regarding the taking of photos, just making a side comment on
your very poor choice for an analogy.

Regards,
Bob...

"Do not suppose that abuses are eliminated by destroying
the object which is abused.  Men can go wrong with wine
and women.  Shall we then prohibit and abolish women?"
-Martin Luther

From: "Herb Chong" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


> by the time you do, your plane will be a smear on the ground.
>
> From: "Bob Blakely" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > Yes, Herb , many, many minutes. Commercial flight today demands very,
very
> > little of the pilot during the majority of the autopilot controlled
flight.
> > It's almost as though the pilot's only job is to get the aircraft off
the
> > ground and land the thing. Both activities involve time consuming
checklists
> > involving nearly every light and gauge to insure safety.

New Optio 550 review

[Roland Mabo]

A good Optio 550 review can be found at:
http://www.megapixel.net
Click on "New Reviews", then on "Optio 550" and enjoy!
(It is a good review, because they praise the image quality and other 
things. :-) )

Best wishes
Roland
_
Lättare att hitta drömresan med MSN Resor http://www.msn.se/resor/

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[T Rittenhouse]

Ah, another know nothing that thinks she can do as well as the pros with her
point and shoot. I understand that diamonds are a real bitch to shoot
properly even when you have all the proper lighting equipment (very
specialized) in your studio.

And, I am surprised at you, Cotty. Why didn't you just tell her she is out
of her depth? 10x of a diamond is microphotography (well maybe not if it is
the Hope), not macro. This is not a job for an inexperienced professional
product photographer to attempt with a tight deadline (remember the spectral
highlights are very important here), much less someone who doesn't even know
the basics.

File sizes? Least of the problem.

Ciao,
Graywolf
http://pages.prodigy.net/graywolfphoto


- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 10:34 AM
Subject: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question


> Can anyone help this customer:
>
> <
> I have been on the internet for hours and I have no hair left!! I want to
> phoograph diamonds for a web site. They need to appear on the site abot 10
times
> real size. I bought a 3+ filter but this was a waste of time and money. I
got
> myself a camera book (I am a photo novice) and it would appear the only
way I
> am going to get quality macro images is with a macro lense. I have a
Pentax
> MZ30 and can not afford anything like £500 for a new Pentax Macro Lens.
Being a
> novice the auto features of any lense are important. From the book I read.
> Taking Macro images of a diamond will require maximum depth of field so I
need an
> apeture priority compatible lens (does this make sense?).
>
> Any help you can give would be wonderful and restore my faith in the
internet.
>
> Thanks
>
> Hayley>>
>
> Post your replies here and I will forward to her (?). Since I know nothing
> about file sizes for the web.
> FAX 44 1273 681135
>

Vs: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Raimo Korhonen]

Yeah, it´s us old geezers who need AF.
The speed of operation of modern, good quality AF SLR is from another world compared 
with e.g. Leica rangefinder - especially obvious when changing film or lenses - and 
Leica has a reputation as being instinctive.
All the best!
Raimo
Personal photography homepage at http://www.uusikaupunki.fi/~raikorho

-Alkuperäinen viesti-
Lähettäjä: Dag T <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Vastaanottaja: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Päivä: 02. kesäkuuta 2003 0:07
Aihe: Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)


>A nive observation:  I met two teenage girls today both using cameras 
>from the 70s, one of them being a Pentax K2.  Not all of the youngsters 
>require AF speed and auto everything... :-)
>
>DagT
>
>På søndag, 1. juni 2003, kl. 23:15, skrev Jim Apilado:
>
>>
>> Jim A.  (user of the classic ES II and manual focus SMC Taks.)
>

Vs: Canon financial results 1Q03

[Raimo Korhonen]

Nah, IIRC nobody has said that Canon makes cameras at loss - of Nikon it is suspected 
that the F5 does not make profit.
All the best!
Raimo
Personal photography homepage at http://www.uusikaupunki.fi/~raikorho

-Alkuperäinen viesti-
Lähettäjä: Caveman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Vastaanottaja: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Päivä: 02. kesäkuuta 2003 2:03
Aihe: OT: Canon financial results 1Q03


>http://www.canon.com/finance/conf2003q1/p06.html
>
>http://www.canon.com/finance/conf2003q1/p10.html
>
>http://www.canon.com/finance/conf2003q1/p11.html
>
>I remember someone stating that they sell cameras at a loss (just for 
>annoying Nikon) ???
>
>cheers,
>caveman
>

Vs: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Raimo Korhonen]

If he needs 10x magnification the only alternative would be bellows with a special 
real macro lens (like Zeiss Luminars) are needed - outside his budget, though. Maybe a 
microscope, too?
All the best!
Raimo
Personal photography homepage at http://www.uusikaupunki.fi/~raikorho

-Alkuperäinen viesti-
Lähettäjä: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Vastaanottaja: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Päivä: 02. kesäkuuta 2003 16:35
Aihe: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question


>Can anyone help this customer:
>
><
>I have been on the internet for hours and I have no hair left!! I want to 
>phoograph diamonds for a web site. They need to appear on the site abot 10 times 
>real size. I bought a 3+ filter but this was a waste of time and money. I got 
>myself a camera book (I am a photo novice) and it would appear the only way I 
>am going to get quality macro images is with a macro lense. I have a Pentax 
>MZ30 and can not afford anything like £500 for a new Pentax Macro Lens. Being a 
>novice the auto features of any lense are important. From the book I read. 
>Taking Macro images of a diamond will require maximum depth of field so I need an 
>apeture priority compatible lens (does this make sense?).
>
>Any help you can give would be wonderful and restore my faith in the internet.
>
>Thanks
>
>Hayley>>
>
>Post your replies here and I will forward to her (?). Since I know nothing 
>about file sizes for the web.
>
>Kind regards
>
>Peter
>
>CAMERA DIRECT
>8 DORSET STREET
>BRIGHTON
>EAST SUSSEX
>BN2 1WA
>UK
>http://www.camera-direct.com
>TEL 44 1273 681129
>FAX 44 1273 681135
>

Semi-OT: A little stealth project

[Stephen Moore]

Here's a situation:

For four out of the past eight Friday nights
(every one when it wasn't raining or otherwise
too vile to be out and about), somebody has been
pelting the front of my house with raw eggs. It's
always Friday, always between 21:00 and 22:00,
always two eggs. And it's getting old. Really old.
The village where I live has no police force;
the county and state cops have bigger fish to 
catch on Friday nights.

This past Friday my wife happened to be looking
out the front window and caught a glimpse of the
perp winging an egg. Not a good enough glimpse for
an ID, but enought to know it's a teenager using 
as cover the deep shadows in the yard across the street.

Having thought of and dismissed many solutions that
involve physical violence, since they won't let me 
use my Pentax gear in jail (assuming it hadn't already
been sold off to pay fines and costs), I'm wondering
if there's a photographic solution. 

I've got an LX, a 300/4, an AF400T, and an AF2T
flash extender. The distance from the observed launch
point to a hiding spot behind my front hedge is about
120 feet. Have I got the ingredients for a photo ID
I can take to the local juvenile authorities?

Hints, tips, advice, and/or "creative solutions" ;-)  
will be greatly appreciated.

Regards,

Stephen

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Caveman]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I want to 
phoograph diamonds for a web site. They need to appear on the site abot 10 times 
real size. I bought a 3+ filter but this was a waste of time and money. I got 
myself a camera book (I am a photo novice) and it would appear the only way I 
am going to get quality macro images is with a macro lense.
At this magnification... which would be at least 4x in film terms, 
there's little he can do without spending some money. I would vote for 
some bellows gear, or a macro lens with extension tubes. The biggest 
problem will be framing, focusing and getting enough DOF, and long 
exposures, I suspect the macrophoto stand + lighting table would be 
really nice. Otherwise a good tripod and the macro focus rail.
There is the cheaper alternative of attaching some 50mm reversed on 
200mm lens. But that is cheaper only if you already own such lenses, 
otherwise it would be more convenient to get the FA 100/3.5 and some 
extension tubes. Or an used macro lens running at decent price, if he 
can find one.
I suspect the first experiments were with closeup diopters on a zoom 
lens. No way to get decent quality at very high magnification with this 
combination.

cheers,
caveman

Re: Semi-OT: A little stealth project

[Caveman]

Stephen Moore wrote:
I've got an LX, a 300/4, an AF400T, and an AF2T
flash extender.
1. I'd vote for a faster shorter focal. with the 300 it is easy to get 
some out-of-focus pics (with great bokeh) ;-)
2. I suspect that just firing the flash in his direction 2-3 times will 
take care of the situation, no police needed.

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Maris V. Lidaka Sr.]

Considering his/her lack of experience and equipment, and budget, he/she
might scan it, then enlarge it for the web.  At 72 ppi screen resolution the
resulting size won't be a problem, though I don't know how well  it will
scan.

Maris

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Can anyone help this customer:
>
> <
> I have been on the internet for hours and I have no hair left!! I
> want to phoograph diamonds for a web site. They need to appear on the
> site abot 10 times real size. I bought a 3+ filter but this was a
> waste of time and money. I got myself a camera book (I am a photo
> novice) and it would appear the only way I
> am going to get quality macro images is with a macro lense. I have a
> Pentax
> MZ30 and can not afford anything like £500 for a new Pentax Macro
> Lens. Being a novice the auto features of any lense are important.
> From the book I read. Taking Macro images of a diamond will require
> maximum depth of field so I need an apeture priority compatible lens
> (does this make sense?).
>
> Any help you can give would be wonderful and restore my faith in the
> internet.
>
> Thanks
>
> Hayley>>
>
> Post your replies here and I will forward to her (?). Since I know
> nothing
> about file sizes for the web.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Peter
>
> CAMERA DIRECT
> 8 DORSET STREET
> BRIGHTON
> EAST SUSSEX
> BN2 1WA
> UK
> http://www.camera-direct.com
> TEL 44 1273 681129
> FAX 44 1273 681135

Fo sale : pentax M 28-50 and 70-150 zooms

[Cyril MARION]

For sale :

SMC PENTAX-M Zoom f/3,5 28mm f/4,5 50mm 
very nice condition, practically never been used, with caps and genuine
case.
Pictures on http://pentaxiste.org/article.php3?id_article=32

SMC PENTAX-M Zoom f/4 75-150mm, not used, very good condition, as new. Front
cap is missing.
Pictures on http://pentaxiste.org/article.php3?id_article=31

Both visible in Paris, price to be negotiated (something around 80€each,
tell me if it is too expensive; on another hand I would like to find an A of
FA 35mm f/2... so any arrangement can be possible)

Cheers,

Cyril
www.pentaxiste.org



---

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/05/2003
 

Re: Is this the new digital? Or, prosumer digital #2?

[Cotty]

Have a look here, Frank:



Ah, just saw your follow up post. The link still stands ;-)



Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Herb Chong]

Bruce's point was that it takes 6 months steady practice with a camera to be able 
react and fix a focusing problem in an AF camera without having to think about it. 
that fixing time is the same reaction time it takes for a trained pilot to see that 
one of the instrument lights isn't green that should be and know what's wrong. reading 
an unfamiliar camera's manual for 5 minutes and dismissing its AF as useless only 
means you have already made up your mind and reason has nothing to do with it.

Herb
- Original Message - 
From: "Bob Blakely" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 11:13
Subject: Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)


> Clearly, you are not a pilot, and certainly you have no commercial or
> military experience flight experience. It's ok. Not everyone has. Further,
> it this has nothing to do with Pentax or photography. I was not commenting
> on your views regarding the taking of photos, just making a side comment on
> your very poor choice for an analogy.
> 
> Regards,
> Bob...

Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Cotty]

Oh.!



But it's still got crap manual focus facility. How do the Optios manual
focus??




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Christian Skofteland]

On Monday 02 June 2003 13:26, Cotty wrote:
> Oh.!
>
> 
>
> But it's still got crap manual focus facility. How do the Optios manual
> focus??

Like crap.

Christian

Re: Pentax bashing

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

>From: Bruce Dayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 

>I used to have very mixed feelings about Pentax (much like Caveman) 
>when I was pursuing 35mm. I was trying to get the best quality I 
>could in lenses and bodies but my pictures didn't show that much 
>difference. 

You've very clearly defined the problem that WW & I have mentioned
so frequently.  There's only so much info in that little neg.
A composition may be superb but the content just isn't there.

>Once I crossed over to medium format (thanks to some much 
>needed encouragement and information from some PDML'ers) 

Leaving the (35mm) dark side, that is.

>the whole Pentax world changed for me. 

You heard it here first, folks.  Pentax (medium format) changes lives.

>My local camera shop carries Pentax MF along with all their Nikon stuff.
>The quality of manual focus lenses was high like in the old K mount days.
>My picture quality has gone up tremendously. 

Yes, real repentance leads to good works!

>I don't get condescending looks from Canon/Nikon shooters 

Isn't it you giving them the condescending looks now.
"You shoot Nikon/Canon/Leica/Contax?  That's nice.  Here's what I shoot."

>when I pull out that big 67II. 

Envy, I think they call it.
Is it wrong to incite envy in others?
Could be a lot of fun.

>The lens line is extensive for medium format. 
>I no longer have this driving urge to "need" 
>what Nikon and Canon 35mm offer. 

Why?  Don't you want more?  That's unAmerican!

>I have found that I am actually enjoying my 35mm shooting more 
>now than I was before moving to Medium Format. 
>I used to shoot PZ-1p's and then MZ-S's in my quest. Now I am shooting 
>an MX and SuperProgram. Yes there is an occasional image that is 
>harder to capture that the high tech cameras would aid with. 

Also a member of Luddites Anonymous.

>But my contentment with what I have and am doing 
>has increased dramatically. 

S.  Don't tell marketing!

>Bruce

Collin 


mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Nick Zentena]

On June 2, 2003 10:34 am, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Can anyone help this customer:
>
> <
> I have been on the internet for hours and I have no hair left!! I want to
> phoograph diamonds for a web site. They need to appear on the site abot 10
> times real size. I bought a 3+ filter but this was a waste of time and
> money. I got myself a camera book (I am a photo novice) and it would appear
> the only way I am going to get quality macro images is with a macro lense.
> I have a Pentax MZ30 and can not afford anything like £500 for a new Pentax
> Macro Lens. Being a novice the auto features of any lense are important.
> From the book I read. Taking Macro images of a diamond will require maximum
> depth of field so I need an apeture priority compatible lens (does this
> make sense?).
>
> Any help you can give would be wonderful and restore my faith in the
> internet.
>
> Thanks
>
> Hayley>>
>
> Post your replies here and I will forward to her (?). Since I know nothing
> about file sizes for the web.


Okay so no budget? Needs 10x? Which if I understand would limit it to a max 
real life size of 2.5 mm if she stuck to 35mm? Plus she wants full automatic? 
I assume she wants it to bake bread to?-))

I think it might be possible to do this on the cheap. But not on automatic. 
Not 35mm. Even on the cheap you've got lights etc. 

Smart thing send it out to be done. Second thing maybe find a school that is 
teaching photography and would be willing to do the work in return for 
borrowing the subjects. 

How big are these things? 

Nick

FS: Pentax 1.4X-s converter

[Tonghang Zhou]

Pentax 1.4X-S converter for sale.  Like new condition
with caps and leather case.  5 elements in 4 groups.
Very good optical performance.

Here's a picture:
http://www.cicely.com/trade/a14x-s.jpg

For info, see Bojidar's excellent page:
http://kmp.bdimitrov.de/teleconverters/A1.4X-S.html

B&H currently sells this item for $220 without the
leather case:


http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh6.sph/FrameWork.class?FNC=ProductActivator__Aproductlist_html___40609___PE1.4XS___USA___CatID=0___SID=F5C4AF824D0

I'd like to get $125 plus shipping ($5 in US.)  Let me
know, thanks.

Tonghang.

Re: Semi-OT: A little stealth project

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

Calculate the distance in advance and shoot in manual mode.
The perp will be in focus and exposed properly.

Collin



mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .

Re: Semi-OT: A little stealth project

[Camdir]

I concur with the Caveman.

And to even attempt to prove something, wouldn't you have to be able to id 
not only the perp but also the target? 

Hanging's too good for 'em etc cont. p94

Kind regards

Peter 

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Cotty]

>And, I am surprised at you, Cotty. Why didn't you just tell her she is out
>of her depth? 10x of a diamond is microphotography (well maybe not if it is
>the Hope), not macro. This is not a job for an inexperienced professional
>product photographer to attempt with a tight deadline (remember the spectral
>highlights are very important here), much less someone who doesn't even know
>the basics.

EH?!?!?

Not me boss. Dunno what yer drinking but can I have some?




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

You can get close to 1:1 with extension tubes and a 2x placed at the rear.
The scanned results will easily allow the desired web display @ 10x.
I suspect lighting will end up being more of an issue than magnification.
(That is, if I understand the issue correctly.)

Collin



mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .

Re: Semi-OT: A little stealth project

[Rfsindg]

Stephen,
 You should check out the coverage of the 300mm lens.  You may need to use less, 
like a 135mm and pre-focus to catch your juvenile egg tosser.  I'd use fast film and 
shoot thru an open window in the darkened house.  The flash should reach out to get 
your image.  
 Have you talked to your neighbors?... especially the ones with older children at 
home.  Let them know how distressing it is and ask if they can help identify the 
perpetrator.
 Regards,  Bob S.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> I've got an LX, a 300/4, an AF400T, and an AF2T
> flash extender. The distance from the observed launch
> point to a hiding spot behind my front hedge is about
> 120 feet. Have I got the ingredients for a photo ID
> I can take to the local juvenile authorities?

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Rfsindg]

Peter,
 I tried taking pictures of my wife's engagement ring when the setting wore out.  
The results were not very satisfactory... even with a Tripod, Bellows A, and A100/2.8 
Macro.  The depth of field was non-existant.  I couldn't get the front & back of the 
stone in focus at the same time, let alone any of the ring.
 If I did it again, I would note the caveman's suggestion of using a 50mm reversed 
on some longer lens.  He has some great Micro/Macro shots in past PUGs.  Then your 
next problem is lighting.  She needs to find an experienced friend to help with the 
project.
 Regards,  Bob S.

In a message dated 6/2/2003 9:34:40 AM Eastern Standard Time, Camdir writes:
> I want to phoograph diamonds for a web site. They need to appear on the site about 
> 10 times real size. I bought a 3+ filter but this was a waste of time and money. I
> got myself a camera book (I am a photo novice) and it would appear the only way I
> am going to get quality macro images is with a macro lense. I have a Pentax
> MZ30 and can not afford anything like £500 for a new Pentax Macro Lens. Being a
> novice the auto features of any lense are important. From the book I read.
> Taking Macro images of a diamond will require maximum depth of field so I need an
> apeture priority compatible lens (does this make sense?).

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Caveman]

The AF principle of use does not change in time. My understanding of it 
is that you have to overlay one of the AF sensor points on a point in 
the scene that you want to focus on. Then you can shoot away, or lock 
focus and recompose. Did you find it to work differently after 6 months 
? In the case of the "modern AF camera" that Bruce is using (the now 
obsolete F100), you have 5 such AF points, and that's easy to determine 
from the specs. I state again that if you need 6 months of looking 
through the viewfinder in order to get convinced that the F100 has 5 AF 
points, it's you that have a problem.

Herb Chong wrote:
Bruce's point was that it takes 6 months steady practice with a camera to be able react and fix a focusing problem in an AF camera without having to think about it. that fixing time is the same reaction time it takes for a trained pilot to see that one of the instrument lights isn't green that should be and know what's wrong. reading an unfamiliar camera's manual for 5 minutes and dismissing its AF as useless only means you have already made up your mind and reason has nothing to do with it.

Herb
- Original Message - 
From: "Bob Blakely" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 11:13
Subject: Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)



Clearly, you are not a pilot, and certainly you have no commercial or
military experience flight experience. It's ok. Not everyone has. Further,
it this has nothing to do with Pentax or photography. I was not commenting
on your views regarding the taking of photos, just making a side comment on
your very poor choice for an analogy.
Regards,
Bob...

Re: Pre-Prom Pix with the PA-1p & fill flash

[Rfsindg]

Dave,

I used the AF500T flash mounted directly on the PZ-1p's off center flash shoe,
shooting 200ASA film with the sun behind the subjects.  I think that I had the camera 
dialed in at -.3 or -.7 stops for the fill flash.  With the daylight shooting and film 
speed, the flash recycle time was nearly zero.  With the faster 3+ FPS motor on the 
PZ-1p, I was slow with my trigger finger and got several doubles of the same scene.  
That was a surprise.

Overall, I'm quite pleased at how easy it was and the results I got.  The FA28-70/2.8 
is big and heavy, but very nice to work with in those situations.

Regards,  Bob S.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> They look good Bob.
> What flash/flashes combo were you using.
> Dave(knowing he should have waited for a used pz-1p)Brooks
> 
> > Scanned my prints from yesterday's Pre-Prom photos.
> > As I said, I'm very happy with the PZ-1p ability to do synchro 
> > sunlight pix.  I've put up a number of photos taken with 
> > fill flash and the sun behind the subjects.
> > They are here...
> > http://members.aol.com/dontmailbob/PromB.jpg
> > http://members.aol.com/dontmailbob/PromC.jpg
> > thru...
> > http://members.aol.com/dontmailbob/PromH.jpg
> > Regards,  Bob S.

Re: Pre-Prom Pix with the PA-1p & fill flash

[Butch Black]

Thanks Bob,

I recently got a Z-1P and I have a Vivitar flash with TTL capabilities that
I had from my old 645. I am going to have to try it out soon. Yours look
good.

BUTCH

Each man had only one genuine vocation - to find the way to himself.

Hermann Hess (Damien)

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Herb Chong]

the number of points is irrelevant. it is whether you have to think or just react to 
set focus with AF engaged.

Herb...
- Original Message - 
From: "Caveman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 14:13
Subject: Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)


> I state again that if you need 6 months of looking 
> through the viewfinder in order to get convinced that the F100 has 5 AF 
> points, it's you that have a problem.

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[T Rittenhouse]

Where did you hear that? No one I ever knew claimed loading film in a Leica
was instinctive.

Very well built, a pleasure to handle, sharp lenses, the world's best
rangefinder, yes. But, instinctive? Not likely.

I am glad I am not one of you old geezers, so I don't need AF. Of course, my
opinion is that most people never learned to focus a camera, and therefore
fiddle with it forever. I will admit AF works better for them.

Ciao,
Graywolf
http://pages.prodigy.net/graywolfphoto


- Original Message -
From: "Raimo Korhonen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


> Yeah, it´s us old geezers who need AF.
> The speed of operation of modern, good quality AF SLR is from another
world compared with e.g. Leica rangefinder - especially obvious when
changing film or lenses - and Leica has a reputation as being instinctive.

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Dag T]

I agree with you in the medium format solution.  I had some luck and 
sold a lot of photos some time ago, but being fond of the square format 
I bought a 6x6 Bronica with 40mm, 80mm and 180mm lenses.  The lenses 
are made by Tamron (Bronica is owned by them) and have that nice manual 
focus feeling.  The 180mm is great for portraits, having a close 
focussing at 1m...

DagT

På mandag, 2. juni 2003, kl. 15:53, skrev Bruce Dayton:

I used to have very mixed feelings about Pentax (much like Caveman)
when I was pursuing 35mm.  I was trying to get the best quality I
could in lenses and bodies but my pictures didn't show that much
difference.  Once I crossed over to medium format (thanks to some much
needed encouragement and information from some PDML'ers) the whole
Pentax world changed for me.  My local camera shop carries Pentax MF
along with all their Nikon stuff.  The quality of manual focus lenses
was high like in the old K mount days.  My picture quality has gone up
tremendously.  I don't get condescending looks  from Canon/Nikon
shooters when I pull out that big 67II.  The lens line is extensive
for medium format.  I no longer have this driving urge to "need" what
Nikon and Canon 35mm offer.  I have found that I am actually enjoying
my 35mm shooting more now than I was before moving to Medium Format. I
used to shoot PZ-1p's and then MZ-S's in my quest.  Now I am shooting
an MX and SuperProgram.  Yes there is an occasional image that is
harder to capture that the high tech cameras would aid with.  But my
contentment with what I have and am doing has increased dramatically.
Bruce



dcn> That's why I've had a slowly growing "camera equipment account" 
for years.  I've been planning on a change from Pentax to something 
with good manual focus lenses.  The problem is that a Leica or
dcn> Contax camera with the equivalent of 85 f/1.4, 50 f/1.4, 28 
f/2.0, 20 f/2.8 and a good macro lens is still far out of reach.

dcn> Maybe I'll by the *istD in stead :-)

dcn> DagT

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Caveman]

From my strictly personal pov, it looks to me to be a better 
proposition than a DSLR.
And it's interesting to note who are the contenders in the digicam race: 
Canon and Sony.

Cotty wrote:
Oh.!

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[T Rittenhouse]

Sorry, Cotty. Its this cold. My brain is all stopped up. I meant Peter.
Really.  I did... Didn't I?

Ciao,
Graywolf
http://pages.prodigy.net/graywolfphoto


- Original Message -
From: "Cotty" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

>
> EH?!?!?
>
> Not me boss. Dunno what yer drinking but can I have some?

31 Limited Wobble

[jtainter]

Hi Joe,

Does the front section of your 31 still wobbles slightly (can feel it if 
held by hand) after service? Or it is completely firm now?

regards,
Alan Chan


Alan, I would say that it is stable and firm now. If you have a noticeable wobble, you 
may need to send it to Pentax.

Joe

Vs: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Raimo Korhonen]

Ah well, I did not intend to imply that loading a Leica with film would be instinctive 
- but taking pictures with same.
I considered the matter in earnest when deciding what to take on a trip to Estonia 
next weekend which includes a visit to an exotic island - Kihnu - where the women 
still wear the traditional folk dresses - and convenience won over absolute quality: 
I´ll take the MZ-S with the 3.5-4.5/24-105 Pentax and 2.8/20 Pentax and 4-5.6/70-300 
Sigma.
I´m sure I would get better quality images with my Leica M6 but Pentax gear will be 
good enough and faster to use. AF is just plain faster, no doubt about it.
All the best!
Raimo
Personal photography homepage at http://www.uusikaupunki.fi/~raikorho

-Alkuperäinen viesti-
Lähettäjä: T Rittenhouse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Vastaanottaja: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Päivä: 02. kesäkuuta 2003 20:46
Aihe: Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)


>Where did you hear that? No one I ever knew claimed loading film in a Leica
>was instinctive.
>
>Very well built, a pleasure to handle, sharp lenses, the world's best
>rangefinder, yes. But, instinctive? Not likely.
>
>I am glad I am not one of you old geezers, so I don't need AF. Of course, my
>opinion is that most people never learned to focus a camera, and therefore
>fiddle with it forever. I will admit AF works better for them.
>
>Ciao,
>Graywolf
>http://pages.prodigy.net/graywolfphoto
>
>
>- Original Message -
>From: "Raimo Korhonen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>
>> Yeah, it´s us old geezers who need AF.
>> The speed of operation of modern, good quality AF SLR is from another
>world compared with e.g. Leica rangefinder - especially obvious when
>changing film or lenses - and Leica has a reputation as being instinctive.
>
>
>

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Christian Skofteland]

On Monday 02 June 2003 14:56, Caveman wrote:
>  From my strictly personal pov, it looks to me to be a better
> proposition than a DSLR.
> And it's interesting to note who are the contenders in the digicam race:
> Canon and Sony.

A better proposition for what use?  

I was just at a 12 hour race on Saturday (more to follow) and, because I was 
crewing for a team I didn't bring my film SLRs (LX and MX).  Instead I took a 
few grab-shots with the Optio 330.  Panning to catch moving cars on a track 
with a digicam is a hit and miss proposition.  While i am happy with the 
results I got, with an SLR with negligable lag time (film or digital) I would 
have had fewer misses and more hits.  Also, the manual focus on the Optio is 
a joke and the lag time is so high that I'd never be able to trap-shoot cars 
in a head on shot.

The other reasons (for me) that a digicam is not a better proposition than a 
DSLR is lens selection and FPS.  I shoot mostly normal to long telephoto, and 
while some digicams have long reach, they are simply not long enough for me.  
Being able to shoot at least 2 FPS for several seconds is also important to 
me.

I know the Optio 330 has nothing on the G5 in terms of features and I agree 
that the G5 and G3 look like awesome cameras.  I've seen samples from a G2 
where the photographer reveresed a 55/1.8 SMC Takumar for some great macro 
shots (better than anything I've done on film).  But I don't think I'd give 
up an interchangeable-lens DSLR for a digicam.  I love my Optio for a film 
P&S replacement however.

It all boils down to what works for you is best for you in a given situation.

Christian

Re: Semi-OT: A little stealth project

[Bob Walkden]

Hi,

clearly a case for the Pentax Nocta and a 2X eggs tender...

or, rig up something like the things wildlife photographers use to get
animals to photograph themselves by triggering an infra-red beam. Set
up two cameras, one with a wide-angle lens to capture the throw and
the ovoid trajectory towards your house, the other to capture the
perp's criminal physiognomy. Let the trip wire trigger the cameras and
flash simultaneously. Also, perhaps, have it release a net from the
tree, or spring a rope round his ankle.

Alternatively, hide behind the tree on indicated nights, and jump on
him when he tosses the embryos. When you've caught him, don't punish
him! No, forgive him. Show him true Christian love. Repeatedly. Sing
hymns at him. Show him your other cheeks. Teach him the meaning of
God's Love by standing over him and reading from the authorised
version for several hours, very, very loudly. Make him an omelette
and insist that he eat it. Then make another. And another. Make him
eat omelettes until they ooze out of his eyeballs. Then ask him why he
did it. Why? Keep asking. Why? Why? After an hour or 2, start crying.
Beg for his forgiveness. Try to make it up to him. Take him for a
drive in the desert, at night. When you get somewhere really lonely,
drive off the road for a couple of miles, and make him start digging
a hole. While he's digging, pick your teeth with a Bowie knife, and
hum 'Bohemian Rhapsody', off-key.

When the hole's big enough, tell him to get in the trunk of your car.
Drive him back to the tree, drop him off and say 'Thanks, Bubba. Must
do it agin sometime'.

That always works for me.

Hannibob.

Wow, I've just had another great idea. Get some explosives and wire
them up so that when the egg hits the house, the entire village
explodes! That's gonna make him feel really sheepish thinking he did
it!

And it'll get the police to pay some attention.


Monday, June 2, 2003, 5:25:58 PM, you wrote:

> Here's a situation:

> For four out of the past eight Friday nights
> (every one when it wasn't raining or otherwise
> too vile to be out and about), somebody has been
> pelting the front of my house with raw eggs. It's
> always Friday, always between 21:00 and 22:00,
> always two eggs. And it's getting old. Really old.
> The village where I live has no police force;
> the county and state cops have bigger fish to 
> catch on Friday nights.

> This past Friday my wife happened to be looking
> out the front window and caught a glimpse of the
> perp winging an egg. Not a good enough glimpse for
> an ID, but enought to know it's a teenager using 
> as cover the deep shadows in the yard across the street.

> Having thought of and dismissed many solutions that
> involve physical violence, since they won't let me 
> use my Pentax gear in jail (assuming it hadn't already
> been sold off to pay fines and costs), I'm wondering
> if there's a photographic solution. 

> I've got an LX, a 300/4, an AF400T, and an AF2T
> flash extender. The distance from the observed launch
> point to a hiding spot behind my front hedge is about
> 120 feet. Have I got the ingredients for a photo ID
> I can take to the local juvenile authorities?

> Hints, tips, advice, and/or "creative solutions" ;-)  
> will be greatly appreciated.

MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Thomas Haller]

Hi Folks,

I know this is a beat-to-death topic, but I searched and searched and I
haven't found what I was looking for so I'm asking here.

What do you folks think of using the Lithium DL-1 battery in place of two
MS76s in an MX?

I understand the original battery (mercury-something) started at 1.3V but
quickly dropped to and held a fairly even 1.2V until it suddenly died, which
made it perfect for the meter application.

I read that the alkaline replacement (AS76?) starts a bit too high at 1.5V,
but quickly comes down to around 1.25V, but the discharge characteristic of
slowly getting lower and lower in voltage (especially in the last third of
their life) makes these "useless" for the meter application.

I've read that the MS76 US replacement is a silver-oxide battery that starts
at 1.6V, but quickly drops to 1.5V where it stays until the last 1% of it's
life. This is a great discharge profile but the voltage is "too high". Yet
these are what I most often see recommended as the battery to use in my MXs.

What I haven't seen is any discussion of the Lithium DL-1 battery, which
says it is a 3V battery. I've used those occasionally and they seemed to
work, but then again I was shooting wide-latitude color print film and
"bracketing like crazy". One of the reason I like the DL-1 is it provides
voltage at very cold temperatures (-10 degrees F or "Christmas in
Connecticut") and has a nice 10 year shelf life.

Does anyone know the DL-1's discharge profile (which is probably similar to
other Lithium batteries)? Or what is the current solution of the MX battery
issue? If I want to use DL-1s exclusively do I really need to / can I get
the MX meters adjusted for the higher voltage? Do I need to if I use the
MS76 silver-oxide replacements?

Sorry to bring up an old issue, but I've read what I could find online and I
still have these questions.

Thanks for listening!

- THaller

Re: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Lukasz Kacperczyk]

AFAIK MXs use normal 1.5V batteries. They weren't desinged for mercury
batteries.

Regards,
Lukasz
===
www.fotopolis.pl
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
===
 internetowy magazyn o fotografii

Sensor cleaning - easy and fun to do (was Barn Owl, 1000 ISO, ufo'setc)

[Cotty]

*ist D purchasers may well be interested. I just cleaned the sensor on my
digi, no problem. I aimed an anglepoise lamp at some white paper and took
some shots. Then I followed instructions and cleaned the CMOS sensor,
which basically entailed the equivelent of locking the mirror up and
firing the shutter on 'B' so I could use a blower to blast away the
offending dust spots. I did this with the anglepoise illuminating the
scene and I could actually see the dust particles - a couple - and they
blew off easily. A few more pumps on the blower for good measure and it
was done. Next, I took the same shots of white paper again.

Examining the pics in Photoshlop side by side, the dust was obvious in
the 'before' and completely gone in the 'after'. This was the first time
I had done this in 6 months of ownership. I think it worth pointing out
that in my case at least, the dust particles weren't adhering to the
actual sensor itself, rather a thin transparent protective shield
(glass?) that exists in front of the sensor for this reason. Hence dust
spot appear out of focus and not as hard sharp dark points (which would
be more obvious, but also more distracting.

.02 dust spots,




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
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||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
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Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Christian Skofteland]

On Monday 02 June 2003 16:32, Alan Chan wrote:

>
> But we don't know if she meant 10X on film, or just on the monitor.
>
> regards,
> Alan Chan

10x on film is a microscope/magnifier (or a kludge of TCs, Tubes, and stacked 
lenses).  10x on the monitor is a good scanner and fine-grained film.

Christian

OT: need help from UK members

[Alan Chan]

Hi PDML members,

I would like to buy some Opti-clean from UK and wonder if anyone could help 
me purchase them and then ship them to me because the shop won't ship 
overseas? I live in Vancouver Canada. The items I am interested in include:

(x6) http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=110
(x2) http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=9165
(x1) http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=61023
Payment would be made by PayPal. Thank.  :-)

regards,
Alan Chan
_
MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

Re: Sensor cleaning - easy and fun to do (was Barn Owl, 1000 ISO, ufo's etc)

[Mark Roberts]

Cotty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>I think it worth pointing out that in my case at least, the dust 
>particles weren't adhering to the actual sensor itself, rather a thin 
>transparent protective shield (glass?) that exists in front of the sensor

Anti-aliasing filter.


-- 
Mark Roberts
Photography and writing
www.robertstech.com

Re: Vs: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Nick Zentena]

On June 2, 2003 04:32 pm, Alan Chan wrote:
> >If he needs 10x magnification the only alternative would be bellows with a
> >special real macro lens (like Zeiss Luminars) are needed - outside his
> >budget, though. Maybe a microscope, too?
>
> But we don't know if she meant 10X on film, or just on the monitor.


No but we can guess. What is a jewellers loupe? I'm betting the idea is to 
have on the web the same sort of detail that the loupe would show. That means 
10X on the film to me.

Nick

Re: Pentax Macro/pix for the web question

[Christian Skofteland]

On Monday 02 June 2003 16:21, William Robb wrote:

> The best way to light this sort of thing is to build a box painted white
> on the inside and put a couple of 100 watt lights into it. The colour of
> the light can be corrected with an 80A filter between the lens and the
> reversing ring.
> Depth of field will be a problem, but that can't be helped.
>
> William Robb

What would you think about black seamless paper, a softbox from above and 
slightly behind for even, shadow-free lighting and pointing a really fine 
spot into the diamond to add sparkle?

I have an image in my mind and wonder if it would even be doable.  Not that 
it really matters because I don't have the equipment, nor the need/care to do 
such a photograph.

Christian

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Fred]

> Gosh. Am I the only one that likes the ME Super too ? ;-) It's so
> cute, especially when properly skinned ;-)

I love the ol' ME Super, too.

I happen to even love those cute little Up and Down shutter buttons.

It's cute in silver and it's elegant in black.

But not so cute when improperly skinned (i.e., re-skinned)...  

Fred

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Cotty]

> From my strictly personal pov, it looks to me to be a better 
>proposition than a DSLR.
>And it's interesting to note who are the contenders in the digicam race: 
>Canon and Sony.
>
>Cotty wrote:
>> Oh.!
>> 
>> 

Ah, but Cavo old chap,

The one thing I love to do is use manual focus, so from my point of view,
a DSLR is much better. I think proper manual control (not just override)
is essential. That's what bothers me about manual focussing in these
small digicams like the Optios and the Powershots and so on - it's not
manual focussing at all, it's a manual override that is slow and
cumbersome. The great thing about SLRs, whether digital or film, is that
you can taylor the system to your own liking. All my lenses have big fat
manual focus grips on them - I would consider nothing else.

Turning a lens barrel is quick and easy. Pushing buttons (in this case)
is not as quick and not as easy and therefore I (personally) am not
interested. However, that said, for a point and shoot street camera in
digital (where grabbing the shot the quickest way possible is primary),
then an Optio or a Powershot will be a good choice. The Optio 550 sure
looks perty, no mistake. But I have a thing for black cameras. Especially
when they take CF cards (does the Optio take CF cards?) and the same
batteries that I'm already using

I'm not sure I follow you about 'who are the contenders in the digicam
race: Canon and Sony'

What about Pentax? What about Nikon? What about Olympus? etc? They are
contenders also, surely, and good ones. If I choose a camera, one of the
criteria that strikes me as pretty important is the lens quality/design.
Off the top of my head, I couldn't tell you who makes the lenses for
Sony's digicams, but I wouldn't immediately consider a Sony over a Canon
because of those two, I know which one specialises in photographic items.
Same for a Pentax, or a Nikon, or an Olympus. It's true that with
digital, the camera body is much more important than with film, but a
Sony stills camera to me is like a Canon hifi stereo system. Nice, but
I'd rather have a Sony, cos that's what they're best at

Sorry, rambling. More drink!




Cheers,
  Cotty


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Re: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Herb Chong]

that's what is recommended in the manual, S76 batteries. hard to argue with that.

Herb
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Haller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Pentax Discuss (E-mail)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 15:38
Subject: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)


> I've read that the MS76 US replacement is a silver-oxide battery that starts
> at 1.6V, but quickly drops to 1.5V where it stays until the last 1% of it's
> life. This is a great discharge profile but the voltage is "too high". Yet
> these are what I most often see recommended as the battery to use in my MXs.
> 

Re: OT: need help from UK members

[Caveman]

Alan Chan wrote:
(x6) http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=110
C'mon. Isopropyl alcohol rules.

cheers,
caveman

Re: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[alexanderkrohe]

Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 12:38:45 -0700 
From: Thomas Haller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> 
> What do you folks think of using the Lithium DL-1
battery in place of 
> two
> MS76s in an MX?


The Pentax service says no to the use of the Lithium
battery in the MX.

Alexander

__
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com

RE: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Thomas Haller]

Hi Herb,

> "that's what is recommended in the manual, S76 batteries.
> hard to argue with that."
>
Thanks Herb! I guess I forgot that. I was reading all over the web about
"the Pentax battery replacement issue" but I was know now reading about
other Pentax models, like the Spotmatic, without realizing it.

Got myself confused! :-) I still like the CR1/3N or DL-1, though. I do
available light shots a lot, when it's fairly dark, and I can remember at
least one occasion when I had to change the batteries and one of the two
button cells turned over as I was loading them. Took a while to figure out
what was wrong! Harder to do with the single CR1/3N! And that shelf life! 

Thanks for the response!

- THaller

RE: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Thomas Haller]

Hi Alexander!

Thanks for the great response! (Alexander, great...:-)

> "The Pentax service says no to the use of the Lithium
> battery in the MX."
>
Uht-oh! Why do they say that, do you know? Seems like it can't be something
intrinsic, they must be worried about leakage or something?

Or maybe it's the discharge profile? Heck, just when I thought this question
was answered, too!

Thanks again for the info, Alexander! Any comments about this new info,
gang?

- THaller

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Caveman]

Cotty wrote:
Off the top of my head, I couldn't tell you who makes the lenses for
Sony's digicams,
Zeiss. At least on the top models.

but I wouldn't immediately consider a Sony over a Canon
because of those two, I know which one specialises in photographic items.
Same for a Pentax, or a Nikon, or an Olympus.
The nice thing with digital is that it's *very* easy to compare image 
quality between different models. From what I've seen until now, Canon 
and Sony (Zeiss) are doing better, with lower chromatic aberrations and 
so on. And both are good at electronics too.

cheers,
caveman

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Christian Skofteland]

On Monday 02 June 2003 16:07, Caveman wrote:
> I don't extrapolate it to the others - since they have different
> personal interests, what works for me may be useless for them and the
> other way round.
>
> cheers,
> caveman

I wasn't saying you were.  By the way, I was looking at some of the 
accessories avaialable for the G5.  WOW!  They really push the 
macro-capabilities of that thing don't they?  Two seperate closeup flash 
set-ups.  Pretty amazing.

Christian

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Herb Chong]

i just happened to be looking for a friend. Minolta has quite a series of macro 
accessories they advertise as suitable for their 7i digital camera, including two 
different ring light flash units.

Herb
- Original Message - 
From: "Christian Skofteland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 17:36
Subject: Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition


> I wasn't saying you were.  By the way, I was looking at some of the 
> accessories avaialable for the G5.  WOW!  They really push the 
> macro-capabilities of that thing don't they?  Two seperate closeup flash 
> set-ups.  Pretty amazing.

Re: Loading film in a Leica (was Pentax bashing)

[Paul Stenquist]

T Rittenhouse wrote:
> 
> Where did you hear that? No one I ever knew claimed loading film in a Leica
> was instinctive.

I'd like to chime in here. When I bought a Leica screwmunt (IIIf RD),
the pessimists here said I'd be selling it after loading a half dozen
rolls or so. In fact I've found that loading does become quite easy with
practice -- one might say instinctive. I've now shot about a hundred
rolls with the screwmount Leica and have grown quite fond of it. It has
replaced the MX as my walk around camera. I did a 20 mile walk through
Paris last week and shot eight rolls, loading on the street each and
every time. No problem. I'll be posting some of the pics once I've
scanned a couple dozen.
Paul

Re: OT: need help from UK members

[Alan Chan]

Nope, nothing come close to Opticlean when it comes to cleaning inner 
elements.  :-)

regards,
Alan Chan
C'mon. Isopropyl alcohol rules.
_
Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.  
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RE: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Alan Chan]

I don't know why the 3V lithium would damage the circuit, but this web site 
suggested some LXs were damaged by CR1/3N.
http://member.nifty.ne.jp/tsun2/libat.htm

You can get the translation here:
http://www.excite.co.jp/world/url/
regards,
Alan Chan
"The Pentax service says no to the use of the Lithium battery in the MX."
_
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Re: Loading film in a Leica (was Pentax bashing)

[Bob Walkden]

Hi,

Monday, June 2, 2003, 10:55:19 PM, you wrote:

> T Rittenhouse wrote:
>> 
>> Where did you hear that? No one I ever knew claimed loading film in a Leica
>> was instinctive.

[...]
> rolls or so. In fact I've found that loading does become quite easy with
> practice -- one might say instinctive. I've now shot about a hundred
[...]

there's a very simple experiment you could do here. First, find a
maternity ward full in a statistically significant way of new born
children (preferably human). Give them all a Leica IIIf and a roll of
Tri-X (but no instruction manual). Count how many of them load the
camera before they reach their majority.

For the 2nd part of the experiment, recruit an equal number of baby
pigeons, and using a mixture of punishment and reward techniques,
revolving largely around giving and withholding hemp seed, give them a
Leica IIIf and roll of Tri-X each. Using the original Leica manual
train them how to load film.

This simple and cost-effective experiment will demonstrate beyond all
reasonable doubt that loading a Leica is a learned behaviour, not an
instinct.

Don't forget to feed the dogs.

-- 
Cheers,
 G. E. (Pavbob) Skinner

Archive link broken

[Kevin Waterson]

I am trying to access the mailing list archives from this page
http://www.pdml.net/dbrewer/p4.html
but I just get an error..
The requested URL /[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ was not found on this server.

Kind regards
Kevin



-- 
 __  
(_ \ 
 _) )            
|  /  / _  ) / _  | / ___) / _  )
| |  ( (/ / ( ( | |( (___ ( (/ / 
|_|   \) \_||_| \) \)
Kevin Waterson
Port Macquarie, Australia

OT: exciting Konica digital tomorrow?

[Alan Chan]

http://www.konica.co.jp/personal/newproduct/index.html

Anybody noticed this? Seems like something exciting is coming, espcially 
after you checked their samples.

regards,
Alan Chan
_
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Re: Loading film in a Leica (was Pentax bashing)

[Bob Walkden]

Hi,

Monday, June 2, 2003, 11:14:33 PM, I wrote:

> --
> Cheers,
>  G. E. (Pavbob) Skinner

that should, of course, read either B. F. Skinner, or G. E. Moore.

I apologise for my bad behaviourists.

Bob

Re: OT: need help from UK members

[Caveman]

Alan Chan wrote:
Nope, nothing come close to Opticlean when it comes to cleaning inner 
elements.  :-)
Is it a fungicide or something ? ;-)

cheers,
caveman

Re: OT: need help from UK members

[Alan Chan]

Works too! But not for men (or women).  :-)

regards,
Alan Chan
Is it a fungicide or something ? ;-)
_
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RE: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Thomas Haller]

Hello again Alan,

> I don't know why the 3V lithium would damage
> the circuit, but this web site suggested some
> LXs were damaged by CR1/3N.
> http://member.nifty.ne.jp/tsun2/libat.htm
> 
I couldn't get the excite link to translate for me, but here's what I got
out of BabelFish from AltaVista:

> "CR - 1 / 3n lithium electric battery XXYEN 700 
>
> The CR - 1 / the LR44, 3n (the SR44) there is a lithium
> electric battery of equal size to x 2. It is tend to think
> as the lithium electric battery = high performance, but to
> tell the truth the CR - 1 / the 3n because it is the quality
> which is unsuitable to to use for the camera, when in the 
> type which is not stated in the instruction manual and the
> like as a use electric battery please do not use, received
> guidance at service center of the ??. 
> The CR - 1 / inserting the 3n, handwritten it is to repair
> vote of the LX which it puts out to overhaul, clear. 
> 
> Active type: Super A and PROGRAM A 
> 
> Use failure type: LX and P50 DATE, P30 (DATE, N and T) 
> 
> (The type which is not stated is lack of confirmation)
>
Not much hard data. Could it be that the LX and P50/P30 draw too much
current and overheat the battery, causing it to crack open and leak? But I
would think the Super and Program A models would draw a lot of current as
well. 

Maybe it is a physical size issue, like the CR1/3N is _slightly_ taller then
two MS76s and in the "failure types" this damages the battery compartment,
requiring an overhaul?

Any Japanese readers/translators out there that can interpret the page any
better?

Thanks for the info Alan!

- THaller

OT: Canon G5

[Alan Chan]

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0306/03060201canong5.asp

regards,
Alan Chan
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Re: PUG Comments Part Deux

[Steve Larson]

Hi Frank,
 Thanks for the kind words and commenting on the whole lot!
Steve Larson
Redondo Beach, California


frank theriault wrote:
> "Calla", by Steve Larson:
> 
> Wasn't there some discussion here a while back about this lens?  Wow!
> This reminds me of those famous "pepper" photos by Weston.  It actually
> looks erotic!  Beautifully captured, Steve.

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Rob Studdert]

On 2 Jun 2003 at 14:46, T Rittenhouse wrote:

> Where did you hear that? No one I ever knew claimed loading film in a Leica was
> instinctive.
> 
> Very well built, a pleasure to handle, sharp lenses, the world's best
> rangefinder, yes. But, instinctive? Not likely.

Sure it's not initially nor is any camera but all M series cameras have a life 
sized picture of the load procedure on their base (for the dummies) and if you 
do as it shows you're likely never to have a bad load and after the second time 
it's no slower to load than any other camera. Pre-M well that's another story 
from a previous era in film tech.

> I am glad I am not one of you old geezers, so I don't need AF. Of course, my
> opinion is that most people never learned to focus a camera, and therefore
> fiddle with it forever. I will admit AF works better for them.

I would estimate AF is actually useful to me in less than 10% of shots that I 
make.

Cheers,

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: Sensor cleaning - easy and fun to do (was Barn Owl, 1000 ISO, ufo's etc)

[Rob Studdert]

On 2 Jun 2003 at 21:36, Cotty wrote:

> *ist D purchasers may well be interested. I just cleaned the sensor on my
> digi, no problem. I aimed an anglepoise lamp at some white paper and took
> some shots. Then I followed instructions and cleaned the CMOS sensor,
> which basically entailed the equivelent of locking the mirror up and
> firing the shutter on 'B' so I could use a blower to blast away the
> offending dust spots. I did this with the anglepoise illuminating the
> scene and I could actually see the dust particles - a couple - and they
> blew off easily. A few more pumps on the blower for good measure and it
> was done. Next, I took the same shots of white paper again.

Great, more web folk law blown to bits, all the crap that I've read about CCD 
cleaning danger/difficulties have been put nicely to rest (as I suspected), 
thanks Cotty.

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Daniel Liu]

I think something we forget too often is how fun taking pictures can 
be. Not necessarily getting the shot and have the satisfication of 
seeing it "perfect", but rather the work involved getting it. I 
remember using a canon AF slr (rebel somethingorother) once: it was 
point, shoot, and pray. It's very satisfying to have to set up all the 
exposure, focus, and all that, i think. And pentax had at one point 
(mid 80s?) gotten that all right. And to some extent still do.

  --Daniel Liu
  "Oh Lordy, that's dry. Sucks the
  tissues right out of your mouth."
On Monday, Jun 2, 2003, at 06:53 US/Pacific, Bruce Dayton wrote:

I used to have very mixed feelings about Pentax (much like Caveman)
when I was pursuing 35mm.  I was trying to get the best quality I
could in lenses and bodies but my pictures didn't show that much
difference.  Once I crossed over to medium format (thanks to some much
needed encouragement and information from some PDML'ers) the whole
Pentax world changed for me.  My local camera shop carries Pentax MF
along with all their Nikon stuff.  The quality of manual focus lenses
was high like in the old K mount days.  My picture quality has gone up
tremendously.  I don't get condescending looks  from Canon/Nikon
shooters when I pull out that big 67II.  The lens line is extensive
for medium format.  I no longer have this driving urge to "need" what
Nikon and Canon 35mm offer.  I have found that I am actually enjoying
my 35mm shooting more now than I was before moving to Medium Format. I
used to shoot PZ-1p's and then MZ-S's in my quest.  Now I am shooting
an MX and SuperProgram.  Yes there is an occasional image that is
harder to capture that the high tech cameras would aid with.  But my
contentment with what I have and am doing has increased dramatically.
Bruce

Re: pentax-discuss-d Digest V03 #378

[frank theriault]

Were that the case, I'd only have to look out my front door...  

-frank

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Gee, I thought we were all going out to shoot the "world's olderst professionals" 
> (prostitutes) between certain hours.
>

--
"The optimist thinks this is the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears it 
is true." -J. Robert
Oppenheimer

Re: Sensor cleaning - easy and fun to do (was Barn Owl, 1000 ISO, ufo's etc)

[Alan Chan]

I don't have DSLR, but I imagine the sensor was sealed behind a piece of 
glass which should be hard enough for gentle cleaning. Or am I wrong?

regards,
Alan Chan
Great, more web folk law blown to bits, all the crap that I've read about 
CCD
cleaning danger/difficulties have been put nicely to rest (as I suspected),
thanks Cotty.
_
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Re: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Rob Studdert]

On 2 Jun 2003 at 12:38, Thomas Haller wrote:

> Hi Folks,
> 
> I know this is a beat-to-death topic, but I searched and searched and I
> haven't found what I was looking for so I'm asking here.
> 
> What do you folks think of using the Lithium DL-1 battery in place of two
> MS76s in an MX?

Below are extracts from previous answers which I've posted to the PDML over the 
last 5 years (yes the question does come up regularly):

"2 stacked LR44/SR44 are equivalenmt to 1 CR1/3N. The only reason that the 
CR1/3N cells may not appear in the compatible battery list in manuals is that
they are a relatively late battery design"

"The biggest problem with using the CR1/3N cells in the LX is that once you see
the low warning battery it's all over in a few minutes, I always keep one or 
two in each camera case. I have used them successfully for years in LX, ME 
Super, MX, KM, SuperA, ProgramA, M6 and M6 TTL cameras (and probably more that 
I can't think of at the moment)"

"There is no good reason not to use CR1/3N lithium cells in place of 2 x S76 or
equivalents, these batteries are only ever used for metering circuits which 
have an inherently high internal resistance (read low current requirement) so 
are self limiting. Since the terminal voltage remains the same there is no real
argument not to use them."

""I did a little research and found the following:

Approximate self discharge rates:

Alkaline batteries : 5 % / year (PX28A, A544, 4LR44 105mAh capacity)
Silver oxide : 5% / year (PX28, 544, 4SR44 160mAh capacity)
Lithium batteries : 1% to 2% / year (PX28L, L544 160mAh capacity)

>From the data above we can surmise that for low current applications the Silver 
oxide and lithium cells should offer similar operational life over the short 
term (eg under 6 months) however the Lithium cells will allow longer storage 
period."

Cheers,

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: OT: need help from UK members

[Rob Studdert]

On 2 Jun 2003 at 15:04, Alan Chan wrote:

> Nope, nothing come close to Opticlean when it comes to cleaning inner 
> elements.  :-)

Good cleaning is a product of removing contaminants not adding them :-)

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: OT: need help from UK members

[Rob Studdert]

On 2 Jun 2003 at 13:46, Alan Chan wrote:

> Hi PDML members,
> 
> I would like to buy some Opti-clean from UK and wonder if anyone could help me
> purchase them and then ship them to me because the shop won't ship overseas? I
> live in Vancouver Canada. The items I am interested in include:

If it's volatile then air freight isn't an option.

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: Archive link broken

[jerome]

FWIW, here's a bit more info:

June 2, 2003 

Mail-Archive is experiencing technical problems, all archives are temporarily 
offline and are being actively restored from backup. Because of the very large 
volume of data, this process takes a long time - multiple days so far, and 
possible a few more are required. Thank you for your patience. 

Jeff Breidenbach
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Quoting Kevin Waterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> I am trying to access the mailing list archives from this page
> http://www.pdml.net/dbrewer/p4.html
> but I just get an error..
> The requested URL /[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ was not found on this server.

Re: Sensor cleaning - easy and fun to do (was Barn Owl, 1000 ISO, ufo's etc)

[brooksdj]

To clean mine i have several choices.I can buy the solutions and swabs at Vistek
here in Toronto and HOPE i do it correctly(purchase cost +-75-80$)
or take it to Nikon in Mississauga for them to do it,cost 80-100$.
I even went and bought the $150 adaptor to lock up the mirror so as not to have the ccd
charged and 
still 95% is still there.
Its the swabs for me,but i think i'll let Nikon deal with it.Just have to talk myself 
into
it and get it 
there.They said i can wait if i get it in early in the day.
But until then its next to no sky and photoshop clone tool:)

Dave  

> I don't have DSLR, but I imagine the sensor was 
sealed 
behind a piece of 
> glass which should be hard enough for gentle cleaning. Or am I wrong?
> 
> regards,
> Alan Chan
> 
> >Great, more web folk law blown to bits, all the crap that I've read about 
> >CCD
> >cleaning danger/difficulties have been put nicely to rest (as I suspected),
> >thanks Cotty.
> 
> _
> Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*   
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
> 

Re: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[William Robb]

Just a brief adendum regarding what I found as relative life
expectancies beween 2 S76 batteries and a single DL 1/3n.
My experience was based on use in a Nikon F2s Photomic, which used 2
rather bright LEDs
for metering. The lithium battery gave about 20 minutes of metering, the
silver oxides gave about 1/2 hour of meter on time.
I have not bothered to do any sort of testing since, so my information
should be considered quite dated.

William Robb

Re: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[Rob Studdert]

On 2 Jun 2003 at 18:33, William Robb wrote:

> Just a brief adendum regarding what I found as relative life
> expectancies beween 2 S76 batteries and a single DL 1/3n.
> My experience was based on use in a Nikon F2s Photomic, which used 2
> rather bright LEDs
> for metering. The lithium battery gave about 20 minutes of metering, the
> silver oxides gave about 1/2 hour of meter on time.
> I have not bothered to do any sort of testing since, so my information
> should be considered quite dated.

My Nikon DP-2 ate batteries too, I thought there was something wrong with it 
for a long time.

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

RE: Will Caesar go screwhead on us?

[Cesar Matamoros II]

Collin,

WOOHOO

And yes, I was shouting.  Finally my name (anglicized) in the subject of a
thread!!

I had mentioned this to a lurker friend of mine - I believe only one post on
her part - that it would be neat to be mentioned in a thread's subject.  And
finally, I made it...

Thank you.  Now to the reply...

I have only four M42 Pentax cameras, but I do have a collection of
screwmount lenses.  I have used them on my K mounts on many an occassion.

I have thought about reskinning one of my M42 cameras... I do have two
S1as...

Cesar
Panama City, Florida

-- -Original Message-
-- From: collinb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 6:33 PM
--
-- http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2930468649
-- &category=15240
--
-- Tempting
--

RE: Will Caesar go screwhead on us?

[Cesar Matamoros II]

A Peter,

Don't feel bad that you only have one reskinned LX.  I will have to bring
both of mine whenever I make it across the pond...

Too much time to take, to little time to take it,

Cesar
Panama City, Florida

-- -Original Message-
-- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 12:45 PM
--
-- Snakeskin LXen are s passe, don't you know? I am getting
-- a Yuzen Kimono
-- kit made.
--
-- That is 'just beautiful'. :)
--
-- Peter
--

RE: Will Caesar go screwhead on us?

[Cesar Matamoros II]

The ultimate complement.

Thank you Tom.

My M42 'collection' consists of only four camera bodies and 11 lenses.  I
have used the lenses on K-mount bodies though.

I am used to using an external meter, so, even though one of my M42 cameras
have an internal meter, I still use the external meter.  What a joy to use
them...

Finishing off a bottle of '96 Bonne Chere Santa Barbara County Chardonnay,

Cesar
Panama City, Florida

-- -Original Message-
-- From: tom [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 1:31 PM
--
-- Cesar is already a screwhead.
--
-- tv
--
--
--

Optio pics at the 12 Hours at the Point

[Christian Skofteland]

Actual Pentax content!

I crewed for my friend Matt at the 12 hours at the Point which is an SCCA
endurance race held for the 5th year at Summit Point, West Virginia from
noon to midnight on May 31-June 1.

http://www.xian.us/12_hours.html
All shot with the Optio 330 from the pit wall (I was timing and scoring) or
inside the pits.  Panning for the moving cars was a hit-or-miss proposition
with the Optio but I got some okay images.  Some have been heavily cropped
and all were re-sized so final images on the web aren't as good as the
full-size 3MP originals.

It's a tough test for your average weekend racer (like Matt and his 3
co-drivers) but he was able to finish.  We were leading our class (Spec-RX7)
until 3 hours to go when a front bearing blew apart and welded itself to the
axle.  It had to be ground off and replaced.  The stop cost us 54 minutes
and ruined any chance of finishing higher than 3rd in class (there were only
3 SRX7s in the race):
http://www.xian.us/images/srx7_31_pits02a.jpg
This isn't the greatest photo as far as technical qualities go, but I think
it conveys what I intended: frantic work, panic, a good idea of what it's
like to race in the dark and the hopelessness of the situation. And you
gotta love the sparks!

Comments appreciated on my images.

Christian Skofteland
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: OT: Canon G5

[Butch Black]

Caveman wrote:
They also have a secret weapon - the G Spot model.

Isn't that the one specifically designed to photograph the worlds oldest
profession?

BUTCH

Each man had only one genuine vocation - to find the way to himself.

Hermann Hess (Damien)

Re: New Skin

[Christian Skofteland]

Maybe I exaggerated a little bit but  I swear the LX bit Stan!

Christian Skofteland
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


- Original Message -
From: "Cesar Matamoros II" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 10:11 PM
Subject: RE: New Skin


> Etu Christian?
>
> With the military I am used to stories with only 10% truth, but this is
> going too far... :-)
>
> You know you wanted the Grey Sea Snake...  You even asked about the White
> Cobra LX!!!
>
> Good thing I kept an eye on you while you were handling the Limited
> lenses...  Too bad I don't have a scanner, I would post the shots you took
> with it.  Maybe if I can use my CoolPix - when I have a chance...
>
> Thank you again for allowing us into your abode,
>
> César
> Panama City, Florida
>
> -- -Original Message-
> -- From: Christian Skofteland [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> -- Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 8:10 AM
> --
> -- Cesar was over my house the other day (along with Tom and
> -- Stan) and he
> -- brought his sea snake LX.  My 7 month old daughter wouldn't
> -- stop crying
> -- every time he pulled it out of his bag to take a photo!
> -- Come to think of it
> -- Tom cried too! For the record, I just felt physically ill
> -- and Stan needed
> -- antivenin. 
> --
> -- Too bad Cesar didn't "misplace" one of his limited lenses
> --
> -- Christian Skofteland
> -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>

Re: What do you do?

[Paul Eriksson]

Today, the "compensation" for the milk in the book incident came, a FA* 
200mm from KEH.  I guess I can't complain anymore .  The lens actually 
had a little more wear marks than I expected but the glass is nice, just a 
very limited amount of dust.

/Paul


From: Keith Whaley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: What do you do?  
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 10:34:45 -0700
None of these suggestions made herein take into account how his WIFE
acted, when she saw she had spilled milk on his newly beloved book!
What might or should come as a result of that incautious action depends
totally on what her immediate reaction was.
That there should be some action is a given.
It cannot be ignored as tho' it never happened!
No mehitibal's "oh well. what the hell. toujours gai."
keith whaley

Steve Desjardins wrote:
>
> You have to be understanding.  Accidents happen, and it's always more
> grief in the end for everyone if you take it out on your wife.  Look for
> another copy however, and be sure she knows the cost.  It's OK to
> encourage someone to be more careful.  ;-)
>
> Steven Desjardins
> Department of Chemistry
> Washington and Lee University
> Lexington, VA 24450
> (540) 458-8873
> FAX: (540) 458-8878
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
_
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

Re: What do you do?

[Bruce Dayton]

Paul,

Pretty good deal.  Guess I'm going to have to leave a few books out
and see what happens... 


Bruce



Monday, June 2, 2003, 9:30:12 PM, you wrote:

PE> Today, the "compensation" for the milk in the book incident came, a FA* 
PE> 200mm from KEH.  I guess I can't complain anymore .  The lens actually 
PE> had a little more wear marks than I expected but the glass is nice, just a 
PE> very limited amount of dust.

PE> /Paul


>>From: Keith Whaley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>Subject: Re: What do you do?  
>>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 10:34:45 -0700
>>
>>None of these suggestions made herein take into account how his WIFE
>>acted, when she saw she had spilled milk on his newly beloved book!
>>What might or should come as a result of that incautious action depends
>>totally on what her immediate reaction was.
>>
>>That there should be some action is a given.
>>It cannot be ignored as tho' it never happened!
>>No mehitibal's "oh well. what the hell. toujours gai."
>>
>>keith whaley
>>
>>Steve Desjardins wrote:
>> >
>> > You have to be understanding.  Accidents happen, and it's always more
>> > grief in the end for everyone if you take it out on your wife.  Look for
>> > another copy however, and be sure she knows the cost.  It's OK to
>> > encourage someone to be more careful.  ;-)
>> >
>> > Steven Desjardins
>> > Department of Chemistry
>> > Washington and Lee University
>> > Lexington, VA 24450
>> > (540) 458-8873
>> > FAX: (540) 458-8878
>> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>

PE> _
PE> The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*  
PE> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

Trust Adorama Condition as much as KEH?

[Thomas Haller]

Hey folks,

Do you all trust the Condition ratings at Adorama as much as you do the 
ones at KEH?

I've only done "pig-in-a-poke" shopping at KEH and so far their 
condition ratings seem conservative, the stuff is as good or better 
than they said it was.

What about Adorama? Can you compare their "D" (Demo) rating to KEH's 
"Like New Minus"?

I'm a bit suspicious of Adorama's ratings, as I see things like two 
identical model lenses for the same price, but one is "D" rated with 
caps, while the other is only rated "E" with no caps. Seems "odd" that 
they would be the same price.

Anyone with recent Adorama experience? Comments? Opinions?

Thanks for listening!

- THaller

Re: The problems of E.T. (was Re: pentax smc 15mm A turned into Star Trek Thread)

[Peter Alling]

Actually the chemistry mitigates against most common variations of life as
we sort of know it, such as chlorine breathers, or silicon based life to
name a couple of the more popular ones.  One of the most intelligent non
human species are squid.  If they weren't stuck in a liquid environment
they'd make a good candidate as tool users and it would be hard to be less
humanoid than that.
At 11:28 AM 6/1/03 -0400, you wrote:
Frank wrote;
But, back to the question at hand.  I'd say that you're limiting yourself
somewhat, Butch.  You're assuming (it seems to me) that in order to be
intelligent, life has to follow a similar evolution to us.  Why does all
life
have to be carbon based?  Just because we can't imagine any other way?  Why
does
all life have to evolve from the sea?  Is there no other way to manipulate
materials into tools but with opposable thumbs?
Yes it is somewhat limiting, though my original thread mentioned space
faring species. My understanding is that next to our intelligence, opposable
thumbs is our most significant evolutionary advantage. If the breakthrough
in physics ever comes that allows us to travel out of our solar system we
may very well find intelligent life looking very different then us.
The problem with sci-fi depicting alien species as basically humanoid is
strictly marketing. They discovered that the audience related more to them
if they were humanoid. Plus make-up is probably easier
I do agree with the concern that any other space faring species would be no
less aggressive then our own and would result in a major conflict. I also
worry about our tendency to do that and what we would do if we found a less
advanced civilization. Would we repeat the atrocities we did to the
indigenous civilizations that were found in the New World?
BUTCH

Each man had only one genuine vocation - to find the way to himself.

Hermann Hess (Damien)
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.  --Groucho Marx

Re: OT: The problems of E.T. (was Re: pentax smc 15mm A turned into Star Trek Thread)

[Peter Alling]

The drake equation quantifies nothing.  But it does look impressive, which 
is the
point.

At 07:07 AM 6/1/03 -0400, you wrote:
On May 31, 2003 11:59 pm, Butch Black wrote:
> Given the Star trek thread am I the only one with reservations that mankind
> will ever find another space faring species? If you think about it. If in
Somebody did a series of statiscal estimates on this years ago. 
Basically
turns out that quite a few intelligent life forms are likely out there. Look
up Drake equation.

Nick
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.  --Groucho Marx

Re: OT: The problems of E.T. (was Re: pentax smc 15mm A turned into Star Trek Thread)

[Peter Alling]

You can change the assumed parameters to come up with 1 as the number of
communicating life forms or lots more... As a tool it is useless as an
arguing point it's priceless.  But basically it's a way to pull numbers
out of you a** that looks scientific.
At 04:56 AM 6/1/03 -0700, you wrote:
I just did look it up. Thanks.

http://www.activemind.com/Mysterious/Topics/SETI/drake_equation.html

Redoing the existing formula's default parameters to some a bit less
optimistic, I come up with 200 possible communicating life forms within
OUR galaxy... The downloaded formula says 2400. I'm less optimistic.
The chief complicating factor, it seems to me, is the absolutely
incredible number of planetary bodies out there and the distances involved...
Akin, perhaps, to locating any of 200 particular grains of sand on your
favorite beach?
The magnitude of the task is mind-boggling!
Yeah, I know, that's why SETI exists, still...

keith

Nick Zentena wrote:
>
> On May 31, 2003 11:59 pm, Butch Black wrote:
> > Given the Star trek thread am I the only one with reservations that 
mankind
> > will ever find another space faring species? If you think about it. If in
>
> Somebody did a series of statiscal estimates on this years ago. 
Basically
> turns out that quite a few intelligent life forms are likely out there. 
Look
> up Drake equation.
>
> Nick
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.  --Groucho Marx

RE: OT: The problems of E.T. (was Re: pentax smc 15mm A turned into Star Trek Thread)

[Peter Alling]

At 02:59 PM 6/1/03 +0100, you wrote:
Frank Theriault wrote:

>I'm not a Sci Fi fan at all.  I'm even less of a Star Trek fan (sorry,
guys), so
>I haven't been following this thread at all.  But, I did read your post,
Butch,
>and you do pose some interesting questions, to which I have a few random
>thoughts.
I enjoy Star Trek as pure 'escapism', at the end of a bad day dealing with
life at the start of the 21st Century!
I have quite a few issues with it though:

Knowing how you feel in a Ferrari giving it some welly from 0 to 60 mph, you
feel pushed back in the seat - 0 to 186000 miles per second and multiples
thereof would atomise you;
Compensating force fields, a device used in a lot of Science Fiction
because, well because otherwise your crew would be jelly, and a bit more
likely than say the FTL drive itself.

I can't believe that all intelligent life forms will be carbon based or look
like us;
I doubt they will look like us but I'll bet on carbon based, at least
the one's well interact with will be.  (But I'd still bet against any
other chemistry producing life).
Seeing that some light takes hundreds/thousands + years to arrive to Earth,
even if you had the capability to travel much faster than light, there is no
guarantee these star systems would still exist when you travelled to them;
Star lifetimes are relatively predictable, even at the FTL speeds postulated
by most SF if a star is with a couple hundred light years you can pretty
confidently predict it'll still be there when you arrive.

I agree with Keith of the possibility and that an alien species who found us
(and therefore far more technically advanced) would be benevolent and (my
comment) might look at our planet as useful resources, or us as food
. With Voyager, we have even sent our address!
Ah, but any star faring race wouldn't want our planet for resources.  They'd
want the Solar system.  (They might leave us alone on our rock except we're too
clever so if I were them I'd _remove_ any possible competition).  I doubt they
would find us tasty enough and as raw materials for factory food there's 
lots of
CHON out in the outer solar system.


Of course, we only have a limited time to develop or evolve enough to
explore the galaxies - although a long time away the Sun has a finite
existence, so we will have to become travellersor casualties.
Anyway...

Hello to all and sorry to hear about Glenn and Frank's misfortunes. I hope
the thief who stole the bag gets what's coming to him.
I have had the opportunity to borrow a digital camera and the appeal to
immediately see what you have taken or modify the shot on computer is
compulsive. I am still hanging in for a look at the D*ist, even though it
has been put back to August for availability. I came within 12 meters of my
first film scanner. Whilst being delivered, the driver on top of the tail
lift on the truck thought his friend on the road had it, and he thought the
driver had it. It made a very expensive noise on landing on the road. It was
a sale item too, so no replacement, but they made no fuss about liability or
refund.
I found last week I had a day to myself and took the camera (LX) into the
forest for some pictures of my town from the top of the hill. The weather
has been very hot but a bit overcast here at times and I normally rush to
take what I want. This time when it went overcast, I relaxed and read a book
until the light was perfect again - I can't wait to see the result of that
film.
Regards to all,

Malcolm
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.  --Groucho Marx

RE: What do you do?

[tom]

> -Original Message-
> From: Paul Eriksson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 
> Today, the "compensation" for the milk in the book incident 
> came, a FA* 
> 200mm from KEH.  I guess I can't complain anymore .  

Did I call this or what?

tv 

Re: Hello and lots and lots "for sale"

[Peter Alling]

You see it too?

At 08:39 PM 6/1/03 -0400, you wrote:
There's a dirty joke in there somewhere...  

-frank

Caveman wrote:

> Yes, there's a world wide shortage of sand, plastic, aluminum and screws.
>
--
"The optimist thinks this is the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist
fears it is true." -J. Robert
Oppenheimer
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.  --Groucho Marx

Re: What do you do?

[Keith Whaley]

Paul Eriksson wrote:
> 
> Today, the "compensation" for the milk in the book incident came, a FA*
> 200mm from KEH.  

Excellent!

> I guess I can't complain anymore .  

Well, I wouldn't!  

> The lens actually
> had a little more wear marks than I expected but the glass is nice, just a
> very limited amount of dust.
> 
> /Paul

Thanks for the update!
That was a nice gesture.

keith

> >From: Keith Whaley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Subject: Re: What do you do?  
> >Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 
> >
> >None of these suggestions made herein take into account how his WIFE
> >acted, when she saw she had spilled milk on his newly beloved book!
> >What might or should come as a result of that incautious action depends
> >totally on what her immediate reaction was.

[...]

> >keith whaley
> >
> >Steve Desjardins wrote:
> > >
> > > You have to be understanding.  Accidents happen, and it's always more
> > > grief in the end for everyone if you take it out on your wife.  Look for
> > > another copy however, and be sure she knows the cost.  It's OK to
> > > encourage someone to be more careful.  ;-)
> > >
> > > Steven Desjardins

Re: PUG Comments Part Trois

[Peter Alling]

At 09:29 PM 6/1/03 -0400, Frank wrote:

"Alligator" by Peter J. Alling:

My only major criticism is that it would be nice were it sharper, but
you already know that .  The minor one, is that I wish the 'gator
were closer, but hell, if a 300mm won't get you any closer than that, I
wouldn't want to walk or move any closer .  Obviously, without that
sharpness, you can't really crop effectively.  Too bad you didn't have a
1000mm 
Actually the 'gator moved quite a bit closer.  Unfortunately I don't think
I could have held a 28mm acceptably steady that day.  1000mm har.
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.  --Groucho Marx

Re: Pentax bashing (was Re: another 31 Limited question)

[Bob Walkden]

Hi,

Tuesday, June 3, 2003, 12:06:06 AM, you wrote:

> Sure it's not initially nor is any camera but all M series cameras have a life
> sized picture of the load procedure on their base (for the dummies) and if you 
> do as it shows you're likely never to have a bad load and after the second time 
> it's no slower to load than any other camera. Pre-M well that's another story 
> from a previous era in film tech.

My M3 has the old-style loading where you have to take the spool out,
whereas my M4-2 has the new-style loading. The M3 is really quite slow
to load. The M4 loading system seems to be as good as any others that
I know, though. The Pentax magic needle system has always been quite
good for me, but is no better than the M4, and the M4 is probably
actually better than the Contax RX loading system. At least, I've
never had a misload with the M4, whereas on Sunday I shot 7 rolls with
the RX, of which one was a misload. The RX is slightly faster than the
M4 when it loads properly, but not by a huge amount.

-- 
Cheers,
 Bobmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Pentax Optios have some steep competition

[Peter Alling]

The only non crap focusing digicam I've seen is the Leica.  They're 
solution is neat.

At 02:56 PM 6/2/03 -0400, you wrote:
From my strictly personal pov, it looks to me to be a better proposition 
than a DSLR.
And it's interesting to note who are the contenders in the digicam race: 
Canon and Sony.

Cotty wrote:
Oh.!

Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.  --Groucho Marx

RE: MX Batteries: MS76 vs. DL-1 (vs. ?)

[alexanderkrohe]

Date: Mon, 2 Jun 2003 14:32:21 -0700 
From: Thomas Haller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> Hi Alexander!
> 
> Thanks for the great response! (Alexander,
great...:-)
>>
>> "The Pentax service says no to the use of the
Lithium
>> battery in the MX."
>>
> Uht-oh! Why do they say that, do you know? Seems
like it can't be 
> something
> intrinsic, they must be worried about leakage or
something?
> 


They said this has something to do with differences of
the internal resistance between the Lithium and the
alkaline batteries (I am not an expert, so I would
also appreciate any comments about that). 

The MX was released before the introduction of the
lithium batteries; it may not be safe to use the
lithium batteries in such cameras.  


> Or maybe it's the discharge profile? Heck, just when
I thought this 
> question
was answered, too!
> 
> Thanks again for the info, Alexander! Any comments
about this new info,
> gang?

I have to say that I used the Dl-1 batteries only once
in my MX. Soon after that the light meter had to be
replaced by the Pentax service. I can't say for sure
that it was the the lithium battery that caused the
failure of the light meter but it is probable. 

Enjoy,
Alexander  

__
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Re: OT: The problems of E.T. (was Re: pentax smc 15mm A turned into Star Trek Thread)

[T Rittenhouse]

Literally!

The equation probably would give us a relatively precise indication of the
life out there, IF we had real numbers to plug into it. However, all we have
is off the top of our heads BS. It is a case of having a method, but not
having any data to use it with. We can give an accurate estimate of the
range of possible answers though. Somewhere between 1 (this one), and all
the planets that possibly can produce life.

Ciao,
Graywolf
http://pages.prodigy.net/graywolfphoto


- Original Message -
From: "Peter Alling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 2:10 AM
Subject: Re: OT: The problems of E.T. (was Re: pentax smc 15mm A turned into
Star Trek Thread)


> The drake equation quantifies nothing.  But it does look impressive, which
> is the
> point.