Stus-List R&D flex coupling

[Pete Shelquist via CnC-List]

I need to replace my prop shaft/coupling and am considering the addition of an 
R&D flex coupling.  

 

Anyone have experience if they provide the reduction in noise/vibration as 
advertised?

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Re: Stus-List soft shackles

[Wade Glew via CnC-List]

merci beaucoup!

Wade
Oh Boy C&C 33 MK II

On Mon, Mar 4, 2019 at 3:23 AM Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

>
> https://stingysailor.com/2015/06/27/diy-soft-shackles-for-quick-and-easy-headsail-changes-2/
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 4, 2019, 12:29 AM Wade Glew via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote:
>
>> Hi Listers,
>>
>> some time ago there were some comments on the use of soft shackles to
>> join genoa sheets to the genoa clew.  This idea sounds really interesting
>> to me but having browsed Amazon, I realize I don't know what working
>> strength of soft shackle I need to buy.  My  C&C is a 33 MK II with I
>> dimension of 44.5 ft (13.56 m) and J dimension of 13.9 ft (3.99 m).  I
>> have  a 135 furling genoa.  Would anyone please help me to choose the
>> proper strength shackle?
>>
>> Wade
>> Oh Boy, 33 MK II
>> Lake of the Woods
>> ___
>>
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
>> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Re: Stus-List soft shackles

[Morgan Ellis via CnC-List]

>
> I know there was a great discussion on soft shackles last year, it had
inspired me to make some and try them out. But then I was talking to a
friend who had tried them on his express 27 and changed my mind. His
problem was that when they got wet and loaded up, they were difficult to
open. Has anyone else had this experience, or could it be just style of
soft shackle he used?

Regards,

Morgan
S/V Meandher
30-2
Thunder Bay, ON
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Re: Stus-List R&D flex coupling

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I have one.  Generally I would recommend it, but you might be disappointed
in the lack of vibration reduction.  This is not a fault of the coupling.
Vibrations come from many different points along the drive train and
engine.  The coupling can only reduce those vibrations resulting from a
misalignment of the engine and shaft.  The virtues of the flex coupling
include:
- helping to achieve a proper shaft alignment.
- allowing for slight deviations from proper alignment, up to 2 °.
- protect/prevent/minimize transmission damage in the event of a prop
strike with underwater obstructions - acting as the sacrificial component.
- provide electrical isolation if desired

I simultaneously adjusted the backlash on my valve lifters, replaced the
engine mounts with PYI mounts, and upgraded the intake filter/silencer.
Being able to isolate one component and its contributions to the reduction
in the noise/vibration is difficult.  I have enjoyed the above virtues.
Particularly, I've noticed considerable improvements in zinc anode life
span which I attribute to the electrical isolation.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD




On Tue, Mar 5, 2019, 8:48 AM Pete Shelquist via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote:

> I need to replace my prop shaft/coupling and am considering the addition
> of an R&D flex coupling.
>
>
>
> Anyone have experience if they provide the reduction in noise/vibration as
> advertised?
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Re: Stus-List soft shackles

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Amsteel is extremely slippery AND hydrophobic.  I think that your friend
was referring to something that was not a soft shackle or one that was not
properly made with the appropriate materials.

I make my own.  I can't justify the x4 or x5 price tag associated with
pre-made shackles.  I can usually make mine of repurposed (used), or scrap
Amsteel.  If I have to buy then it is usually less than $1/ft and I use ~3
ft.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD



On Tue, Mar 5, 2019, 9:08 AM Morgan Ellis via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote:

> I know there was a great discussion on soft shackles last year, it had
> inspired me to make some and try them out. But then I was talking to a
> friend who had tried them on his express 27 and changed my mind. His
> problem was that when they got wet and loaded up, they were difficult to
> open. Has anyone else had this experience, or could it be just style of
> soft shackle he used?
>
> Regards,
>
> Morgan
> S/V Meandher
> 30-2
> Thunder Bay, ON
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Re: Stus-List soft shackles

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

In the video below I use a soft shackle to attach the spring line to the
toe rail.  I drop the line and it is not uncommon for the line to be wet
from rain or from being dropped in the water.  Never have any difficulties
operating the shackle and can always make/unmake the connection in less
than 10 seconds.  In this case the soft shackle has the added advantage of
not damaging the rub rail and fiberglass in the event of contact.

https://youtu.be/DSAMR27tnFI

Josh

On Tue, Mar 5, 2019, 9:08 AM Morgan Ellis via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote:

> I know there was a great discussion on soft shackles last year, it had
> inspired me to make some and try them out. But then I was talking to a
> friend who had tried them on his express 27 and changed my mind. His
> problem was that when they got wet and loaded up, they were difficult to
> open. Has anyone else had this experience, or could it be just style of
> soft shackle he used?
>
> Regards,
>
> Morgan
> S/V Meandher
> 30-2
> Thunder Bay, ON
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Stus-List AIS antenna FYI SWR

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

My 8 foot extension mast was looking pretty bad and would get your hand full of 
fiberglass splinters if you touched it ☹ I got a new one with the nice gelcoat 
finish and when I went to take the AIS antenna off, it broke the base. Since I 
had to buy a new antenna anyway, I decided to get an AIS version 
(https://www.amazon.com/Shakespeare-5250-AIS-Classic-Skinny-Antenna/dp/B0029WVMBS/ref=sr_1_3?keywords=shakespeare+AIS&qid=1551801317&s=gateway&sr=8-3-spell
 ).
The old antenna was a plain old VHF antenna and the AIS unit measured the SWR 
at 1.4 to 1. The new antenna measures at 1.1 to 1, which is better. (For SWR, 
lower is good)
The actual real world difference in range will probably not be great enough to 
measure. I ran the coax calculator and the difference in loss between 1.1:1 and 
1.4:1 is about 2% for 20 feet of coax at 162 MHz. So the conclusion IMHO is if 
you are buying a new antenna for AIS work, for even money the AIS version is a 
tiny bit better, but I wouldn’t go spending much extra on it. Conversely you 
will lose a percent or two if you use an AIS antenna for a comm antenna. Note 
this whole discussion is based on 3dB gain antennas. Higher gain narrows 
bandwidth considerably as well as radiation angle. I would not use a 6 or 9 dB 
gain antenna on a sailboat in any case.


Joe Della Barba
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I


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Re: Stus-List soft shackles

[Morgan Ellis via CnC-List]

Hi Josh, Thanks for the feedback, and great video! I believe my friend had
used the conventional Y-style soft shackle design made from Dyneema. I like
the look of your's much better (see a better soft shackle,
http://l-36.com/soft_shackle_9.php) as there is no need to try to milk the
cover back to open the shackle, and leaving some short tails on, to have
something to grab would help as well. Another thing I picked up from your
video is that even though very small diameter Dyneema would be strong
enough, by using a bit larger size the shackle would be easier to work
with, especially with gloves on.
(BTW nice spring line set up!)

Regards,

Morgan
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Stus-List soft shackles

[Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List]

This video is what I use to make soft shackles:

http://l-36.com/soft_shackle_howto.php

Get some Dyneema, make one, and give it a try.  Alternatively, order from ebay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Blue-5-16-Soft-Shackles-ATV-Winch-Shackle-Synthetic-Rope-Shackle/132776705341?hash=item1eea1bbd3d:g:pSMAAOSw~BRcApxk:rk:4:pf:0

I don't recall if this is the one I ordered, but the soft shackle I got on ebay 
as an experiment was fine -- dyneema and well made.  Just had to tighten up the 
knot some.  Price is right.

To speed up the opening of the shackle, you can add a small pull cord.

Jeff Laman
1981 C&C34 "Harmony"
Ludington, MI


From: Morgan Ellis 
Sent: Tuesday, March 5, 2019 11:47 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List soft shackles

Hi Josh, Thanks for the feedback, and great video! I believe my friend had used 
the conventional Y-style soft shackle design made from Dyneema. I like the look 
of your's much better (see a better soft shackle, 
http://l-36.com/soft_shackle_9.php) as there is no need to try to milk the 
cover back to open the shackle, and leaving some short tails on, to have 
something to grab would help as well. Another thing I picked up from your video 
is that even though very small diameter Dyneema would be strong enough, by 
using a bit larger size the shackle would be easier to work with, especially 
with gloves on.
(BTW nice spring line set up!)

Regards,

Morgan
___

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Re: Stus-List soft shackles

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Yeah that is a very good price!

The "better soft shackle" has 2 "improvements".  First, the shackle eye is
limited in amount of eye size which can be expanded.  This can help further
secure the diamond knot from flogging loose.  When you make them yourself
you can tweak this parameter.  Second, the tails of the diamond knot are
tapered into the shackle.  You don't need to melt seal the ends.  This is
less significant but it does present a very neat and orderly appearance
that makes you ask, "How did you make that?  Where is the end."

Josh

On Tue, Mar 5, 2019, 12:37 PM Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote:

> This video is what I use to make soft shackles:
>
> http://l-36.com/soft_shackle_howto.php
>
> Get some Dyneema, make one, and give it a try.  Alternatively, order from
> ebay:
>
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Blue-5-16-Soft-Shackles-ATV-Winch-Shackle-Synthetic-Rope-Shackle/132776705341?hash=item1eea1bbd3d:g:pSMAAOSw~BRcApxk:rk:4:pf:0
>
> I don't recall if this is the one I ordered, but the soft shackle I got on
> ebay as an experiment was fine -- dyneema and well made.  Just had to
> tighten up the knot some.  Price is right.
>
> To speed up the opening of the shackle, you can add a small pull cord.
>
> Jeff Laman
> 1981 C&C34 "Harmony"
> Ludington, MI
>
> --
> *From:* Morgan Ellis 
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 5, 2019 11:47 AM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List soft shackles
>
> Hi Josh, Thanks for the feedback, and great video! I believe my friend had
> used the conventional Y-style soft shackle design made from Dyneema. I like
> the look of your's much better (see a better soft shackle,
> http://l-36.com/soft_shackle_9.php) as there is no need to try to milk
> the cover back to open the shackle, and leaving some short tails on, to
> have something to grab would help as well. Another thing I picked up from
> your video is that even though very small diameter Dyneema would be strong
> enough, by using a bit larger size the shackle would be easier to work
> with, especially with gloves on.
> (BTW nice spring line set up!)
>
> Regards,
>
> Morgan
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Autopilot tiller arm on LF38 *without* bolting

[Dreuge via CnC-List]

Patrick,

As you can imagine, I thought about this a bit, and while I choose to use a 
radial rudder stop mount for my connections for several reasons.  But there are 
options one may consider which would utilize a traditional autopilot tiller 
arms.  Edson makes tiller arms in both Aluminum and Bronze.  To me, it makes no 
sense to opt for the Aluminum arm as I doubt it's structurally as strong as 
using the radial rudder stop mount.  A Bronze arm (or even a custom stainless) 
is a good choice.

* Edson sells a different radial drive which has a shorter height.  Replacing 
an existing with one of these would be costly but it could free up shaft space 
for the tiller arm.  One needs to check the specs for the shorter radials and 
see if that option is feasible. 

* Alternatively, one may consider flipping the existing radial drive upside 
down.  It would be a challenging to reinstall and adjust the cables, and who 
knows, it may actually make the reinstall easier.   The rudder stop can be 
installed either on top or below on a radial drive, so in principle that can be 
mounted back on top,  but since the radial plane would be higher than existing, 
one may need to go with smaller steering idler sheaves.   While I though about 
this, I never actually measured for a fit.  

* A third option, and one I thought of after the fact, is to have a tiller arm 
custom made so that it bolts onto the radial at the shaft using the radial 
shaft bolts.  One would need slightly longer bolts, but it would be very 
robust.  (inspired by the custom bracket mount for my rudder indicator).   

Finally, with regards to radial/mount failures, I have heard of one where 
someone drilled holes in the radial for installing a mounting bracket rather 
than using the rudder stop bracket.  The set up failed over time due to 
dissimilar metal corrosion.I think drilling the radial is a huge mistake. 
It makes it weaker and more prone to corrosion.   Edson has reported that over 
time the radial can corrode at the rudder stop due to the dissimilar metals. 
This has been a common cause of rudder stop failures. While Edson has 
redesigned the rudder stop, they contend that failure is due to steering system 
neglect and lack of system system inspection.  Yes, we should all inspect more. 
 I would like to add that improper installation likely added to the haste of 
deterioration.   (.i.e. some Tef-Gel and some DMD electrical insulation paper 
goes a long way)   





-
Paul E.
1981 C&C Landfall 38 
S/V Johanna Rose
Fort Walton Beach, FL

http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/

> On Mar 4, 2019, at 12:00 PM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com wrote:
> 
> Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2019 07:46:09 -0800
> From: Patrick Davin mailto:jda...@gmail.com>>
> To: Robert Boyer mailto:dainyr...@icloud.com>>
> Cc: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Autopilot tiller arm on LF38 *without* bolting
>   to quadrant?
> Message-ID:
>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> That would be great if my worries are unfounded because it would save a lot
> of work. :)
> But I'm not so sure. Generally I like to defer to the advice of the
> manufacturer - they're the designers, the experts, the engineers, after
> all. Of course, I think Edson is being overly conservative to cover their
> butts. But it is true that losing steering could very well be catastrophic.
> 
> And of the boats that have installed direct to quadrant, I don't know what
> kind of conditions they've been tested in. It's possible they've never
> reached peak thrust.
> 
> Bob do you have any pictures of your autopilot install? I searched your
> blog but I think it's not on there (it's from before the blog).
> 
> -Patrick

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Stus-List Broken shift cable

[Fred Hazzard via CnC-List]

Sunday the shift cable on my 44 broke. Are there any 44 owners out who have
replaced this cable?
My cable is a red Morse cable.
My question is; how long is it?
I would like any suggestions on how to fish a new cable in.  The cable
comes down from the binacle runs under 2 fuel tanks and floorboards to the
engine.

Thanks
Fred Hazzard
S/V Fury
C&C 44
Portland Or
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Re: Stus-List Broken shift cable

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

I can’t help you with the cable length since my boat is different but I can 
recommend replacing it with a twisted cable (like a wire stay) instead of a 
solid cable.  Good luck!

Bob Boyer
s/v Rainy Days
C&C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
(Presently in Charleston SC for the winter)
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
email: dainyr...@icloud.com

> On Mar 5, 2019, at 5:32 PM, Fred Hazzard via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Sunday the shift cable on my 44 broke. Are there any 44 owners out who have 
> replaced this cable?
> My cable is a red Morse cable. 
> My question is; how long is it?
> I would like any suggestions on how to fish a new cable in.  The cable comes 
> down from the binacle runs under 2 fuel tanks and floorboards to the engine. 
> 
> Thanks 
> Fred Hazzard 
> S/V Fury 
> C&C 44
> Portland Or 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 


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Re: Stus-List Autopilot tiller arm on LF38 *without* bolting

[Patrick Davin via CnC-List]

Hi Paul,
Thanks for the ideas, lots of good ones!

> you wrote > * Edson sells a different radial drive which has a shorter
height.  Replacing an existing with one of these would be costly but it
could free up shaft space for the tiller arm.  One needs to check the specs
for the shorter radials and see if that option is feasible.

This is one idea Edson engineering suggested to me today actually!  Alden
got back to me (after speaking with engineering) and has been very helpful.
It would be a good deal of work swapping out the radial, and there are some
subtle impacts to consider (I can't change the wire track height too much
because if it causes steering cable chafe that will require shimming the
idlers/sheaves). It also might require extending the rudder stop post.

Flipping the existing offset-disc radial upside down doesn't help because
it would still consume the same amount of rudder shaft space (nearly all of
it, leaving no room for a standard tiller arm).

Edson's other idea was to move the existing radial down by 1.75", bringing
the concave portion of the disc closer to the rudder stock tube and freeing
up enough space for the 1 5/8" tiller arm above the radial. This definitely
requires idler/sheave modification though and rudder stop modification. In
addition it's a very tight fit to the point where it might not work (1/8"
clearance on cockpit floor and aft stern bulkhead).

Your 3rd idea is quite interesting, no one has thought of reusing the
radial drive hub thrubolts. The hub is contoured and has a ridge, so it
would have to be quite a custom part to get a good fit.

I've ruled out option B from my original email (Jefa quadrant with
integrated tiller arm) because it turns out it too would require
idler/sheave adjustments in addition to a custom rudder stop - basically
complete steering system redesign.

I'm focusing on option A now, which was to have a machine shop make an
"offset tiller arm" or "drop" tiller arm. I discovered the term "offset
tiller arm" when I found Buck Algonquin makes them (but not in the right
size for our boat, and they're bronze castings so they can't do a custom
one - they do 1000+ unit production runs).
https://www.deepblueyachtsupply.com/89112-89000-series-offset-tiller-arm

But having a machine shop make my own offset tiller arm seems doable, as
long as I can find a machine shop willing to do it.

-Patrick

-- Forwarded message --
> From: Dreuge 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc:
> Bcc:
> Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2019 17:24:39 -0500
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Autopilot tiller arm on LF38 *without* bolting
> Patrick,
>
> As you can imagine, I thought about this a bit, and while I choose to use
> a radial rudder stop mount for my connections for several reasons.  But
> there are options one may consider which would utilize a traditional
> autopilot tiller arms.  Edson makes tiller arms in both Aluminum and
> Bronze.  To me, it makes no sense to opt for the Aluminum arm as I doubt
> it's structurally as strong as using the radial rudder stop mount.  A
> Bronze arm (or even a custom stainless) is a good choice.
>
> * Edson sells a different radial drive which has a shorter height.
> Replacing an existing with one of these would be costly but it could free
> up shaft space for the tiller arm.  One needs to check the specs for the
> shorter radials and see if that option is feasible.
>
> * Alternatively, one may consider flipping the existing radial drive
> upside down.  It would be a challenging to reinstall and adjust the cables,
> and who knows, it may actually make the reinstall easier.   The rudder stop
> can be installed either on top or below on a radial drive, so in principle
> that can be mounted back on top,  but since the radial plane would be
> higher than existing, one may need to go with smaller steering idler
> sheaves.   While I though about this, I never actually measured for a fit.
>
> * A third option, and one I thought of after the fact, is to have a tiller
> arm custom made so that it bolts onto the radial at the shaft using the
> radial shaft bolts.  One would need slightly longer bolts, but it would be
> very robust.  (inspired by the custom bracket mount for my rudder
> indicator).
>
> Finally, with regards to radial/mount failures, I have heard of one where
> someone drilled holes in the radial for installing a mounting bracket
> rather than using the rudder stop bracket.  The set up failed over time due
> to dissimilar metal corrosion.I think drilling the radial is a huge
> mistake. It makes it weaker and more prone to corrosion.   Edson has
> reported that over time the radial can corrode at the rudder stop due to
> the dissimilar metals. This has been a common cause of rudder stop
> failures. While Edson has redesigned the rudder stop, they contend that
> failure is due to steering system neglect and lack of system system
> inspection.  Yes, we should all inspect more.  I would like to add that
> improper installation likely added to th

Re: Stus-List Broken shift cable

[svrebeccaleah via CnC-List]

Hi Fred, I can't help on length, but for installing new cable. Before pulling 
old cable out tie a 1/8 inch line to the cable to use for pulling new cable 
back in place. Once cable is out it is a simple chore to measure. I use this 
method for pulling wires, cables or what ever. Doug Mountjoy Sv Rebecca Leah 
LH39Port Orchard YC wa.
 Original message From: Fred Hazzard via CnC-List 
 Date: 3/5/19  14:32  (GMT-08:00) To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Fred Hazzard  Subject: Stus-List 
Broken shift cable Sunday the shift cable on my 44 broke. Are there any 44 
owners out who have replaced this cable?My cable is a red Morse cable. My 
question is; how long is it?I would like any suggestions on how to fish a new 
cable in.  The cable comes down from the binacle runs under 2 fuel tanks and 
floorboards to the engine. Thanks Fred Hazzard S/V Fury C&C 44Portland Or 
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