I don't think anybody said 1-2 cm below the saddle was really low.  I 
called 10cm really low.  I also said the lowest you can easily get on any 
stock Rivendell would probably be about 4 or 5 cm below with a Roadeo. 
 Patrick Moore gets that low on his customs also.  I think 4-5cm below is 
still perfectly normal for Rivendells.  Lungimsam observed that nobody can 
get a Roadeo fit on a sub $2000 frameset, and that's true.  All the sub 
$2000 frames are more upright than the Roadeo/Hilsen/Atlantis.  He said he 
was just making an observation, and it's a correct observation.  Maybe the 
next step in his thought process will be "there should be a budget 
Rivendell that fits like a Roadeo".  I know there are a lot of potential 
Rivendell customers who love the Rivendell vibe, are not going to buy a 
$4000 complete bike, but still want a "road bike", not a "cruiser".  There 
are a lot of people that would love to buy an inflation-adjusted Romulus. 
 That was a $1500 complete bike road bike.  Nothing dumb, but not 
sit-up-and-beg like the Appaloosa.  The 2016 version of that bike could be 
a great add, if Rivendell had the cashflow to do it.  I can't wait to sit 
up and beg on my Appaloosa, and would rather eat glass than put drop bars 
on it.  I've got drop bar bikes coming out my ears, but for those who 
don't, a budget Rivendell Road Bike might have a lot of appeal. 

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA 



On Tuesday, January 5, 2016 at 3:09:07 PM UTC-8, RJM wrote:
>
> I really don't see 1-2 cm below saddle height as low, certainly not really 
> low. 
>
> The one thing Rivs are, they are usually versatile and can be set up many 
> different ways. When I had my Sam I had it with drops that started two 
> inches above saddle height and that eventually went down to 1 cm below the 
> saddle. I just naturally felt more comfy there...then I switched it 
> albatross and of course the bars were higher then. The bike worked great 
> with each setup too.  My Roadeo is going similar to the Sam where I started 
> a little above saddle height but now I have mark's bars an inch below. Rivs 
> can certainly be ridden with bars that are lower than saddle height. This 
> is why quill stems are awesome too.
>
> The Joe really seems like a more laid back upright bike though. The long 
> wheelbase and top tube length kinda point it in that direction. Drop bars 
> would certainly work for those who don't mind actually riding in the drops. 
>
>

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