On 2024-12-18 15:24, Scott Q. via mailop wrote:
I simply wanted a way to find out who the abusers were so I can solve
the problem. I didn't want a removal, automatic or not.
Not co-operating with ESPs about who the offenders are doesn't really
help solve anything. It's completely counter-productive.
So basically, the logic here is the following: RBL operators won't tell
me what the spamtrap is because they want to keep it secret. Yet, they
expect me to parse thousands of lines of logs, go through who knows
how many hard bounces and eventually STILL FIND the spamtrap address.
How does this make any sort of sense ?
You are supposed to monitor logs anyways.. aren't you?
Scott
On Wednesday, 18/12/2024 at 16:53 Michael Peddemors via mailop wrote:
IF you can't adequately monitor your own outbound mail queues, and
track
rejections, and want someone else to do your job for you, you might
like
to offer the RBL operators some money to do your job for you.
*Sheesh*
Eg, Twilio is a billion dollar company, and can't get a handle on those
phishers abusing their systems..
Most RBL's do it voluntarily, or make a lot less money.. They don't
really have the time to tell you which accounts are being bad.. If you
believe in what they do, then contribute..
Amazing how many ESP's simply say 'remove me' or create bots to send
removal requests from RBL's.. and expect sympathy..
If you are worried about getting listed on Blacklists, do a better job
of monitoring traffic, rather than trying to squeeze in every
suspicious
client, for the bottom line..
ITs not that hard..
You can tell a bit aggravated when I hear ESP's expecting other people
to help them keep off blacklists for nothing..
And trying to compare an ESP to Gmail or o365 isn't realistic.. As bad
as those two companies are for letting spam out..
Grr.. back to work..
Thanks Atro and Anne for your comments, now can we put this to bed?
On 2024-12-18 13:26, Scott Q. via mailop wrote:
> But why is it bad if legitimate hosting providers know which of
their
> accounts is abused so they can take action and fix the problem ?
>
> I understand you don't want spammers to know what spamtraps you
use, but
> surely it would be beneficial for everyone if there is a trust
circle
> that can easily solve problems. A feedback loop basically.
>
> Scott
>
> On Wednesday, 18/12/2024 at 07:48 Atro Tossavainen via mailop wrote:
>
> ("List only" replies appreciated here)
>
> > ok, granted, but how else do you suppose would be a better
method
> > ? Can you imagine them asking Gmail to look at their logs
at around
> > +/- 1 minute ? We're not Gmail level but we still have
lots of data,
> > it's a silly way to convey information.
>
> I don't have a better way to suggest. I'm just pointing out that
> identifying spamtraps explicitly enables listwashing, so spamtrap
> operators are trying to do whatever they can to avoid it - while
> nonetheless trying to provide at least some useful information,
> in some cases.
>
> It is likely that any spamming account sent any number of similar
> messages around the timeframe indicated.
>
> Any entity rejecting the messages that another party tries to
send
> owes just about nothing to the would-be sender. At least you
get the
> information of WHO is responsible for the rejection here; in
the case
> of Cisco Talos Intelligence, the error messages don't even
tell you
> that you have a problem with Talos, they refer to unspecific
reputation
> issues where you don't even know where to start looking :-D
>
> --
> Atro Tossavainen, Founder, Partner
> Koli-Lõks OÜ (reg. no. 12815457, VAT ID EE101811635)
> Tallinn, Estonia
> tel. +372-5883-4269, https://www.koliloks.eu
<https://www.koliloks.eu> <https://www.koliloks.eu
<https://www.koliloks.eu>>/
> _______________________________________________
> mailop mailing list
> mailop@mailop.org <mailto:mailop@mailop.org> <mailop@mailop.org
<mailto:mailop@mailop.org>>
> https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
<https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop>
> <https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
<https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mailop mailing list
> mailop@mailop.org <mailto:mailop@mailop.org>
> https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
<https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop>
--
"Catch the Magic of Linux..."
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.
Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com <http://www.linuxmagic.com>
@linuxmagic
A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca
<http://www.wizard.ca>
"LinuxMagic" a Reg. TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada
_______________________________________________
mailop mailing list
mailop@mailop.org <mailto:mailop@mailop.org>
https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
<https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop>
_______________________________________________
mailop mailing list
mailop@mailop.org
https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
--
"Catch the Magic of Linux..."
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.
Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic
A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca
"LinuxMagic" a Reg. TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada
_______________________________________________
mailop mailing list
mailop@mailop.org
https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
