Hi Daniel, Regina, Clement, Marco,
You make good points.
Daniel,
You are right, we have been refining our processes at OSGeo-Live, and
the first projects to be included didn't fill the "mini application for
incubation". But we did ask these projects questions, and also turned
some projects away which we felt were not mature enough. After a while,
we collated all the questions we were asking into a wiki page which
people can use when applying.
Daniel,
You are also right that some old projects on OSGeo-Live might not be at
the level of quality we expect from new projects. Some of these projects
have already been retired. There are a couple more which we have been
considering retiring in future releases, especially if it appears the
community behind the project has left and it is not being maintained or
used any more.
Regina,
Your check list is pretty good. It actually aligns quite closely with
our Osgeo-Live application checklist:
https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Disc_Apply
Clemens, Daniel,
I agree that we as an OSGeo community should help new projects become
successful, which includes attracting a community, and building a
reputation. And yes, OSGeo-Live is an excellent marketing tool to help
projects get exposure.
However, it is a delicate balancing act. Uses are attracted to
OSGeo-Live because it provides a stamp of quality and maturity for the
projects associated with it.
If we lower the entry criteria, we weaken the branding value of
OSGeo-Live, and the marketing value to all the projects already on
OSGeo-Live.
So please do continue to question where we draw the line about the level
of quality we expect from OSGeo-Live projects. It is something that we
as a community need to continually revisit, which typically happens
during the start of a build cycle (ie now for the OSGeo-Live 9.5 release).
Warm regards,
Cameron
On 28/11/2015 5:05 pm, Daniel Kastl wrote:
Hi Cameron,
At the time when OSGeo Live started, no project had to answer a
questionnaire, that almost looks like a "Mini application for
incubation". So I think there are quite a few installed on OSGeo Live,
that wouldn't qualify with the rules you're setting now:
http://live.osgeo.org/en/overview/overview.html
I can understand the frustration of some, who would like to make their
project available on OSGeo Live to reach out to more users. Because
this might be actually a way to build a community. We could help them
to achieve something, that is pretty difficult and can take years.
So I'm not sure we have to be so strict in terms of community and
maturity.
We should be more strict in how software is installed (ie. providing
packages) and that there is someone maintaining the project for OSGeo
Live.
Just some thoughts,
Daniel
On 28/11/2015 5:35 pm, Paragon Corporation wrote:
Clement,
That is a pretty harsh statement to make. But sadly you are more or
less correct. The main issue being there are probably a ton of new
promising open source GIS projects
And since the LiveDemo initiative is to spread the FOSS4G gospel and
is created by volunteers, it does mean that they have to pick what is
most commonly used and easy to get up and going and things the group
expects will be easy for users to grasp and run with.
That said though, I think there is room for new projects with not a
large community and LiveDemo can help enlargining that community.
LiveDemo group needs to weigh in on the benefit of including such a
project as well as how much additional disk space it would take up on
the OSGEO Live cd, as well as how well it plays with other things
already on the cd.
So in the case of Marco's project, my suspicion is that his doesn't
add too much additional weight – I could be mistaken though, because I
forget what's on LiveCD already.
So Marco's builds on OpenLayers, Laravel, CodeIgnite (both of Laravel
and CodeIgnite anre PHP frameworks so just PHP scripts), JQuery,
AnuglarJS (both JQuery and AngularJS are just a bunch of javascript
files). It can use Apache which I think is already on the CD.
I don't recall if the CD has PHP already. I presume it does since I
think GeoMoose requires it. It can use Mapserver, PostGIS, GeoServer
data sources which are already on the CD.
So from my vantage point, all the services Marco's app needs to work
(including data) are already on the CD.
So that said, I think aside from judging how large a community is to
decide if it deserves to be on OSGEO-Live we should also consider
a)How much of a foot-print does the project app add to the CD?
b)How much of things already on the CD can a project app take
advantage of?
c)Are the developer's (or somebody) willing to put in the work to get
it on the CD and maintain it on the CD?
d)How redundant is it with other things on the Cd. In case of Marco's
app one may consider there is a lot of overlap with GeoMoose for
example. Though GeoMoose at a glance strives to be more ambitious,
which may turn off people looking for something a bit lighter they can
more easily integrate in a larger application.
e)Licensing of course
As a user looking at OSGeo for the first time, I may not have any
experience with anything GIS related. I may actually have more
experience with PHP and AngularJS than anything else. So just because
GeoServer or MapServer are the big kings in OSGeo doesn't mean they
will be seen as such from a newbie webdeveloper's perview. They'll
jump at something that looks more familiar to them, which could very
well be Mario's app.
Sidenote – when I was starting out in GIS, I got turned on to
MapServer first cause hey it's this executable I can load shapefiles
with and I can run in Microsoft IIS (that's all I knew and cared).
That turned me on to PostGIS, hey it’s a database thingy I already
know cause I'm an SQL guru Jand it works with Mapserver, and I can
finally get rid of those stupid shapefiles or generate them
automagically. Didn't care no one else had heard about it, meant I
could use the knowledge I had already to get stuff done.
Thanks,
Regina
On 28/11/15 14:43, clem...@igonet.fr wrote:
That's the answer I got for OpenEarthView project...
OsGeoLive is made for user only, not at all to help starting
promising projects.
That's frustrating.
They get the good part of free and open source projects, refusing to
take the risk of helping new ones.
What to say... That's not the open source (and open mind) philosophy...
Le 26 novembre 2015 19:28:14 UTC+01:00, Cameron Shorter
<cameron.shor...@gmail.com> a écrit :
Hi Marco,
It sounds like you have the start of a good project.
However, my feeling is that has not yet reached the maturity of
the other projects we have on OSGeo-Live.
In particular, we help new users answer the questions:
* What good open source GIS projects are out there?
* What is everyone else using?
What I suggest working on is getting a stronger answer to the
second question.
Aim to build up a community behind your project.
Look to get your project used by many organisations.
Aim to attract developers from these organisations.
I know this is a tough ask, and often takes years to attract such
a community.
But attracting a community is the true test of whether a project
is valuable or not.
Apache has a good page about building a community which might be
worth a read:
http://incubator.apache.org/guides/community.html
On 26/11/2015 6:39 am, Marco Afonso wrote:
Hello Alex,
Thank you for your reply.
Follows the MapIgniter application request to integrate OSGeo
Live. As we can see, this is a very recent project but with very
good technological background to evolve and specially satisfy
user needs.
I hope it can be accepted. If work has to be done, I'm on it!
Cheers,
Marco
*Please describe your application.
What is its name?*
It's name is MapIgniter2. The name came from previous release,
where it was based on CodeIgniter PHP framework.
*What is the home page URL?*
The project's home is hosted on GitHub at
https://github.com/taviroquai/mapigniter2
*Which OSI approved Open Source Licence is used?*
It uses the MIT license.
*What does the application do and how does it add value to the
GeoSpatial stack of software?*
MapIgniter is a GeoCMS which combines web mapping features with
Content Management System (CMS) features. It is a browser-based
software, or more commonly refered as a web application. The
main purpose of this software is to let users publish Geographic
Information on the Internet / Intranet on a free and Open Source
platform. Considering that there are other Open Source web
mapping platforms, MapIgniter distinguishes it self, and adds
value to GeoSpatial stack software, by being powered by cutting
edge Javascript and PHP frameworks/libraries, providing the best
tools for creating modern web applications.
*
*
*Does the application make use of OGC standards? Which versions
of the standards? Client or server? You may wish to add comments
about how standards are used.*
This software makes use of a subset of OGC standards; currently
WMS and WFS. Specific version numbers can be configured by the
user. MapIgniter backoffice interface allows to configure these
OGC service parameters to be used by OpenLayers 3 (frontend web
mapping library).
*What language is it written in?*
The default interface language is English. Also includes
Portuguese language files. Any idiom can be added later. This is
a feature of the PHP Laravel Architecture which is the PHP
Framework that powers this software.
*Which version of the application should be included in the next
OSGeo-Live release?*
MapIgniter2 targets release 1.0 for the next release of OSGeo-Live.
*Stability is very important to us on OSGeo-Live. If a new user
finds a bug in one application, it will tarnish the reputation
of all other OSGeo-Live applications as well. (We pay most
attention to the following answers):
If risk adverse organisations have deployed your application
into production, it would imply that these organisations have
verified the stability of your software. Has the application
been rolled out to production into risk (ideally risk adverse)
organisations? Please mention some of these organisations?*
The number of organisations using MapIgniter2 is unknown. Mainly
because this is a very recent software. Although, being
MapIgniter built upon Laravel 5.1 and OpenLayers 3, these two
frameworks have proven it's success in web development
applications it's usage by a number of companies.
Please see
Laravel Jobs https://larajobs.com/?partner=5#/
Openlayers Sponsors http://openlayers.org/sponsors.html
*Open HUB provides metrics to help assess the health of a
project. Eg:
http://adhoc.osgeo.osuosl.org/livedvd/docs/en/metrics.html Could
you please ensure that your project is registered with Open HUB,
and Open HUB has been updated to reference the correct code
repository(s) for your project. What is the Open HUB URL for
your project?*
The Open Hub URL is https://www.openhub.net/p/mapigniter2
*What is the size of the user community? You can often answer
this by mentioning downloads, or describing a healthy, busy
email list?*
MapIgniter2 has no community yet. The previous release has 10
forks on GitHub, 19 starred and 9 people watching the
repository. The Google groups has been some activity since 2012
until April 2015 from several users.
*What is the size of your developer community?*
Currently there is one developer.
*Do you have a bug free, stable release?*
Not yet.
*
*
*Please discuss the level of testing that your project has gone
through.*
There will be automated tests in soon.
*How long has the project has had mature code.*
The project is very recent.
*OSGeo-Live is targeted at applications that people can use
rather than libraries. Does the application have a user
interface (possibly a command line interface) that a user can
interact with? (We do make an exception for Incubated OSGeo
Libraries, and will include Project Overviews for these
libraries, even if they don't have a user interface.)*
Yes the software works on a web browser interface.
*We give preference to OSGeo Incubated Projects, or Projects
which are presented at FOSS4G conferences. If your project is
involved in OSGeo Incubation, or has been selected to be
presented at FOSS4G, then please mention it.*
Previous release of MapIgniter was presented to the OSGeo
Portuguese community on the 16th November 2012.
Please see
http://www.osgeo.org/node/1318
http://osgeopt.pt/eventos/sasig5.markdown/
*
*
*With around 50 applications installed on OSGeo-Live, us core
packagers do not have the time to liaise with every single
project email list for each OSGeo-Live release. So we require a
volunteer (or two) to take responsibility for liaising between
OSGeo-Live and the project's communities. This volunteer will be
responsible for ensuring the install scripts and English
documentation are updated by someone for each OSGeo-Live
release. Also test that the installed application and Quickstart
documentation works as expected on release candidate releases of
OSGeo-Live. Who will act as the project's liaison person.*
*
OSGeo-Live is Ubuntu Linux based. Our installation preference is:
Install from UbuntuGIS or DebianGIS
Install .deb files from a PPA
Write a custom install script
Can you please discuss how your application will be installed.*
*MapIgniter is a web mapping application based on PHP Laravel
5.1 Framework. Laravel framework runs over Apache2 or Nginx web
servers. MapIgniter system requirements matches Laravel 5.1
requirements.*
MapIgniter install procedure is similar to Laravel install
procedure. It can be manually installed by using the
instructions documented in MapIgniter GitHub repository. Also,
there is an install script (linux) that automates the install
process. Just enter onto Apache public folder and run from shell
curl
https://raw.githubusercontent.com/taviroquai/mapigniter2/master/install.sh
| sudo sh
Please see
Laravel Documentation http://laravel.com/docs/5.1
Install script
https://github.com/taviroquai/mapigniter2/blob/master/install.sh
*OSGeo-Live is memory and disk constrained. Can the application
run in 512 Meg of RAM?*
Yes.
*How much disk space will be required to install the application
and a suitable example application?*
Approximately 38 Mbytes.
*We aim to reduce disk space by having all applications make use
of a common dataset. We encourage applications to make use of
the example datasets already installed:
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Add_Project#Example_Datasets
If another dataset would be more appropriate, please discuss
here. Is it appropriate, to remove existing demo datasets which
may already be included in the standard release.*
Examples datasets provided by OSGeo Live are fine to be used
with MapIgniter. Optimum data is with native Web Mercator
projection.
*Each OSGeo-Live application requires a Project Overview
available under a CC By and a Quickstart available under a CC
By-SA license. (You may release under a second license as well).
Will you produce this?*
Yes.
*In past releases, we have included Windows and Mac installers
for some applications. It is likely we won't have space for
these in future releases. However, if there is room, would you
be wishing to include Windows and/or Mac installers?*
Yes, Windows installer.
*
*
2015-11-25 17:01 GMT+00:00 Alex Mandel
<tech_...@wildintellect.com <mailto:tech_...@wildintellect.com>>:
On 11/25/2015 08:24 AM, Marco Afonso wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I would like to submit a new project for OSGeo-Live.
>
> The project in case is MapIgniter2.
> Here is the home of the project:
https://github.com/taviroquai/mapigniter2
>
> I would like to know what are the requirements and
procedures to be
> accepted to integrate OSGeo Live.
>
>
>
Marco,
Reply to this thread with the answers to the following
questions:
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Disc_Apply
The expanded details of adding new projects is documented at:
http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Add_Project
Thanks,
Alex
--
Regards,
Marco Afonso
http://goo.gl/ZDtQjm
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Cameron Shorter,
Software and Data Solutions Manager
LISAsoft
Suite 112, Jones Bay Wharf,
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P +61 2 9009 5000, Wwww.lisasoft.com, F +61 2 9009 5099
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LISAsoft
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26 - 32 Pirrama Rd, Pyrmont NSW 2009
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