Did you read the topmatter disclaimer about the terminology? Anyway no podling has a guaranteed "right" to a sufficient number of mentors, that's why I didn't bother addressing Upayavira's concern. That is a best-effort attempt based on volunteer availability not something we should commit to in a "Bill of Rights".
----- Original Message ----- > From: Ross Gardler <rgard...@opendirective.com> > To: general@incubator.apache.org; Joe Schaefer <joe_schae...@yahoo.com> > Cc: > Sent: Tuesday, June 18, 2013 7:09 PM > Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] PodlingBillOfRights > > Joe, this is (in general) great. I feel I could pick a few holes and > make a few suggestions but they are mostly insignificant so I'll > refrain from doing so. > > I do have one concern I want to air. Unfortunately I don't have a > suggestion for improvement so am happy for you to ignore it, but maybe > someone else has a bright idea. > > My concern is the use of the word "right". We are a volunteer > organisation. Telling a podling they have a "right" to Foo and Bar > might set the wrong tone. Upayavira appears to be thinking something > similar (unless I'm misinterpreting him) when he asks: > > "I guess a question that it would be worth clarifying - what happens to a > perfectly reasonable podling who's mentors resign/go awol, when the > Incubator PMC cannot recruit replacements? Can we make any promises at > that point?" > > Perhaps we can use a slightly softer word - perhaps I'm being too cautious. > > On 16 June 2013 15:16, Joe Schaefer <joe_schae...@yahoo.com> wrote: >> Since I realize that most of you can't be >> bothered to look at the wiki page I created ;-), >> I'll go ahead and post the current content >> here for commentary. I hope the bulk of it >> is non-controversial, though some of it may >> not belong on the page... >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------ >> First a clarification- as provisional constructs of the Incubator PMC, > podlings have no official standing in the corporation known as The Apache > Software Foundation. So technically, it is a farce to claim that podlings > have > any formal rights whatsoever. What we write about here are promises and > covenants the Incubator PMC will make a good-faith effort to honor. >> >> 1. First, podlings have a right to expect active participation and > guidance from their mentors. That minimally includes participation in release > votes, discussions and votes on new personnel, and signing off on a > podling's quarterly reports. >> >> >> 2. Mentoring is done solely for the podling's benefit, and as such > podlings have the right to fire mentors for any reason by a majority > consensus > vote on their private list. Just don't be denigrating about it, since > mentors are always volunteers and not paid staff. >> >> >> 3. Podlings who find themselves in need of additional mentors have the > right to ask general@incubator for more mentors to volunteer. >> >> >> 4. Podlings have the right to expect their quarterly reports to be > read, reviewed, and critiqued by "shepherds" on the Incubator PMC, who > are typically outside the podling's set of mentors. >> >> >> 5. Podlings have the right to express private concerns about anything > related to their incubation to the Incubator Ombudsman > <ombudsman@incubator>, who will handle such communications as if they were > sent anonymously. >> >> >> 6. Podlings have the right to express their opinions concerning their > incubation efforts post-graduation (or post-mortem) in the form of an > anonymous > survey. >> >> >> 7. Podlings have the right to ignore commentary made on > general@incubator in the middle of a VOTE thread, especially during releases. > Reminder- release votes are a majority consensus vote, so seeing a few -1's > occasionally is expected and often ignorable by the RM should they otherwise > see > a majority of at least 3 binding IPMC votes. >> >> >> 8. Podling committers have the right to remain unsubscribed to > general@incubator. Any relevant policy/process changes will be passed along > by > the podling's mentors. >> ------------------------------------------------ >> >> Comments and critiques welcome. I'd like to >> move the ball forward to a ceremonial endorsement >> VOTE on this over the course of the remainder >> of June, so please be constructive! >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
