I remember part of mine. The anesthesia was a bit *too* light. At one point I felt the instrument in me. I opened my eyes and grunted. They gave me a bit more anesthesia.
On Sat, Apr 27, 2019 at 11:35 AM Frank Wimberly <wimber...@gmail.com> wrote: > No. But people who are under light anesthesia such as during a > colonoscopy sometimes talk. I don't think they remember that. > > ----------------------------------- > Frank Wimberly > > My memoir: > https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly > > My scientific publications: > https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2 > > Phone (505) 670-9918 > > On Sat, Apr 27, 2019, 12:32 PM Nick Thompson <nickthomp...@earthlink.net> > wrote: > >> Oh, yes. We agree that I was unconscious. And if you had been there, >> you would have experienced my unconsciousness. But did I? I think a >> person who adopts your position has to say, “No.” >> >> >> >> Nicholas S. Thompson >> >> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology >> >> Clark University >> >> http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ >> >> >> >> *From:* Friam [mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com] *On Behalf Of *Frank >> Wimberly >> *Sent:* Saturday, April 27, 2019 12:16 PM >> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group < >> friam@redfish.com> >> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] A Question For Tomorrow >> >> >> >> Yes, you were unconscious. As you know, I had that experience a few days >> ago. >> >> >> >> Frank >> >> ----------------------------------- >> Frank Wimberly >> >> My memoir: >> https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly >> >> My scientific publications: >> https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2 >> >> Phone (505) 670-9918 >> >> >> >> On Sat, Apr 27, 2019, 12:13 PM Nick Thompson <nickthomp...@earthlink.net> >> wrote: >> >> Hi Frank, >> >> >> >> The problem is that one has immediately to ask, what is the contrast >> class of experiencing consciousness? Experiencing non-consciousness? I >> think for your line of thinking, where consciousness is direct, that’s an >> oxymoron. For my line of thinking, when I woke up from my surgery and 24 >> hours had passed, I had a powerful experience of my non-consciousness. >> >> >> >> Nick >> >> >> >> Nicholas S. Thompson >> >> Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology >> >> Clark University >> >> http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ >> >> >> >> *From:* Friam [mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com] *On Behalf Of *Frank >> Wimberly >> *Sent:* Saturday, April 27, 2019 11:33 AM >> *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group < >> friam@redfish.com> >> *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] A Question For Tomorrow >> >> >> >> Jon, >> >> >> >> How about "experiences consciousness" in place of has consciousness. >> >> >> >> Frsnk >> >> >> >> ----------------------------------- >> Frank Wimberly >> >> My memoir: >> https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly >> >> My scientific publications: >> https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2 >> >> Phone (505) 670-9918 >> >> >> >> On Sat, Apr 27, 2019, 11:03 AM Jon Zingale <jonzing...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Nick, >> >> >> >> I love that the title of this thread is 'A question for tomorrow'. >> >> My position continues to be that the label `conscious` is meaningful, >> >> though along with you, I am not sure what language to use around it. >> >> For instance, can something *have* consciousness? That said, a >> >> conservative scoping of the phenomena I would wish to describe >> >> with *consciousness language* begins with granting consciousness >> >> to more than 7 billion things on this planet alone. Presently, for those >> >> that agree thus far, it appears that the only way to synthesize new things >> >> with consciousness is to have sex (up to some crude equivalence). >> >> This constraint seems an unreasonable limitation and so the problem >> >> of synthesizing consciousness strikes me as reasonably near, ie. >> >> `a question for tomorrow` and not some distant future. >> >> >> >> You begin by asking about the Turing machine, an abstraction which >> >> summarizes what we can say about processing information. Here, >> >> I am going to extend Lee's comment and ask that we consider >> >> particular implementations or better particular embodiments. >> >> >> >> Hopefully said without too much hubris, given enough time and >> >> memory, I can compute anything that a Turing machine can compute. >> >> The games `Magic the Gathering` and `Mine Craft` are Turing >> >> complete. I would suspect that under some characterization, the >> >> Mississippi river is Turing complete. It would be a real challenge >> >> for me state what abstractions like `Mine Craft` experience, but >> >> sometimes I can speak to my own experience. Oscar Hammerstein >> >> mused about what Old Man River knows. >> >> >> >> Naively, it seems to me that some kind of information processing, >> >> though not sufficient, is necessary for experience and for a foundations >> >> for consciousness. Whether the information processor needs to be >> >> Turing complete is not immediately obvious to me, perhaps a finite- >> >> state machine will do. Still, I do not think that a complete description >> of >> >> consciousness (or whatever it means to experience) can exist without >> >> speaking to how it is that a thing comes to sense its world. >> >> >> >> For instance, in the heyday of analogue synthesizers, musicians >> >> would slog these machines from city to city, altitude to altitude, >> >> desert to rain-forested coast and these machines would notoriously >> >> respond in kind. Their finicky capacitors would experience the >> >> change and changes in micro-farads would ensue. What does an >> >> analogue synthesizer know? >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Jonathan Zingale >> >> >> >> ============================================================ >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College >> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove >> >> ============================================================ >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College >> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove >> >> ============================================================ >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College >> to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove >> > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove >
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
