On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 10:55 PM, KatolaZ <kato...@freaknet.org> wrote: > On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 05:46:03PM +0000, Luke Leighton wrote: > > [very long cut] > >> >> this is again a self-fulfilling statement of intent, where i have >> demonstrated logically and rationally above that the grounds for the >> conclusion that you draw are incorrect. >> >> is there anything that you can perceive which is incorrect about the >> rationale i give above? > > Hi Luke, a very nice theory is yours, indeed, and I am not > kidding.
thanks. occasionally i have useful insights - even more occasionally i'm able to communicate them effectively :) > Unfortunately, in practice we already might miss some of the > packages of Jessie because of the systemd-nonsense, and not because of > an explicit anti-Debian choice of Devuan developers. > > And things will apparently not get better anytime soon, since more and > more packages are including dependencies on the systemd-nonsense, and > this is totally beyond your control. welll.... there's a difference between including dependencies on systemd *itself* and converting code over to use the d-bus API. not that i like d-bus (long story: in 2005 i compared the spec to DCE/RPC and it was absolutely identical... except that d-bus only implemented about 25% of what is in DCE/RPC... *sigh* but i digress... ) so for example here: https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/kde-plasma-5.47280/ it would seem that someone has noticed that the hard-dependency in KDE5 is *not* on logind itself, but is on the d-bus interface *to* logind ... therefore, as long as you can provide a re-implementation of the other side of that service, you're good to go. and as long as *all* the applications which use systemd do so via d-bus interfaces, then it is really not so disruptive a proposition to replace them all as it first seems. ... luckily, when searching "alternative logind" guess what came up? https://git.devuan.org/pkgs-utopia-substitution/loginkit/blob/master/debian/control hey you should talk to those guys, they might have something that could do the job, as long as it's behind a d-bus interface :) > For the moment I would be content to have a working Devuan (i.e., a > Debian without the systemd-nonsense), knowing that it inherits some of > the merits of one of the most important collaborative projects in the > history of Free Software, wouldn't you? :) i'm tempted to say yes - really! but i need several things: continuity for my clients (including two desktop systems), access to weird archaic packages at the forefront of software libre technology (four years ago i provided *full* python bindings to over 20,000 functions and properties in webkit that are considered the exclusive domain of javascript for example), and continuity on the (five or so) servers that i run. so whatever i go with, it has to be stable (or small enough for me to maintain myself). i can't even contemplate, right now, converting to e.g. FreeBSD even though i use fvwm2, because i am going to be in the middle of a huge project running qemu, librecad, openscad, blender, repsnapper and more, for several more months. i can't afford any downtime on it for things like "convert to FreeBSD", esp. on a strange piece of hardware as a macbook pro (UEFI boot only). bottom line is: i *really* have to be careful, when previously i would have been happy to just go "yippeee!" :) l. _______________________________________________ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
