On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 3:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) <marcus.m...@wtnet.de> wrote: > Am 09/06/2013 03:24 AM, schrieb Dave Fisher: > >> >> On Sep 5, 2013, at 4:32 PM, Kay Schenk wrote: >> >>> On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 4:11 PM, sebb<seb...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> A related issue is: why so many emails with the (irrelevant) subject: >>>> >>>> "Reporting a problem with the Open Office website" >>>> >>> >>> that's the pre-constructed subject for the first entry in: >>> "If you have technical problems with one of the Apache OpenOffice >>> websites.." >>> >>> this was put in a few weeks ago, so folks using this email section would >>> get more of an indication about what the subject they're sending about. >>> >>> But we are still getting product problem reports this way. I would still >>> recommend removing the first reference to contacting the developers, >>> however. >>> >>> If folks really do need an immediate e-mail on this Contact Us page, we >>> could easily put in a mailto: to "us...@openoffice.apache.org" the way >>> we've done with contact the developers. This would go through moderation, >>> but at least it would be going to a more appropriate mailing list. Is >>> this >>> a good idea? >> >> >> Yes - and we should shorten the long suggested "subject" with something >> like "[Contact]" > > > I've asked if it's a good idea to extend the subject to see where it comes > from and to show the user (hopefully) "Hey, maybe your text doesn't fit to > the subject, think again". Nobody objected and I did it. > > Now it is too long, so I don't understand the objection. Why now? > > OK, maybe a little revolution but we should remove any hints to the dev@ > list completely as it obviously doesn't work. Just leave some hints to > users@ and the general mailing list webpage. >
With a million downloads per week nothing will work perfectly accept removing any mention of the dev list from that page. We played with adjusting the wording on the website, and the ordering of things on the page. That improved things a little, I think. But even a small human error rate multiplied by 65 million will be significant. Maybe we shouldn't have a a subject line at all? That would force the sender to think and write one. Many email clients force that. If we predefine a subject than many users will just use it unchanged. This is OK in some cases, where the intent is clearly expressed by the subject, like "I am starting the Introduction to Contributing to Apache OpenOffice" emails. But it doesn't work well in other cases. Another angle is to realize that enabling the user and motivating them in a specific direction is more powerful than trying to steer them away from a specific direction. Maybe the problem is we are not making the support forums sound attractive enough? Maybe if we said something like, "For the fastest and most expert response, post your question to...."? Make the forums sound like the most attractive option. We know they are the best place for questions, of course. But we ought to describe it equally attractively. -Rob > Marcus > > > > >>>> I assume there must be a mailto: link somewhere that is producing this. >>>> The surrounding text may need to be tweaked to reduce these. >>>> >>>> >>>> On 5 September 2013 22:48, Kay Schenk<kay.sch...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 6:29 AM, sebb<seb...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On 5 September 2013 12:00, Rob Weir<robw...@apache.org> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 5:24 AM, sebb<seb...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The dev list sees the occasional thread which IMO really belongs on >>>>>>>> the user list/forum >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Although it is convenient for the poster to have the question >>>> >>>> answered >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> on the dev list, I wonder if that is the best approach overall. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The disadvantages of not referring the poster to the user list are >>>>>> >>>>>> several: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> - other users don't benefit from the thread >>>>>>>> - the dev list is cluttered with the off-topic threads >>>>>>>> - the poster may continue to use the dev list rather than the user >>>>>>>> list/forum where there are lots more potential responders >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just a thought. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This is all true. We also get user questions to the private mailing >>>>>>> list, and via the press alias address. And we also get product >>>>>>> support questions to the Bugzilla admin alias and the ezmlm admin >>>>>>> alias. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> But I don't think we actively encourage users to post questions to do >>>>>>> these things. But it is a puzzle why this happens. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The main contact page for the project, on the footer of every web >>>>>>> page >>>>>> >>>>>> is this: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/contact_us.html >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We've adjusted this over time, to make sure that the support options >>>>>>> were first and more prominent. But we still get misdirected emails, >>>>>>> to the dev, private, etc. lists. But with a million downloads a week >>>>>>> there will always be some small number of users who don't read that >>>>>>> page carefully, or maybe think they will get a faster response if >>>>>>> they >>>>>>> send to a different list. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> [And they are proved right when their off-topic questions are promptly >>>>>> answered ...] >>>>>> >>>>>> The second heading currently says: >>>>>> >>>>>> "If you want to contact the Apache OpenOffice developer team..." >>>>>> >>>>>> which may explain some of the misdirected questions. >>>>>> [Who better to ask than a developer if there is a problem? >>>>>> Maybe I'll get a faster response?] >>>>>> >>>>>> I think that section should have some explanation as to when it is >>>>>> appropriate to contact the team directly. >>>>>> Possibly move it further down the page as well. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Maybe the "contact the Apache OpenOffice developer team" needs to be >>>>> removed from the "Contact Us" page entirely. Honestly, given the >>>> >>>> context, >>>>> >>>>> I'm not sure this belongs here. Maybe delete that section and add a >>>> >>>> heading >>>>> >>>>> at the end called Mailing Lists and route them to the project mailing >>>> >>>> list >>>>> >>>>> page. That might encourage users to make a better choice for >>>>> contacting. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> -Rob > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
