On Jan 16, 5:33 pm, mdipierro <mdipie...@cs.depaul.edu> wrote: > Back to PyCon. Rejecting all web2py talks for 3 years in a row is not > a fluke. We do have more users that some of the projects that will be > talked about at PyCon 2010. > Just check > this:http://www.google.com/trends?q=repoze%2C+web2py&ctab=0&geo=all&date=a... > Yet there will be a 4hrs tutorial on repoze. Notice that I am not > complaining about Repoze, that is actually one of the subjects I am > interested in, but people are entitled to ask, without blaming anyone: > why not web2py? >
I risk being labelled as an irrelevant 'social scientist' type by this posting, but what have I got to lose by taking this risk? It might provide some insight. With regard to web2py being voted out in the cold at PyCon and Django being warmly welcomed, there may be a lot more subtlety than many realise. I personally prefer web2py over Django for a few simple 'common sense' reasons, namely the web2py beats Django hands down for elegance, coherency and for want of some better words, far less irritation. PyCon really has very little practical use. Whatever PyCon achieves can be accomplished much more efficiently with other means. PyCon is essentially a religious celebration for those whose life is consumed by Python, with Guido van Rossum at the top of the hierarchy as Pope (or dictator). PyCon tells everyone that Python is a important, provides an opportunity for devotional hero worship, a reinforcement of community and reinforcement of place within a hierarchy (known as networking). Essentially Massimo is being told he is not wanted as part of the community by a democratic voting process. This has nothing to do with the merits of web2py. We can look elsewhere for an explanation. So why would the this community not want to welcome Massimo and why would they risk compromising themselves by rejecting web2py or only allowing web2py a very marginal participation? To me the biggest turn off about web2py has nothing to do with the merits of web2py. It has to do with the coupling of web2py to an academic environment. I suspect if web2py could shake off this association, web2py might find itself less alienated. This is ironic because web2py espouses the opposite of what many come to associate with academic tainting, namely impractical academically politicised snobberies, hierarchies and verbiage. Linux has a classic example of a clash with academia that the Linux hierarchy forever continue to milk. Python nearly evaporated like many other wannabes. Guido was apparently going nowhere. It was the corporate world, not the academic world that has made Python such a success and the best example of this is Google. In fact Google in effect subsidises the ongoing development of Python through employing Guido and allowing him to spend much of his employee time working on developing Python as a language. Initially I was incredibly suspicious of web2py because of the academic taint. I even went to the extent of examining Massimo's academic profile. Sure enough there is evidence of academic snobbery. Massimo lists web2py as a hobby academic pursuit and a teaching tool. He lists his academic pursuit as sub atomic physics. Web2py comes across as an embarrassment to Massimo in an academic context. Python is replacing C as the 'de facto' teaching language in IT courses. Python has an incredibly strong presence in academic number crunching and modelling (NumPy and SciPy for example). But Python does not belong to academia and clearly the Python community does not welcome academia. This is understandable. Why would a strong thriving community wish to risk.academia muscling in its achievements and risk having credit and control wrested away? Contrary to the images portrayed by academic Computer Science departments as powerhouses of innovation, the phenomenal achievements in IT have had next to nothing to do with academia. Academia has always played catch-up in IT, never a leading role. It can be argued that web2py is starting to take a leading role as a web framework. But web frameworks would hardly be considered to be an academic sub discipline. After all web2py is merely regarded as a teaching tool in an academic context. By the way I will not be attending PyCon 2010 anywhere. I NEVER attend conferences. The last conference I attended was one in the nineties in Sydney Australia hosted by Microsoft at a time when Microsoft ActiveX (or COM) was the latest sexy technology, when the Internet was regarded as the Disneyland of public networks and when Microsoft was stating they would not support the Internet. How ironic given how closely Microsoft is now identified with the Internet by general users. John Heenan
-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "web2py-users" group. To post to this group, send email to web...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to web2py+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/web2py?hl=en.
