So yes testing a screen reader with all the different phones and firmwares available for each phone and making sure you get everything is next to imposible.
From what I could tell from the release note; This version was mainly forSymbian Belle. So based on that, could be why some things could have gotten mixed being people could have been checking out Symbian Belle stuff? Just a thought only.
Signed: Stephen Giggar Skype: dr-phone. Hardware eventually fails, software eventually works. No amount of bandwidth can fix poor design.----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Chaltain" <chalt...@gmail.com>
To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)
Well, I'm not a tester for Talks, and I don't have access to Nuance's test plans or their test team, but I would be surprised if they didn't do any testing of Talks at all before they release it. My only point was that comparing the testing of Talks to proof reading a letter or testing "any goods going to a shop" is seriously underestimating the complexity of testing a screen reader like Talks with every possible combination of hand set, firmware level, application, web page and so on. I'm not saying this wasn't an escape from their testing or that this isn't a serious issue, but IMHO, it doesn't do anyone any good to make it sound like testing Talks is something someone can knock out in an hour or two. BTW, I'm not saying this to defend Talks or Nuance, but I'm speaking for software/system testers everywhere. On 20/03/12 10:05, Eleanor Burke wrote:No, I cannot! Is someone seriously telling me that the Talks released on 29 February was tested, even put through its paces on one or 2 phones. If any goods going to the shop for example, some must be thoroughly inspected and marked as such, so why not Talks too. ----- Original Message ----- From: <m...@chopra.us> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 2:39 PM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)Hey Eleanor! Have you tried to make a selection from a combo box? well with the new Talks you can't. It makes access to so much info impossible. I just can't do anything! -original message- Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) From: "Eleanor Burke" <eleanorbu...@btinternet.com> Date: 20/03/2012 9:23 AM I cannot even have any feedback when writing in Edit box On Google search box with my C 5 which I am trying right now. facebook. Here is something more frustrating. I am writing in predictive text on C 5 and I had to spell facebook as it was not in the dictionary -original message- Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) From: "Kit" <goldeneagl...@gmail.com> Date: 20/03/2012 4:48 am Denise, If we forgo this new version, our email and web won't work. Actually, it's not the problem of TW or FB but more of the type of edit box which they use to write those pages. So, simplest is to find the type and solve that issue. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Long" <dennisl1...@gmail.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 9:23 PM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) What everyone is forgetting is it isn't always easy to track down bugs and it wouldn't be effective to put out a update just for facebook and twitter.If you don't like the new version then downgrade to the one before it andwait for the new version. I'm sure the dealers have passed on the feedback. Are you all forgetting that without talks we wouldn't have had accessibilityfor all these years lets be patient. If an update is rushed out then you would be complaining if it broke something that worked. Talks has alwaysbeen about stability so relax people there are alternatives. ----- Original Message ----- From: <m...@chopra.us> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)Exactly my point. I had put out an email a couple of weeks ago. Nuance is just not interested in Talks any more. -original message- Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) From: "Kit" <goldeneagl...@gmail.com> Date: 19/03/2012 5:46 AM It's amazing the testers, either Alpha or Omega or Beta missed this bug onFB and Twitter. It's so commonly used by so many people in the world andalso always ask on accessibility in Talks list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eleanor Burke" <eleanorbu...@btinternet.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) Fair points, but I mean the Testers must be reading our mails too and surely they must be finding the same issues as ourselves so I am wondering why they are not reporting back to the Developers. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fi Dunn" <f...@fidunn.plus.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 11:21 PM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)Ah, well, I have done some beta testing, although never for talks, and you have to sign agreements about not disclosing various things, which can depend on the software in question. It always says you won't share features of upcoming versions you are testing, though, whichever company. Also, the hassle some of them on here would get from people trying to weedle information out of them would be horrific, if they disclosed that they were testers, I should imagine. Fi -----Original Message----- From: talks-boun...@talksusers.com [mailto:talks-boun...@talksusers.com] On Behalf Of Eleanor Burke Sent: 18 March 2012 23:10 To: Talks Mailing List Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) Or if not developers, maybe even Testers, though I do not think the Testers openly say who they are either. Eleanor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fi Dunn" <f...@fidunn.plus.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 10:53 PM Subject: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)Exactly, this silence is really frustrating. Developers, are you there? Fi -----Original Message----- From: talks-boun...@talksusers.com [mailto:talks-boun...@talksusers.com] On Behalf Of Eleanor Burke Sent: 18 March 2012 22:15 To: Talks Mailing List Subject: Re: [Talks] I just bought an iPhone Well said Fi but I must just make another point about the e-mail and Talks and indeed I raised this within a few days of latest release of Talks but it was met with a wall of silence. When we want to read an e-mail we have all this additional information that we do not want, the number of frames the first frame being untitled and consisting of 2 colms, when the firstframe finishes and when the second frame starts. Not only that, it is50 50 if Talks even picks up the e-mail on first go, I am often treated to Browser Browser Browser and have to repeat the Talks and arrow down yet again. Eleanor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fi Dunn" <f...@fidunn.plus.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 10:05 PM Subject: Re: [Talks] I just bought an iPhoneI agree totally, especially about E-mail and the FaceBook and Twitterjabbering while you're inputting text issue, which is really annoying!!! It's far easier for me to use my Android, iPhone or even ... um ... Mobile speak on faceBook! Yes, it doesn't do some other stuff that the very latest Talks does, but they haven't broken edit boxes on social networking sites up till now. Why should these be broken when they were fine before? I have only upgraded Talks, not my firmware or anything lately. I'm not sure if I should upgrade to the new versions of software available, either. Will facebook and Twitter edit boxes still be broken, even after that? Will my E-mail be even worse? We don't seem to get answers to suchquestions from developers the way they do on the Android list ... andmost of the Android screen readers are free! So we've kept on and on paying for Talks and can't access E-mail very well, and the Ovi Store isn't even a joke! It's worse! As far as I know, there hasn't really been any explanation about why this doesn't work well, but the same applies withMobile Speak there. Code factory did, at least make older phones readE-mail better, though. Having to arrow down to read the body of an E-mail really is primitive! I tend to do most of my mailing on my HTC or iPhone for that reason these days.I love the design of Nokia phones, and the Vocaliser voices used withtalks, but, if you want to keep us on side, at least give us some reasons why this stuff doesn't work well in Symbian, when it does on other platforms, please! Thank you for reading this. These are thoughts I have had for a number of months now, not just something I thought of today. I've already pretty much decided my next new phone ... and I like new phones ... often ...will almost certainly not b a Nokia on Symbian, with its inaccessibleOvi Store, most apps and half-baked e-mail access. If people think I'm being harsh, I'm sorry. However, I say all this after using all three platforms, so I do know what I am comparing. Thanks. Fi -----Original Message----- From: talks-boun...@talksusers.com [mailto:talks-boun...@talksusers.com] On Behalf Of Eleanor Burke Sent: 18 March 2012 21:39 To: Talks Mailing List Subject: Re: [Talks] I just bought an iPhone Christopher I am very pleased to read what you write below re Talks andiPhone. I am aware of more and more blind people making the move overto iPhone and I am thinking seriously about it for my necxt phone, however, I have been a Talks user for 4 years now and my appeal here is to the Talks developers not to let the iPhone and Android take over the market of screen readers for the blind. My Symbian S60 has met all my needs up to 2011 but Talks is not meeting my needs at present. What then are my problems? 1. E-mail accessability is not what it was. I cannot seem to find a way on my E6 to save a new e-mail address. 2. As pointed out by another list member, over a week ago, the Edit boxes in Twitter and Facebook have Talks continually saying edit box while one is writing. Yet this has only become an issue with Talks released in February 2012. What surprises me is that such an issue is not known at release time. Surely the developers run through e-mail, internet and social network sites prior to release. 3. Despite all I said over months about the work around on E6 to start writing in a word document. My comments were not listened to. Finally Talks developers, I love Talks and do not want to stop using this excellent and reasonably priced software, but if my comments and those of other users fall on deaf ears, then we may be forced to go out and purchase an alternative mobile device than the symbian S60 one. -----Original message----- From: Christopher Chaltain Sent: 18/03/2012, 3:28 pm To: Talks Mailing List Subject: [Talks] I just bought an iPhoneWell, after being a happy Symbian and Talks user for almost exactly 9years, I finally decided to get a new smart phone, and this time I went with an iPhone. Not that why I did so is important to anyone, but I'll include some of my thoughts below, as well as how much I appreciate Talks and the Symbian platform. I started using Talks while it was still in beta back at the end of 2002. I got a Nokia 9290 communicator, and I think this, in conjunction with Talks, was the first fully accessible smart phone available to the blind. I've had 2 Symbian phones since then, the Nokia N75 and the AT&T Nokia E71X. Each phone had it's strengths and weaknesses, but in general, I've never been disappointed with Symbian or Talks. My decision to go with an iPhone was a tough one, although that was as much philosophical as anything else. I type on my E71X much less than Iused to, so the thought of going with a touch only device became lessof a concern for me. I was kind of waiting for the Droid 4 (which will have a keyboard), but I wasn't sure when or if AT&T would ever carry the Droid 4,and after reading multiple reviews of Android and Ice Cream Sandwich,itseemed like I'd be waiting quite a while for Android to catch up withthe iPhone with respect to accessibility. The closed nature of the iPhone also concerned me when comparing it to anAndroid, or even a Symbian, phone, but I use the cloud more and more,and I eventually decided that I could leverage the cloud enough to minimize my need to use Windows or iTunes. I also started finding myself needing an IOS or Android device for work and wanting one for personal use, e.g. the apps I needed for work or wanted to use personally were only available on the IOS or Android platforms. Although there isn't anything wrong with my E71X, it is starting to show it's age, and once I decided Android would be playingcatch up with the iPhone with respect to accessibility for quite sometimeto come, even given Ice Cream Sandwich. I decided there was no longerany reason to wait. I just want to say that I never slammed the iPhone, so I don't think I'm being hypocritical at all. I still feel the Symbian device and Talks are perfectly adequate solutions for the right situation, and I don't thinkanyone needs to feel like they're being left behind if they choose to continue to use a Symbian device for another handset or two. It's allabout what you want and what gets the job done.I just want to conclude by letting the Talks developers and this listknow how much I appreciated the technological advances made by the Talks developers. They were truly visionaries. I also want this list to know howmuch I appreciated the support I got from this list and it's members.I'mconvinced that without Symbian, Talks and this list, I would not havebeen a satisfied blind smart phone user these past nine years. I'll hang out on this list for a bit, and I'm sure I'll see some of you onmore generic lists, but eventually I'll have to unsubscribe from thislist, unless of course, I can't stand the iPhone and come back to Talks! Wow, this all seems a bit melodramatic, but Talks and this list have actually been a big part of my life for most of a decade, so I hope y'all will forgive my drama! Good luck everyone in that quest for the perfect smart phone for your own situation! -- Christopher (CJ) chalt...@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/-- Christopher (CJ) chalt...@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ andTalknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/
_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/
