Yes i just mean - when making a 3D sound installation you can use various types of panning round a sphere (or whatever of speaker array). You seemed to be saying ambisonics had a clear advantage over other types of panning for 3D audio - I was just wondering what you saw as ambisonics' advantages over VBAP. I've actually found Ambisonics to be worse compared to VBAP in many situations and better in others - but generally I use Vbap or Dbap . The only real advantage I can see of ambisonics is having one file that can be up or down mixed - but you can do that to a degree with Vbap files as well. In terms of one of these "modern" binaural recordings - I dont really know what this means . I have recorded my own Binaural album using binaural microphones - it doesnt work at all on speakers - and thats with my own HRTF . Seeing as the claim has been made between "modern" binaural recordings work on two speakers (not by you incidently) - lets hear one - I can guarantee you you will not hear a barber shaving the back of your head on to loud speakers.
On 9 January 2017 at 03:49, Stefan Schreiber <st...@mail.telepac.pt> wrote: > Augustine Leudar wrote: > > Spatial audio is as doused snakeoil as the hifi world. >> > I find this view a bit one-sided. At least this should not be related to > our discussion... > > Sound localisation >> is not a purely subjective affair - >> >> I didn't claim this. > > have there been any listening tests >> which demosntrate binaural rendering is capable of creating anything like >> headphone spatialisation over two stereo loudspeakers ? >> > I am pretty sure that the kunstkopf proponents did some scientific > listening tests. > > > Anyway -- perhaps one of these "modern" inaural recording are available >> online and we can judge for ourselves. >> >> > There are plenty of CDs around, so you will find some content on YT, > Spotify etc. > > I have neve rnotices any problems rendering ambisonics or vbap with dozens >> of channels - or even WFS . What do you mean by "you cant record audio >> objects" ? >> >> > What means "rendering vbap" at all? Vbap is "just" (3D) stereophonic > panning. > > You could pan some spot mikes or audio objects into some loudspeaker > layout. But you have to pan "something". > > http://legacy.spa.aalto.fi/research/cat/vbap/ > > > What do you mean by "you cant record audio >> objects" ? >> >> I was referring to music and scene/ambiance recording. > Of course you can record some audio objects. This is not a complete > recording yet... I admit that the citing above doesn't make a lot of sense, > but in its context there was one: > > Stefan I am curious what are the advantages you see of >> >> >>> ambisonics for 360 audio over say vbap aside from upmix downmix >>> capability ? >>> >>> >>> >>> >> 1. You can't record audio objects. 2. You could reduce computational >> complexity? >> >> > I must again ask: What does "vbap" actually means in your question. > Because it is not clear what should be "compared" at all. For me, VBAP (= > panning technique) is always used in some specific context. Is this > context 7.1 or Dolby Atmos or DTS:X or...? You see what I mean, hopefully. > > Good night > > Stefan > > > > > > > > On 9 January 2017 at 01:05, Stefan Schreiber <st...@mail.telepac.pt> >> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Augustine Leudar wrote: >>> >>> <> modern binaural recordings I've heard on speakers did not give >>> excellent >>> >>> >>>> results they gave terrible results, aside from the fact the transfer >>>> functions are messed up by room reflections and cross talk >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> Fair enough. But it seems that opinions about this seem to be vastly >>> different. (The quality of binaural recordings represented via >>> loudspeakers >>> is judged to be about between "terrible" and "excellent", depending on >>> listener....) >>> >>> it doesn't even >>> >>> >>>> work perfectly on headphones due to differences in individual hrtfs. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> No, quite obviously not "perfectly". Listening results will depend a lot >>> on the hrtf mismatch between dummy head and (individual) listener. And >>> the >>> perspective is fixed - you can't rotate some dummy head recording! >>> >>> Transaural is supposed to be the the two speaker equivelant of binaural >>> for >>> >>> >>>> speakers I know spat were due to release a new version that worked - >>>> anyone >>>> heard it ? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> Ambiophonics could also be used - as some already established form of >>> X-talk cancellation. >>> >>> Stefan I am curious what are the advantages you see of >>> >>> >>>> ambisonics for 360 audio over say vbap aside from upmix downmix >>>> capability ? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> 1. You can't record audio objects. 2. You could reduce computational >>> complexity? >>> >>> You didn't specify any application details. (So I assume you referred to >>> music recordings or VR.) >>> Best regards, >>> >>> Stefan >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sunday, 8 January 2017, Bob Burton <b...@audiorents.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> 1997 "The year had started and finished with Mike (Oldfield) >>>>> collaborating >>>>> with David Bedford. To finish the year Mike played on the title track >>>>> on >>>>> Bedford's 5th studio LPInstructions for Angels (V2090). Surprisingly, >>>>> the >>>>> track on which Mike appeared was recorded live at Worcester Cathedral >>>>> on >>>>> the Rolling Stones mobile recording studio. This track is quite >>>>> breathtaking, with Bedford playing the cathedrals organ and Mike >>>>> playing >>>>> guitar, the natural acoustics of the cathedral make it sound quite >>>>> awesome. >>>>> Finally, the complete LP was mixed at Mike's Througham studio in BBC >>>>> Matrix >>>>> H Quad which was also stereo compatible." >>>>> >>>>> https://youtu.be/hRIadP2XMgc >>>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >>>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ >>>>> attachments/20170107/65d28b1e/attachment.html> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sursound mailing list >>> Sursound@music.vt.edu >>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here, >>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Sursound mailing list > Sursound@music.vt.edu > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here, > edit account or options, view archives and so on. > -- Augustine Leudar Artistic Director Magik Door LTD Company Number : NI635217 Registered 63 Ballycoan rd, Belfast BT88LL -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20170109/fd20a13d/attachment.html> _______________________________________________ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here, edit account or options, view archives and so on.
