To add to Ryan and Anthony’s comments there are a whole bunch of code provisions people like to use rated stairwells for. For Ryan’s you need to not just consider the pipe and a few Vic ftg’s impinging on the exit pathway. The valve and outlet need to be outside the required space.
Have you talked with the architect to confirm where Area of Refuge is going to be? Best. Bruce Verhei. > On 03/26/2024 3:48 PM PDT Hinson, Ryan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Placement/coordination within the stairwell is also important since the riser > location cannot encroach into the minimum egress width or height required > through the stairwell. > > > > Ryan L. Hinson, PE*, SET** \ Burns & McDonnell > > Associate Fire Protection Engineer \ Upper Midwest Region > > O 612-900-3755 tel:612-900-3755 \ M 763-688-4045 tel:763-688-4045 \ F > 952-229-2923 tel:952-229-2923 > > [email protected] mailto:[email protected] \ burnsmcd.com > http://www.burnsmcd.com/ > > 8201 Norman Center Drive, Suite 500 \ Bloomington, MN 55437 > > *Registered in: AK, LA, MD, MN, PA, TX, & UT > > **NICET IV - Water-Based Systems Layout > > > > From: Steve Leyton <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2024 3:57 PM > To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers > <[email protected]> > Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: Riser in a rated stair enclosure > > > > Of a separate riser ROOM for backflow, etc. Definitely not saying that you > need a chase within the stair shaft, just that you’re not allowed to use the > under-landing space for a “riser room”. > > > > Steve > > > > From: Prahl, Craig <[email protected] mailto:[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2024 1:48 PM > To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers > <[email protected] > mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: Riser in a rated stair enclosure > > > > I’ve never seen a requirement for a 1 or 2-hr enclosure of a riser in a > stair. The stair towers I’ve encountered are typically rated 2-hrs and the > combination sprinkler/standpipe riser located under the first landing or off > to the unused side of the ground level has never been rejected by an AHJ. > > > > Craig Prahl | Jacobs | Fire Protection SME – Special Hazards | > [email protected] mailto:[email protected] | www.jacobs.com > https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.jacobs.com/__;!!KZTdOCjhgt4hgw!-_khxU8gU0_6jc895I7kRbnU8JghRDsWgqOblZ4jr7Qp2IVbR30VYw_hWvNFtphnl0uWpB9KIvbYi1pvZz4$ > > 1041 East Butler Road Greenville, South Carolina 29606 > > CONTACT BY: Phone 1-864-676-5252 tel:1-864-676-5252, Email or MS TEAMS > > > > > > From: Steve Leyton <[email protected] > mailto:[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2024 4:30 PM > To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers > <[email protected] > mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: [EXTERNAL] [Sprinklerforum] Re: Riser in a rated stair enclosure > > > > Right, as long as your “riser/backflow room” is separated from the rest of > the stair shaft. And it might have to be 2-hour rated, not just 1-hour. > > > > To the question of the sprinkler riser, there isn’t any restriction in the > code, except for the obvious provisions for fire-stopping penetrations. > > > > Steve L. > > > > From: Anthony Carrizosa <[email protected] > mailto:[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2024 1:22 PM > To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers > <[email protected] > mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: Riser in a rated stair enclosure > > > > We do backflows and risers in stairs all the time, typically below the > intermediate landing, as long as it’s a minimum 1 hour construction then it > has been ok with most jurisdictions. Remember standpipes and floor controls > are typically in stairs as a standard. > > > > Anthony Carrizosa > > Project Manager | Fire Protection > > 7855 S 206th St Kent, WA 98032 > > Cell: 206-679-5283 tel:206-679-5283 | Office Dir: 253-341-4593 > tel:253-341-4593 > > https://archerconstruction.com > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https*3a*2f*2farcherconstruction.com*2f&c=E,1,Wdb65AWzMgSBzW3HDw91SfcRQCtxDUQKoJf-UowQ-WnB_WMosgG-8W7eLePJ42PwWQvLiQx16Pls052VqwHO7tKm-_u5AnWly0ewkNiMkxn-AjQb1JI,&typo=1__;JSUlJQ!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3tHph3goA$ > > > > From: Jeff Werre <[email protected] mailto:[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2024 1:09 PM > To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers > <[email protected] > mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Riser in a rated stair enclosure > > > > Does code allow a sprinkler riser to be installed in a rated stairwell? > > > > I cannot find anything that prohibits it, but would like others opinions > (experiences). > > > > Thank you- > > > > Jeff Werre, CFM > > Fire Plan Review and Inspection Specialist > > > > Development Services > > City of Goodyear, Arizona > > 1900 North Civic Square > > Goodyear, AZ 85395 > > > > c 602 316-0704 tel:602316-0704 > > w goodyearaz.gov > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http*3a*2f*2fwww.goodyearaz.gov*2f&c=E,1,HWheNqpd4bMAObWDA1Pz4jKGCAJR-thfNkyG-V6ubIPnRmE78JXq5nU1kLB5Uv0b6yAs3DnR0fq9Cb648VwhZkjzd0drubjF-G192TGVad51Zbnsm7L6vOrmJg,,&typo=1__;JSUlJQ!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3tVFDFq8g$ > > e [email protected] mailto:[email protected] > > > > > > > > > > > > From: Ken Wagoner <[email protected] > mailto:[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2024 1:17 PM > To: [email protected] > mailto:[email protected] > Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: NFPA 14 2019 Hose Connection on the Roof > > > > ⚠ This email arrived from an external source - Please exercise caution when > opening any attachments or clicking on links > > > > Completely agree with you John. > > Considering that I work with two adjacent agencies, each of which uses a > different hose thread. One uses National Standard Thread, the other National > Hose Thread. It's difficult to explain to contractors that identification of > the hose threads to be supplied on private fire hydrants or hose valves can > be as critical as it gets. > > sincerely, > > Ken Wagoner, SET > Parsley Consulting > 500 West Mechanic Street > Harrisonville, Missouri 64701-2235 > Phone: (760) 745-6181 tel:(760)745-6181 > Visit the website > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http*3a*2f*2fwww.parsleyconsulting.com*2f&c=E,1,Y5zKJKPEh1mBEBqSR-VE9cUKl5y-eyP8BpvmE_5j9ZqW2eJbNphYzrCMBZ-2YuX6d-RRkHI4gQ1FV-cvOeCfRC58uZS9NiToZv2mx7909oCqLvCW_n5hDHeK&typo=1__;JSUlJQ!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3tX2yXVSk$ > > > > On 2/21/2024 1:13 PM, John Denhardt wrote: > > > > > Rick’s and Steve’s comments are spot on. Give the fire department what they > > need/want. Do not install something that no one will ever use in an > > emergency condition. > > > > > > > > John > > > > John August Denhardt, P.E. > > > > Vice-President Engineering and Technical Services > > > > American Fire Sprinkler Association > > > > 301-343-1457 tel:301-343-1457 > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 21, 2024, at 13:30, Rick Matsuda <[email protected]> > > > mailto:[email protected] wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Steve’s guidance is the best. > > > > > > When it comes to hose valves and standpipe requirements, always verify > > > with the AHJ to find out what they want. > > > > > > Rick > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 21, 2024, at 12:09 PM, Steve Leyton <[email protected]> > > > > mailto:[email protected] wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To Rick’s comments: > > > > > > > > Concur, and also offer that while the standard doesn’t require a valve > > > > where there is no roof access, I am aware of numerous AHJ’s who do. > > > > The stated intent of the rooftop connection(s) is to enable forward > > > > flow testing of the system. However – and this goes to my mantra of > > > > many years now – it is incumbent on the designer to verify with the > > > > serving FD is they require roof connections that they may use for > > > > firefighting. I have been made aware of several fire incidents that > > > > used roof connection hose streams and I am also aware of fireground > > > > strategies that encompass these connections. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The foregoing is my opinion only and does not represent NFPA or the > > > > NFPA 14 Technical Committee, nor intended to serve as an interpretation > > > > of the standard. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Steve L. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: Rick Matsuda <[email protected]> mailto:[email protected] > > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2024 9:51 AM > > > > To: Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers > > > > <[email protected]> > > > > mailto:[email protected] > > > > Subject: [Sprinklerforum] Re: NFPA 14 2019 Hose Connection on the Roof > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is my opinion only from what I remember after being retired for > > > > ten years. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The requirement for installing a hose valve is driven by the stairway > > > > requirements found in the building code which requires at least one > > > > stairway providing access to the roof. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If the stairway extends to the roof, then a hose valve is required at > > > > the top landing or on the roof. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If there is no roof access from the stairway, then no hose valve is > > > > required. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The fire service will use the hose valve where they have safe access > > > > from the stairway but they will not walk across the roof dragging fire > > > > hose to hook up to a hose valve located where no safe access was > > > > provided. > > > > > > > > Rick Matsuda > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 21, 2024, at 10:47 AM, Fpdcdesign <[email protected] > > > > > mailto:[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are people here with more experience than I, but if one outlet > > > > > goes to the roof, the requirement is met. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 21, 2024 at 11:34 AM, <Joe Burtell [MT-BILL] > > > > > > mailto:[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > If I have 3 stair towers and the middle on has access to the roof > > > > > > and I provide a connection as required by 7.3.2.7* “Hose > > > > > > connections shall be provided at the highest landing of stairways > > > > > > with stairway access to a roof”, do the other (2) not have to go to > > > > > > the roof because of 7.3.2.9.2 “The hose connection required by > > > > > > 7.3.2.9 shall not be required where at least one hose connection in > > > > > > accordance with 7.3.2.7 is provided in the building”. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <image001.jpg> > > > > > > > > > > > > Joe > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Burtell > > > > > > > > > > > > Fire Sprinkler Manager > > > > > > > > > > > > D > > > > > > > > > > > > C > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 406-204-4653 tel:406-204-4653 > > > > > > > > > > > > 406-861-4507 tel:406-861-4507 > > > > > > > > > > > > 3004 1st Ave South > > > > > > > > > > > > Billings > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > > > > > > > > MT > > > > > > > > > > > > 59101 > > > > > > > > > > > > Office: > > > > > > > > > > > > 406‑652‑7697 tel:406‑652‑7697 > > > > > > > > > > > > www.summitfiresecurity.com > > > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http*3a*2f*2fwww.summitfiresecurity.com*2f&c=E,1,ZyzzqWo58xliyC5jRd9RdTLBBZo5jBEbiHix11FarpdW6p9BZLi5cyYnCyfcGhCFs7Mjew4A84L4gMd9Zn-QcKk5wbpkUpp2_prGEtUdqFeTwliA1vO3eEu-2E71&typo=1__;JSUlJQ!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3tjGXKPfo$ > > > > > > > > > > > > This information transmitted, including attachments, is intended > > > > > > only for the person(s) or entity to which it is addressed and may > > > > > > contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, > > > > > > retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any > > > > > > action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities > > > > > > other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received > > > > > > this in error, please contact the sender and destroy any copies of > > > > > > this information. > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________ > > > > > > SprinklerForum mailing list: > > > > > > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > > > > > > > > > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https*3a*2f*2flists.firesprinkler.org*2flist*2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,zSczA6fh1z_DZmRiDK-SmOo2Q4iD1ybs-dofDAvbol2ARplwrC3CBPuJ5a3M1J8_FALzCrYwXVIdMdoRY1GetEF5HPRcSwVLnkfeGB7fJAT0jA,,&typo=1__;JSUlJSU!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3tFELFh_8$ > > > > > > To unsubscribe send an email to > > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > > mailto:[email protected] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <image001.jpg> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________ > > > > > SprinklerForum mailing list: > > > > > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > > > > > > > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https*3a*2f*2flists.firesprinkler.org*2flist*2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,cn2QOu3An6_NJyh_-n31_xLLKLAryTT4kv8MVY8TqJ2tAbIic9WRP3VMiL7Zsa_JQjzaIzYp9C1xb376t1oQxX-odSiNENfy2M5txOLU23NwBAyI53R1EyIXksgS&typo=1__;JSUlJSU!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3tXyO6WrE$ > > > > > To unsubscribe send an email to > > > > > [email protected] > > > > > mailto:[email protected] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________ > > > > SprinklerForum mailing list: > > > > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > > > > > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https*3a*2f*2flists.firesprinkler.org*2flist*2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,Gi862oLoF3I3PplbXyhBlyIqWk1hlUfaFq9LFqSSetXU_-QR2vszIPHoPCLemLpvP0IDslPxYZ0DJomXGuGZ1wGFfIq8RBojUhao19aiCM1LBGtLKy2trXyxLJY,&typo=1__;JSUlJSU!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3tEoX6sD4$ > > > > To unsubscribe send an email to > > > > [email protected] > > > > mailto:[email protected] > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________ > > > SprinklerForum mailing list: > > > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > > > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https*3a*2f*2flists.firesprinkler.org*2flist*2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,MWR4WxvMm_voDTNku1D03F-6A9h7Gjbw2wvOS49dDZ4dGxceCjdtDa2_nTMSn1oskjiBgoFgJqtSxtjY9p-j1EVkWm8Y_tlvE_y1U995rCMZ_84,&typo=1__;JSUlJSU!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3twlbc8x8$ > > > To unsubscribe send an email to > > > [email protected] > > > mailto:[email protected] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________ > > > > SprinklerForum mailing list: > > > > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https*3a*2f*2flists.firesprinkler.org*2flist*2fsprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,Zpm0EABfFsWYaANMGgf1uWLhtVfyI7HnZMUfAbuYLjv9MsLHX1mMcjxoSR48b1-eE-_y1osOjMNHzemMmoczBd_hkPjZgDRcLqK2w6x0YKgX&typo=1__;JSUlJSU!!B5cixuoO7ltTeg!AKDEQrf6NuN-W7D9y4dezAtAkbuSU8nl5s0ZAFQ7pDJyr1jiHYyoFHcF4_6Yz8odTqlPaH82RnQG9j3ttg6vig4$ > > > > To unsubscribe send an email to > > [email protected] > > mailto:[email protected] > > > > > > All messages created in this system belong to the City of Goodyear and should > be considered a public record subject to disclosure under Arizona Public > Records Law (A.R.S. 39-121). City employees, City public officials, and those > who generate E-mail to them, should have no expectation of privacy related to > the use of this technology. If you are not the intended recipient you are > notified that disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action in > reliance on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited. > > > > > --------------------------------------------- > > > NOTICE - This communication may contain confidential and privileged > information that is for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any viewing, > copying or distribution of, or reliance on this message by unintended > recipients is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in > error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting > it from your computer. > > > _________________________________________________________ > SprinklerForum mailing list: > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] >
_________________________________________________________ SprinklerForum mailing list: https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]
