Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-07-03 Thread Ross
Regarding the error checking, as others suggested you're best buying two devices and mirroring them. ZFS has great error checking, why not use it :D http://blogs.sun.com/perrin/entry/slog_blog_or_blogging_on And regarding the memory loss after the battery runs down, that's no different to any

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-07-01 Thread Marc Bevand
Erik Trimble Sun.COM> writes: > > * Huge RAM drive in a 1U small case (ala Cisco 2500-series routers), > with SAS or FC attachment. Almost what you want: http://www.superssd.com/products/ramsan-400/ 128 GB RAM-based device, 3U chassis, FC and Infiniband connectivity. However as a commenter poi

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-30 Thread Bob Friesenhahn
On Mon, 30 Jun 2008, Ross wrote: The Gigabyte iRAM looks great. £100 for the basic unit, around £200 fully populated with 4GB. I am not sure that i would want to entrust my data to a product which contains no error checking/correction at all and loses its memory after a day if the computer

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-30 Thread Ross
Ok, replying with the details of what I've found so far. First of all, SSD devices, despite high published IOPS figures hide very poor IOPS *write* figures. I've been sent the manual for the Mtron Pro 7000 series SSD's, and while they have random read figures in the 12,000 range, the random wr

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-28 Thread Kyle McDonald
Richard Elling wrote: > Erik Trimble wrote: > >> * 5.25" CDROM-form-factor RAM disk, as above >> >> > > CD-ROMs are dead. With the size of slim DVDs today, you wouldn't > be able to put much space in them. > > The point here is a 5.25" half height device, that will fit in a drive ba

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-28 Thread Miles Nordin
> "et" == Erik Trimble <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: et> SSD used to refer strictly to standard DRAM backed with a et> battery (and, maybe some sort of a fancy enclosure with a hard et> drive to write all DRAM data to after a power outage). et> * 3.5" LP disk form factor, SCSI h

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-28 Thread Tim
On Sat, Jun 28, 2008 at 1:42 AM, Erik Trimble <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Brian Hechinger wrote: > > On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 03:02:43PM -0700, Erik Trimble wrote: > > > >> Unfortunately, we need to be careful here with our terminology. > >> > > > > You are completely and 100% correct, Erik. I've

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-28 Thread David Magda
On Jun 28, 2008, at 10:17, Richard Elling wrote: > This week, Verident announced a system using Spansion EcoRAMs > (DRAM + NOR Flash on a DIMM form factor) for main memory. > This is almost getting there, but seems to require some special OS > support, which is not surprising. The holy grail is f

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-28 Thread Richard Elling
Erik Trimble wrote: > Brian Hechinger wrote: > >> On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 03:02:43PM -0700, Erik Trimble wrote: >> >> >>> Unfortunately, we need to be careful here with our terminology. >>> >>> >> You are completely and 100% correct, Erik. I've been throwing the >> term SSD

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-28 Thread Ross
I believe there's a block rewrite function being worked on, which if memory serves will enable further technologies such as changing raid-z stripe size on the fly, defrag, etc. I doubt 'soon' is a word you could use to describe the timeframe for these arriving however. This message posted f

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-28 Thread Ross
Thanks, that's something I hadn't realised. After googling, I've found this article comparing the i-RAM with a couple of SSD's, and the difference is quite something: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/storage/display/ssd-iram_5.html However, the SATA interface's limitations soon seem to even thi

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Erik Trimble
Brian Hechinger wrote: > On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 03:02:43PM -0700, Erik Trimble wrote: > >> Unfortunately, we need to be careful here with our terminology. >> > > You are completely and 100% correct, Erik. I've been throwing the > term SSD around, but in the context of what I'm thinking, b

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Matthew Gardiner
> > > Can anybody confirm that random read performance is definitely > > better with mirrored volumes. Does ZFS use all the disks in the > > mirror sets independently when reading data? Am I right in thinking > > I could have around 7x better random read performance with the 15 > > mirrored drive

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Brian Hechinger
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 03:02:43PM -0700, Erik Trimble wrote: > Unfortunately, we need to be careful here with our terminology. You are completely and 100% correct, Erik. I've been throwing the term SSD around, but in the context of what I'm thinking, by SSD I mean this new-fangled flash based SS

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Erik Trimble
Unfortunately, we need to be careful here with our terminology. SSD used to refer strictly to standard DRAM backed with a battery (and, maybe some sort of a fancy enclosure with a hard drive to write all DRAM data to after a power outage). It now encompasses the newer Flash-based devices. My

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Brian Hechinger
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 08:32:23AM -0700, Richard Elling wrote: > > You will want mirrored slogs. Yes, always an excellent recommendation. > Note that there are some companies, Crucial and STEC come to mind, > sell SSDs which fit in disk form factors. IIRC, Mac Book Air and EMC > use STEC's SS

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Brian Hechinger
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 07:22:48AM -0700, Ross wrote: > Thanks both, very good pieces of advice there. > > Wonko, I was about to question how much difference the iRAM will actually > make with it being on a single SATA connection, but after googling, for ??70 > + RAM it's worth buying just as

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Tim
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 11:50 AM, Albert Chin < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 08:13:14AM -0700, Ross wrote: > > Bleh, just found out the i-RAM is 5v PCI only. Won't work on PCI-X > > slots which puts that out of the question for the motherboad I'm > > using. Vmetro have a 2

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Albert Chin
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 08:13:14AM -0700, Ross wrote: > Bleh, just found out the i-RAM is 5v PCI only. Won't work on PCI-X > slots which puts that out of the question for the motherboad I'm > using. Vmetro have a 2GB PCI-E card out, but it's for OEM's only: > http://www.vmetro.com/category4304.ht

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Richard Elling
Brian Hechinger wrote: > On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 07:58:42AM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> Yes. two caveats though. ZFS is a COW filesystem, currently with no >> defrag. Placing heavy write (vmware is) on this type of storage >> (especially, but not only if you are planning on using snaps

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Ross
Bleh, just found out the i-RAM is 5v PCI only. Won't work on PCI-X slots which puts that out of the question for the motherboad I'm using. Vmetro have a 2GB PCI-E card out, but it's for OEM's only: http://www.vmetro.com/category4304.html, and I don't have any space in this server to mount a

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Ross
Thanks both, very good pieces of advice there. Wonko, I was about to question how much difference the iRAM will actually make with it being on a single SATA connection, but after googling, for £70 + RAM it's worth buying just as an experiment. I'm really not interested in iSCSI, it might be s

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Brian Hechinger
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 07:58:42AM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Yes. two caveats though. ZFS is a COW filesystem, currently with no > defrag. Placing heavy write (vmware is) on this type of storage > (especially, but not only if you are planning on using snapshots) you will > tend to see d

Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS configuration for VMware

2008-06-27 Thread Wade . Stuart
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 06/27/2008 03:39:41 AM: > I'm likely to be building a ZFS server to act as NFS shared storage > for a couple of VMware ESX servers. Does anybody have experience of > using ZFS with VMware like this, and can anybody confirm the best > zpool configuration? > > The serve