Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Adam Leventhal
On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 01:51:17PM -0500, Al Hopper wrote: > I think that I'll (personally) avoid the initial rush-to-market > comsumer level products by vendors with no track record of high tech > software development - let alone those who probably can't afford the > PhD level talent it takes to g

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Vincent Fox
Your key problem is going to be: Will Sun use SLC or MLC? >From what I have read the trend now is towards MLC chips which have much lower >number of write cycles but are cheaper and more storage. So then they end up >layering ECC and wear-levelling on to address this shortened life-span. A

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Al Hopper
On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 4:31 AM, Adam Leventhal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Jun 11, 2008, at 1:16 AM, Al Hopper wrote: >> >> But... if you look >> broadly at the current SSD product offerings, you see: a) lower than >> expected performance - particularly in regard to write IOPS (I/O Ops >> per

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Al Hopper
On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 10:35 AM, Bob Friesenhahn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 11 Jun 2008, Al Hopper wrote: >> >> disk drives. But - based on personal observation - there is a lot of >> hype surrounding SSD reliability. Obviously the *promise* of this >> technology is higher performance

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Mertol Ozyoney
ilton Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2008 2:58 PM To: zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org Subject: Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period > > btw: it's seems to me that this thread is a little > bit OT. > > I don't think its OT - because SSDs make perfect >

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Andy Lubel
On Jun 11, 2008, at 11:35 AM, Bob Friesenhahn wrote: > On Wed, 11 Jun 2008, Al Hopper wrote: >> disk drives. But - based on personal observation - there is a lot of >> hype surrounding SSD reliability. Obviously the *promise* of this >> technology is higher performance and *reliability* with lo

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Bob Friesenhahn
On Wed, 11 Jun 2008, Al Hopper wrote: > disk drives. But - based on personal observation - there is a lot of > hype surrounding SSD reliability. Obviously the *promise* of this > technology is higher performance and *reliability* with lower power > requirements due to no (mechanical) moving parts

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Richard Elling
Richard L. Hamilton wrote: > > Older SSDs (before cheap and relatively high-cycle-limit flash) > were RAM cache+battery+hard disk. Surely RAM+battery+flash > is also possible; the battery only needs to keep the RAM alive long > enough to stage to the flash. That keeps the write count on the flash

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Richard L. Hamilton
> > btw: it's seems to me that this thread is a little > bit OT. > > I don't think its OT - because SSDs make perfect > sense as ZFS log > and/or cache devices. If I did not make that clear > in my OP then I > failed to communicate clearly. In both these roles > (log/cache) > reliability is of t

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Darren J Moffat
Tobias Exner wrote: > The reliability of flash increasing alot if "wear leveling" is > implemented and there's the capability to build a raid over a couple of > flash-modules ( maybe automatically by the controller ). > And if there are RAM-modules as a cache infront of the flash the most > prob

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Tobias Exner
The reliability of flash increasing alot if "wear leveling" is implemented and there's the capability to build a raid over a couple of flash-modules ( maybe automatically by the controller ). And if there are RAM-modules as a cache infront of the flash the most problems will be solved regarding

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Adam Leventhal
On Jun 11, 2008, at 1:16 AM, Al Hopper wrote: > But... if you look > broadly at the current SSD product offerings, you see: a) lower than > expected performance - particularly in regard to write IOPS (I/O Ops > per Second) True. Flash is quite asymmetric in its performance characteristics. That sa

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Al Hopper
On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 3:59 AM, Tobias Exner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi Al, > > Sorry, but "leading the market" is not right at this point. > > www.superssd.com has the answer to all those questions about SSD and > reliability/speed for many years.. > > But I'm with you. I'm looking forward t

Re: [zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Tobias Exner
Hi Al, Sorry, but "leading the market" is not right at this point. www.superssd.com has the answer to all those questions about SSD and reliability/speed for many years.. But I'm with you. I'm looking forward the coming products of SUN concerning SSD.. btw: it's seems to me that this thread

[zfs-discuss] SSD reliability, wear levelling, warranty period

2008-06-11 Thread Al Hopper
I've been reading, with great (personal/professional) interest about Sun getting very serious about SSD-equipping servers as a standard feature in the 2nd half of this year. Yeah! Excellent news - and it's nice to see Sun lead, rather than trail the market! Those of us, who are ZFS zealots, know