[TLS] Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-09 Thread D. J. Bernstein
Alicja Kario writes: > But then you may also want to add > https://github.com/openssl/openssl/issues/23860#issuecomment-2103073417 > (while upstream OpenSSL have decided not to call it a vulnerability, > it's because they consider local side-channels outside of their threat > model and we didn't tr

[TLS] Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-09 Thread Alicja Kario
On Monday, 9 September 2024 14:49:08 CEST, D. J. Bernstein wrote: Alicja Kario writes: We haven't actually performed an attack in which we extracted the private key. [ ... ] In practice, what we've shown is that the implementation is _likely_ vulnerable to microarchitectural side-channel att

[TLS] Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-09 Thread D. J. Bernstein
Alicja Kario writes: > We haven't actually performed > an attack in which we extracted the private key. [ ... ] > In practice, what we've shown is that the implementation is _likely_ > vulnerable to microarchitectural side-channel attacks. The top of Appendix A of https://cr.yp.to/papers.html#sa

[TLS] Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-09 Thread Alicja Kario
On Monday, 9 September 2024 08:44:46 CEST, D. J. Bernstein wrote: John Mattsson writes: ignoring the mandatory point validation Exactly! That's how the real world works. The NSA/NIST approach fills ECDH and signatures with traps for the implementors; implementors fall into the traps; the NSA/N

[TLS] Re: [TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-08 Thread D. J. Bernstein
John Mattsson writes: > ignoring the mandatory point validation Exactly! That's how the real world works. The NSA/NIST approach fills ECDH and signatures with traps for the implementors; implementors fall into the traps; the NSA/NIST responses sound like "This security failure is _your_ fault! Rea

[TLS] Re: [TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-08 Thread Watson Ladd
in 2014. I know because I found the issues. > > > Cheers, > > John > > > > *From: *D. J. Bernstein > *Date: *Sunday, 8 September 2024 at 13:23 > *To: *tls@ietf.org > *Subject: *[TLS] Re: [TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs > #1360 > >

[TLS] Re: [TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-08 Thread John Mattsson
ussion is a bit to general for TLS. Cheers, John From: D. J. Bernstein Date: Sunday, 8 September 2024 at 13:23 To: tls@ietf.org Subject: [TLS] Re: [TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360 Eric Rescorla writes: > I do not think we need to make Curve25519 MTI. The purpose of M

[TLS] Re: [TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-08 Thread D. J. Bernstein
Eric Rescorla writes: > I do not think we need to make Curve25519 MTI. The purpose of MTIs is to > provide a minimum baseline for interoperability, and we have that already > with the existing MTI. That's entirely compatible with most people > preferring X25519 because they believe it's better than

[TLS] Re: [TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-09-05 Thread Eric Rescorla
I do not think we need to make Curve25519 MTI. The purpose of MTIs is to provide a minimum baseline for interoperability, and we have that already with the existing MTI. That's entirely compatible with most people preferring X25519 because they believe it's better than the MTI. -Ekr On Mon, Aug

[TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-08-26 Thread David Adrian
I also support *not* making Curve 25519 MTI. On Mon, Aug 26, 2024 at 10:18 AM Richard Barnes wrote: > My feelings exactly match Rich's here. > > On Mon, Aug 26, 2024 at 10:15 AM Salz, Rich 40akamai@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: > >> I am also opposed to the merge. 8446bis changes are editorial an

[TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-08-26 Thread Richard Barnes
My feelings exactly match Rich's here. On Mon, Aug 26, 2024 at 10:15 AM Salz, Rich wrote: > I am also opposed to the merge. 8446bis changes are editorial and > clarifications, not semantic ones. > > > ___ > TLS mailing list -- tls@ietf.org > To unsubsc

[TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-08-26 Thread Salz, Rich
I am also opposed to the merge. 8446bis changes are editorial and clarifications, not semantic ones. ___ TLS mailing list -- tls@ietf.org To unsubscribe send an email to tls-le...@ietf.org

[TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-08-26 Thread Peter Gutmann
Andrei Popov writes: >I support *not* making Curve 25519 MTI in TLS 1.3. Same here, there's already enough new stuff required by 1.3 without adding even more. Peter. ___ TLS mailing list -- tls@ietf.org To unsubscribe send an email to tls-le...@ietf

[TLS]Re: [EXTERNAL] Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360

2024-08-26 Thread Andrei Popov
I support *not* making Curve 25519 MTI in TLS 1.3. Cheers, Andrei -Original Message- From: Sean Turner Sent: Monday, August 26, 2024 6:23 AM To: TLS List Subject: [EXTERNAL] [TLS]Consensus Call: -rfc8446bis PRs #1360 Hi! Loganaden submitted a PR to add x25519 as an MTI in TLS 1.3 that