[RBW] Re: FS: 650B Conversion Kit

2011-06-15 Thread danmc
Is the 650B setup still available? Just got a frame that it would be good for. Thanks -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rbw-owners-bunch/-/OiWsq6H9NzIJ

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Joe Bernard
I'd love to score a Bleriot, for completely shallow reasons: It's my favorite Riv name/graphics package. I don't know the story of them being pulled from the market, and didn't realize they disappeared quickly (I was in recumbent world the last three years). About the mythical Legolas: I was at Ri

[RBW] Looking for Hilsen Owners in PDX

2011-06-15 Thread Dennis
Hi, I am new to the list (per Mark's suggestion @ Riv). I am in discussions about getting a 65cm Hilsen and wonder if there are any owners in the Portland area that would let me check out their bikes and ask a few questions. Please respond off list if appropriate Thanks Dennis -- You received thi

Re: [RBW] OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread Ed Fausto
I had good experience with Racor PBH. I have 6 bicycles hoist with that method and is very convenient. Ed On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 8:53 AM, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > Can y'all post photos of some of these hoist and store devices? I wonder if > one might free up needed wall space -- for more shelvin

[RBW] FS: Grand Bois Hetre tires

2011-06-15 Thread Rod C
About 1,000 miles of use. Honestly, plenty of tread left. One is in about 8 out of 10 condition and the other is about a 7 out of 10. Selling both for $50 shipped. Black w/tan sidewall. 650b x 42, of course. Contact me directly for deal closure. -- You received this message because you are s

[RBW] FS: Bicycle Fixations merino Ninja Hoodie, Large, old stock Turbo saddle

2011-06-15 Thread PATRICK MOORE
Both used but VG (they both look new). $80 shipped CONUS for Turbo; $100 shipped CONUS for Ninja. OBO. Will trade either for nice set of G B Cypres, 28s. I have a plethora (relative of the plesiosaurus) of nice wool jerseys and don't really need this one with a hood. Worn about 10 times and washe

[RBW] Re: Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread RonaTD
A genuine, rare-as-hens'-teeth Riv MTB: http://gallery.me.com/teddurant#100134 Sorry it's just a bad garage-door shot. I should do it justice sometime. Ted Durant -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Bill Gibson (III)
Oh, I forgot...one of my Velo Orange cages broke, so I repaired it with a fillet of transparent epoxy. It's held so well I forgot I'd done that... but on really bumpy rides I have the habit of using an old toe strap to keep things from falling out of the cage I'm not drinking from. On Wed, Jun 15,

Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread David Blessing
I bought the bike from Bill a couple of years ago. It is just a wonderful bike. Not good at photos, but this attempt should show the way it is set up now. Cheers. david blessing http://www.flickr.com/photos/60600619@N08/5838185994/in/photostream On Jun 15, 2011, at 7:33 PM, Bill M. wrote:

[RBW] Re: Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread eddie...@gmail.com
I know the guy who sold this one to Larry. Here's what he sent me about it: >> 1995 frameset 55' tt, 53 (c-t) st Paint was in grt shape for a 15y/o frame Xtr rr drlr Xt hubs, Mavic rims Xt front drlr Sugino 46/36/26 Nitto bullmoose Dura Ace HS Brooks B17 Avid cantis Great bike. TT was a bit to sho

[RBW] OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread Peter Pesce
There are lots of different hooks, bike-specific and non-, that you can find at HD, on amazon etc. In almost every case, the vinyl "tool dip" or neoprene coating is the weak point. it never lasts through more than a few on-and-offs. Probably makes sense to wrap whatever you buy with a strip of o

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Roger
I like that the Iris is stiffest at the top of the cage where it can best restrain the bottle. My old Riv Aellee's (sp?) are quite rattly with a Klean Kanteen because the whole cage pivots from the bottom edge of the cage. The only flaw I see with myfavorite Iris/KK 28oz wide mouth combo is that t

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread EricP
Honestly, no idea. I think that's the lugged unicrown fork model. (Too lazy to look it up.) If it doesn't have a U brake fitting under the seatstays, it's worth more. But really have no idea on a price. Montclair BobbyB might know more. He's had more of those bikes through his hands. I'd want

[RBW] Re: Montclair NJ Bike shop recommendation

2011-06-15 Thread Montclair BobbyB
Not sure which bike shops in Montclair do this kind of work. FWIW I do minor restoration in my spare time, including sourcing parts and paint, and wheel building; what are you looking for? I live in Princeton, but have been known to frequent Montclair. Email me offline: montclairbob...@gmail.co

Re: [RBW] OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread PATRICK MOORE
Can y'all post photos of some of these hoist and store devices? I wonder if one might free up needed wall space -- for more shelving -- in my already too cluttered garage. Patrick "and that's without putting any stupid cars in it" Moore On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 2:53 PM, andrew hill wrote: > I've

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread PATRICK MOORE
We are at 6% today per NWS and mid '90s -- how can all of you flatlanders bear that lowland heat, dry or otherwise? Me, I have refrigerated air which I love; Mom has a big swamp cooler that works until the humidity soars above 15% and then loses efficiency. But at least I didn't have to switch it o

[RBW] Re: Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread Bill M.
I think Tim is right, this is probably an All-Rounder with flat bars. The giveaway is the level top tube, the Mountain-Expedition had a sloping TT. The bike on Cyclofiend's site is the M/E I once owned, which I believe to be the bike used for the catalog photos. I bought it at a "need- cash-now"

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Bill Gibson (III)
I recall 3% RH recently, though today it's a balmy 10%. We're still on evaporative cooling in our house, where I am spending a lazy day building a wheel out of the solar radiation, where it hit 110F this PM. Planning a ride and a swim after sundown. On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Jim Cloud wrot

[RBW] Brooks trade...My Swift - Your B17 Special?

2011-06-15 Thread jinxed
I just picked up a new single speed Raleigh Rush Hour for cruisin with the wife and kiddo. It came with a Brooks Swift in what I would call a dark honey almost chestnut brown. I pulled it off right out the box because my posterior and the Swift have argued in the past. So. Would anyone like to t

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Jim Cloud
Humidity in Tucson right now is 5% on Accuweather.com and 6% on forecast.weather.gov, the present temperature is 105 degrees (it gets hotter in Tempe where Bill lives). I've been able to get a nice neoprene water bottle cover from a friend that perfectly fits a 18 oz. Klean Kanteen. Unfortunately

[RBW] FS Sugino XD2 triple 170mm

2011-06-15 Thread JL
For Sale 170mm Sugino triple with 48/36/26 rings $80 shipped. Used but in great condition no shark teeth, no rust. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To

Re: [RBW] Re: OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread cyclotourist
I need to do something similar to the hooks. There are also "nicer" hooks that HD sells that have more of a heavy black foam on them. I have some of those and so far they haven't worn through yet. On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 1:43 PM, Zack wrote: > David - > > I had that happen on one set, and put

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread PATRICK MOORE
Mo' stupidity: Tempe, man! TEMPE!! On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 2:58 PM, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > How low have you seen you (Tucson?) humidity? I've clocked ours here in NW > ABQ at 4%. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To p

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread PATRICK MOORE
Bill!! Thanks for that obvious but (speaking for myself) rather stupidly forgotten connection: felted wool over metal water containers: Of course, I see any number of canteens so covered. I must try that on my metal bottles. And I agree 'bout VO: some nice stuff but, for many of their items, low

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread PATRICK MOORE
I replaced various pretty and expensive Nitto and lower end VO cages with the Irises and add my strong shout of approval to the last. 28 oz, double-wall stainless bottles broke the Nittos frequently and quickly and rattled most annoyingly with the two VO models; the Irises hold them tightly with mi

Re: [RBW] OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread andrew hill
I've used the Topeak Dual Touch in two different apartments - works great. Currently holding a CantiRom and a Sam. :) Holds up to 4 bikes with optional extra hooks (best for 2). Doesn't mark floors or ceilings much, really good use of space for 2 bikes, at least. 3 or 4 require the pole to be

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Benedikt
My Velo Orange cages fell apart after a few short mile. Broken weld. My Kleen Kanteen's have no rattling AT ALL in my King Cage Iris. Both insulated and regular. On Jun 15, 1:14 pm, andrew hill wrote: > I've found the VO cages to be underwhelming in build quality - I've had 3 > different styl

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Zack
Anyone have experience with the double-walled KK bottles in the Iris cages? I have used the VO Retro cages with leather on them, but they are all bent out of shape now and I am thinking of getting some new cages when I get my Sam next month. On Jun 15, 4:14 pm, andrew hill wrote: > I've found

[RBW] Re: OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread Zack
David - I had that happen on one set, and put some black gorilla tape over the rubber part. I guess it depends on how high your ceilings are too - mine are like 15 feet, and i have a rafter that comes down a foot or two that i have the hooks in, and I am 6'3. The bikes are too high for my 5'8 SO

[RBW] Montclair NJ Bike shop recommendation

2011-06-15 Thread JGS
Anyone have a recommendation for a bike shop in the Montclair NJ area that would understand the idea of restoring an old steal bike or that sells bikes in the Riv / Surly / Soma / etc. world? Thanks so much! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owner

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread andrew hill
I've found the VO cages to be underwhelming in build quality - I've had 3 different styles (type I, II, and moderniste) and two of them have separated at the welds, and one of the three wasn't even close to "true" either - e.g. crooked lines set-up pre-weld (one of the type I/II - forget which).

Re: [RBW] Re: OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread cyclotourist
Just an FYI, over time the rubber on those J hooks wears off, exposing the steel. It will start marring your rims cosmetically over time. Not the biggest worry in the world, but just a heads up. On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 10:03 AM, Zack wrote: > Just FYI, I also live in an apartment, and just h

[RBW] Re: OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread MKahrl
I'm happy with the inexpensive pulley type system such as the Racor PBH-IR. After the last sheave the line goes through before leading to your hand there is a jamming lever that is manipulated by altering the angle of the line. The line will be leading down past your front wheel so you want to t

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Bill Gibson (III)
I have and daily enjoy my Klean Kanteens (sp?) both single and double wall bottles. The folks at the company seems to be great, too, it might be a family design and sourcing operation, except the bottles aren't made locally, as in the USA. They sent me a recall notice for one of my bottle caps, the

[RBW] Re: Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread RonLau
The owner of the shop is Larry Black, nice person and I know him. If you are interested about this bike, I will email/call him directly. Don't be annoy if he takes longer to give you more information, he has thousand of bikes (no joke, I have seen them in person). It always take Larry some time t

[RBW] Re: Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread newenglandbike
Agreed. the fork looks bent. Still a cool find though. On Jun 15, 2:14 pm, CycloFiend wrote: > on 6/15/11 10:32 AM, Marty at mgie...@mac.com wrote: > > > Well, not actually seen in person, but I did run across one that > > appears to be for sale at College Park Cycles. It has all the beefy >

Re: [RBW] Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread Tim McNamara
It's possible that's al All-Rounder built up with MTB bars. I have a '96 A/R and the frame is nearly identical in all the little details that I could see. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Rene Sterental
Do they fit on KK Iris cages? I thought they didn't... Sent from my iPhone 4 On Jun 15, 2011, at 10:41 AM, Zack wrote: > Robert: You should try one of the double-walled insulated KK > bottles! They are awesome. You can keep coffee hot and water cold > for a pretty good amount of time. In my

Re: [RBW] Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread CycloFiend
on 6/15/11 10:32 AM, Marty at mgie...@mac.com wrote: > Well, not actually seen in person, but I did run across one that > appears to be for sale at College Park Cycles. It has all the beefy > qualities of the Bombadil, sans under or diaga tubes for those > afflicted with that 'itis. Give Larry Bla

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread andrew hill
I just checked.. the 20 oz Kleen Kanteen fits pretty perfectly into an Arundel, and doesn't wiggle around. Best, Andrew On Jun 15, 2011, at 9:02 AM, Karl Fundenberger wrote: > Those Arundel cages look pretty nice, but it looks like I'd have to > use a bottle with the indentation - whereas the K

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Brett Lindenbach
Interesting. I've noticed Rivs going for considerably less here than on CL or eBay, prolly because this group has a better sense of what they are really worth. Prices also seem to vary considerably based on location. There are a lot of Rivs in the bay area for obvious reasons, so there is a d

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Charlie
Two posts in one day for me. This is to Eric. If hanging next to the Wilbury mixte referenced a few messages above, there was a red, lugged, 19 1/2 inch, 1985 Stumpjumper frame and fork, made by Toyo (I think) - one owner - purchased new by me in 1985 - what sort of premi

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread islaysteve
Leslie, No offense taken by me at all! I understand what you're saying about some people overpaying for nice-looking restored car, while more knowledgable folks know that there is an upper limit to reasonable prices for any given model. This may be similar to the pricing on the Ram we are discuss

[RBW] Re: NOS Freewheel Cache

2011-06-15 Thread pruckelshaus
The Shimanos worth having IMO are the 600 and Dura Ace. The lower end ones are disposable. On Jun 14, 5:52 pm, Tim Whalen wrote: > Newly sensitized to freewheels by the recent discussion here, I noticed a > cache of some at a local bike shop.  There are 6 - 8 Shimano 7 speeds, > mostly 14-28 I t

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Seth
$352 in 1971 means rougly $1890 today... On Jun 15, 6:17 am, Steve Palincsar wrote: > On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 18:45 -0700, Leslie wrote: > > Maybe I'm too pessimistic.  I usually think of myself as being overly > > optimistic, but, I really wouldn't see paying 'more' for a frame than > > what it or

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread islaysteve
I was using another brand of SS bottle and yes, it did rattle a bit. I switched back to a plastic bottle (RBW-branded, just because). I missed the easy grip and being able to squeeze the bottle when drinking on the bike. So I'm slowly reverting back to my roadie ways. (Next, 120 psi--not.) Steve

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Brett Lindenbach
You're right on both accounts. The Blériot was a steal to begin with, and there is no good replacement anywhere near in value. Also, because it was pulled from the market sooner than expected, I think there was less fatigue. One might argue that the Ram market suffers from Ram-fatigue. And, t

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Karl Fundenberger
Those Arundel cages look pretty nice, but it looks like I'd have to use a bottle with the indentation - whereas the King Iris might allow me to use a taller cylindrical stainless steel bottle, like the bigger Kleen Kanteens. I think I'll check one of those out. Thanks, all! And wow, I could have t

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Zack
Robert: You should try one of the double-walled insulated KK bottles! They are awesome. You can keep coffee hot and water cold for a pretty good amount of time. In my experience it's a little better at keeping coffee hot for a while than water cold, but it's still a vast improvement over the si

[RBW] Rivendell MTB? Rare Sighting

2011-06-15 Thread Marty
Well, not actually seen in person, but I did run across one that appears to be for sale at College Park Cycles. It has all the beefy qualities of the Bombadil, sans under or diaga tubes for those afflicted with that 'itis. Give Larry Black a call if you're in the mood. I love his shop - so much vin

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread EricP
Maybe I'm being optimistic here (probably). But feel sorta like Rivendell owners are often more critical in their bike needs (in a good way). So are willing to pay a premium to get a specific bike. Not necessarily the vintage idea, which is a whole 'nother thing. But more towards the boutique en

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Robert F. Harrison
I use KKs but I've always put a wet sock around them. This not only stops the rattling but keeps the water much cooler in the Hawaiian sun. With the right sock it's not terribly unattractive and as it works well I don't worry about how it looks. http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2787/4355453296_13cf5

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Rene Sterental
I've been using them for over a year with no issues, rattles, noises or anything else. They're the best cages! Rene Sent from my iPhone 4 On Jun 15, 2011, at 8:05 AM, cyclotourist wrote: I bought the Iris cages on the recommendation of this list for use with KK bottles. The Iris cages hold th

[RBW] Re: OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread Zack
Just FYI, I also live in an apartment, and just hang my bikes on hooks that I screwed into the ceiling. They were maybe $2 each from Home Depot, covered in rubber. I am pretty tall and am able to reach the bike up to hang it on the hooks. Works for me, and haven't had any problems with wheels be

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread cm
You mean you have a new Glorius/ Wilbury hanging in your garage? Do you have any pics? These bikes seem to have just disappeared and attained an almost mythical status-- I knew a guy who knew a guy who once rode with a guy who had one. Cheers! cm On Jun 15, 10:31 am, Charlie wrote: > I don't pos

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Charlie
I don't post much but do have some comments here. I was talking last week with Rivendell about the purchase of a Betty Foy or the possibility of a custom Hunqapillar type mixte. I currently ride a 48 cm Hunqa and have an original never built 52cm mixte hanging in the rafters. I ride ve

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Leslie
On Jun 15, 7:17 am, Steve Palincsar wrote: > On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 18:45 -0700, Leslie wrote: > > Maybe I'm too pessimistic.  I usually think of myself as being overly > > optimistic, but, I really wouldn't see paying 'more' for a frame than > > what it originally cost. > > In which case, I hope y

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Minh
I find this idea a litlte counter to the spirit of Rivendell in general as it seems like these bikes were always meant to be ridden and beat-up. If you really want to see the price of things you can get a sense of it from the archives, but the ranges that people have been throwing out are pretty a

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread cyclotourist
I bought the Iris cages on the recommendation of this list for use with KK bottles. The Iris cages hold them perfectly. No rattling at all. These are really perfect cages. On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 7:54 AM, Darin G. wrote: > Those of you using the Kleen Kanteen--do they rattle around? I > susp

Re: [RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Seth Vidal
On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 10:54 AM, Darin G. wrote: > Those of you using the Kleen Kanteen--do they rattle around?  I > suspect there is a difference between being secure in the cage and not > making noise every time you go over a bump. > I use them in king cages and they don't rattle once you size

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Darin G.
Those of you using the Kleen Kanteen--do they rattle around? I suspect there is a difference between being secure in the cage and not making noise every time you go over a bump. On Jun 15, 6:14 am, John Aydelotte wrote: > +1 for the King Kage Iris.  I have them on almost all my bikes.  They > fi

[RBW] Re: Touch-up for Orange Sam Hill

2011-06-15 Thread Minh
>From the archives: For touching-up we've found the following recipe to work well: 3 drops of "Orange Pearl" Colors by Boyd from Testor's 1 drop of 1114 Yellow by Testors As with any re-touch, it won't be 100% as good as new, but this is just about as perfect as can be expected. And for making

[RBW] Re: And Summer Begins.

2011-06-15 Thread Tex69
Agreed. I find that after spending 9 months pulling 12hr days grading papers and providing Johnny and Susie every extra-curricular advantage possible so they can get a scholarship to go to Harvard, much less the continuing ed requirements and PD, I don't feel too guilty about my summer time. As f

Re: [RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread jimD
OK this cinches it. I'm keeping the 61 cm Bleriot frame that hangs from the rafters in my garage. the Bleriot's components went to outfit a Saluki. Who knew it would become a collectors item? Of course if the 'recession' carries on all bets are off. -JimD On Jun 14, 2011, at 11:10 AM, Brett Linden

[RBW] OT: Bike Storage

2011-06-15 Thread jandrews_nyc
Hello, I've moved to a new, smaller apartment, but with very high ceilings. So, Given that my wife and I have 4 bikes, including 2 Rivs, we've decided to go the bike hoist route. These are the devices that fix to a joist in the ceiling that allow the bike to be lifted up and locked in. Does anyone

[RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Peter Pesce
Interesting topic indeed. I'm pretty new to the 'dell so I don't have much historical perspective or data to add. One idea, though - would it be any use to have the Group admin set up a database where we could list transactions in used Rivs? I know of other "collector" groups that do something s

[RBW] Re: Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread John Aydelotte
+1 for the King Kage Iris. I have them on almost all my bikes. They fit the Klean Kanteen bottles extremely well. I actually met the guy who makes them at the Rocky Mountain Bicycle Festival this past weekend. He made most of a cage in front of me in under a minute (not including the part that

Re: [RBW] Re: Market Prices for Riv Frames

2011-06-15 Thread Steve Palincsar
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 18:45 -0700, Leslie wrote: > Maybe I'm too pessimistic. I usually think of myself as being overly > optimistic, but, I really wouldn't see paying 'more' for a frame than > what it originally cost. In which case, I hope you never get the urge to have a Herse or a Singer or e

Re: [RBW] Watter bottle recommendations?

2011-06-15 Thread Steve Palincsar
On Tue, 2011-06-14 at 21:59 -0700, cyclotourist wrote: > King Cage Iris cages. Not as elegant as the Nittos, but still look > interesting and have held up well so far (bought earlier this year). > They carry KK bottles fine, with no need for twine or leather. The King Iris is the best cage there