Re: Still Loving Python

J�r�me Laheurte wrote: > > P.S. Why does Google Groups have to mangle J�r�me's name > > I didn't see anything wrong... Encoding problem ? The preview and subsequent re-editing page typically show trashed non-ASCII characters in Konqueror, which doesn't usually show such brokenness on the pages I v

Re: Still Loving Python

[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bengt Richter) writes: > On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:07:04 -0500, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bengt Richter) writes: >>> A single click compiles, links and runs the resulting independent windows >>> .exe in a fraction of a second >>> for the above, and

Re: Still Loving Python

Paul Rubin wrote: > Glade also does something like that. Indeed. I'd also add some lines on this. There is a very nice designer for GTK+ applications called Gazpacho, written in python and available here: http://gazpacho.sicem.biz/ It generates an XML file in the same

Re: Still Loving Python

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:07:04 -0500, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bengt Richter) writes: >> A single click compiles, links and runs the resulting independent windows >> .exe in a fraction of a second >> for the above, and I can see the hint, kill the .exe, and go on wh

Re: Still Loving Python

On 12/14/05, Magnus Lycka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > It's my impression that code generation leads to more duplication > and less code reuse. It's easy to whip up a new class or window > that duplicates a lot of already existing code, with those graphical > tools. Of course, Visual designer !=

Re: Still Loving Python

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 08:53:26 +, Steve Holden wrote: > It isn't often done, but I quite like the idea of giving users the GUI > builder so that they can specify their preferred task interface, at > least to a first approximation. That would be a valid use for these things, prototyping the UI

Re: Still Loving Python

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 12:35:56 -0600, Brian van den Broek wrote: > It seems to me that long tradition has it that "evil" in a context > such as this really is not that strong a term. See > . Thanks. Next time I'll spell it 'vil', in the hope that i

Re: Still Loving Python

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 08:35:56 -0800, Paul Boddie wrote: > I imagine that Jérôme was referring to code generated by pyuic. Of > course, there are various extensions for PyQt which let you build the > user interface directly from the XML-based descriptions. Indeed, that's what I meant. I should have

Re: Still Loving Python

On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 08:21:30 -0800, Daniel Crespo wrote: >> So wxPython doesn't need a runtime? I don't think so. wxPython for me >> sucks under Linux (built on gtk2) and I don't like its API at all. It >> seems a bit awkward to me. Anyway... what do you mean with "much better" ? > > It's much b

Re: Still Loving Python

Peter Maas wrote: > If you design a moderately complex UI a designer will be faster. It's > not the speed of typing vs. dragging that matters. You see the result > instantly and don't have to start your program, look, type code, start > again and so on. A GUI builder is more pleasant to work with,

Re: Still Loving Python

Peter Decker said unto the world upon 2005-12-14 07:03: > On 12/13/05, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >>>Why this need to have everyone do things the way you do? >> >>Whatever makes you think I have this need? I said I hated them. I'm >>pretty sure I didn't say everyone should have to

Re: Still Loving Python

Il 2005-12-14, Daniel Crespo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ha scritto: > Under windows, only needs some dlls (they are its runtime), and works > perfect. The same exe works on Win98, ME, 2000, XP. Of course that > there are some differences between these OSs. It's the same for Gtk > I tried both a lot, and

Re: Still Loving Python

Alex Martelli wrote: > Jérôme Laheurte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Sorry for the harsh tone, I just think GUI builders are *evil*. Except > > maybe for QT Designer, which has a nice model where you implement > > callbacks by subclassing the generated classes. At least you don't have to > > look

Re: Still Loving Python

By the way: > Under windows, only needs some dlls py2exe does this job :) Daniel -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Still Loving Python

> So wxPython doesn't need a runtime? I don't think so. wxPython for me > sucks under Linux (built on gtk2) and I don't like its API at all. It > seems a bit awkward to me. Anyway... what do you mean with "much better" ? It's much better: - Its portability is superior over PyGTK - Its look & feel

Re: Still Loving Python

TwistyCreek wrote: > Peter Decker wrote: > > >>On 12/13/05, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> Why this need to have everyone do things the way you do? >>> >>>Whatever makes you think I have this need? I said I hated them. I'm >>>pretty sure I didn't say everyone should have to use t

Re: Still Loving Python

Peter Decker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On 12/13/05, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > Why this need to have everyone do things the way you do? >> Whatever makes you think I have this need? I said I hated them. I'm >> pretty sure I didn't say everyone should have to use them. > Sorry, b

Re: Still Loving Python

[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bengt Richter) writes: > A single click compiles, links and runs the resulting independent windows > .exe in a fraction of a second > for the above, and I can see the hint, kill the .exe, and go on where I was. Click? Yuck. If I wanted it, I've had environments where a single k

Re: Still Loving Python

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 > "Bengt" == Bengt Richter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Bengt> De gustibus non disputandum, or whatever ;-) Yeah, and quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur. :-) Martin -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Us

Re: Still Loving Python

Il 2005-12-14, Daniel Crespo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ha scritto: > PyGTK is crossplatform, that's true, but it looks very ugly under > Windows and don't know under MacOS (if it's supported). You can use themes. Under MacOSX you have to install X11, but a native version in on the way. > I couldn't fi

Re: Still Loving Python

On 14 Dec 2005 13:49:39 -, TwistyCreek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > And by the by... visual tools ARE evil. > > It's like your dad getting his drunken bar buddies to plow your mother > because he's too fat to do it himself. The unfortunate offspring of any > such union is equally the bastard

Re: Still Loving Python

Peter Decker wrote: > On 12/13/05, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> > Why this need to have everyone do things the way you do? >> >> Whatever makes you think I have this need? I said I hated them. I'm >> pretty sure I didn't say everyone should have to use them. > > Sorry, but there is

Re: Still Loving Python

Lawrence Oluyede wrote: > ps. the customer wants Windows as a platform, we develop on Linux using > PyGTK, postgre and sql server for some old data. This is the true power of > cross-platform :) PyGTK is crossplatform, that's true, but it looks very ugly under Windows and don't know under MacOS (

Re: Still Loving Python

On 12/13/05, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Why this need to have everyone do things the way you do? > > Whatever makes you think I have this need? I said I hated them. I'm > pretty sure I didn't say everyone should have to use them. Sorry, but there is a world of difference between sa

Re: Still Loving Python

On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 20:33:36 -0500, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Peter Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> Mike Meyer schrieb: >>> I agree. I've tried a number of different gui builders. I find it much >>> faster to type something like: >>> ui.add_button("New", self.new) >>> ui.a

Re: Still Loving Python

Alex Martelli wrote: > Jérôme Laheurte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >... > >>Sorry for the harsh tone, I just think GUI builders are *evil*. Except >>maybe for QT Designer, which has a nice model where you implement >>callbacks by subclassing the generated classes. At least you don't have to >>l

Re: Still Loving Python

Mike Meyer wrote: > Peter Decker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > A GUI builder is more pleasant to work with, at least with a good one like Delphi or Qt designer. >>> >>>That is your opinion, and I'm sure it's true for you. It isn't true >>>for me. >> >>Why, then, do you disparage those who

Re: Still Loving Python

[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Alex Martelli) writes: > Try Interface Builder on a Mac: it builds interfaces as _data_ files, > not "generated code". You can then use the same UI from Objective C, > Java, Python (w/PyObjC), AppleScript... interface-painters which > generate code are a really bad idea. Glade

Re: Still Loving Python

Yeah, I have a system like that on my product. It's a data file loaded at code startup time, which results in a UI - no need to cut code to change the interface. It's saved me a lot of time. I also have a problem with 'designers'. If the GUI designer is as easy as making an interface was in VB6, I

Re: Still Loving Python

Jérôme Laheurte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: ... > Sorry for the harsh tone, I just think GUI builders are *evil*. Except > maybe for QT Designer, which has a nice model where you implement > callbacks by subclassing the generated classes. At least you don't have to > look at the generated code.

Re: Still Loving Python

Peter Decker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> > A GUI builder is more pleasant to work with, at least >> > with a good one like Delphi or Qt designer. >> That is your opinion, and I'm sure it's true for you. It isn't true >> for me. > Why, then, do you disparage those who like to do things differentl

Re: Still Loving Python

On 12/13/05, Mike Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > A GUI builder is more pleasant to work with, at least > > with a good one like Delphi or Qt designer. > > That is your opinion, and I'm sure it's true for you. It isn't true > for me. Why, then, do you disparage those who like to do things di

Re: Still Loving Python

Mike Meyer wrote: >>A GUI builder is more pleasant to work with, at least >>with a good one like Delphi or Qt designer. > > That is your opinion, and I'm sure it's true for you. It isn't true > for me. Not trying to start a war here, but I consider this discussion something like using regular e

Re: Still Loving Python

Peter Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Mike Meyer schrieb: >> I agree. I've tried a number of different gui builders. I find it much >> faster to type something like: >> ui.add_button("New", self.new) >> ui.add_button("Open", self.open) >> ui.add_button("Save", self.save) >> ui.ad

Re: Still Loving Python

Ivan Voras wrote: > Maybe the OP really wants a GUI builder. > > More than 5 years ago, i programmed in Visual Basic and Delphi and I > still miss the wonderful ease of graphically creating the user interface > in WYSIWYG mode. If you haven't tried it, you don't know what you're > missing :) >

Re: Still Loving Python

I just wanted to mention that, according to the latest news from Ironpython's mailing list, an Ironpython plug-in for Visual Studio is on the works. Read on: Aaron Marten wrote: > Hi Giles, > I'm on the Visual Studio SDK team here at Microsoft. In > co-operation with the IronPython team, we'

Re: Still Loving Python

Mike Meyer schrieb: > I agree. I've tried a number of different gui builders. I find it much > faster to type something like: > > ui.add_button("New", self.new) > ui.add_button("Open", self.open) > ui.add_button("Save", self.save) > ui.add_button("Save As", self.save_as) > > Than

Re: Still Loving Python

Jérôme Laheurte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 17:35:40 +0100, Ivan Voras wrote: >> Maybe the OP really wants a GUI builder. >> More than 5 years ago, i programmed in Visual Basic and Delphi and I >> still miss the wonderful ease of graphically creating the user interface >> in

Re: Still Loving Python

Nothing beats Delphi for the raw design speed and choices for GUI development. .NET is another good option. The good news is you don't have to loose their benefits just because we chose Python. Python for Delphi works quite well to get you the best of both worlds. I develop the app in Python as a l

Re: Still Loving Python

Lawrence Oluyede wrote: > Il 2005-12-13, Kamilche <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ha scritto: > > Python still suffers from the lack of a good GUI, which I believe is > > slowing its acceptance by the programming community at large. (I know > > about tKinter, no need to post links to it, thanks.) > > Let me s

Re: Still Loving Python

Lawrence Oluyede wrote: > Il 2005-12-13, Ivan Voras <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ha scritto: > >>More than 5 years ago, i programmed in Visual Basic and Delphi and I >>still miss the wonderful ease of graphically creating the user interface >>in WYSIWYG mode. If you haven't tried it, you don't know what

Re: Still Loving Python

Ivan Voras wrote: > Are there any easy GUI builders for any Python-supported toolkits? wxDesigner is a really good commercial product, it's pretty inexpensive, too. http://www.roebling.de/ -- Benji York -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Still Loving Python

On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 17:35:40 +0100, Ivan Voras wrote: > Maybe the OP really wants a GUI builder. > More than 5 years ago, i programmed in Visual Basic and Delphi and I > still miss the wonderful ease of graphically creating the user interface > in WYSIWYG mode. If you haven't tried it, you don'

Re: Still Loving Python

Il 2005-12-13, Ivan Voras <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ha scritto: > More than 5 years ago, i programmed in Visual Basic and Delphi and I > still miss the wonderful ease of graphically creating the user interface > in WYSIWYG mode. If you haven't tried it, you don't know what you're > missing :) I used

Re: Still Loving Python

Lawrence Oluyede wrote: > Python *does* have GUI, you only have to decide which one you prefer. > > ps. the customer wants Windows as a platform, we develop on Linux using > PyGTK, postgre and sql server for some old data. This is the true power of > cross-platform :) Maybe the OP really wants a

Re: Still Loving Python

Il 2005-12-13, Kamilche <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ha scritto: > Python still suffers from the lack of a good GUI, which I believe is > slowing its acceptance by the programming community at large. (I know > about tKinter, no need to post links to it, thanks.) Let me say I'm not agree, I'm developing a l

Still Loving Python

I switched to Python a couple years ago, and haven't looked back. I've used Python for many applications, including several commercial plugins for Poser. I don't post on here much, because I don't need to; working in Python is so obvious and easy, it's rare that I get stumped by the limitations and