Re: Python does not play well with others

you have to undestand that python is not like other languages. I am working wih it for 3 months. in this time i learned more than throgh c, c++, java or php. you take. what the hell is php. a language developed primary for webaplications. take zope and you have the same. besides that zope will do f

Re: Python does not play well with others

"[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > It's possible that we could build it all in a startup module and then > pickle everything we've built into a file that each child would > unpickle, but I'm a bit leery about that approach. Yeah, that's not so great. You could look at POSH. -- htt

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 6, 4:27 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > In our case, the issue is this: we load a ton of info at server > > restart, from the database. Some of it gets processed a bit based on > > configuration files and so forth. If t

Re: Python does not play well with others

"[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > In our case, the issue is this: we load a ton of info at server > restart, from the database. Some of it gets processed a bit based on > configuration files and so forth. If this were done in my own C > server, I'd do all of that and set up the (r

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 5, 5:45 pm, "Graham Dumpleton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Feb 6, 8:57 am, "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > On Feb 5, 12:52 pm, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > John Nagle wrote: > > > > >>Graham Dumpleton wrote: > > >

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Graham Dumpleton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Certainly launching any new threads should be postponed til after the > > fork. > > Except that you can't outright prevent it from being done as a Python > module could create the threads as a side effect of the module import > itself. Yeah, th

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 6, 10:15 am, Paul Rubin wrote: > "Graham Dumpleton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > There is also much more possibility for code, if it runs up extra > > threads, to interfere with the operation of the Apache parent process. > > Certainly launching any new threads

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Graham Dumpleton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > The first is whether it would be possible for code to be run with > elevated privileges given that the main Apache process usually is > started as root. I'm not sure at what point it switches to the special > user Apache generally runs as and whether

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 6, 9:15 am, Paul Rubin wrote: > "Graham Dumpleton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Yes, these per VirtualHost interpreter instances will only be created > > on demand in the child process when a request arrives which > > necessitates it be created and so there is s

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 6, 8:57 am, "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Feb 5, 12:52 pm, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > John Nagle wrote: > > > >>Graham Dumpleton wrote: > > > >>>On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > > > >>>

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Graham Dumpleton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Yes, these per VirtualHost interpreter instances will only be created > on demand in the child process when a request arrives which > necessitates it be created and so there is some first time setup for > that specific interpreter instance at that po

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Graham Dumpleton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > No such limitation exists with mod_python as it does all the > interpreter creation and management at the Python C API level. The one > interpreter per process limitation is only when using the standard > 'python' runtime executable and you are doing

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 5, 12:52 pm, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > John Nagle wrote: > > >>Graham Dumpleton wrote: > > >>>On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >> Realistically, mod_python is a d

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 6, 5:39 am, Paul Rubin wrote: > John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > The GIL doesn't affect seperate processes, and any large server that > > > cares about stability is going to be running a pre-forking MPM no > > > matter what language they're supporting.

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 6, 4:52 am, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > John Nagle wrote: > > >>Graham Dumpleton wrote: > > >>>On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >> Realistically, mod_python is a de

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > The GIL doesn't affect seperate processes, and any large server that > > cares about stability is going to be running a pre-forking MPM no > > matter what language they're supporting. > >Pre-forking doesn't reduce load; it just improves responsiveness

Re: Python does not play well with others

On 5 Feb, 18:52, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >Pre-forking doesn't reduce load; it just improves responsiveness. > You still pay for loading all the modules on every request. For > many AJAX apps, the loading cost tends to dominate the transaction. According to the Apache prefork d

Re: Python does not play well with others

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > John Nagle wrote: > >>Graham Dumpleton wrote: >> >>>On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: >>> >>> "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> Realistically, mod_python is a dead end for large servers, >>because Python isn't really mult

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle wrote: > Graham Dumpleton wrote: > > On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > > > >>"Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >> > >>>Probably the biggest inhibitor, as far as I can see, has been the > >>>server technology chosen. Many hosting providers have hi

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 5, 9:45 am, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Graham Dumpleton wrote: > > On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > > >>"Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > >>>Probably the biggest inhibitor, as far as I can see, has been the > >>>server technology chos

Re: Python does not play well with others

Graham Dumpleton wrote: > On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > >>"Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> >>>Probably the biggest inhibitor, as far as I can see, has been the >>>server technology chosen. Many hosting providers have historically >>>offered no better

Re: Python does not play well with others

Graham Dumpleton wrote: > > Having said all that, perhaps those who are complaining about lack of > support for specific features in mod_python can now clarify what > actually you are talking about. At the moment the brief comments being > made seem to possibly cover some things that mod_python can

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 4, 1:05 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> Probably the biggest inhibitor, as far as I can see, has been the >> server technology chosen. Many hosting providers have historically >> offered no better than CGI for Python, whilst PHP

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle wrote: > > The real problems are with integration of modules that > aren't written in Python. Python-only modules don't have the > version compatibility problems which C modules do. Loading > a Python-only module from an external source is usually not > a big deal. Building a C m

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Boddie wrote: > I was really advocating improvements to the built-in SSL support, > anyway, which was also what the complainant was suggesting before > people started asking him mistakenly why he thought that Python was > weakened by some third party packages (PyOpenSSL, M2Crypto). The

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin wrote: > "George Sakkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >>> What does "batteries included" mean to you? To me, it means you don't >>> have to install add-ons. >> So let's make a 500MB executable and add Numpy, Zope, Django, PIL, >> pretty much everything actually. Even better, make CheeseS

Re: Python does not play well with others

Jorge Godoy wrote: > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > And while Python eggs may be useful for people managing additional > > software as some unprivileged user, hosting providers (and virtual > > private server administrators) will want packages that fit in with the > > rest of the s

Re: Python does not play well with others

I find Paul Rubin's arguments compelling and convincing. As just a Python user (i.e., someone who has contributed nothing) let me add a few comments along the same lines. On 03 Feb 2007 18:31:03 -0800, Paul Rubin <"http://phr.cx"@nospam.invalid> wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > Paul> Why

Re: Python does not play well with others

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Would it benefit the Python community more if Python shipped with > MySQL support out of the box? Is it likely that a user suddenly finds > him/herself needing to connect to a MySQL database? The other problem is that it

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > And while Python eggs may be useful for people managing additional > software as some unprivileged user, hosting providers (and virtual > private server administrators) will want packages that fit in with the > rest of the software being managed in the h

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin wrote: > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Python should only incorporate functionality in order to offer a > > coherent experience (where the omission of functionality would > > otherwise lead to a flawed experience). For example, having support > > for SSL in the socket mod

Re: Python does not play well with others

Kirk Sluder wrote: > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Quite. I imagine that most GNU/Linux distributions (and various BSDs) > > provide at least some version of MySQLdb as a package. > > Bingo, I've rarely installed python from python.org, or other >

Re: Python does not play well with others

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Quite. I imagine that most GNU/Linux distributions (and various BSDs) > provide at least some version of MySQLdb as a package. Bingo, I've rarely installed python from python.org, or other libraries from sourceforge, etc.

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin schrieb: > "Diez B. Roggisch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> And they certainly require special treatment like putting them in the >> classpath, setting up the project directory and the like - no simple >> import will work out of the box, as it would witch python standard lib >> drivers.

Re: Python does not play well with others

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Paul> Why would I expect your employer to solve my problems anyway, even > Paul> if they relate to some module that you actually use? > > Your reasoning seems to be that Python should contain the functional union > of everything at least in Java and PHP if not P

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Python should only incorporate functionality in order to offer a > coherent experience (where the omission of functionality would > otherwise lead to a flawed experience). For example, having support > for SSL in the socket module offers a coherent experi

Re: Python does not play well with others

Dennis Lee Bieber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > languages do. PHP hosting providers don't have to install a separate > > PHP to MySQL interface gizmo as far as I know. > > Really? Then why does the MySQL AB download site at > http://dev.mysql.com/downloads/connector/php/ list both a > "Co

Re: Python does not play well with others

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Paul> Yeah well, the Wxpython, PyQt, PyGTK etc. people may feel slighted > Paul> that Tkinter got included and their stuff didn't, and the Eric, > Paul> Eclipse, Komodo etc. people may feel slighted that IDLE got > Paul> included, but that doesn't stop Tk

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin wrote: > Ben Finney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > Since Python is being touted as good for web apps as a competitor to > > > PHP > > > > Python is being touted as a good language for *many* purposes, not > > just web applications. Python is also a "competitor" to Java, to Ruby, > > t

Re: Python does not play well with others

Chris Mellon wrote: > On 02 Feb 2007 11:10:04 -0800, Paul Rubin > <"http://phr.cx"@nospam.invalid> wrote: > > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > If the hosting provider doesn't want to install MySQLdb then it may > > > not be a technical issue - perhaps they just can't be bothered to >

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin: > I thought J2SE comes with JSP. Maybe that's not a "framework" in the > fancy sense though. J2SE does not include JSP. Neil -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Python does not play well with others

Jorge> So we should get a better egg support. Then it would all be just Jorge> a matter of easy_install . I'm all in favor of that... Skip -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul> Yeah well, the Wxpython, PyQt, PyGTK etc. people may feel slighted Paul> that Tkinter got included and their stuff didn't, and the Eric, Paul> Eclipse, Komodo etc. people may feel slighted that IDLE got Paul> included, but that doesn't stop Tkinter and IDLE from being useful

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul> Why would I expect your employer to solve my problems anyway, even Paul> if they relate to some module that you actually use? Your reasoning seems to be that Python should contain the functional union of everything at least in Java and PHP if not Perl, Ruby and Tcl as well. Free soft

Re: Python does not play well with others

Szabolcs> seriously, python is a programming language and not a flee Szabolcs> market (so don't compare it to java or php) If it grew to be as bloated as Java it might well become a "flee" market. ;-) Skip -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin writes: > "Diez B. Roggisch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> And they certainly require special treatment like putting them in the >> classpath, setting up the project directory and the like - no simple >> import will work out of the box, as it would witch pyth

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Diez B. Roggisch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > And they certainly require special treatment like putting them in the > classpath, setting up the project directory and the like - no simple > import will work out of the box, as it would witch python standard lib > drivers. Well, that's nowhere nea

Re: Python does not play well with others

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Paul Rubin wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > Where would you stop? At the boundaries of your particular application > > interests? > > If the Pythonistas are serious > about such a claim, competitive analysis says they should be wi

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin schrieb: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >> I can't speak authoritatively for either PHP or J2SE, but I suspect the >> latter at least has some signifiant monetary support (if not outright gobs >> of human resources) from Sun. PHP seems to have a more limited application >> domain (web apps

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin schrieb: > "Diez B. Roggisch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> This is simply not true. J2SE doesn't include a web-framework. J2EE >> does, but it's a separate multi-megabyte-download. > > I thought J2SE comes with JSP. Maybe that's not a "framework" in the > fancy sense though. JSP is

Re: Python does not play well with others

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Paul Rubin wrote: > I do think the core should have more stuff than it does, so that its > functionality can be on a par with competing language distros like > J2SE and PHP. Both of those distros include database connectvity > modules an

Re: Python does not play well with others

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > iceberg.) The Pylons, web.py, Karrigell, Webware and TurboGears people > might (rightly) feel slighted if you include Django but not their > frameworks. Yeah well, the Wxpython, PyQt, PyGTK etc. people may feel slighted that Tkinter got included and their stuff didn't,

Re: Python does not play well with others

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > I can't speak authoritatively for either PHP or J2SE, but I suspect the > latter at least has some signifiant monetary support (if not outright gobs > of human resources) from Sun. PHP seems to have a more limited application > domain (web apps) from which it has expand

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Diez B. Roggisch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > This is simply not true. J2SE doesn't include a web-framework. J2EE > does, but it's a separate multi-megabyte-download. I thought J2SE comes with JSP. Maybe that's not a "framework" in the fancy sense though. > PHP _is_ a web centered language, s

Re: Python does not play well with others

Ben Finney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Since Python is being touted as good for web apps as a competitor to > > PHP > > Python is being touted as a good language for *many* purposes, not > just web applications. Python is also a "competitor" to Java, to Ruby, > to Perl, to many other languages

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin wrote: > "George Sakkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > What does "batteries included" mean to you? To me, it means you don't > > > have to install add-ons. > > > > So let's make a 500MB executable and add Numpy, Zope, Django, PIL, > > pretty much everything actually. Even better, m

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin <"http://phr.cx"@NOSPAM.invalid> writes: > Since Python is being touted as good for web apps as a competitor to > PHP Python is being touted as a good language for *many* purposes, not just web applications. Python is also a "competitor" to Java, to Ruby, to Perl, to many other languag

Re: Python does not play well with others

Ben Finney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > "Something like it" *is* included in Python. Python 2.5 includes > SQLite in the standard library. Where do we draw the line? You want > MySQL, I want PostgreSQL, he wants Firebird, they want an interface to > something proprietary. Since Python is being to

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin <"http://phr.cx"@NOSPAM.invalid> writes: > Why should the hosting provider need to devote attention to > something like that? MySQLdb or something like it should be > included with Python, not added separately by the hosting provider. "Something like it" *is* included in Python. Pytho

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul> Why is it that PHP and J2SE manage deal with this problem but Paul> Python cannot? I can't speak authoritatively for either PHP or J2SE, but I suspect the latter at least has some signifiant monetary support (if not outright gobs of human resources) from Sun. PHP seems to have a mo

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul> Numpy should certainly be included and I think there are efforts Paul> in that direction. There is also a movement to choose a web Paul> framework to include and Django might be a good choice. Right off the bat you run into problems. While Numpy is popular in the scientific

Re: Python does not play well with others

> I do think the core should have more stuff than it does, so that its > functionality can be on a par with competing language distros like > J2SE and PHP. Both of those distros include database connectvity > modules and web frameworks. This is simply not true. J2SE doesn't include a web-framewo

Re: Python does not play well with others

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > database: Sybase, Oracle, MySQL, SQLite, ODBC, Firebird > database versions: who knows? assume two per database > python versions: 2.4, 2.5, 2.6, 3.0? > platforms: windows, pick two linux flavors, solaris > > Those numbers give me 6 * 2 * 4 * 4 == 192 co

Re: Python does not play well with others

"George Sakkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > What does "batteries included" mean to you? To me, it means you don't > > have to install add-ons. > > So let's make a 500MB executable and add Numpy, Zope, Django, PIL, > pretty much everything actually. Even better, make CheeseShop just a > fronte

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul> What does "batteries included" mean to you? To me, it means you Paul> don't have to install add-ons. Who decides which batteries are important to include? Skip -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul> Why should the hosting provider need to devote attention to Paul> something like that? MySQLdb or something like it should be Paul> included with Python, ... What about Firebird? Oracle? Sybase? Who maintains them in the core? MySQLdb is quite stable outside the core. What

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Feb 2, 2:41 pm, Paul Rubin wrote: > "Chris Mellon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > How about because thats what you pay them for? Seriously. Do you even > > think about what you're saying? Python needs to move MySQL (and only > > MySQL, of course) into the core becaus

Re: Python does not play well with others

On 02 Feb 2007 11:41:03 -0800, Paul Rubin <"http://phr.cx"@nospam.invalid> wrote: > "Chris Mellon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > How about because thats what you pay them for? Seriously. Do you even > > think about what you're saying? Python needs to move MySQL (and only > > MySQL, of course) int

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Chris Mellon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > How about because thats what you pay them for? Seriously. Do you even > think about what you're saying? Python needs to move MySQL (and only > MySQL, of course) into the core because installing packages is too > much of a burden for hosting companies? W

Re: Python does not play well with others

On 02 Feb 2007 11:10:04 -0800, Paul Rubin <"http://phr.cx"@nospam.invalid> wrote: > "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > If the hosting provider doesn't want to install MySQLdb then it may > > not be a technical issue - perhaps they just can't be bothered to > > install it, possibly becaus

Re: Python does not play well with others

"Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > If the hosting provider doesn't want to install MySQLdb then it may > not be a technical issue - perhaps they just can't be bothered to > install it, possibly because there's no demand or benefit to the > bottom line in doing so. Why should the hosting p

Re: Python does not play well with others

On 2 Feb, 04:56, Ben Finney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > A bug report should be sent to the bug tracker for the software > against which you're reporting a bug. Only at that point does it > become something on which you can comment about attitude toward bug > reports, because before that point th

Re: Python does not play well with others

On 2 Feb, 03:46, Paul Rubin wrote: > > I'd say the functionality that John wants is the same that pretty much > everyone wants, and it's much easier to get for other languages than > for Python. If the hosting provider doesn't want to install MySQLdb then it may not be a

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin wrote: > Ben Finney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >>>Python still isn't ready for prime time in the web hosting world. >> >>That doesn't follow. It's just as valid to say that the web hosting >>providers (that you've interacted with so far) aren't ready to support >>the Python functiona

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Python is the only major open source project I've encountered where > there's so much hostility to bug reports. Bear in mind that if you send a message only to this mailing list, that's not a bug report. That's a discussion, which may be worth having, but

Re: Python does not play well with others

John> From Aplus.net tech support: John> "No, db connectivity with Python is not supported. Modules for John> Python can't be installed by request on shared hosting." John> And these are companies that say they support Python. John> Python still isn't ready for prime time in

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Jan 24, 2:59 pm, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Python is the only major open source project I've encountered where > there's so much hostility to bug reports. Try telling the Perl community that their debugger is broken. That didn't go well. ;-) Mike -- http://mail.python.org/m

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Jan 23, 8:50 pm, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >The major complaint I have about Python is that the packages > which connect it to other software components all seem to have > serious problems. As long as you don't need to talk to anything > outside the Python world, you're fine. A

Re: Python does not play well with others

Ben Finney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Python still isn't ready for prime time in the web hosting world. > That doesn't follow. It's just as valid to say that the web hosting > providers (that you've interacted with so far) aren't ready to support > the Python functionality you want. I'd say t

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Just a followup. I'm still trying to get Python, MySQL, MySQLdb, > M2Crypto, and maybe mod_python to work on a shared hosting server. >From your description in the rest of the message, it seems that it's the *hosting providers* who are unable to do this,

Re: Python does not play well with others

Just a followup. I'm still trying to get Python, MySQL, MySQLdb, M2Crypto, and maybe mod_python to work on a shared hosting server. This is amazingly difficult, because of all the version incompatibility issues. Python, MySQL, MySQLdb, SWIG, OpenSSL, and gcc all have to have the right versions

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle a écrit : (snip) >My main concern is with glue code to major packages. The connections > to OpenSSL, MySQL, and Apache (i.e. mod_python) all exist, but have major > weaknesses. Neither MySQLdb nor mod_python are part of the Python's standard lib AFAIK. > If you're doing web app

Re: Python does not play well with others

> Andy Dustman, the author of the package is quite responsive to requests > raised in the mysql-python forums on SourceForge > (http://sourceforge.net/forum/?group_id=22307). If you have problems with > MySQLdb, bring them up there. I'm sure Andy will respond. I apologize in advance for beating

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin wrote: > John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >>That's the problem. We now have four SSL implementations for >>Python, none of which let you do all the things OpenSSL can do. > > > I'm aware of some OpenSSL wrappers plus TLSlite. Am I missing a > couple more? I guess maybe

Re: Python does not play well with others

Harry George napisał(a): > You experience isn't shared by everyone. Some of us find Python the > most functional and portable of the candidates you mention. The point on MySQLdb is rather common, many people who used it with SQLObject will confirm. Fortunately for MySQLdb, the MySQL on its own i

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > That's the problem. We now have four SSL implementations for > Python, none of which let you do all the things OpenSSL can do. I'm aware of some OpenSSL wrappers plus TLSlite. Am I missing a couple more? I guess maybe the OpenSSL wrappers also work o

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Rubin wrote: > "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >>I haven't had a need to do anything with OpenSSL from Python; all >>that takes place in the Apache server > > > That's a reasonable approach for a typical server-side web > application, but there are other types of Python a

Re: Python does not play well with others

"[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > I haven't had a need to do anything with OpenSSL from Python; all > that takes place in the Apache server That's a reasonable approach for a typical server-side web application, but there are other types of Python apps that can also want to use SS

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Jan 25, 12:17 pm, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > My main concern is with glue code to major packages. The connections > to OpenSSL, MySQL, and Apache (i.e. mod_python) all exist, but have major > weaknesses. If you're doing web applications, those are standard pieces > which need

Re: Python does not play well with others

John> My main concern is with glue code to major packages. The John> connections to OpenSSL, MySQL, and Apache (i.e. mod_python) all John> exist, but have major weaknesses. I have no SSL experience or direct mod_python experience (I do use Myghty effectively), but I have used MySQLdb

Re: Python does not play well with others

John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > My main concern is with glue code to major packages. The connections > to OpenSSL, MySQL, and Apache (i.e. mod_python) all exist, but have major > weaknesses. If you're doing web applications, those are standard pieces > which need to work right. Ther

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul Boddie wrote: > On 25 Jan, 12:01, "Ben Sizer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> I think that is why many of the SIGs are stagnant, why the standard library >> has so much fluff yet still lacks in key areas such as multimedia and web >> development, etc. > ... I think this is also a good insight

Re: Python does not play well with others

Paul> We all know that the Python language has issues (or "warts" Paul> as they are popularly called), although some of the most notable Paul> ones don't seem to have been addressed as yet in the plans for Paul> Python 3000 (eg. default argument evaluation), but some of the

Re: Python does not play well with others

On 25 Jan, 12:01, "Ben Sizer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Python is quite capable in many areas, such that the people in the > community with the expertise to extend the language and libraries, are > usually the ones who've been happily using the polished features for > years and have found they

Re: Python does not play well with others

On Jan 24, 1:50 am, John Nagle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > In the Perl, Java, PHP, and C/C++ worlds, the equivalent > functions just work. That's because, in those worlds, either the > development team for the language or the development team > for the subsystem takes responsibility for making t

Re: Python does not play well with others

Kay Schluehr wrote: > On 25 Jan., 04:46, "Paul Boddie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>> That's because, in those worlds, either the >>> development team for the language or the development team >>> for the subsystem takes responsibility for making them work. >>> Only Python doesn't do that.And t

Re: Python does not play well with others

On 1/24/07, Harry George <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Python - it just works. Same scripts run on every platform. Bindings > available to every C/C++/FORTRAN library I've needed so far. Often > the bindings are not complete, but oddly enough the binding developers > have chosen to do just the fu

Re: Python does not play well with others

At Thursday 25/1/2007 03:39, Dennis Lee Bieber wrote: On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:04:39 +0100, egbert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> declaimed the following in comp.lang.python: > On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 06:24:37AM +, Harry George wrote: > > > > Perl - excellent modules and bindings for just about everythi

Re: Python does not play well with others

Dennis Lee Bieber wrote: > Uhm... Unless something has happened that I don't know about, isn't > C# a M$ specific product? Mono? Regards Stephan -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Python does not play well with others

Harry George wrote: > Perl - excellent modules and bindings for just about everything you ... > Java - a world of its own. They reinvent the wheel instead of linking ... > PHP - are we talking web scripts or serious programs? Are you doing ... > C - the portable assembler. Solid, trusted, tunab

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