On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Tim Harig wrote:
> I also looked at F# and Scala; but, neither are really applicable on my
> chosen platform. With F# being such a new language, I suspect that it
> borrowed its indent practices either from Haskell or from Python.
>
I'm pretty sure F# gets its wh
On 2010-11-07, Ethan Furman wrote:
> Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> In message , Tim Harig wrote:
>>> I personally prefer tabs as it lets *me* decide how far the
>>> apparent indentations are in the code.
>>
>> But they don???t. Other people can have different settings,
>> and they will see differ
Arnaud Delobelle writes:
> python-mode has python-beginning-of-block (C-c C-u) and
> python-end-of-block.
Yes. It was one of my explicit gripes that editing Python requires one
to learn entirely new and unfamiliar keystrokes for doing fairly
familiar editing tasks.
-- [mdw]
--
http://mail.pyt
In message , Ethan
Furman wrote:
> Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> In message , Tim Harig wrote:
>>>
>>> I personally prefer tabs as it lets *me* decide how far the apparent
>>> indentations are in the code.
>>
>> But they don’t. Other people can have different settings, and they will
>> see dif
Lawrence D'Oliveiro writes:
> In message <87oca1b8ba.fsf@metalzone.distorted.org.uk>, Mark Wooding
> wrote:
>
>> Vertical space is a limiting factor on how much code one can see at a
>> time.
>
> One thing that helps me is that Emacs has commands for quickly jumping
> between matching brack
On 2010-11-08, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <87oca1b8ba.fsf@metalzone.distorted.org.uk>, Mark Wooding
> wrote:
>> Vertical space is a limiting factor on how much code one can see at a
>> time.
> One thing that helps me is that Emacs has commands for quickly jumping
> between matc
On 2010-11-08, Michael Torrie wrote:
> On 11/06/2010 02:27 AM, Seebs wrote:
>> I have yet to find an editor that allows me to, well, *edit*, more
>> comfortably than vi.
> Indeed vi (or in my case, vim) works wonderfully well with python. I
> always use the following vim settings on python files
In message , Grant Edwards wrote:
> ... though I'd still prefer a 4:3.
4:3 still seems to be the best. It gives you a landscape A3-proportional
view (or two A4-proportioned portrait pages side by side), and the little
bit of space left over at the top or bottom can be used for toolbars,
titleb
In message , Grant Edwards wrote:
> IOW, editing a loop or other control structure where you couldn't see both
> ends was problematic. Conserving vertical space avoids that problem.
No it doesn’t. It just moves it to a different, arbitrary, point a few
percent away—not enough to be worth botheri
In message <87oca1b8ba.fsf@metalzone.distorted.org.uk>, Mark Wooding
wrote:
> Vertical space is a limiting factor on how much code one can see at a
> time.
One thing that helps me is that Emacs has commands for quickly jumping
between matching brackets.
Of course, this only works for langu
On 11/06/2010 02:27 AM, Seebs wrote:
> On 2010-11-06, Steve Holden wrote:
>> If someone were to use a text editor which had always historically
>> mangled whitespace I would find myself wondering why they found it
>> necessary to restrict themselves to such stone-age tools.
>
> I have yet to find
On 11/8/2010 8:50 AM, Neil Cerutti wrote:
[...]
> Interesting. I find conserving vertical space to be a big win. I
> understand why you'd enforce braces for virtually all code bodies
> in C. In C, I'm giving up the most obvious form of expression for
> something obviously more robust. In Python, th
On 2010-11-08, Roy Smith wrote:
> In article ,
> Grant Edwards wrote:
>
>> It's getting really hard to find high-DPI displays on laptops any
>> more. 1600x1200 used to be available on 16" laptop displays, and that
>> looked great. Even my old 15" thinkpad at 1400x1050 wasn't bad.
>
> My 15" Ma
On 2010-11-07, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <8jftftfel...@mid.individual.net>, Neil Cerutti wrote:
>
>> The handsome ':' terminator of if/elif/if statements allows us to
>> omit a newline, conserving vertical space. This improves the
>> readability of certain constructs.
>>
>> if x: pr
In article ,
Grant Edwards wrote:
> It's getting really hard to find high-DPI displays on laptops any
> more. 1600x1200 used to be available on 16" laptop displays, and that
> looked great. Even my old 15" thinkpad at 1400x1050 wasn't bad.
My 15" MacBook Pro is 1680 x 1050.
--
http://mail.py
On 2010-11-07, Steve Holden wrote:
> On 11/7/2010 10:46 AM, Grant Edwards wrote:
>> On 2010-11-07, Steve Holden wrote:
>>> On 11/7/2010 8:23 AM, Grant Edwards wrote:
>>> [...]
(I bought 4:3 monitors before they got replaced by cheap 16:8
screens)
>>>
>>> I think you'll find the new aspe
On 2010-11-07, Ethan Furman wrote:
> Seebs wrote:
>> On 2010-11-05, Ethan Furman wrote:
>>> The verifiable benefit for me is ease of use, ease of thought, ease of
>>> typing... I realize these are not benefits for everyone, but they are
>>> for some -- and I would venture a guess that the ease
On 2010-11-07, Mark Wooding wrote:
> I've no idea how people manage with these ridiculous widescreen monitors.
Side space used for Other Stuff. It takes some reworking of the layout,
but overall I sorta like it now.
-s
--
Copyright 2010, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / usenet-nos...@seeb
On 2010-11-07, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2010-11-07, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> In message <87sjzige0r@benfinney.id.au>, Ben Finney wrote:
>>> The more general answer is: the block is explicitly ended where the
>>> indentation ends.
>> That's implicit, not explicit.
> If you can _see_ it
On 11/7/2010 10:46 AM, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2010-11-07, Steve Holden wrote:
>> On 11/7/2010 8:23 AM, Grant Edwards wrote:
>> [...]
>>> (I bought 4:3 monitors before they got replaced by cheap 16:8
>>> screens)
>>
>> I think you'll find the new aspect ration is 16:9.
>
"aspect ration". Sheesh
Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
In message , Tim Harig wrote:
>>
I personally prefer tabs as it lets *me* decide how far the apparent
indentations are in the code.
But they don’t. Other people can have different settings, and they will see
different indentations for your code
That's exactly the
Seebs wrote:
On 2010-11-05, Ethan Furman wrote:
The verifiable benefit for me is ease of use, ease of thought, ease of
typing... I realize these are not benefits for everyone, but they are
for some -- and I would venture a guess that the ease of thought benefit
is one of the primary reasons P
On 2010-11-07, Steve Holden wrote:
> On 11/7/2010 8:23 AM, Grant Edwards wrote:
> [...]
>> (I bought 4:3 monitors before they got replaced by cheap 16:8
>> screens)
>
> I think you'll find the new aspect ration is 16:9.
I knew that. My keyboard didn't.
I recently bought a close-out Lenovo T500
On 11/07/10 08:26, Steve Holden wrote:
On 11/7/2010 8:23 AM, Grant Edwards wrote:
[...]
(I bought 4:3 monitors before they got replaced by cheap 16:8
screens)
I think you'll find the new aspect ration is 16:9.
Unless that's why they're cheap...
dual-16x9-widescreen-in-portrait-mode-is-a-won
In article <87oca1b8ba.fsf@metalzone.distorted.org.uk>,
m...@distorted.org.uk (Mark Wooding) wrote:
> Vertical space is a limiting factor on how much code one can see at a
> time.
Yup. Over three decades of programming, my personal upper bound for how
long a function should be has always b
On 11/7/2010 8:23 AM, Grant Edwards wrote:
[...]
> (I bought 4:3 monitors before they got replaced by cheap 16:8
> screens)
I think you'll find the new aspect ration is 16:9.
regards
Steve
--
Steve Holden +1 571 484 6266 +1 800 494 3119
PyCon 2011 Atlanta March 9-17 http://us.
On 2010-11-07, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <87sjzige0r@benfinney.id.au>, Ben Finney wrote:
>
>> Seebs writes:
>>
>>> On 2010-11-03, Steven D'Aprano
>>> wrote:
>>>
Python does explicitly mark blocks. It does it by changes in
indentation. An indent is an explicit start-b
On 2010-11-07, Mark Wooding wrote:
> Lawrence D'Oliveiro writes:
>
>> I would never do that. "Conserving vertical space" seems a stupid
>> reason for doing it.
>
> Vertical space is a limiting factor on how much code one can see at a
> time.
And one study I read shoed that how much code one can
Lawrence D'Oliveiro writes:
> I would never do that. “Conserving vertical space” seems a stupid reason for
> doing it.
Vertical space is a limiting factor on how much code one can see at a
time. I use old-fashioned CRT monitors with 4x3 aspect ratios and
dizzyingly high resolution; I usually w
In message <87sjzige0r@benfinney.id.au>, Ben Finney wrote:
> Seebs writes:
>
>> On 2010-11-03, Steven D'Aprano
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Python does explicitly mark blocks. It does it by changes in
>>> indentation. An indent is an explicit start-block. An outdent is an
>>> explicit end- block. There
In message <8jftftfel...@mid.individual.net>, Neil Cerutti wrote:
> The handsome ':' terminator of if/elif/if statements allows us to
> omit a newline, conserving vertical space. This improves the
> readability of certain constructs.
>
> if x: print(x)
> elif y: print(y)
> else: print()
I would
In message , Grant Edwards wrote:
> But without the colon, how are people who write programming editors
> going to know when to increase the indentation level as I enter code?
I hate editors (or editing modes) that think they know when to change
indentation level on me. Hate, hate, hate.
--
htt
In message , Tim Harig wrote:
> I agree with Seebs, Python is the only language I know that promotes
> the use of spaces over tabs; and there are equally picky syntaxs (ie,
> Makefiles) that mandate the use of tabs.
That’s widely conceded to be a misfeature of Make.
> I personally prefer tabs as
On 2010-11-07, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Sun, 07 Nov 2010 14:53:45 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> In message , Seebs wrote:
>>> Four spaces followed by a tab nearly always actually means "eight
>>> spaces" to most editors (and Python seems to treat it that way), but
>>> it's hard to tell.
On Sun, 07 Nov 2010 14:53:45 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message , Seebs wrote:
>
>> Specifically:
>>
>> Four spaces followed by a tab nearly always actually means "eight
>> spaces" to most editors (and Python seems to treat it that way), but
>> it's hard to tell. Worse, a tab may hav
On 2010-11-07, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message , Seebs wrote:
>> Four spaces followed by a tab nearly always actually means "eight spaces"
>> to most editors (and Python seems to treat it that way), but it's hard to
>> tell. Worse, a tab may have been intended to be the same thing as four
In message , Seebs wrote:
> Specifically:
>
> Four spaces followed by a tab nearly always actually means "eight spaces"
> to most editors (and Python seems to treat it that way), but it's hard to
> tell. Worse, a tab may have been intended to be the same thing as four
> spaces, and someone was ex
On Nov 6, 5:21 pm, m...@distorted.org.uk (Mark Wooding) wrote:
> Rustom Mody writes:
> > As for tools' brokeness regarding spaces/tabs/indentation heres a
> > thread on the emacs list wherein emacs dev Stefan Monnier admits to
> > the fact that emacs' handling in this regard is not perfect.
>
> >h
Rustom Mody writes:
> As for tools' brokeness regarding spaces/tabs/indentation heres a
> thread on the emacs list wherein emacs dev Stefan Monnier admits to
> the fact that emacs' handling in this regard is not perfect.
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/gnu.emacs.help/browse_thread/thread/1bd0c
On 11/06/10 03:27, Seebs wrote:
On 2010-11-06, Steve Holden wrote:
If someone were to use a text editor which had always historically
mangled whitespace I would find myself wondering why they found it
necessary to restrict themselves to such stone-age tools.
I have yet to find an editor that
On 2010-11-06, Steve Holden wrote:
> If someone were to use a text editor which had always historically
> mangled whitespace I would find myself wondering why they found it
> necessary to restrict themselves to such stone-age tools.
I have yet to find an editor that allows me to, well, *edit*, mo
On 11/5/2010 4:09 PM, Seebs wrote:
> On 2010-11-05, Grant Edwards wrote:
>> On 2010-11-05, Seebs wrote:
>>> On 2010-11-05, Emile van Sebille wrote:
So, which of your tools are you married to that are causing your issues?
>
>>> Python.
>
>> I think you should quit using Python and choose a
As for tools' brokeness regarding spaces/tabs/indentation heres a
thread on the emacs list wherein emacs dev Stefan Monnier admits to
the fact that emacs' handling in this regard is not perfect.
http://groups.google.com/group/gnu.emacs.help/browse_thread/thread/1bd0c33a3e755730/89cbd920ee651b5a?q=
On 2010-11-06, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Fri, 05 Nov 2010 08:17:02 +0530, Rustom Mody wrote:
>> However the original question -- mixing tabs and spaces is bad -- has
>> got lost in the flames. Do the most die-hard python fanboys deny this?
>> And if not is it asking too much (say in python3) t
On 2010-11-06, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 19:37:25 +, Tim Harig wrote:
>> Examples of communication channels that mangle white space abound.
> Yes. So what?
So something which is broken by them is brittle.
And in every circumstance *other* than the syntax of Python, specif
On 2010-11-06, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Fri, 05 Nov 2010 18:45:39 +, Seebs wrote:
>> On 2010-11-05, Steven D'Aprano
>> wrote:
>>> Well there's your problem -- you are relying on tools that operate by
>>> magic.
>> Wrong.
> Really? Then how did the logic get screwed up from a mere copy-an
On Fri, 05 Nov 2010 08:17:02 +0530, Rustom Mody wrote:
> However the original question -- mixing tabs and spaces is bad -- has
> got lost in the flames. Do the most die-hard python fanboys deny this?
> And if not is it asking too much (say in python3) that mixing tabs and
> spaces be flagged as
On Fri, 05 Nov 2010 18:45:39 +, Seebs wrote:
> On 2010-11-05, Steven D'Aprano
> wrote:
>> On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 20:17:35 +, Seebs wrote:
>>> That was the thing which bit me the worst. I had a fairly large block
>>> of code in a first-pass ugly program. I wanted to start refactoring
>>> it
On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 17:45:58 +, Tim Harig wrote:
>>> Python is the only language that I know that *needs* to specify tabs
>>> versus spaces since it is the only language I know of which uses
>>> whitespace formating as part of its syntax and structure.
[...]
> I am also aware of other langauge
On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 19:37:25 +, Tim Harig wrote:
> Examples of communication channels that mangle white space abound.
Yes. So what? If your communication channel mangles your data, change
your communication channel, don't expect users of clean communication
channels to hand-enter error-corr
On 05 Nov 2010 20:14:47 GMT
Seebs wrote:
> I can just see how well this attitude must work in other circumstances:
I guess this message ends the topic for me. Bye.
--
D'Arcy J.M. Cain | Democracy is three wolves
http://www.druid.net/darcy/| and a sheep voting on
+1 4
On 11/5/2010 3:33 PM, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
my language. Use Perl or C or even pybraces.
http://timhatch.com/projects/pybraces/
"I work with a guy who hates Python's significant whitespace and wishes
that he could just use curly braces."
I am offering no solutions.
Except you just did
On 2010-11-05, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2010-11-05, Seebs wrote:
>> On 2010-11-05, Emile van Sebille wrote:
>>> So, which of your tools are you married to that are causing your issues?
>> Python.
> I think you should quit using Python and choose a language that works
> with whatever tools are
On 2010-11-05, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
> The simple fact is that the combination of your tools and Python is
> broken. The combination of my tools and Python is not. That's lucky
> for me since I really, really like IAS. That's unlucky for people who
> have to work with tools that mangle code.
On 2010-11-05, Ethan Furman wrote:
> The verifiable benefit for me is ease of use, ease of thought, ease of
> typing... I realize these are not benefits for everyone, but they are
> for some -- and I would venture a guess that the ease of thought benefit
> is one of the primary reasons Python i
On Nov 5, 12:35 pm, John Nagle wrote:
> INTERLISP's editor allowed the user to select a block of
> LISP code and make it into a function. The selected block
> would be analyzed to determine which local variables it referenced,
> and a new function would be created with those parameters. The
On Fri, 5 Nov 2010 18:13:44 + (UTC)
Tim Harig wrote:
> > care about. If no one was on a crusade to convince people that
> > indentation as syntax (can we call is IAS from now on?) was evil then I
> > wouldn't be posting anything at all on the subject. I am being totally
> > reactionary here.
Tim Harig wrote:
The use of whitespace was a stylistic change and
stylistic holy wars exist because it is almost impossible to prove that
any reasonable style has benefit over another. That whitespace causes
issues is verifiable. I find it hard to concluded that that whitespace
based syntax is
On 2010-11-05, Seebs wrote:
> On 2010-11-05, Emile van Sebille wrote:
>> So, which of your tools are you married to that are causing your issues?
>
> Python.
I think you should quit using Python and choose a language that works
with whatever tools are causing all your white-space corruption
prob
On 2010-11-05, Emile van Sebille wrote:
> So, which of your tools are you married to that are causing your issues?
Python.
-s
--
Copyright 2010, all wrongs reversed. Peter Seebach / usenet-nos...@seebs.net
http://www.seebs.net/log/ <-- lawsuits, religion, and funny pictures
http://en.wikipedia
On 2010-11-05, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 20:17:35 +, Seebs wrote:
>> That was the thing which bit me the worst. I had a fairly large block
>> of code in a first-pass ugly program. I wanted to start refactoring it,
>> so I moved a big hunk of code into a method (with plans
On 2010-11-05, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> How does an edit accidentally add a trailing space to a large number of
> lines?
I would love to know the answer to this question.
However, empirically, it happens.
My guess would be cutting and pasting in some way.
> So we keep coming back to work-arou
On 11/5/2010 3:41 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 20:17:35 +, Seebs wrote:
* I /do/ have a significant problem with cutting and pasting code in
Python. In most languages, I can haul a chunk of code about, hit
C-M-q, and Emacs magically indents the result properl
On 11/5/2010 11:13 AM Tim Harig said...
It is simply hard for me to accept that your solution is better when
it is telling us that we have to abandon thousands of tools that other
solutions manage to work with without difficulty.
I only work with a few tools none of which alter or strip leading
On 2010-11-05, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2010-11-05, Tim Harig wrote:
>> On 2010-11-05, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>>> On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 21:47:59 +, Tim Harig wrote:
>>>
I have seen huge patches caused by nothing more then some edit that
accidently added a trailing space to a large n
On 2010-11-05, Alain Ketterlin wrote:
> Terry Reedy writes:
>
>> If you add the normally redundant information in the form of explicit
>> dedents (anything starting with '#' and distinguishable from normal
>> comments), then it is not too hard to re-indent even after all indents
>> have been remo
On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Nov 2010 19:37:25 + (UTC)
> Tim Harig wrote:
>> On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
>> You are the one who seems to be on a crusade against against braces. It
>
> You totally misunderstand me. I am not on a crusade of any sort. I am
I
On 2010-11-05, Tim Harig wrote:
> On 2010-11-05, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 21:47:59 +, Tim Harig wrote:
>>
>>> I have seen huge patches caused by nothing more then some edit that
>>> accidently added a trailing space to a large number of lines. White
>>> space mangling ha
On 2010-11-05, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 21:47:59 +, Tim Harig wrote:
>
>> I have seen huge patches caused by nothing more then some edit that
>> accidently added a trailing space to a large number of lines. White
>> space mangling happens all the time without people even k
Steven D'Aprano writes:
>> I really like "indentation as structure" (code is more compact and
>> clearer), but I really hate that it relies on me putting the right
>> spaces at the right place.
>
> Er what? You really like indentation as structure, but you don't like
> putting in the indentation
On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 20:17:35 +, Seebs wrote:
>> * I /do/ have a significant problem with cutting and pasting code in
>> Python. In most languages, I can haul a chunk of code about, hit
>> C-M-q, and Emacs magically indents the result properly. This is,
>> unfortunately, impossi
On Thu, 04 Nov 2010 21:47:59 +, Tim Harig wrote:
> I have seen huge patches caused by nothing more then some edit that
> accidently added a trailing space to a large number of lines. White
> space mangling happens all the time without people even knowing about
> it.
How does an edit accident
On Fri, 05 Nov 2010 11:21:57 +0100, Alain Ketterlin wrote:
> I really like "indentation as structure" (code is more compact and
> clearer), but I really hate that it relies on me putting the right
> spaces at the right place.
Er what? You really like indentation as structure, but you don't like
Terry Reedy writes:
> If you add the normally redundant information in the form of explicit
> dedents (anything starting with '#' and distinguishable from normal
> comments), then it is not too hard to re-indent even after all indents
> have been removed.
I actually use such a trick in emacs, no
On Nov 5, 8:25 am, Terry Reedy wrote:
> On 11/4/2010 10:47 PM, Rustom Mody wrote:
>
> > As far as I am concerned python would not be python if its
> > indentation=structure went. However the original question -- mixing
> > tabs and spaces is bad -- has got lost in the flames. Do the most
> > die
On Nov 4, 9:47 pm, Rustom Mody wrote:
> However the original question -- mixing
> tabs and spaces is bad -- has got lost in the flames. Do the most
> die-hard python fanboys deny this?
Hey we need to get something strait right now... i am the only true
fanboy around here, all the others are pues
On 11/4/2010 10:47 PM, Rustom Mody wrote:
As far as I am concerned python would not be python if its
indentation=structure went. However the original question -- mixing
tabs and spaces is bad -- has got lost in the flames. Do the most
die-hard python fanboys deny this?
Of course not. Not mix
The real issue is not tabs/spaces vs braces but academic/scientific
orientation vs engineering/commercial needs.
Mostly these worlds are so far separated that no dialogue happens --
think C vs Pascal, Java vs Eiffel etc
The problem -- actually advantage -- is that Python straddles both worlds.
Mai
On 2010-11-04, Terry Reedy wrote:
> I am sorry you feel compelled to use a language you so dislike. Not our
> fault though.
I don't dislike it all that much. What I dislike is being told that the
problems don't exist.
> If you add the normally redundant information in the form of explicit
> d
On 2010-11-04, Grant Edwards wrote:
> It exists because so many people change whitespace intentionally in C
> source code because no two C programmers seem able to agree on how to
> format code. Diff -b allows you to attempt to ignore semantically
> null stylistic changes made by programmers.
I
On 2010-11-04, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2010-11-04, Seebs wrote:
>> On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
>>> Right. If you mangle spaces in Python or mangle braces in C then
>>> recovery becomes impossible. I don't think anyone is contesting that.
>>> What we question is the idea that someh
On 2010-11-04, Mark Wooding wrote:
> Tim Harig writes:
>
>> I use simple comments that are not effected by white space. I don't
>> waste my time trying to make comments look artistic. They are there
>> to convey information; not to look pretty. I really detest having to
>> edit other peoples c
On 11/4/2010 4:17 AM, Seebs wrote:
I am sorry you feel compelled to use a language you so dislike. Not our
fault though.
Other languages I use are mostly amenable to the development of tools
to automatically indent code. Makefiles and Python are the only two
exceptions...
If you add the no
On 2010-11-04, Seebs wrote:
> On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
>> Right. If you mangle spaces in Python or mangle braces in C then
>> recovery becomes impossible. I don't think anyone is contesting that.
>> What we question is the idea that somehow Python is special in this
>> regard. If
On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
> Right. If you mangle spaces in Python or mangle braces in C then
> recovery becomes impossible. I don't think anyone is contesting that.
> What we question is the idea that somehow Python is special in this
> regard. If you move files around in ways that
Tim Harig writes:
> I use simple comments that are not effected by white space. I don't
> waste my time trying to make comments look artistic. They are there
> to convey information; not to look pretty. I really detest having to
> edit other peoples comment formatting where you have to re-alig
On 2010-11-04, Mark Wooding wrote:
> Seebs writes:
>> Python's the only language I use where an obvious flaw, which is
>> repeatedly observed by everyone I know who uses the language, is
>> militantly and stridently defended by dismissing, insulting, and
>> attacking the character and motives of
On Thu, 4 Nov 2010 19:37:25 + (UTC)
Tim Harig wrote:
> On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
> You are the one who seems to be on a crusade against against braces. It
You totally misunderstand me. I am not on a crusade of any sort. I am
happy with Python and the number of other people wh
On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Nov 2010 17:55:55 + (UTC)
> Tim Harig wrote:
>> What Seebs is refering to is that it is difficult or impossible to
>> re-indent Python source automatically after the indent structure has been
>> broken (such as his email being converted to ht
On 2010-11-04, Mark Wooding wrote:
> Tim Harig writes:
> This is wishful thinking. Firstly, code written with a narrow
> indentation offset (e.g., two spaces) can take up an uncomfortable width
> when viewed with a wider offset.
I can accept that as a trade-off. People have different ideas abo
Tim Harig writes:
> So, your telling me that mixing tabs and spaces is considered a good
> practice in Haskell?
It doesn't seem to be a matter which is discussed much. I think Haskell
programmers are used to worrying their brains with far more complicated
things like wobbly[1] types.
> I would
On Thu, 4 Nov 2010 17:55:55 + (UTC)
Tim Harig wrote:
> What Seebs is refering to is that it is difficult or impossible to
> re-indent Python source automatically after the indent structure has been
> broken (such as his email being converted to html on the server or a web
Right. If you mangl
On 2010-11-04, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2010-11-04, Neil Cerutti wrote:
>> On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
* Not being able to write an auto-indenter, ever, because it
is by design theoretically impossible: Annoying.
>>>
>>> Right. And in C you can never write an auto-bracer
On 2010-11-04, MRAB wrote:
> On 04/11/2010 16:49, Mark Wooding wrote:
>> Seebs writes:
>>* I don't have many problems with tools trashing whitespace in Python
>> programs, though I have seen web forum software mangling
>> indentation; since this makes nontrivial chunks of almost any
On 2010-11-04, Neil Cerutti wrote:
> On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
Seebs Wrote:
>>> * Not being able to write an auto-indenter, ever, because it
>>> is by design theoretically impossible: Annoying.
>>
>> Right. And in C you can never write an auto-bracer for exactly
>> the same reason.
On 2010-11-04, Mark Wooding wrote:
> Tim Harig writes:
>
>> Python is the only language that I know that *needs* to specify tabs
>> versus spaces since it is the only language I know of which uses
>> whitespace formating as part of its syntax and structure.
>
> You need to get out more. Miranda,
On 11/4/2010 7:15 AM Neil Cerutti said...
The handsome ':' terminator of if/elif/if statements allows us to
omit a newline, conserving vertical space. This improves the
readability of certain constructs.
if x: print(x)
elif y: print(y)
else: print()
Analogously, x+=1;y=f(x);return
We don't h
On 04/11/2010 16:49, Mark Wooding wrote:
Seebs writes:
Python's the only language I use where an obvious flaw, which is
repeatedly observed by everyone I know who uses the language, is
militantly and stridently defended by dismissing, insulting, and
attacking the character and motives of anyon
On 2010-11-04, Neil Cerutti wrote:
> On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
>>> * Not being able to write an auto-indenter, ever, because it
>>> is by design theoretically impossible: Annoying.
>>
>> Right. And in C you can never write an auto-bracer for exactly
>> the same reason.
>
> It's not
On 2010-11-04, D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
>> * Not being able to write an auto-indenter, ever, because it
>> is by design theoretically impossible: Annoying.
>
> Right. And in C you can never write an auto-bracer for exactly
> the same reason.
It's not right, actually. Auto-indent is fairly easy i
1 - 100 of 196 matches
Mail list logo
