thus Timo Schoeler spake:
thus Stefan Olsson spake:
From: "Alexander Bochmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 2:29 PM
My guess is that especially (US-based) public companies don't want to
be seen associated with OpenBSD (by donating, for example), as they
fear damage to their
thus Stefan Olsson spake:
From: "Alexander Bochmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 2:29 PM
My guess is that especially (US-based) public companies don't want to
be seen associated with OpenBSD (by donating, for example), as they
fear damage to their business reputation from t
From: "Alexander Bochmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 2:29 PM
My guess is that especially (US-based) public companies
don't want to be seen associated with OpenBSD (by donating,
for example), as they fear damage to their business
reputation from that.
-Why? In what way wou
...on Sat, Mar 25, 2006 at 08:25:32AM +0100, Jurjen Oskam wrote:
> > There is no reason to provide funding from a business standpoint. What
> > does
> > the business gain?
> Does having a "business standpoint" require shutting off all common sense?
In todays world: Mostly. Modern businesses
On 2006-03-27 14:49:52 +0200, Hannah Schroeter wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 10:35:05AM -0700, Spruell, Darren-Perot wrote:
> >And a quick Google search reveals that this is a.) a dead horse, b.) already
> >in place:
>
> >http://mailman.theapt.org/listinfo/openbsd-newbies
>
> This should be re
Hello!
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 10:35:05AM -0700, Spruell, Darren-Perot wrote:
>And a quick Google search reveals that this is a.) a dead horse, b.) already
>in place:
>http://mailman.theapt.org/listinfo/openbsd-newbies
This should be referred to from http://www.openbsd.org/mail.html
Systematica
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 03:15:27PM -0800, Brian wrote:
> There is no reason to provide funding from a business standpoint. What does
> the business gain?
Does having a "business standpoint" require shutting off all common sense?
Everytime someone mentions things like "business decision" or "bus
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 03:15:27PM -0800, Brian wrote:
> I think
I doubt.
IMHO, this thread should die for now.
Byy CDs, donate, hack, clean up your refridgerator, whatever is
important for you.
Ciao,
Kili
"Copyright law is complex, OpenBSD policy is simple - OpenBSD strives to
maintain the spirit of the original Berkeley Unix copyrights."
This is the first sentence of this page: http://www.openbsd.org/policy.html
Can't people see how ridiculous is all that talk about "why don't we change
the licen
--- "Spruell, Darren-Perot" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Better approach. How about said companies belly up and support the group
> that enables them (in part) to enjoy the financial success they have?
Because there is no reason for them to. Here's what would happen:
1) license change comes ou
On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, Chet Uber wrote:
1. Read the damn FAQ's, newbies, and do a Google search on what you are
about to waste list bandwidth on. People on the project spend good time
getting this done for us.
2. Buy the CD, and quit bitching about it. For that matter be a good
neighbor and buy
Finally having to weight in:
I personally and my company has been buying at least 2 copies of each
release and t-shirts for as long as I can remember. The store folks
do a great job, and the one time they mixed up an order they sent me
a T-shirt and a nice reply. Theo and many others have w
James Mackinnon wrote:
If you do offer paypal for the stuff above, I will buy more frequently
as to do my part to help support the System I trust with my
systems/network security.
I will send a donation now as well as I can do that VIA paypal (won't be
large, but it will be a donation)
It'
ostings I can so I might
have missed some.
James Mackinnon
Devantec Solutions
- Original Message -
From: "Theo de Raadt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc:
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: openbsd and the money -solutions
I did no
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Why don't we have separate lists? One for general questions,
> and gently
> guiding new users to the FAQ and man pages? It can be all fuzzy and
> warm; a place for pleasantries. And a separate list for more
> experienced
> users that want to dwell in the lair of dr
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > That said, I think a wall of shame page on the OpenSSH site
> > might be a good idea: one listing all those big companies
> > mentioned that have never donated a dime. Negative PR might
> > result in more donations than managers receiving the minor
> > annoyance message
On Thu, Mar 23, 2006 at 08:17:42PM -0700, Theo de Raadt wrote:
> > http://www.digg.com/linux_unix/OpenBSD_needs_a_major_donor
> > http://bsd.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/03/21/1555243
> >
> > No one seems to care (unless donations have shot up and Theo, et. al.
> > haven't mentioned it)
>
> >Fr
On 3/24/06, Ryan Fox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> There is quite a conflict between the core developers that don't wish to
> spend their time nicely holding newbies' hands (frankly, I don't want
> them to spend their time on that either), and the touchy-feely people
> that think OpenBSD would pr
On 3/24/06, chefren <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Demand something like $50 a year for access to the ftp.openbsd.org now!!!
great idea. that's $50 from ibm, $50 from sun, $50 from redhat, and
$50 from apple. $200 sounds about right to cover all the expenses.
in case the project ends up using a l
Hi!
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 11:20:19AM -0500, Ryan Fox wrote:
>Why don't we have separate lists? One for general questions, and gently
>guiding new users to the FAQ and man pages? It can be all fuzzy and
>warm; a place for pleasantries. And a separate list for more experienced
>users that wan
On 2006/03/24 11:20, Ryan Fox wrote:
> Why don't we have separate lists? One for general questions, and gently
> guiding new users to the FAQ and man pages?
Like misc@ and http://mailman.theapt.org/listinfo/openbsd-newbies, you mean?
(I'm so sorry that I'm continuing this thread...)
There is quite a conflict between the core developers that don't wish to
spend their time nicely holding newbies' hands (frankly, I don't want
them to spend their time on that either), and the touchy-feely people
that think OpenBSD would progre
"Andris Delfino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Don't do that, that is extortion.
Well, it needn't be so severe. It could simply be an addition
to the users page ( http://www.openssh.org/users.html ) with
parenthetical notes such as:
( has donated to the project -- thank you. )
next to those
On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, mickey wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 06:43:27AM -0700, Diana Eichert wrote:
SNIP
> > Lot's of money flowing from the US Gov't Dept of Defense?
>
> and big companies...
sorry Mickey, but I've been involved with DOD & DOE ( and it's
predecessors) for almost 25 years.
UC get
--- Deanna Phillips <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> That said, I think a wall of shame page on the OpenSSH site
> might be a good idea: one listing all those big companies
> mentioned that have never donated a dime. Negative PR might
> result in more donations than managers receiving the minor
> an
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 06:43:27AM -0700, Diana Eichert wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, mickey wrote:
> SNAP
> > sorry dude but you are full of shit.
> > for example from history:
> > how do you think bsd was developped originally at the ucb?
> >
> > cu
> >
> > --
> > paranoic mickey (my em
Don't do that, that is extortion. If you don't want to make OpenBSD
free-as-in-freedom, but not free-as-in-beer; well, there is another
thing that might help. Companies will only donate if they gain
something, not just code, I'm talking about money.
I'm not a legal guy, but: isn't there a way to m
On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, mickey wrote:
SNAP
> sorry dude but you are full of shit.
> for example from history:
> how do you think bsd was developped originally at the ucb?
>
> cu
>
> --
> paranoic mickey (my employers have changed but, the name has
> remained)
Lot's of money flowing from th
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 10:10:36AM -0300, Andr?s Delfino wrote:
> As I have said before, BSD was the unique Unix-like operative system
> with a ISC-style license. That's why, IMHO, companies invested in it.
they supported it because they used it for their own product.
so what has changed in 'em no
On 03/24/06 13:54, Damien Miller wrote:
On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, chefren wrote:
Demand something like $50 a year for access to the ftp.openbsd.org now!!!
You are suggesting that we screw the people who have contributed by far
the most to OpenBSD and OpenSSH, individual users and small organisat
Ryan Flannery <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I really hate prolonging this thread, but I'm curious about the
> following... I've done quite bit of contract work around my area, and
> in most cases I've been able to implement OpenBSD for something.
> Whenever that's happened, I've always pushed for
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 09:36:01AM -0300, Andr?s Delfino wrote:
> It was the unique Unix-like OS with that licence. Right now, there are
> tons of other systems. Companies want to invest in Linux-based
> systems, because of marketing.
what are you smoking dude?
what unique?
there was not att unix
As I have said before, BSD was the unique Unix-like operative system
with a ISC-style license. That's why, IMHO, companies invested in it.
On 3/24/06, Damien Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, Andris Delfino wrote:
>
> > Please, stop wanting companies to support you. It doesn
On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, Andris Delfino wrote:
> Please, stop wanting companies to support you. It doesn't work that
> way. To develop an OS under a licence like the ISC has a big hole:
> funding. You can't just go: Hey, you use the implementation that I
> develop and give away for free, you should pa
On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, chefren wrote:
> Demand something like $50 a year for access to the ftp.openbsd.org now!!!
You are suggesting that we screw the people who have contributed by far
the most to OpenBSD and OpenSSH, individual users and small organisations.
Not a very bright idea.
-d
It was the unique Unix-like OS with that licence. Right now, there are
tons of other systems. Companies want to invest in Linux-based
systems, because of marketing.
On 3/24/06, mickey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 08:40:59AM -0300, Andr?s Delfino wrote:
> > Please, stop want
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 08:40:59AM -0300, Andr?s Delfino wrote:
> Please, stop wanting companies to support you. It doesn't work that
> way. To develop an OS under a licence like the ISC has a big hole:
> funding. You can't just go: Hey, you use the implementation that I
> develop and give away for
On 2006-03-24 12:10:37 +0100, chefren wrote:
> This is whining and it isn't very sure because you have no idea what
> alternatives for the free OpenSSH product would have cost.
They can happily use lsh.
Best
Martin
--
http://www.tm.oneiros.de
Please, stop wanting companies to support you. It doesn't work that
way. To develop an OS under a licence like the ISC has a big hole:
funding. You can't just go: Hey, you use the implementation that I
develop and give away for free, you should pay me!. If the pay you,
OK, if the don't, well, that'
On 03/24/06 04:17, Theo de Raadt wrote:
http://www.digg.com/linux_unix/OpenBSD_needs_a_major_donor
http://bsd.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/03/21/1555243
..
These donations from individuals are really great. The community is
great. Thanks a lot.
But we know this is the wrong way to fund O
On Thu, 23 Mar 2006, Paul Greene wrote:
> Just another idea. Start making the mega-companies like IBM, RedHat,
> etc pay a license fee for the use of OpenSSH. They save literally
> millions of dollars incorporating this into their own products, and
> don't give anything back to the project.
No, w
On Thu, 2006-03-23 at 23:00:50 -0500, Paul Greene proclaimed...
> Just another idea. Start making the mega-companies like IBM, RedHat, etc
> pay a license fee for the use of OpenSSH. They save literally millions
> of dollars incorporating this into their own products, and don't give
> anything
Just another idea. Start making the mega-companies like IBM, RedHat, etc
pay a license fee for the use of OpenSSH. They save literally millions
of dollars incorporating this into their own products, and don't give
anything back to the project.
They won't give anything financially without it be
correction: no one with a great deal of money seems to care. ;)
I've been following the thread, and once I saw it on slashdot I got
off my lazy
ass and donated what little I could right now (more to come, but on a
grad
student salary, I can't donate what companies can).
I really hate prolo
> http://www.digg.com/linux_unix/OpenBSD_needs_a_major_donor
> http://bsd.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/03/21/1555243
>
> No one seems to care (unless donations have shot up and Theo, et. al.
> haven't mentioned it)
>From what I see, we have received a mini flood of donations, which
means there
On 3/23/06, Edd Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Just an idea, but why not try to have this conversation linked to on
> slashdot / digg. There is huge traffic to these sites from the linux
> community, who all owe the OpenBSD developers for OpenSSH.
http://www.digg.com/linux_unix/Open
On 3/23/06, Edd Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Just an idea, but why not try to have this conversation linked to on
> slashdot / digg. There is huge traffic to these sites from the linux
> community, who all owe the OpenBSD developers for OpenSSH.
yeah, the last time we tried that, way back
On 3/23/06, Edd Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Just an idea, but why not try to have this conversation linked to on
> slashdot / digg. There is huge traffic to these sites from the linux
> community, who all owe the OpenBSD developers for OpenSSH.
>
Someone put it up on Slashdot Tue
Hi,
Just an idea, but why not try to have this conversation linked to on
slashdot / digg. There is huge traffic to these sites from the linux
community, who all owe the OpenBSD developers for OpenSSH.
Regards
Edd
Are you saying "we" can't propose anything better?
I did not mean to step on another sacred cow - I really only wanted to
suggest redirecting this thread toward workable solutions.
I don't know anything and I can prove it!
Theo de Raadt wrote:
I read that FTP is becoming far more popular
> I did not mean to step on another sacred cow - I really only wanted to
> suggest redirecting this thread toward workable solutions.
The problem is that many of the "workable solutions" people are
suggesting are completely ridiculous.
They are in the catagory of "Cater to me, the entire world i
Apologies if this hasn't already been covered on the lists somewhere.
Limit CD-ROM download availability and push for more CD sales.
Instead of offering hefty discounts to resellers, why not establish
trusted distribution points in different countries?
I would personally be happy to act as one
On Thu, 2006-03-23 at 22:27:10 +0100, chefren proclaimed...
> Sigh... Is it so difficult to try this for a period?
>
> I offer to do the administration.
Who the fuck are you? Nobody, that's who.
I don't trust some nobody to do the administration of the FTP server I
download from. Why would we t
your customers to buy the CDs
along with the project, with an explanation of what the project does.
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of chefren
Sent: Thu 3/23/2006 4:27 PM
To: misc@openbsd.org
Subject: Re: openbsd and the money -solutions
On 03/23/06 20:52, Dan
I fail to see why there aren't at least 2000
people/organizations/OS's/OS projects willing to donate at a dollar a
day. That should give the projects what they need to evolve at a
healthy pace.
~5,000/mo for power, internet connection, and other overhead
~25,000/mo for hackathons
~10,000/mo for h
On 03/23/06 22:11, Theo de Raadt wrote:
We can't.
What's difficult with pointing ftp.openbsd.org to a new server that's
a mirror of the current ftp.openbsd.org server?
Why can you point us again and again to the place where we "should"
buy CD's while we want to be pointed to a the place w
On 03/23/06 20:52, Daniel E. Hassler wrote:
I read that FTP is becoming far more popular than CDROMs as a means
of obtaining OpenBSD. If this is because it's more convenient (vs. folks
just being too cheap) then it might make sense to sell downloadable
official (copyright Theo de Raadt) ISO
> I read that FTP is becoming far more popular than CDROMs as a means
> of obtaining OpenBSD. If this is because it's more convenient (vs. folks
> just being too cheap) then it might make sense to sell downloadable
> official (copyright Theo de Raadt) ISO images of releases as well as
> CD
I read that FTP is becoming far more popular than CDROMs as a means
of obtaining OpenBSD. If this is because it's more convenient (vs. folks
just being too cheap) then it might make sense to sell downloadable
official (copyright Theo de Raadt) ISO images of releases as well as
CDROMs. Yes,
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