[gentoo-dev] Re: minimalistic emerge

Igor posted on Fri, 08 Aug 2014 17:12:27 +0400 as excerpted: > About 60% of all the packages are installed and work with nodep flag > without any problems for years. Most of the maintainers just depend on > new packages not knowing if it's necessary or not resulting in a really > HUGE update that

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 4:16 PM, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: > I don't think we have any sort of tree-wide policy on this either, do > we? Although I believe common sense says it's a good idea (and i hope > most devs do this) to put a minver on a dependency atom if there was > any ebuild with an older

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On 9 August 2014 09:39, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: > *AND* (just to tie this back) it's unlikely that this is going to > actually help the original issue posted, ie, reducing the amount of > dependency updates being done "unnecessarily" on a system, or making > blind/automated system updates (of the

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 08/08/14 05:33 PM, Kent Fredric wrote: > [ Snip! ] - Somebody has to implement this technology - That > requires time and effort - People have to be convinced of its > value - Integration must happen at some level somehow somewhere in > the portag

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On 9 August 2014 08:52, Igor wrote: > Hello Kent, > > Friday, August 8, 2014, 9:29:54 PM, you wrote: > > But it's possible to fix many problems even now! > > What would you tell if something VERY simple is implemented like - > reporting > every emerge failed due to slot conflict back home with d

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Am Freitag 08 August 2014, 17:12:27 schrieb Igor: > Hi, > > About 60% of all the packages are installed and work with nodep flag > without any problems for years. Most of the maintainers just depend on new > packages not knowing if it's necessary or not resulting in a really HUGE > update that in

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Hello Kent, Friday, August 8, 2014, 9:29:54 PM, you wrote: But it's possible to fix many problems even now! What would you tell if something VERY simple is implemented like - reporting every emerge failed due to slot conflict back home with details for inspection? If maintainers had that kind

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 08/08/14 03:56 PM, Kent Fredric wrote: > > On 9 August 2014 07:34, Peter Stuge > wrote: > > ebuilds often (for me) have artificial dependencies, when the > actual version required is too old to be in the tree, but maybe n

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On 9 August 2014 07:34, Peter Stuge wrote: > ebuilds often (for me) have artificial dependencies, when the actual > version required is too old to be in the tree, but maybe not too old > to be installed on an existing system. > The inverse is also true, sometimes you see people go: "Well, upst

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 08/08/14 03:34 PM, Peter Stuge wrote: > Kent Fredric wrote: >> dependencies are forward specifications from upstream telling us >> what their software needs to function properly. > > Unfortunately that's not the full story. :\ > > ebuilds often

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Kent Fredric wrote: > dependencies are forward specifications from upstream telling > us what their software needs to function properly. Unfortunately that's not the full story. :\ ebuilds often (for me) have artificial dependencies, when the actual version required is too old to be in the tree,

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On Fri, 2014-08-08 at 21:26 +0400, Igor wrote: > Hello Homer, > > Friday, August 8, 2014, 8:40:20 PM, you wrote: > > >> I know no server that is automatically updated with -uDNav @world > >> and works for more than 6 months. > > > I would never auto-update.. That said, I installed this

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 08/08/14 12:27 PM, Igor wrote: > Hello Ian, > > Friday, August 8, 2014, 7:45:56 PM, you wrote: > > > *> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- >> Hash: SHA256 > >> Igor - you need to read the emerge man page. > >> "emerge -uDNav @world" is the re

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On 9 August 2014 04:58, Igor wrote: > Maintainers have no feedback from their ebuilds, they all do their best > but there are no tools > to formalize their work. No compass. They have no access to user > space where the packages are installed, unaware how users are using their > ebuilds. It's the

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Hello Homer, Friday, August 8, 2014, 8:40:20 PM, you wrote: >> I know no server that is automatically updated with -uDNav @world >> and works for more than 6 months. > I would never auto-update.. That said, I installed this system in > 2005. >> I can't keep a single system functional

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Kent, Friday, August 8, 2014, 7:51:22 PM, you wrote: There's no way to communicate to a user what you will and will not do with the software, so its impossible to know what flaws you will and won't encounter, so the dependencies thus declare a minimum for expected working behaviour for *all*

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On Fri, 2014-08-08 at 20:27 +0400, Igor wrote: > I know no server that is automatically updated with -uDNav @world > and works for more than 6 months. I would never auto-update.. That said, I installed this system in 2005. > I can't keep a single system functional with auto-updates for

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 11:45 AM, Ian Stakenvicius wrote: > However, if you don't want to do this, just "emerge -u > @world" -- that will only update packages in your world file, and will > only force dependency updates when the new version is required (based > on minimum versions in package depend

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Hello Ian, Friday, August 8, 2014, 7:45:56 PM, you wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA256 > Igor - you need to read the emerge man page. > "emerge -uDNav @world" is the recommended way to update your system, > because then you will stay in sync with all appropriate updates

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Hello hasufell, Friday, August 8, 2014, 7:36:24 PM, you wrote: >>> cave resolve --lazy :P >> A great option name :-) I liked it. Wish it were there. > It is. Thanks! I'll give cave a try. Never used it before. -- Best regards, Igormailto:lanthrus...@gmail.co

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On 9 August 2014 01:12, Igor wrote: > Most of the maintainers just depend on new > packages not knowing if it's necessary or not resulting in a really HUGE > update that in the absolute majority of cases destabilize GENTOO making it > not operational and WORSE than it was before. You then STABILI

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Igor - you need to read the emerge man page. "emerge -uDNav @world" is the recommended way to update your system, because then you will stay in sync with all appropriate updates in the portage tree. However, if you don't want to do this, just "emer

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Igor: > Hello Ciaran, > > Friday, August 8, 2014, 5:22:03 PM, you wrote: > >>> get the result - install the application you need, leaving everything >>> else AS IS untouched and stable? > >> cave resolve --lazy :P > > A great option name :-) I liked it. Wish it were there. > It is.

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Hello Ciaran, Friday, August 8, 2014, 5:22:03 PM, you wrote: >> get the result - install the application you need, leaving everything >> else AS IS untouched and stable? > cave resolve --lazy :P A great option name :-) I liked it. Wish it were there. Updating only the minimum necessary packag

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On 08/08/2014 15:32, Jeroen Roovers wrote: >> If no such USE flag, what about stabilize >> > gentoo with STABILIZED flag implementation in make.conf? > Next time, please bother the gentoo-user@ mailing list. No, please don't. -- Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On Fri, 8 Aug 2014 17:12:27 +0400 Igor wrote: > About 60% of all the packages are installed and work with nodep flag > without any problems for years. Most of the maintainers just depend > on new packages not knowing if it's necessary or not resulting in a > really HUGE update that in the absolu

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Igor: > Hi, > > About 60% of all the packages are installed and work with nodep flag > without any problems for years. Most of the maintainers just depend on new > packages not knowing if it's necessary or not resulting in a really HUGE > update that in the absolute majority of cases destabiliz

Re: [gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

On Fri, 8 Aug 2014 17:12:27 +0400 Igor wrote: > Is there any option in emerge to pull MINIMUM packages to > get the result - install the application you need, leaving everything > else AS IS untouched and stable? cave resolve --lazy :P -- Ciaran McCreesh signature.asc Description: PGP signat

[gentoo-dev] minimalistic emerge

Hi, About 60% of all the packages are installed and work with nodep flag without any problems for years. Most of the maintainers just depend on new packages not knowing if it's necessary or not resulting in a really HUGE update that in the absolute majority of cases destabilize GENTOO making it

Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Repoman check and QA policy for slot deps/operator

Duncan wrote: > (Hmm... my client's warning says I'm not verbose enough, too much quoted > text for my reply. /That/ doesn't happen very often! After adding this > note it's the "continue anyway" button. =:^) Here is a friendly reminder for everyone; Please remove more quoted text. Full-quote