On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 10:45 AM, Andreas Kolbe wrote:
>
> If you want to make a valid counterargument, say that you are worried that
> some censorious
> ISPs and countries might use our category definitions as a starting point
> for a bolt-on
> censorship system that restricts access to these ima
On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 9:58 AM, Theo10011 wrote:
> Hiya Bishakha
>
> > On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:54 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
> >
> I have said, it is a matter of perspective how you view them. But if we go
> by the assumption that editorial judgement is a separate thing, whose job
> is
> it to exer
On Sat, Oct 01, 2011 at 02:46:52AM +0200, Bjoern Hoehrmann wrote:
> Hi,
>
> A while ago I made a bookmarklet that blurs images in articles on the
> english Wikipedia and reveals them when the user hovers over the image.
> I now had a chance to test this as a skin.js extension.
Constructive solu
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 08:47:43PM +0530, Bishakha Datta wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 4:04 PM, Lodewijk wrote:
> "24,023 people responded to that question, with 23,754 selecting a number on
> the scale. The result was mildly in favour of the filter, with an average
> response of 5.7 and a medi
Bjoern Hoehrmann wrote:
> Hi,
>
> A while ago I made a bookmarklet that blurs images in articles on
> the english Wikipedia and reveals them when the user hovers over the
> image. I now had a chance to test this as a skin.js extension.
For a start, users would have to opt in to this, which may n
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 08:36:43PM +0530, Bishakha Datta wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 4:04 PM, Lodewijk wrote:
> **I am also dismayed at the use of the word 'censorship' in the context of a
> software feature that does not ban or block any images. But somehow there
> doesn't seem to be any othe
--- On Sat, 1/10/11, Theo10011 wrote:
From: Theo10011
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Blog from Sue about censorship, editorial
judgement, and image filters
To: "Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List"
Date: Saturday, 1 October, 2011, 1:58
> We're not suggesting that as far as I know. Nothing is bein
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 09:10:37PM +0200, Andre Engels wrote:
>
> No, we won't be. We will be putting certain categories/tags/classifications
> on images, but it will still be the readers themselves who decide whether or
> not they see the tagged images.
Well, those tags would be public, so *anyo
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 04:12:37PM +0200, Milos Rancic wrote:
> Up to now, all females from US (four of them) are in favor of filter
> (though, Sarah just tactically) and the only one not from US
> (Brazil/Portugal) is against.
This is not entirely true. At least one other .us female is against.
(
Hiya Bishakha
On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 2:20 AM, Bishakha Datta wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:54 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
>
> >
> > Bishakha, call it editorial-content, call it censorship or any other
> > euphemism - at the heart of it, it is deciding what someone gets to see
> and
> > what not.
On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 05:56:02PM -0700, phoebe ayers wrote:
> For heaven's sake. This is the worst kind of cutting and pasting to
> make a point I have seen in ages (Kim's experiments
> notwithstanding)...
:-( That was labelled, and disproved a very specific argument people were
making :-/
I
Hi,
A while ago I made a bookmarklet that blurs images in articles on the
english Wikipedia and reveals them when the user hovers over the image.
I now had a chance to test this as a skin.js extension.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:BlurredImages/vector.js
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Us
I wrote:
> And for a hypothetical "nudity" category, we'll have to decide what
> constitutes "nudity." This will trigger endless debate, and whatever
> definition prevails will fail to jibe that held by a large number of
> readers.
The above should read "jibe _with_ that held by a large number o
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 5:56 PM, Milos Rancic wrote:
>
> I wanted to say the same. Hm. I'll talk with others from my
> organization and see is it possible to mobilize a couple of European
> feminist organizations to work on those articles.
>
>
These are the types of discussions we frequently have
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 21:12, David Gerard wrote:
> On 30 September 2011 20:04, Michael Snow wrote:
>> On this score, it seems likely that we are failing to live up to one of
>> our core principles, that of neutrality. I think we need significantly
>> better editorial judgment applied to many of
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:54 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
>
> Bishakha, call it editorial-content, call it censorship or any other
> euphemism - at the heart of it, it is deciding what someone gets to see and
> what not.
Theo: they are different things, and given the premium on accuracy and
precision
André Engels wrote:
> We will be putting certain categories/tags/classifications on images,
> but it will still be the readers themselves who decide whether or not
> they see the tagged images.
But _we_ will need to determine the categories/tags/classifications to
use and the images to which they
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 2:14 PM, Thomas Dalton wrote:
> On 30 September 2011 18:24, Theo10011 wrote:
>> Bishakha, call it editorial-content, call it censorship or any other
>> euphemism - at the heart of it, it is deciding what someone gets to see and
>> what not.
>
> That is just completely untr
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 21:01, David Gerard wrote:
> http://www.berlios.de/
>
> Is there anything we could do to help? Is this too far outside our area?
>
> I recall how useful and helpful BerliOS was back in the olden days
> when it was Wikipedia's downtime backup and news source ... before
> Wik
This is work for ARCHIVE TEAM http://archiveteam.org/index.php?title=BerliOS
2011/9/30 David Gerard
> http://www.berlios.de/
>
> Is there anything we could do to help? Is this too far outside our area?
>
> I recall how useful and helpful BerliOS was back in the olden days
> when it was Wikipedia
On 30 September 2011 20:04, Michael Snow wrote:
> On this score, it seems likely that we are failing to live up to one of
> our core principles, that of neutrality. I think we need significantly
> better editorial judgment applied to many of these articles to address
> it. That will be a challeng
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 8:41 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
> > That is just completely untrue. The image filter will allow people to
> > choose what to see and what not to see. We won't be making the
> > decisions...
> >
>
>
> Actually, "we" will be. Depending upon how such a system is implemented, it
>
On 9/30/2011 8:53 AM, Milos Rancic wrote:
> As mentioned in some of the previous posts, I think that it is
> much more feminist to defend right of girls to be sexually educated,
> even if it would mean secretly browsing Wikipedia articles on
> sexuality, than to insist on comfort of adult females i
http://www.berlios.de/
Is there anything we could do to help? Is this too far outside our area?
I recall how useful and helpful BerliOS was back in the olden days
when it was Wikipedia's downtime backup and news source ... before
Wikipedia going down knocked over BerliOS too.
- d.
On 30 September 2011 19:41, Theo10011 wrote:
> Then, there also Kim's challenge to break such a filtering system.
Kim doesn't need to do a damn thing. There are enough *actual* trolls
on the Internet to mess with it just for the lulz.
- d.
___
foun
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:44 PM, Thomas Dalton wrote:
> On 30 September 2011 18:24, Theo10011 wrote:
> > Bishakha, call it editorial-content, call it censorship or any other
> > euphemism - at the heart of it, it is deciding what someone gets to see
> and
> > what not.
>
> That is just completel
On Friday 30 September 2011 11:47 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:31 PM, Achal Prabhalawrote:
>
>>
>> On Friday 30 September 2011 11:19 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
>>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:14 PM, Achal Prabhala>> wrote:
>>>
>>> How about an encyclopedia? Anywhere?
>>>
>>> Are you
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:31 PM, Achal Prabhala wrote:
>
>
> On Friday 30 September 2011 11:19 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
> > On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:14 PM, Achal Prabhala >wrote:
> >
> > How about an encyclopedia? Anywhere?
> >
> > Are you suggesting a rating system for an encyclopedia?
>
> No.
>
>
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 19:59, Sue Gardner wrote:
> I just want to point out quickly that I am not American, and my
> position on all these issues is actually a very Canadian one. Ray and
> Risker and other Canadians will recognize this.
>
> Canada doesn't really feel itself to have a fixed nation
On 30 September 2011 18:24, Theo10011 wrote:
> Bishakha, call it editorial-content, call it censorship or any other
> euphemism - at the heart of it, it is deciding what someone gets to see and
> what not.
That is just completely untrue. The image filter will allow people to
choose what to see an
On Friday 30 September 2011 11:19 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:14 PM, Achal Prabhalawrote:
>
>>
>> On Friday 30 September 2011 10:54 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
>>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:21 PM, Bishakha Datta>> wrote:
>>>
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Milos Rancic
>>
On 30 September 2011 09:15, Milos Rancic wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:24, Risker wrote:
>> Milos, I believe this is exactly the kind of post that Sue was talking about
>> in her blog. It is aggressive, it is alienating, and it is intimidating to
>> others who may have useful and progressiv
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:14 PM, Achal Prabhala wrote:
>
>
> On Friday 30 September 2011 10:54 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
> > On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:21 PM, Bishakha Datta >wrote:
> >
> >> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Milos Rancic
> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:24, Risker wrote
On Friday 30 September 2011 10:54 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:21 PM, Bishakha
> Dattawrote:
>
>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Milos Rancic wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:24, Risker wrote:
Milos, I believe this is exactly the kind of post that Sue was ta
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 18:07, Sarah Stierch wrote:
> Uh, ok. I'm pansexual and I like pornography. I'm also a feminist (I believe
> in equality). I'm also tired of being accused of being a prudish American
> because I think it's stupid that we have to have a mediocre photograph of a
> naked woman
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:21 PM, Bishakha Datta wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Milos Rancic wrote:
>
> > On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:24, Risker wrote:
> > > Milos, I believe this is exactly the kind of post that Sue was talking
> > about
> > > in her blog. It is aggressive, it is alie
http://wikitrekk.blogspot.com/2011/09/out-of-blue.html
- d.
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I would prefer to read these comments in context and not in snippets.
Can you point me to the corresponding discussion(s)?
-- Niabot
Am 30.09.2011 19:02, schrieb Andreas Kolbe:
> Tobias, you be the judge whether I misunderstood my fellow Wikipedians'
> comments. Here are some verbatim quotes, f
Tobias, you be the judge whether I misunderstood my fellow Wikipedians'
comments. Here are some verbatim quotes, from different contributors:
"How exactly would you propose to get an appropriately licensed video of a
rape? [...] I suppose, in the unlikely even that we were to get a video that
w
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 12:41 PM, Theo10011 wrote:
>
> I have no idea about your personal stance, but correct me if I am wrong.
> Weren't you the one surprised to find an "in your face photo
> of a vagina" on an article about Vagina? You know where you said it was
> up-front and at the top unlike
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 18:46, Risker wrote:
> Do you have any reason to believe that a statistically significant number
> and percentage of female editors of the German Wikipedia are active
> participants in this mailing list?
No, but there are German Wikipedians who could research that issue.
On 30 September 2011 12:06, Tobias Oelgarte
wrote:
> Am 30.09.2011 17:49, schrieb Andreas Kolbe:
> > --- On Fri, 30/9/11, Ryan Kaldari wrote:
> >
> > From: Ryan Kaldari
> > Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Blog from Sue about censorship, editorial
> judgement, and image filters
> > To: foundation-l@li
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Milos Rancic wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:24, Risker wrote:
> > Milos, I believe this is exactly the kind of post that Sue was talking
> about
> > in her blog. It is aggressive, it is alienating, and it is intimidating
> to
> > others who may have useful a
On 30 September 2011 12:32, Milos Rancic wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 18:29, Risker wrote:
> > I think there is much that can be discussed on the range of topic areas
> > covered in this thread. But we must keep in mind that the views expressed
> > here are those of the individuals, and ther
I do think that one needs to have spent some time in Germany to understand that
things *are* different there. Nudity is no big deal. To give some examples,
municipal
swimming pools may have times set aside for nude bathing. They may have mixed
saunas,
or changing rooms used by females, males,
Hi Sarah
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 9:37 PM, Sarah Stierch wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:53 AM, Milos Rancic wrote:
>
> >
> > As a member of one feminist organization, I understand dominant
> > position among feminists toward pornography. It's generally personal
> > (thus, not an ideological
On 30 September 2011 03:47, WereSpielChequers
wrote:
> Re David's point that "The trouble with responding on the blog is that
> responses seem to be being arbitrarily filtered". I can relate to that, it
> isn't just an annoying delay, there are posts which have gone up with
> timestamps long after
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 18:29, Risker wrote:
> I think there is much that can be discussed on the range of topic areas
> covered in this thread. But we must keep in mind that the views expressed
> here are those of the individuals, and there is absolutely insufficient
> information for any of us t
On 30 September 2011 12:15, Milos Rancic wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:24, Risker wrote:
> > Milos, I believe this is exactly the kind of post that Sue was talking
> about
> > in her blog. It is aggressive, it is alienating, and it is intimidating
> to
> > others who may have useful and pr
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:24, Risker wrote:
> Milos, I believe this is exactly the kind of post that Sue was talking about
> in her blog. It is aggressive, it is alienating, and it is intimidating to
> others who may have useful and progressive ideas but are repeatedly seeing
> the opinions of ot
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:53 AM, Milos Rancic wrote:
>
> As a member of one feminist organization, I understand dominant
> position among feminists toward pornography. It's generally personal
> (thus, not an ideological position), but as the main stream
> pornography is male-centric and historic
Am 30.09.2011 17:49, schrieb Andreas Kolbe:
> --- On Fri, 30/9/11, Ryan Kaldari wrote:
>
> From: Ryan Kaldari
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Blog from Sue about censorship, editorial
> judgement, and image filters
> To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Date: Friday, 30 September, 2011, 0:28
>
>
I was on Commons and stumbled across a photograph of a man cumming onto a
cracker and then eating it. Turns out this is called a "soggy biscuit." You
learn something new everyday.
In the heat of annoyance about "WP:NOTCENSORED" cries, I decided to add the
image of the guy eating his cum drenched b
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 16:23, Sarah Stierch wrote:
>> One more, but forgot her name and too lazy to search. German females
>> in discussion on German Wikipedia should be also checked.
>>
>> Up to now, all females from US (four of them) are in favor of filter
>> (though, Sarah just tactically) and
I must confess I completely fail to understand how the discussions in this
thread, especially the last several dozens or so posts, advance our
mission.
Cheers
Yaroslav
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--- On Fri, 30/9/11, Ryan Kaldari wrote:
From: Ryan Kaldari
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Blog from Sue about censorship, editorial
judgement, and image filters
To: foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Date: Friday, 30 September, 2011, 0:28
On 9/28/11 11:30 PM, David Gerard wrote:
> This post appea
On 30 September 2011 13:40, Jussi-Ville Heiskanen wrote:
> First attempt at labeling content was made by Uwe Kils, and his class
> of students collectively logging as Vikings or something of the sort
> tagged content not suitable for teenst. Jimbo banned them, but an
> accomodation was made where
Am 30.09.2011 17:06, schrieb Bishakha Datta:
> ...
> **I am also dismayed at the use of the word 'censorship' in the context of a
> software feature that does not ban or block any images. But somehow there
> doesn't seem to be any other paradigm or language to turn to, and this is
> what is used as
On 30 September 2011 17:17, Bishakha Datta wrote:
> As per Sue's report to the Board, which Erik referred to [1]:
> "The referendum did not directly ask whether respondents supported the idea
> of the filter. It did ask this question:
>
> *On a scale of 0 to 10, if 0 is strongly opposed, 5 is neu
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 11:15 AM, Risker wrote:
>
> I have to respectfully disagree with you on this point, Nathan. The blog
> post was about two basic issues:
>
> *How Wiki[mp]edians are interacting with each other , and
>
> *The role of editorial judgment in selecting which content is most
> edu
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 4:04 PM, Lodewijk wrote:
>
> Hoping for a constructive discussion and more data on what our 'readers'
> actually want and/or need...
>
> Also, while we don't have reader data, we do have more than 20,000 answers
to the referendum or survey or whatever it should accurately b
On 30 September 2011 10:36, Nathan wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:24 AM, Risker wrote:
> > On 30 September 2011 10:12, Milos Rancic wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >> Up to now, all females from US (four of them) are in favor of filter
> >> (though, Sarah just tactically) and the only one
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 4:04 PM, Lodewijk wrote:
> (not responding to anyone in particular) I'm one of the people who tried to
> participate in the discussion without taking a strong standpoint
> (intentionally - because I'm quite nuanced on the issue, and open for good
> arguments of either side)
Am 30.09.2011 16:46, schrieb Risker:
>> My question to you is why anyone would want to participate in a discussion
>> where their opinions are going to be classified by their sex or their
>> geographic location rather than their input.
There's absolutely no harm in coming to a finding that, say, 8
On 30 September 2011 10:44, Oliver Koslowski wrote:
> Am 30.09.2011 16:24, schrieb Risker:
> > The implication of your post is "if you're a woman from
> > the US, your opinion is invalid". Your post here did not further the
> > discussion in any way, and I politely ask you to refrain from making
Am 30.09.2011 16:24, schrieb Risker:
> The implication of your post is "if you're a woman from
> the US, your opinion is invalid". Your post here did not further the
> discussion in any way, and I politely ask you to refrain from making such
> posts in the future.
Weird. I've only seen a post where
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:24 AM, Risker wrote:
> On 30 September 2011 10:12, Milos Rancic wrote:
>
>>
>>
>
>
>> Up to now, all females from US (four of them) are in favor of filter
>> (though, Sarah just tactically) and the only one not from US
>> (Brazil/Portugal) is against.
>>
>
>
> Milos, I
On 30 September 2011 10:12, Milos Rancic wrote:
>
>
> Up to now, all females from US (four of them) are in favor of filter
> (though, Sarah just tactically) and the only one not from US
> (Brazil/Portugal) is against.
>
Milos, I believe this is exactly the kind of post that Sue was talking a
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Milos Rancic wrote:
>
>
> One more, but forgot her name and too lazy to search. German females
> in discussion on German Wikipedia should be also checked.
>
> Up to now, all females from US (four of them) are in favor of filter
> (though, Sarah just tactically) a
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 7:42 PM, Milos Rancic wrote:
> Up to now, all females from US (four of them) are in favor of filter
> (though, Sarah just tactically) and the only one not from US
> (Brazil/Portugal) is against.
>
> Hope we're not going to call this a poll. :)
Cheers
Bishakha
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 15:54, Sumana Harihareswara
wrote:
>> (As > example: the only 2 girls who commented here - phoebe and me - are in
>> opposite sides. ...)
> -*B?ria Lima*
>
> Technically, you, Sarah Stierch, Phoebe, and Sue have all commented --
> at least 4 women, not just 2.
One more, bu
> (As > example: the only 2 girls who commented here - phoebe and me - are in
> opposite sides. ...)
-*B?ria Lima*
Technically, you, Sarah Stierch, Phoebe, and Sue have all commented --
at least 4 women, not just 2.
--
Sumana Harihareswara
Volunteer Development Coordinator
Wikimedia Foundation
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 8:36 AM, MZMcBride wrote:
> Nathan wrote:
>> Erik, if you really want to change the focus of the debate, suggest to
>> Sue and the board that they make a commitment: that an image filter
>> won't be imposed on the projects against strong majority opposition in
>> the contri
Sorry if this is *too* condensed, but here is one summary of this issue...
First attempt at labeling content was made by Uwe Kils, and his class
of students collectively logging as Vikings or something of the sort
tagged content not suitable for teenst. Jimbo banned them, but an
accomodation was m
Nathan wrote:
> Erik, if you really want to change the focus of the debate, suggest to
> Sue and the board that they make a commitment: that an image filter
> won't be imposed on the projects against strong majority opposition in
> the contributing community. Then you can move on to the hard work o
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Nathan wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 4:44 AM, Erik Moeller wrote:
>
>> Overall, I think Sue's post was an effort to move the conversation
>> away from thinking of this issue purely in the terms of the debate as
>> it's taken place so far. I think that's a very
Erik Moeller wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 28, 2011 at 11:45 PM, David Gerard wrote:
>> The complete absence of mentioning the de:wp poll that was 85% against
>> any imposed filter is just *weird*.
>
> The intro and footer of Sue's post say: "The purpose of this post is
> not to talk specifically about th
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 4:44 AM, Erik Moeller wrote:
> Overall, I think Sue's post was an effort to move the conversation
> away from thinking of this issue purely in the terms of the debate as
> it's taken place so far. I think that's a very worthwhile thing to do.
> I would also point out that
Re David's point that "The trouble with responding on the blog is that
responses seem to be being arbitrarily filtered". I can relate to that, it
isn't just an annoying delay, there are posts which have gone up with
timestamps long after my post. I don't know whether that was me not knowing
how to
(not responding to anyone in particular) I'm one of the people who tried to
participate in the discussion without taking a strong standpoint
(intentionally - because I'm quite nuanced on the issue, and open for good
arguments of either side) and I have to fully agree with Ryan. I have yet
been unab
I'll go by pieces in your mail Erik.
*The intro and footer of Sue's post say: "The purpose of this post is not to
> talk specifically about the referendum results or the image hiding feature"
> (...) So it's perhaps not surprising that she doesn't mention the de.wp poll
> regarding the filter in a
On Wed, Sep 28, 2011 at 11:45 PM, David Gerard wrote:
> The complete absence of mentioning the de:wp poll that was 85% against
> any imposed filter is just *weird*.
The intro and footer of Sue's post say: "The purpose of this post is
not to talk specifically about the referendum results or the im
On 09/29/2011 04:37 PM, Dirk Franke wrote:
> For anybody interested: I wrote a blog-post full of disagreement :-)
>
> http://asinliberty.blogspot.com/2011/09/sorry-sue-gardner-but-image-filter.html
So basically, we find that there are two different, somewhat
incompatible definitions of Wikipedia:
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 4:53 AM, Liam Wyatt wrote:
> Scott, the director of rights and reproductions a the NPG kindly wrote
> directly back to me very quickly and said (quoting with permission):
> "We did, indeed, investigate immediately. I am expecting changes to be made,
> shortly."
>
> So, I
M. Williamson, 29/09/2011 22:45:
> ...and Nikerabbit removed it giving only the explanation: "not here, per
> Nikerabbit (would have already fixed the real issues if only somebody had
> told me)"
>
> It seems like he's saying that someone should've let him know about the
> autoselection issue, but
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