On 15/08/2015 00:19, James Powell wrote:
Slackware is maintained by 3 core people with extra help as needed. The
rest of the packages are pushed by the community at large contributing.
Devuan doesn't have to maintain every package possible. That's ludicrous
to think so.
Debian got in over its he
On 15/08/2015 05:38, Isaac Dunham wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 02:42:14PM +0200, Adam Borowski wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 02:02:22PM +0200, Didier Kryn wrote:
Seems to me there's something weird, both, in libreoffice depending on
just one single version of libstdc++, and in libklabxm
On 15/08/2015 05:57, T.J. Duchene wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2015 22:38:35 -0700
Isaac Dunham wrote:
To elaborate on this, GCC 5.1 (I think) has changed the ABI for C++11
support.
Packages using C++11 need to be rebuilt with the new library;
libreoffice has already been rebuilt, but not KDE.
Th
My $0.02...
Shims are not needed, or, in my viewpoint, wanted. You're still working with
systemd or pseudo-systemd and either way you see it, it's still systemd. While
the prospect of systemd-shim does allow to separate the API layer and logind
out from the core project, as uselessd allowed the
I reiinstalled (avoiding past missteps), to a console, and from it
installed xorg and fluxbox. I then ran xstart from console and all went
well.
With one exception. I'm in what looks like VGA mode with large crude
characters. It seems a problem (or symptom) is that installation did not
create a /e
I tried to install xfce4-power-manager which tried to pull in systemd.
Does it harm my new installation of DEVUAN to use apt pinning to block
packages like libsystemd0 and systemd?
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On 15/08/15 13:53, Edward Bartolo wrote:
I tried to install xfce4-power-manager which tried to pull in systemd.
Does it harm my new installation of DEVUAN to use apt pinning to block
packages like libsystemd0 and systemd?
Hello Edward,
Since months ago I always have /etc/apt/preferences.d/0
On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 05:15:44PM +1200, Daniel Reurich wrote:
> On 15/08/15 16:54, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> >On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 03:21:47PM +1200, Daniel Reurich wrote:
> >>On 15/08/15 14:47, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> >>
>
> Don't forget to do `update-initramfs -u -k all` and `update-grub`
After a clean install of devuan from the alpha2 iso using a USB stick
my system is running properly, with xfce and an unknown display manager.
The only packages I asked to install were ones from dselect in the installer,
and very few of those. Beyond the defaults, I asked
for xfce.
There does ap
I accidentally checked for systemd using aptitude on the wrong system.
There are actually a lot more systemd packages.
On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 08:58:46AM -0400, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> After a clean install of devuan from the alpha2 iso using a USB stick
> my system is running properly, with xfce an
Il 15/ago/2015 03:05 PM, "Hendrik Boom" ha scritto:
> There are still a few systemd-related packages iinstalled:
>
> libpam-systemd
> systemd
> systemd-shim
> libsystemd0
> Is this normal?
Yes (for now), and you can easily remove all of them, except libsystemd0,
with no issues
If you use the ver
On 15/08/15 14:39, Edward Bartolo wrote:
What is the purpose of:
Package: init
Pin: origin ""
Pin-Priority: -1
Thanks.
Hello Edward,
As far as I understood, the init package was developed to allow smoother
transition of Debian default init from sysvinit to systemd. As sysvinit
was an es
On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 03:33:31PM +0200, Anto wrote:
> On 15/08/15 14:39, Edward Bartolo wrote:
> >What is the purpose of:
> >
> >Package: init
> >Pin: origin ""
> >Pin-Priority: -1
>
> As far as I understood, the init package was developed to allow smoother
> transition of Debian default init fr
On 15/08/15 15:53, Edward Bartolo wrote:
So, init was transitional.
Thanks.
Yes. It was. But now it is an essential package in both Debian and
Devuan. I am not sure what is the purpose of that for Devuan. But
according to the discussion some time ago, it looks like it is to keep
the optio
On Fri, 8/14/15, Steve Litt wrote:
Subject: Re: [DNG] Systemd Shims
To: dng@lists.dyne.org
Date: Friday, August 14, 2015, 7:26 PM
On Fri, 14 Aug 2015 14:49:17 -0700
Go Linux wrote:
> On Fri, 8/14/15, T.J. Duchene wrote:
>
> Subject: Re: [DNG] Systemd Shims
> To: dng@lists.dyne.org
>
On Fri, 14 Aug 2015 22:25:06 -0700
Isaac Dunham wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 07:01:11AM -0400, Haines Brown wrote:
> > The aim is to boot to a console prompt, log in as root, install
> > xorg and fluxbox. That gives me X and a window manager but no
> > desktop environment. At present I get a
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 08:51:55 +0200
Didier Kryn wrote:
> Le 15/08/2015 02:26, Steve Litt a écrit :
> > On Fri, 14 Aug 2015 14:49:17 -0700
> > Go Linux wrote:
> >
> >> On Fri, 8/14/15, T.J. Duchene wrote:
> >>
> >> Subject: Re: [DNG] Systemd Shims
> >> To: dng@lists.dyne.org
> >> Date: Frid
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 07:43:04 -0400
Haines Brown wrote:
> I purged and reinstalled xorg without luck. Installed were
> libglu1-mesa, x11-apps, x11-session-utils, x11-server-utils, xinit,
> xorg, xorg-docs-core.
>
> The xorg log tells me that it is using as system configuration
> directory, /usr/
Simon Hobson writes:
> Rainer Weikusat wrote:
>
>> ClamAV claims to support FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, Solaris, OpenVMS,
>> Slackware and Windows, all of which certainly don't have systemd. I've
>> just cloned the current development repository and build it on Wheezy
>> using a plain
>>
>> ./conf
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 12:01:35 -0400
Steve Litt wrote:
Please, Steve, provide us with all you mentionned, as an
> > alternative to mainstream bloated/infected stuff. Since Devuan is
> > all about freedom, this is the place where to deliver to the world.
> > As soon as I can install Devuan on metal
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 10:13:56 +
Roger Leigh wrote:
er revision for 2017, and I think they are nuts.
>
> I don't. I write C++ code for my day job, and I'd have to say that
> these revisions make C++ better than ever to write. It's cleaner,
> simpler, and more maintainable. Just last week
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 10:02:12 +
Roger Leigh wrote:
> That's a considerable achievement--how many other projects have been
> able to achieve an equivalent scale?
Not very many and I agree with you, it is very impressive, even if
Debian makes internal bickering look commonplace. I'd say it is
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 03:15:50 -0700
James Powell wrote:
Hi Jim! =)
>
> To me, a shim is not the way. Sanitization is what is needed, and if
> that requires work, then question this, 'Will the work be worth it?'
> and to me the answer is a definable 'yes'.
I suppose there are some people like yo
T.J. Duchene wrote:
> I used Debian Sid recently, with the apparent ability to boot
> using either System 5 or Systemd via Grub. The choice seems clear to me
> that Devuan could minimize upsteam maintenance by looking at that.
The problem is not which init system to use - SystemD is not just an
On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 8:20 PM James Powell wrote:
> Slackware is maintained by 3 core people with extra help as needed. The
> rest of the packages are pushed by the community at large contributing.
> Devuan doesn't have to maintain every package possible. That's ludicrous to
> think so.
>
> Deb
On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 02:20:44PM -0500, T.J. Duchene wrote:
>
> Having a specifically defined base makes it easier for third parties to
> ensure that software is going to work without a hitch. It's much more
> attractive from a testing standpoint than the usual Linux hodge-podge. I
> think it i
On 15/08/2015 22:19, Stephanie Daugherty wrote:
They did, but out of all this design by committee, hidden between all
the political bullshit and bikeshedding, they also created the most
brilliant, most comprehensive set of standards for quality control,
package uniformity, license auditing, and o
Stephanie Daugherty wrote:
> They did, but out of all this design by committee, hidden between all the
> political bullshit and bikeshedding, they also created the most brilliant,
> most comprehensive set of standards for quality control, package uniformity,
> license auditing, and of course.
Simon Hobson writes:
> T.J. Duchene wrote:
>> I used Debian Sid recently, with the apparent ability to boot
>> using either System 5 or Systemd via Grub. The choice seems clear to me
>> that Devuan could minimize upsteam maintenance by looking at that.
>
> The problem is not which init system to
On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 11:54:06AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Fri, 14 Aug 2015 22:25:06 -0700
> Isaac Dunham wrote:
>
> > On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 07:01:11AM -0400, Haines Brown wrote:
> > > The aim is to boot to a console prompt, log in as root, install
> > > xorg and fluxbox. That gives me X
Le 15/08/2015 18:01, Steve Litt a écrit :
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 08:51:55 +0200
Didier Kryn wrote:
Le 15/08/2015 02:26, Steve Litt a écrit :
On Fri, 14 Aug 2015 14:49:17 -0700
Go Linux wrote:
On Fri, 8/14/15, T.J. Duchene wrote:
Subject: Re: [DNG] Systemd Shims
To: dng@lists.dyne.org
On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 07:43:04AM -0400, Haines Brown wrote:
> I reiinstalled (avoiding past missteps), to a console, and from it
> installed xorg and fluxbox. I then ran xstart from console and all went
> well.
>
> With one exception. I'm in what looks like VGA mode with large crude
> characters
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 20:19:03 +
Stephanie Daugherty wrote:
Hi, Stephanie! =)
> They did, but out of all this design by committee, hidden between all
> the political bullshit and bikeshedding, they also created the most
> brilliant, most comprehensive set of standards for quality control,
> pa
The lack of the last two: multiple versions and shell scripts are why
Debian derivatives cannot share packages, even though they use
identical base code.
Correction:
The lack of multiple versions and packahe shell scripts are why
Debian derivatives cannot share packages, even though they use
ide
I would be interested in
* No-dbus replacement for NetworkManager/Wicd
Are you thinking a C program?
daemon and user interface/GUI separation?
On 2015-08-15 18:01, Steve Litt wrote:
On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 08:51:55 +0200
Didier Kryn wrote:
Le 15/08/2015 02:26, Steve Litt a écrit :
> On Fri, 1
On Sat, 8/15/15, Simon Hobson wrote:
Subject: Re: [DNG] Devuan and upstream
To: "dng@lists.dyne.org"
Date: Saturday, August 15, 2015, 3:53 PM
Hendrik Boom wrote:
>> THe way I heard the story, in the ncient days when Apple was choosing
>> the k
On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 00:08:11 +0200
shraptor wrote:
> On 2015-08-15 18:01, Steve Litt wrote:
> >>
> >> Please, Steve, provide us with all you mentionned, as an
> >> alternative to mainstream bloated/infected stuff. Since Devuan is
> >> all about freedom, this is the place where to deliver
On 16 August 2015 7:47:46 AM GMT+12:00, "T.J. Duchene"
wrote:
>On Sat, 15 Aug 2015 03:15:50 -0700
>James Powell wrote:
>
>Hi Jim! =)
>
>>
>> To me, a shim is not the way. Sanitization is what is needed, and if
>> that requires work, then question this, 'Will the work be worth it?'
>> and to m
On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 06:19:23PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 00:08:11 +0200
> shraptor wrote:
> > I would be interested in
> >
> > * No-dbus replacement for NetworkManager/Wicd
> >
> > Are you thinking a C program?
>
> HECK no! There's no requirement for this program
On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 14:26:41 +1200
Daniel Reurich wrote:
> On 16 August 2015 7:47:46 AM GMT+12:00, "T.J. Duchene"
> wrote:
> >All that I ever try to say that I think there should be room for
> >both sorts to make Devuan a home. Yes, I think Devuan should have
> >systemd as an option, but only
>> I would be interested in
>>
>> * No-dbus replacement for NetworkManager/Wicd
>>
>> Are you thinking a C program?
>
> HECK no! There's no requirement for this program to be fast, and I want
> to make it easy on myself. Python probably, with the minimum Python
> addons, and only addons that ship
On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 07:37:16 +0300
Lars Noodén wrote:
>
> >> I would be interested in
> >>
> >> * No-dbus replacement for NetworkManager/Wicd
> >>
> >> Are you thinking a C program?
> >
> > HECK no! There's no requirement for this program to be fast, and I
> > want to make it easy on myself. Py
On 16/08/2015 06:53, Steve Litt wrote:
The toughest part is how to store the passwords in a way that isn't a
security problem.
Unfortunately, /etc/wpa_supplicant.conf doesn't have an include feature
(which is strange, because hostapd supports a wpa_psk_file option).
So you have to store the p
Systemd is not an option. Uselessd is an option, Runit is an option, s6 is an
option, OpenRC is an option. Why, because any of these are init/supervisor sane
replacements and/or extensions to sysvinit.
When you replace the underlying system core with a completely alien hypervisor,
you kill the
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