>Looking back the past, the precursor of systemd chaos was replacement of
>ALSA with pulseaudio that caused headache to many innocent users from
>Debian 6.0 to 7.0. I tried to use buggy pulseaudio for months but went
>back to ALSA.
You *can't* replace ALSA with pulseaudio, lower ALSA
API remains
Hi All,
My solution was a safe two step procedure:
i) restore sources from backup
ii) git pull to update the sources
The other solutions had more steps which could go wrong. In fact, I
tried two suggested procedures to recover the sources from the git
repository as suggested by Aitor. However, b
> On 19/12/2015, aitor_czr wrote:
> Hi Edward,
>
>
> On 12/19/2015 05:52 PM, Edward Bartolo wrote:
>> >The command:
>> >edbarx@edbarx-pc:~/netman_from_backup_08.12.2015$ git patch
>> >../rainer_dng-15.12.2015.patch
>
> The right command is this other one:
>
> $ git apply --stat ../rainer_dng-15
I've been lurking for a while, and I'm getting close to a decision
point. I have been using Debian for well over a decade, but Jessie
appears to be too unstable. The two machines I installed it on had
issues bad enough that I reverted to Wheezy (reformat/reinstall).
Thing is, I mainly deal in serv
Looking back the past, the precursor of systemd chaos was replacement of
ALSA with pulseaudio that caused headache to many innocent users from
Debian 6.0 to 7.0. I tried to use buggy pulseaudio for months but went
back to ALSA.
Systemd built-in Debian Jessie was a disaster.
How many users are
On Sat, 2015-12-19 at 12:02 +0100, John Hughes wrote:
> On 19/12/15 11:58, dev1fanboy wrote:
> > Gnome
> >
> > If you need more: apt-cache rdepends libsystemd0 | wc -l
> We're going round in circles. *I* posted that command:
>
> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20151218.143549.77d859b4.en
Dragan FOSS wrote:
> If the group is so weak, that one opponent may threaten it, then something is
> wrong with that group, right?
No.
As pointed out, the "discussion" has distracted people from the task in hand.
No-one here has to justify their desire to be systemd free to anyone - yet
that'
On 12/19/2015 07:33 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
They damage the group
If the group is so weak, that one opponent may threaten it, then
something is wrong with that group, right?
Be smarter, positive...expose arguments, not anger and "bans":)
Math is simple...troll is only one, group has many memb
On Sat, Dec 19, 2015 at 02:37:22PM +0100, aitor_czr wrote:
[cut]
>
> I agree, but tags are usefull.
>
>
> Here you are an example with linux-libre:
>
>
I have never said that tags are not useful. I have been using tags
since the first days of SVN, where tags where physical copies of
entire
+1
Please receive a virtual handshake.
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Hi Edward,
On 12/19/2015 05:52 PM, Edward Bartolo wrote:
Hi,
>
>I created a .patch file by copying and pasting the patch supplied by
>Rainer, read above. I have the fully restored and up to date netman
>sources, but I am not sure whether as typed below "git patch" should
>actually apply the pa
Hi all,
Here's a partial list of things I just don't do:
* I don't go into a Catholic church saying "Abortion isn't that bad."
* I don't go into an abortion rights group meeting saying "Bans on
abortion aren't that bad."
* I don't go into Linux venues saying "Linux is primitive compared to
On Sat, 19 Dec 2015 11:02:49 +
Rowland Penny wrote:
> Will somebody please do what debian does when somebody says systemd
> is bad on their mailing list -- Ban him!
>
> Rowland
Calling Don Armstrong. Calling Don Armstrong. Don, we need you!
:-)
SteveT
Steve Litt
November 2015 featured
Edward Bartolo writes:
> edbarx@edbarx-pc:~/netman_from_backup_08.12.2015$ git apply --check
> ../rainer_dng-15.12.2015.patch
> error: patch failed: Makefile:13
> error: Makefile: patch does not apply
> error: patch failed: debian/rules:2
> error: debian/rules: patch does not apply
>
>
> Checking
edbarx@edbarx-pc:~/netman_from_backup_08.12.2015$ git apply --check
../rainer_dng-15.12.2015.patch
error: patch failed: Makefile:13
error: Makefile: patch does not apply
error: patch failed: debian/rules:2
error: debian/rules: patch does not apply
Checking for patch applicability git states the p
On Sat, Dec 19, 2015 at 12:46:21PM +0100, John Hughes wrote:
> On 19/12/15 12:02, Rowland Penny wrote:
> >Look, you troll, If you 'apt-get remove systemd' on debian, it will
> >remove Gnome or Mate, I know I tried. Anything that does this, is
> >*BAD* in my books.
>
> You're doing it wrong.
>
> h
On Sat, 12/19/15, John Hughes wrote:
Subject: Re: [DNG] Our friendly community
To: dng@lists.dyne.org
Date: Saturday, December 19, 2015, 6:05 AM
On 19/12/15 12:54, Rowland Penny wrote:
> Firstly, *never* email me directly.
Sorry, pressed wrong button in crappy thunderbird interface.
--
It still answers your question, and you haven't responded to what I
said about gnome.
In the previous response you didn't reply to what I said about Devuan
not being *just* about systemd either.
I think you misunderstand me, I don't want to remove any part of
systemd. Can you show what I sai
On 12/19/2015 02:45 PM, John Hughes wrote:
And all the little no-systemd irritations are fixed? hibernation/suspend
and so on?
I don't know...you can try for yourself.. :)
BTW, I think that list of "little no-systemd irritations.." is much
shorter than list of systemd irritations ;)
Why is
On 19/12/15 14:34, Dragan FOSS wrote:
On 12/19/2015 01:05 PM, John Hughes wrote:
people who don't want to use systemd are forced into running broken
systems, so I would like to see useful work towards making it possible
to easily run alternatives to systemd.
You're obviously ignorant :)
Appa
Hi Katolaz,
On 12/19/2015 10:52 AM, KatolaZ wrote:
On Sat, Dec 19, 2015 at 08:09:39AM +0100, Edward Bartolo wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>Finally, I fully restored my local netman sources from a full system
>backup I made on the 8th December 2015. Updating was a matter of only
>deleting the netman/debian
On 12/19/2015 01:05 PM, John Hughes wrote:
people who don't want to use systemd are forced into running broken
systems, so I would like to see useful work towards making it possible
to easily run alternatives to systemd.
You're obviously ignorant :)
Rock-solid Debian-jessie-based system withou
John Hughes writes:
> On 18/12/15 15:50, Mitt Green wrote:
>>> It's a library whose sole purpose is to make sure that
>>> packages *don't* depend on
>>> systemd.
>> So, you are saying that libsystemd0 is harmless and it
>> doesn't mean anything unless you install systemd, systemd-sysv and so on?
>
On 19/12/15 12:47, KatolaZ wrote:
On Sat, Dec 19, 2015 at 11:02:49AM +, Rowland Penny wrote:
[cut]
Look, you troll, If you 'apt-get remove systemd' on debian, it will
remove Gnome or Mate, I know I tried. Anything that does this, is
*BAD* in my books.
It also removes cups and many other
Mitt Green wrote:
> Go Linux wrote:
>
>> Just a heads up. None of your emails are coming through. Not even in spam.
>> I >only know that you've posted when I see quotes in the responses. I have
>> a >yahoo address for this list and it has been a problem for me too.
>
> The same thing abou
On 19/12/15 12:54, Rowland Penny wrote:
On 19/12/15 11:45, John Hughes wrote:
On 19/12/15 12:02, Rowland Penny wrote:
Look, you troll, If you 'apt-get remove systemd' on debian, it will
remove Gnome or Mate, I know I tried. Anything that does this, is
*BAD* in my books.
You're doing it wro
Red Hat is Novell in 2010s.
Compare: both had deals with Microsoft,
both try to take control over Linux, controversial decisions of both
were and still are highly criticised in the community, both are companies
developing enterprise solutions. Let's see what Red Hat controls:
rpm, GNOME, NetworkMa
On 19/12/15 11:45, John Hughes wrote:
On 19/12/15 12:02, Rowland Penny wrote:
Look, you troll, If you 'apt-get remove systemd' on debian, it will
remove Gnome or Mate, I know I tried. Anything that does this, is
*BAD* in my books.
You're doing it wrong.
http://without-systemd.org/wiki/inde
On Sat, Dec 19, 2015 at 11:02:49AM +, Rowland Penny wrote:
[cut]
>
> Look, you troll, If you 'apt-get remove systemd' on debian, it will
> remove Gnome or Mate, I know I tried. Anything that does this, is
> *BAD* in my books.
>
It also removes cups and many other things, for that matter. W
On 19/12/15 12:02, Rowland Penny wrote:
Look, you troll, If you 'apt-get remove systemd' on debian, it will
remove Gnome or Mate, I know I tried. Anything that does this, is
*BAD* in my books.
You're doing it wrong.
http://without-systemd.org/wiki/index.php/How_to_remove_systemd_from_a_Debian
On 19/12/15 11:02, John Hughes wrote:
On 19/12/15 11:58, dev1fanboy wrote:
Gnome
If you need more: apt-cache rdepends libsystemd0 | wc -l
We're going round in circles. *I* posted that command:
https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20151218.143549.77d859b4.en.html
But you still haven't said
On 19/12/15 10:53, John Hughes wrote:
On 19/12/15 11:28, Rowland Penny wrote:
On 19/12/15 10:21, John Hughes wrote:
On 18/12/15 19:40, Steve Litt wrote:
most of [ JH's posts ] tended to say "libsystemd0 isn't that bad",
I don't think it's that bad, and, despite my asking nobody can tell
m
On 19/12/15 11:58, dev1fanboy wrote:
Gnome
If you need more: apt-cache rdepends libsystemd0 | wc -l
We're going round in circles. *I* posted that command:
https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20151218.143549.77d859b4.en.html
But you still haven't said *why* you want to remove libsystemd0.
Gnome
If you need more: apt-cache rdepends libsystemd0 | wc -l
On Saturday, December 19, 2015 10:45 AM, John Hughes
wrote:
On 19/12/15 11:40, dev1fanboy wrote:
You have to avoid many other packages to avoid systemd and in some
cases you will end up with systemd support that you don't
On 19/12/15 11:28, Rowland Penny wrote:
On 19/12/15 10:21, John Hughes wrote:
On 18/12/15 19:40, Steve Litt wrote:
most of [ JH's posts ] tended to say "libsystemd0 isn't that bad",
I don't think it's that bad, and, despite my asking nobody can tell
me why it is.
I will give you a good r
On 19/12/15 11:40, dev1fanboy wrote:
You have to avoid many other packages to avoid systemd and in some
cases you will end up with systemd support that you don't want anyway.
For example?
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Reading from devuan.org Devuan intends in the long term to try to
follow the UNIX philosophy of doing one thing and doing it well, so
it's not just about systemd.
You have to avoid many other packages to avoid systemd and in some
cases you will end up with systemd support that you don't want a
On 19/12/15 10:21, John Hughes wrote:
On 18/12/15 19:40, Steve Litt wrote:
On Fri, 18 Dec 2015 17:39:26 +0100
John Hughes wrote:
On 18/12/15 17:18, Mitt Green wrote:
No, the actual work on packages that remove libsystemd0 dependency.
I've done quite of it for my machine. Notable examples inc
On 18/12/15 15:50, Mitt Green wrote:
It's a library whose sole purpose is to make sure that
packages *don't* depend on
systemd.
So, you are saying that libsystemd0 is harmless and it
doesn't mean anything unless you install systemd, systemd-sysv and so on?
Exactly.
On 18/12/15 19:40, Steve Litt wrote:
On Fri, 18 Dec 2015 17:39:26 +0100
John Hughes wrote:
On 18/12/15 17:18, Mitt Green wrote:
No, the actual work on packages that remove libsystemd0 dependency.
I've done quite of it for my machine. Notable examples include
angband repositories apart from De
On Sat, Dec 19, 2015 at 08:09:39AM +0100, Edward Bartolo wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> Finally, I fully restored my local netman sources from a full system
> backup I made on the 8th December 2015. Updating was a matter of only
> deleting the netman/debian directory and using "git pull".
>
> My goal was a
Le 18/12/2015 17:39, John Hughes a écrit :
But why? What badness does libsystemd0 do?
It's poluting the depending packages, the repository, and apt
cache. And it can only be built from upstream systemd source, which
means it's imposed on you in some way, even if you don't want it.
On 15/12/2015, Rainer Weikusat wrote:
> Some more remarks on the packaging efforts so far: The rules file in the
> git repository is
>
> --
> #!/usr/bin/make -f
>
> %:
> dh $@ --with quilt,python2
>
> override_dh_auto_clean:
> dh_auto_clean
>
> override_dh_auto_configure:
>
On 18/12/15 19:02, Steve Litt wrote:
Yeah, in an ideal world, we'd like to remove every rotting vestige of
systemd, but in a practical world, where if we don't timely produce
something people can actually use, this has all been for naught,
removal is a process, where on the first go-around we rem
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