Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

Matthias Clasen (mcla...@redhat.com) said: > > BOOTUP > > - System boots successfully to GUI, when configured. > > - System boots successfully to text mode, when configured. > > - System properly handles being passed [1-5], 'single', 'S', 's', '-s', > > booting to the appropriate 'runlevel' (0 a

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:10 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > People like you and me would opt-in. (well I would on some hosts) because > we know what we're doing. Expert eyes get a look at it before it's forced > onto our users, who are already leaving in leaps and bounds. Thanks Mike (and Eric), f

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Mon, 2010-08-23 at 23:06 -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > This, however, is just packaging guidelines. From readng the thread, there > are many things that I think people would like covered with systemd before > they would feel comfortable with it. So, I'm going to attempt to quantify > what wou

Re: Fedora Notifications System.

On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 11:19 PM, Jon Masters wrote: > On Mon, 2010-08-23 at 11:54 -0400, Genes MailLists wrote: > > > Whatever we do please make it an option NOT to have any window splat > > on the screen anywhere - let it stay in the system tray and not > > interfere with my work. > > It get

Re: Git question

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Steve Dickson wrote: > On 08/24/2010 10:46 AM, M A Young wrote: >> On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Steve Dickson wrote: >> >>> Also, the kernel that is currently being built from my pnfs-13 branch >>> fails to install with the following error: >>> >>>FATAL: Could not load >>> /lib/m

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Adam Williamson wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:10 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > > > People like you and me would opt-in. (well I would on some hosts) because > > we know what we're doing. Expert eyes get a look at it before it's forced > > onto our users, who are already l

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 10:19:38 -0700 Adam Williamson wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:10 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > > > People like you and me would opt-in. (well I would on some hosts) > > because we know what we're doing. Expert eyes get a look at it > > before it's forced onto our users, w

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24.08.10 09:29, Michael Schwendt (mschwe...@gmail.com) wrote: > > On Mon, 23 Aug 2010 16:17:21 -0400, Matthew wrote: > > > Was there a conversation other than this FESCO meeting? > > > > >

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24.08.10 10:37, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > > On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 04:32:03PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > > So, I'm honestly asking: what are the odds that these few things are the > > > only improvements that cause a disruptive change to user interaction? I > > >

Re: Git question

On 08/24/2010 01:55 PM, M A Young wrote: > On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Steve Dickson wrote: > >> On 08/24/2010 10:46 AM, M A Young wrote: >>> On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Steve Dickson wrote: >>> Also, the kernel that is currently being built from my pnfs-13 branch fails to install with the following

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24.08.10 10:19, Adam Williamson (awill...@redhat.com) wrote: > > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:10 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > > > People like you and me would opt-in. (well I would on some hosts) because > > we know what we're doing. Expert eyes get a look at it before it's forced > > onto

Re: Git question

On 08/24/2010 02:08 PM, Steve Dickson wrote: > > > On 08/24/2010 01:55 PM, M A Young wrote: >> On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Steve Dickson wrote: >> >>> On 08/24/2010 10:46 AM, M A Young wrote: On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Steve Dickson wrote: > Also, the kernel that is currently being built from

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:00:01AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > Well, ironically enough, Lennart's last big revolution illustrates the > problem with that. PulseAudio - previously PolypAudio, remember - was > 'opt-in' for several releases; it was packaged in Fedora and many other > major distri

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24.08.10 12:56, Mike McGrath (mmcgr...@redhat.com) wrote: > > On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:10 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > > > > > People like you and me would opt-in. (well I would on some hosts) because > > > we know what we're doing. Exp

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 01:21:30PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Miroslav Lichvar (mlich...@redhat.com) said: > > On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 11:06:32PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > > SERVICE HANDLING > > > - Running 'chkconfig <(null)|on|off>' on a service managed by > > > systemd > > > wi

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24.08.10 20:14, Till Maas (opensou...@till.name) wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:00:01AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > Well, ironically enough, Lennart's last big revolution illustrates the > > problem with that. PulseAudio - previously PolypAudio, remember - was > > 'opt-in' fo

dist-f14-updates-testing tag/untag koji notices

You may have noticed notices landing in your mailbox today similar to: foo-1.0-2.fc14 successfully untagged from dist-f14-updates-testing by rdieter You should be able to safely ignore all those, as the mess I caused trying to clean up some koji tags got sorted out. My apologies. -- Rex _

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

seth vidal (skvi...@fedoraproject.org) said: > > > You mean 'being passed on the kernel cmdline', I assume ? > > > Do we consider interactive boot essential (I think not) ? > > > Should mention something about forced fsck, maybe. > > > What about selinux relabeling ? > > > > I can't remember inte

Re: New fedpkg build coming to an update repo near you!

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/24/10 2:10 AM, Jaroslav Skarvada wrote: > Thanks, but I have following problem: > > $ fedpkg co -B xterm > Cloning into bare repository /home/yarda/git-fedora/xterm/fedpkg.git... > remote: Counting objects: 657, done. > remote: Compressing object

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On 08/24/2010 04:18 AM, Tomasz Torcz wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:33:59AM -0400, Jeff Garzik wrote: >>> BOOTUP >>> - System properly handles being passed [1-5], 'single', 'S', 's', '-s', >>> booting to the appropriate 'runlevel' (0 and 6 can still work, >>> but they're sort of pointl

Re: git rebase OK on Fedora git branches?

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/24/10 6:43 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > Is it OK to use 'git rebase -i' to compress my mistakes together into > a single working Fedora git commit? (Provided I don't push things in > between or otherwise try to rewrite public history) > > I'm

Re: systemd and changes

On Mon, 23.08.10 20:04, Toshio Kuratomi (a.bad...@gmail.com) wrote: > On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 11:08:24PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > > On Mon, 23.08.10 13:59, Jesse Keating (jkeat...@j2solutions.net) wrote: > > > > > On 8/23/10 1:17 PM, Matthew Miller wrote: > > > > I understand your desir

Re: systemd and changes

Lennart Poettering (mzerq...@0pointer.de) said: > BTW, was there a written down policy on how to package Upstart > jobs/services? Yes. It was "Don't". (Specifically because issues like this weren't answered.) Bill -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.o

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 12:56:43PM -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Adam Williamson wrote: > > Again, Pulse/PolypAudio seems to suggest that this is not the case. Why > > didn't expert eyes who knew what they were doing migrate to that before > > it become default? Or, alternative

Re: drop default MTA for Fedora 15

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:37 -0400, Jon Masters wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:36 -0400, Matthias Clasen wrote: > > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:19 -0400, Jon Masters wrote: > > > > > > > > My previous objection was based on the precedent it sets. I don't want a > > > "Desktop" distribution in Fedo

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:20:16PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > Well, for different people different things appear more important. From > that you should not imply that one thing is useless and the other > isn't. I did not want to imply that PulseAudio is useless. I doubt that you would ha

Re: drop default MTA for Fedora 15

>> > > My previous objection was based on the precedent it sets. I don't want a >> > > "Desktop" distribution in Fedora. I want a server-usable distribution. >> > > Sure, it's just a dep and one can go install an MTA. But today it's >> > > killing the MTA, tomorrow it's removing something else that

a note on order of arguements to systemctl command

The service command has a syntax like this: service servicename action where as systemctl has a syntax like this: systemctl action servicename.service This is inconvienient for the common case where more than one action is performed in sequence on the same service, since with the first orderi

Re: dist-f14-updates-testing tag/untag koji notices

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 13:08:50 -0500, Rex wrote: > You may have noticed notices landing in your mailbox today similar to: > > foo-1.0-2.fc14 successfully untagged from dist-f14-updates-testing by > rdieter > > You should be able to safely ignore all those, as the mess I caused > trying to clean

Re: Python 3.2a1 in rawhide

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:37 AM, David Malcolm wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 09:10 -0500, Jeffrey Ollie wrote: >> >> One other issue I discovered was that I needed to suppress byte >> compiling during the install stage because it seemed that the python3 >> installer somehow was doing python2-sty

Re: systemd and changes

Till Maas (opensou...@till.name) said: > I did not want to imply that PulseAudio is useless. I doubt that you > would have implemented it, if you did not have any use for it. Probably > a lot of people who bought their soundcard without considering to buy > one capable of hardware mixing will also

Re: drop default MTA for Fedora 15

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:27, Michael Cronenworth wrote: > Paul Howarth wrote: >> I use "at" on a regular basis, to schedule large downloads and uploads >> when my ADSL bandwidth becomes unmetered after midnight. >> >> And I like getting the resulting email in the morning showing that all >> went

Re: dist-f14-updates-testing tag/untag koji notices

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 20:59:54 +0200, Michael wrote: > On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 13:08:50 -0500, Rex wrote: > > > You may have noticed notices landing in your mailbox today similar to: > > > > foo-1.0-2.fc14 successfully untagged from dist-f14-updates-testing by > > rdieter > > > > You should be able

Re: Fedora Notifications System.

Michal Hlavinka wrote: > disagree, have you seen your notifications after leaving your computer > alone for several hours with IM client connected (with whatever status)? > > You'll get tons of "User XY has changed status to: blah blah" Well, IMHO Kopete shouldn't spam notifications for this type

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:02:27PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Till Maas (opensou...@till.name) said: > > I did not want to imply that PulseAudio is useless. I doubt that you > > would have implemented it, if you did not have any use for it. Probably > > a lot of people who bought their soundc

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:11:58AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > > If we're still including upstart as a fallback option, I think it's > The intent is not to do so in the final release, AIUI. We're only > keeping it around during pre-release, so that if we decide we need to > fall back to upstart

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 9:20 PM, Till Maas wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:02:27PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: >> Till Maas (opensou...@till.name) said: >> > I did not want to imply that PulseAudio is useless. I doubt that you >> > would have implemented it, if you did not have any use for i

Re: drop default MTA for Fedora 15

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 5:47 PM, pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Till Maas wrote: >> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:43:36PM +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote: >> >>> The problem with delivering this to a user's mailbox via an MTA is that >>> in the typical case it doesn't re

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 15:23 -0400, Matthew Miller wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:11:58AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > If we're still including upstart as a fallback option, I think it's > > The intent is not to do so in the final release, AIUI. We're only > > keeping it around during pr

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Mon, 23.08.10 23:06, Bill Nottingham (nott...@redhat.com) wrote: > (intentionally breaking thread) > > Toshio Kuratomi (a.bad...@gmail.com) said: > > Maybe I should start a new thread since this isn't really a bug, but it is > > a blocker -- we need to get some packaging guidelines out for sy

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 24.08.10 03:33, Jeff Garzik (jgar...@pobox.com) wrote: > File /etc/inittab should keep working at the same level it is now. Yes, let's have this discussion again. It was so much fun! Lennart -- Lennart Poettering - Red Hat, Inc. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org http

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 24.08.10 09:44, Daniel J Walsh (dwa...@redhat.com) wrote: > I would add security things. > > Starting a service sends audit messages from the proper loginuid. > I am sure Steve Grub has lots of concerns here also. This is not fair! Upstart never did this. We do this now in systemd, as t

fedora mission (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:17:19PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > Acknowledging this: if you want to innovate you have no other option > than pushing things to the people, and then fix what breaks. We do not have this luxury. If we "push" something broken to the people, the people will _comple

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 12:10:45PM -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > People like you and me would opt-in. (well I would on some hosts) because > we know what we're doing. Expert eyes get a look at it before it's forced > onto our users, who are already leaving in leaps and bounds. Yes. It's worth men

File Font-TTFMetrics-0.1.tar.gz uploaded to lookaside cache by xavierb

A file has been added to the lookaside cache for perl-Font-TTFMetrics: 87295ec80f49a2f088925d35fae77cc8 Font-TTFMetrics-0.1.tar.gz -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-de...@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.or

[perl-Font-TTFMetrics] Initial import.

commit 00ebb31882046e2d060b500140a07dafc3bfba82 Author: Xavier Bachelot Date: Tue Aug 24 21:43:40 2010 +0200 Initial import. .gitignore|1 + perl-Font-TTFMetrics.spec | 63 + sources |1 + 3 files chan

Re: drop default MTA for Fedora 15

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:27:04PM +0100, Adam Huffman wrote: > Not really related to the original discussion, but perhaps firstboot > could be amended to add an alias when the first user is created such > that they receive root's mail? https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=135592 and relat

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 14:28 -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > seth vidal (skvi...@fedoraproject.org) said: > > > > You mean 'being passed on the kernel cmdline', I assume ? > > > > Do we consider interactive boot essential (I think not) ? > > > > Should mention something about forced fsck, maybe. >

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 24.08.10 13:28, Bill Nottingham (nott...@redhat.com) wrote: > > Matthias Clasen (mcla...@redhat.com) said: > > > BOOTUP > > > - System boots successfully to GUI, when configured. > > > - System boots successfully to text mode, when configured. > > > - System properly handles being passed

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) said: > > The intent is not to do so in the final release, AIUI. We're only > > keeping it around during pre-release, so that if we decide we need to > > fall back to upstart for final release, it's easy to do. As far as I > > know, the plan is to decide later (p

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 15:46 -0400, seth vidal wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 14:28 -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > seth vidal (skvi...@fedoraproject.org) said: > > > > > You mean 'being passed on the kernel cmdline', I assume ? > > > > > Do we consider interactive boot essential (I think not) ?

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

seth vidal (skvi...@fedoraproject.org) said: > > I'll test it in rhel6 in just a sec. > > Doesn't work in rhel6 :( If you hold down the key long enough at the right time, it sort of works. That's not really how we want to have it going forward, for obvious reasons. Bill -- devel mailing list d

Re: a note on order of arguements to systemctl command

On Tue, 24.08.10 14:59, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > The service command has a syntax like this: > > service servicename action > > where as systemctl has a syntax like this: > > systemctl action servicename.service > > This is inconvienient for the common case where more than

Re: Bodhi updates

Stephen Gallagher wrote: > Bodhi updates can have multiple packages associated with a single update > as long as they are on different branches. Why this restriction? > > At least in the case of something like a security update, I would think > that it would be beneficial to be able to push the up

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 09:33:50PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > What would make sense to add to chkconfig is something that checks > whether a systemd unit is installed and then prints "Hey, you have a > systemd unit installed, chkconfig won't do what you think it will do for > this unit" or

[perl-Font-TTFMetrics/f14/master] Initial import.

Summary of changes: 00ebb31... Initial import. (*) (*) This commit already existed in another branch; no separate mail sent -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-de...@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mai

Re: systemd and changes

On Tuesday, August 24, 2010 02:20:05 pm Till Maas wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:02:27PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > Till Maas (opensou...@till.name) said: > > > I did not want to imply that PulseAudio is useless. I doubt that you > > > would have implemented it, if you did not have any

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 24.08.10 12:14, Mike McGrath (mmcgr...@redhat.com) wrote: > > On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 11:15 -0400, Matthew Miller wrote: > > > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:45:33AM -0400, Matthias Clasen wrote: > > > > > GENERAL SANITY > > > > > - Booting a s

[perl-Font-TTFMetrics/f13/master] Initial import.

Summary of changes: 00ebb31... Initial import. (*) (*) This commit already existed in another branch; no separate mail sent -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-de...@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mai

Re: fedora mission (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 15:40 -0400, Matthew Miller wrote: > This *is* happening, and we need to tread carefully, because once you loose > respect and reputation, it is very, very hard to get back. I really think you're extrapolating too far from some very limited data here. You have some statistic

[perl-Font-TTFMetrics/f12/master] Initial import.

Summary of changes: 00ebb31... Initial import. (*) (*) This commit already existed in another branch; no separate mail sent -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-de...@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mai

[perl-Font-TTFMetrics/el6/master] Initial import.

Summary of changes: 00ebb31... Initial import. (*) (*) This commit already existed in another branch; no separate mail sent -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-de...@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mai

[perl-Font-TTFMetrics/el5/master] Initial import.

Summary of changes: 00ebb31... Initial import. (*) (*) This commit already existed in another branch; no separate mail sent -- Fedora Extras Perl SIG http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/Perl perl-devel mailing list perl-de...@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mai

Re: fedora mission (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 12:59:57PM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > > This *is* happening, and we need to tread carefully, because once you loose > > respect and reputation, it is very, very hard to get back. > I really think you're extrapolating too far from some very limited data > here. You have

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 24.08.10 11:47, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > From a practical point of view, I think what's actually important is: > > -- if you're in single user mode → it says 'S' It actually returns "1" in this case. > -- if you're in non-GUI multiuser → it says '3' > -- if you

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 24.08.10 15:55, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 09:33:50PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > > What would make sense to add to chkconfig is something that checks > > whether a systemd unit is installed and then prints "Hey, you have a > > systemd uni

Re: Bodhi updates

Jesse Keating wrote: > Nor is testing / stability atomic / equal across the branches. While > the f13 package may work fine, the f12 build may have severe problems. Which is something which happens maybe 1 in 1000 times, and would happen even less often (maybe 1 in 1 times) if some strategic

Re: a note on order of arguements to systemctl command

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 09:53:48PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > Interesting definition of "important". I said this before. User interfaces are important, even if they are command line user interfaces. I use this program very, very often. All Red-Hat-universe sysadmins do. To you, it may be a

Re: systemd and changes

On Tue, 24.08.10 13:59, Simo Sorce (sso...@redhat.com) wrote: > > On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 10:19:38 -0700 > Adam Williamson wrote: > > > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:10 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > > > > > People like you and me would opt-in. (well I would on some hosts) > > > because we know what we'

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 01:20:21PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > As stated in the bug, this would lead to a situation where you could > have both a initdefault line, and a default.target symlnk, that select > different things. How would you arbitrate? Well, also as stated in the bug :), always f

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 24.08.10 16:14, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 01:20:21PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > As stated in the bug, this would lead to a situation where you could > > have both a initdefault line, and a default.target symlnk, that select > > different

Re: systemd and changes

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/24/10 12:20 PM, Till Maas wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:02:27PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: >> Till Maas (opensou...@till.name) said: >>> I did not want to imply that PulseAudio is useless. I doubt that you >>> would have implemented it,

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering said: > On Tue, 24.08.10 15:55, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > > This is a very big change. chkconfig has worked for a long, long time. Its > > elegance and simplicity is one of the nice administrative features of Red > > Hat based distributes. Peo

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 14:15, Lennart Poettering wrote: > On Tue, 24.08.10 16:14, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > >> >> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 01:20:21PM -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: >> > As stated in the bug, this would lead to a situation where you could >> > have both a initdefau

Re: Bodhi updates

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 4:07 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote: > Jesse Keating wrote: >> Nor is testing / stability atomic / equal across the branches.  While >> the f13 package may work fine, the f12 build may have severe problems. > > Which is something which happens maybe 1 in 1000 times, and would happen

Re: a note on order of arguements to systemctl command

On 08/24/2010 03:53 PM, Lennart Poettering wrote: > On Tue, 24.08.10 14:59, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > >> The service command has a syntax like this: >> >> service servicename action >> >> where as systemctl has a syntax like this: >> >> systemctl action servicename.service >> >

Re: Bodhi updates

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 14:07, Kevin Kofler wrote: > Jesse Keating wrote: >> They need to be treated individually. > > You've been there when Fedora Legacy failed. (In fact, it was YOUR project.) > This (the excess testing requirements, in particular the requirement to test > every single release

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:15:43PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > > Well, also as stated in the bug :), always follow the /etc/inittab first. If > > if it makes sense, perhaps systemd should change the default.target to > > match. > Maybe we should check AUTOEXEC.BAT first, too? Cute. The ans

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 15:16 -0500, Chris Adams wrote: > Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering said: > > On Tue, 24.08.10 15:55, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > > > This is a very big change. chkconfig has worked for a long, long time. Its > > > elegance and simplicity is one of the nice

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:23 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:14 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: > > > > The intent is not to do so in the final release, AIUI. We're only > > > keeping it around during pre-release, so that if we decide we need to > > > fall back to upstart for fi

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:29 PM, Matt McCutchen wrote: > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:23 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: >> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 12:14 -0500, Mike McGrath wrote: >> >> > > The intent is not to do so in the final release, AIUI. We're only >> > > keeping it around during pre-release, so

Re: Bodhi updates

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 09:54:17PM +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote: > This is something I have been complaining about for a long time, especially > since this now means the same update has different karma requirements on > different branches, making it a PITA to push it in sync. (This wasn't that > b

Re: Bodhi updates

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 8/24/10 1:35 PM, Till Maas wrote: > IMHO it is more a PITA if I had to push all updates in sync. If you want > to push all updates in sync, you just have to wait till all updates > match their stable criteria. And if you do not want this, you can pu

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

Lennart Poettering (mzerq...@0pointer.de) said: > > - init shall support a mechanism to re-exec itself to not cause dirty > > inodes on shutdown; initscripts will use this method on shutdown. > > This is bad. While we support this just fine I think it is a really bad > idea to reexec init at sh

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:05:57PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > > From a practical point of view, I think what's actually important is: > > -- if you're in single user mode → it says 'S' > It actually returns "1" in this case. What do you mean by "actually"? If you try it, you will see th

systemd or why will user fall away from fedora?

hi, why i not like the idea of systemd? it's something that dramatically change the system behavior. period. this is different from all other/previous unix/linux system. there're many config scripts, programs and third party packages which are assume the old setup. such basic changes need years for

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 22:32 +0200, drago01 wrote: > [...] In the event that F14 goes back > > to upstart, the final release will use a configuration that may not have > > received much testing. If we want to claim that it's safe to switch > > back to upstart after beta, we need to be testing that

Minutes/Summary from today's FESCo meeting (2010-08-24)

=== #fedora-meeting: FESCO (2010-08-24) === Meeting started by nirik at 19:30:01 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2010-08-24/fesco.2010-08-24-19.30.log.html .. Meeting summary ---

Re: systemd acceptance, packaging guidelines (was Re: systemd and changes)

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 09:33:50PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote: > > This, however, is just packaging guidelines. From readng the thread, > > there are many things that I think people would like covered with > > systemd before they would feel comfortable with it. So, I'm going to > > attempt to

Re: systemd: targets which are runlevel-like

On Tue, 24.08.10 12:31, Matthew Miller (mat...@mattdm.org) wrote: > As I was thinking about Bug 626840, I noticed something. With the current > runlevel system, it's easy to know what your options are. The systemd FAQ > helpfully explains that "systemctl isolate graphical.target" is the > replacem

Re: systemd or why will user fall away from fedora?

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:46:41PM +0200, Farkas Levente wrote: > for workstation most users already use ubuntu. why? because it's more > user friendly. There is nothing wrong with using Ubuntu, if it servers their needs. > do you think workstation users will like this kind of changes? If they

Re: systemd or why will user fall away from fedora?

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010, Till Maas wrote: > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:46:41PM +0200, Farkas Levente wrote: > > > for workstation most users already use ubuntu. why? because it's more > > user friendly. > > There is nothing wrong with using Ubuntu, if it servers their needs. > > > do you think worksta

[Bug 623627] Error: Missing Dependency: kde-filesystem is needed by package konqueror-mldonkey-ed2k-support-3.0.2-1.el5.i386 (epel)

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=623627 --- Comment #7 from Fedora Update System 2010-08-24 17:11:30 EDT --- mldonkey-3.0.3-1.fc13 has been pushed to the Fedora 13 sta

[Bug 616128] .desktop menu entry has wrong/missing categories

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=616128 Fedora Update System changed: What|Removed |Added --

[Bug 589261] amending values of log_to_syslog = true; log_file = "/dev/null" in config causes nothing, values get reverted

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=589261 Fedora Update System changed: What|Removed |Added --

[Bug 616128] .desktop menu entry has wrong/missing categories

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=616128 --- Comment #10 from Fedora Update System 2010-08-24 17:13:51 EDT --- mldonkey-3.0.3-1.fc12 has been pushed to the Fedora 12 st

[Bug 616128] .desktop menu entry has wrong/missing categories

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=616128 --- Comment #9 from Fedora Update System 2010-08-24 17:11:26 EDT --- mldonkey-3.0.3-1.fc13 has been pushed to the Fedora 13 sta

[Bug 589261] amending values of log_to_syslog = true; log_file = "/dev/null" in config causes nothing, values get reverted

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=589261 --- Comment #9 from Fedora Update System 2010-08-24 17:11:21 EDT --- mldonkey-3.0.3-1.fc13 has been pushed to the Fedora 13 sta

[Bug 623627] Error: Missing Dependency: kde-filesystem is needed by package konqueror-mldonkey-ed2k-support-3.0.2-1.el5.i386 (epel)

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=623627 --- Comment #8 from Fedora Update System 2010-08-24 17:13:55 EDT --- mldonkey-3.0.3-1.fc12 has been pushed to the Fedora 12 sta

[Bug 623627] Error: Missing Dependency: kde-filesystem is needed by package konqueror-mldonkey-ed2k-support-3.0.2-1.el5.i386 (epel)

Please do not reply directly to this email. All additional comments should be made in the comments box of this bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=623627 Fedora Update System changed: What|Removed |Added --

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