Re: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 12. 6. 2014 at 17:11:14, David wrote: > Excuse me. > > To whom, or to where, should I write to request that dnf has a tools > package like yum has. "Yum-utils". We definitely encourage you to file the RFE, but if you want to discuss it upfront, feel free to ping us on IRC, we hang out on #yum

Re: Current FTBFS packages (was Re: [ACTION REQUIRED] Retiring packages for Fedora 21)

2014-06-12 Thread Matthew Garrett
On Fri, Jun 13, 2014 at 01:50:32AM +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote: > Matthew Miller wrote: > > Kevin, I disagree. A positive tone to discussion is important even when > > speaking the truth. > > There was no negative tone in Matthew Garrett's original message: > > If the Fedora/ARM community don't care

Re: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 18:17:01 -0400, David wrote: On 6/12/2014 5:53 PM, Fabio Alessandro Locati wrote: That would be a 'RFE"? I have never really understtod just how to enter one of those. Add the futurefeature keyword. That keeps the bug in rawhide after branches. -- devel mailing list d

Re: Current FTBFS packages (was Re: [ACTION REQUIRED] Retiring packages for Fedora 21)

2014-06-12 Thread Kevin Kofler
Matthew Miller wrote: > On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 02:00:13AM +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote: >> > That was overly critical of me and did nothing to actually further the >> > discussion. I apologise. >> No need to apologize! It's just the truth: ARM is not ready to be a >> primary > > Kevin, I disagree.

Re: rfc: xserver rebase in F20 (was Re: Slipping F21)

2014-06-12 Thread Sérgio Basto
On Qui, 2014-06-12 at 11:06 +0100, Sérgio Basto wrote: > how is this jujuxiii ? I mean who is this jujuxiii ? -- Sérgio M. B. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-cond

Pic of girls for me ?

2014-06-12 Thread Bob
Sent from my iPhone -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct

Re: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread David
On 6/12/2014 5:53 PM, Fabio Alessandro Locati wrote: > Hi David, > Probably the best place to ask is on the dnf > bugzilla: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/buglist.cgi?component=dnf&product=Fedora > > Also, I've noted that there is an open bug about a specific yum-util > (https://bugzilla.redhat.com/s

Re: Orphaning drgeo, drgeo-doc

2014-06-12 Thread Eric Smith
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Yaakov Selkowitz wrote: > IMHO it would be nice if this could stay in, but I'm not a Fedora packager > (yet? :-). FWIW, I just posted a patch for the FTBFS: I'll take over the 1.x pre-smalltalk package, incorporate your patch (thanks for that!), and otherwise

Re: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Fabio Alessandro Locati
Hi David, Probably the best place to ask is on the dnf bugzilla: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/buglist.cgi?component=dnf&product=Fedora Also, I've noted that there is an open bug about a specific yum-util ( https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1048541). Fabio On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 11:11

What exactly is a "bundled library"? (was Re: apitrace, bundled libbacktrace)

2014-06-12 Thread Adam Williamson
On Tue, 2014-05-13 at 18:56 +0200, Sandro Mani wrote: > Hi, > > apitrace 5.0 bundles libbacktrace, which looks like is living within the > gcc sources. libbacktrace is not build as a shared library from the gcc > sources, and not packaged. > > Is it feasible to build libbacktrace as a shared li

Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread David
Excuse me. To whom, or to where, should I write to request that dnf has a tools package like yum has. "Yum-utils". -- David -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-condu

Re: Orphaning drgeo, drgeo-doc

2014-06-12 Thread Yaakov Selkowitz
On 2014-06-07 07:49, Jonathan Dieter wrote: I'm orphaning drgeo and drgeo-doc. I originally picked them up because I thought our school would use drgeo, but we haven't, so I'm letting it go. IMHO it would be nice if this could stay in, but I'm not a Fedora packager (yet? :-). drgeo did FTB

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Richard W.M. Jones
On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 11:37:15AM -0400, Chuck Anderson wrote: > Have puppet, chef, ansible, salt, etc. been taught how to use "dnf" to > install packages? I think it would be a shame to force all this > software to do s/yum/dnf/ or to have to conditionally code for these > differences based on O

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Richard W.M. Jones
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 10:09:13AM -0400, Chuck Anderson wrote: > And if those arguments aren't convincing enough, the second best > option, if you MUST change the name of the command, is to change it > ONCE to something PERMANENT that never changes ever again. Something > generic like "package-ma

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread DJ Delorie
> Actually it is. The "pretty much" part is exactly the reason why to > change the name. If we didn't, a ton of users who are not reading > this conversation would start filing regression bugs. If we set > their expectations right, warning them that yum is no more, they are > far less likely to do

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Les Howell
On Thu, 2014-06-12 at 17:54 +0200, Reindl Harald wrote: > Am 12.06.2014 17:41, schrieb Simo Sorce: > > We can keep the yum symlink forever... > > > > I am for a clear break with dnf having its own name. > > Using yum as the name for dnf is just a lie to the user > > it is not a lie > > DNF is a

Re: [fedora-arm] ExcludeArch tracker doesn't appear to be effective

2014-06-12 Thread Matthew Garrett
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 11:39:00AM +0100, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > > grub2 > > ARM (32 bit) boots using u-boot. Aarch64 machines will boot using > grub2 (or is that grub2-efi? - you know better than I do :-) This one's purely excluded from 32-bit ARM. The source package is grub2 regardless o

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Reindl Harald
Am 12.06.2014 17:41, schrieb Simo Sorce: > We can keep the yum symlink forever... > > I am for a clear break with dnf having its own name. > Using yum as the name for dnf is just a lie to the user it is not a lie DNF is a fork of YUM and pretends to be compatible and if it finally replaces YUM

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Simo Sorce
On Thu, 2014-06-12 at 17:13 +0200, Miloslav Trmač wrote: > 2014-06-12 17:03 GMT+02:00 Rahul Sundaram : > > > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 10:29 AM, Jan Zelený wrote: > > > >> > >> We are on the same page, thanks for your input. > >> > > > > I don't think so. You are clearly arguing for a temporary co

5tFTw: Board Meeting, Rawhide Rebuilt, Firewall Debate, ARM 64, and DNF as Yum Replacement, plus RHEL7 Bonus Item (2014-06-10)

2014-06-12 Thread Matthew Miller
Reposted from . Fedora is a big project, and it’s hard to follow it all. This series highlights interesting happenings in five different areas every week. It isn’t comprehensive news coverage — just quick summaries with links to each. Here are the five

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Petr Spacek
On 12.6.2014 16:16, Miloslav Trmač wrote: 2014-06-12 9:30 GMT+02:00 Jan Zelený : It boils down to this: someone is going to be inconvenienced. I argue it's better to inconvenience the minority with special 'yum' needs by making them use the 'yum-old' alias, rather than inconveniencing the major

Re: F21 System Wide Change: Fedora 21 Make 4.0 Update

2014-06-12 Thread Omair Majid
* Peter Robinson [2014-06-12 04:25]: > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 12:50 AM, Omair Majid wrote: > > * Jaroslav Reznik [2014-04-14 08:32]: > >> = Proposed System Wide Change: Fedora 21 Make 4.0 Update = > >> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/F21Make40 > > > >> == Detailed Description == > >> The

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jamie Duncan
I am +1 for keeping the 'yum' name for the new manager, if only for the connotation. Telling users/consumers/customers that yum is upgraded and awesome is much easier than telling them that yum has been replaced and that the new tool is awesome. Even something like 'yum4' would be preferable

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Miloslav Trmač
2014-06-12 17:03 GMT+02:00 Rahul Sundaram : > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 10:29 AM, Jan Zelený wrote: > >> >> We are on the same page, thanks for your input. >> > > I don't think so. You are clearly arguing for a temporary compatibility > wrapper but eventually forcing everyone to use dnf as the com

Re: Review requests: netgen-mesher, tcl-togl

2014-06-12 Thread Sandro Mani
On 12.06.2014 16:29, Mukundan Ragavan wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 On 06/11/2014 07:07 PM, Sandro Mani wrote: Hi, For the ongoing effort to package salome/code-aster, I need these two dependencies: - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1108395 - netgen-mesher

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Rahul Sundaram
Hi On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 10:29 AM, Jan Zelený wrote: > > We are on the same page, thanks for your input. > I don't think so. You are clearly arguing for a temporary compatibility wrapper but eventually forcing everyone to use dnf as the command. The other side is wanting yum to continue to

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread DJ Delorie
> Nothing will change for you, the yum command will still exist for a > few more Fedora releases, Which only postpones the problem. > just as the `service` command that was superseded by systemctl like > 5 releases of Fedora ago exists. Which is currently annoying me, for the same reason. -- d

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Reindl Harald
Am 12.06.2014 16:28, schrieb Jan Zelený: > On 12. 6. 2014 at 10:11:40, Chuck Anderson wrote: >> At least "systemctl" is generic unlike "dnf". And systemctl is much >> more of a change from the way "service" works that it warranted a >> change of name. "yum" and "dnf" both work pretty much the sa

Re: Review requests: netgen-mesher, tcl-togl

2014-06-12 Thread Mukundan Ragavan
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 On 06/11/2014 07:07 PM, Sandro Mani wrote: > Hi, > > For the ongoing effort to package salome/code-aster, I need these > two dependencies: > > - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1108395 - > netgen-mesher - Somewhat complexish, autotools,

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 12. 6. 2014 at 10:09:13, Chuck Anderson wrote: > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 02:10:22PM +0200, Jan Zelený wrote: > > > > We are open to ideas. I think in this situation there is no perfect > > > > way > > > > how to satisfy everyone. We have thought about this for several > > > > months. > > > > Ren

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 12. 6. 2014 at 10:11:40, Chuck Anderson wrote: > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 10:01:22AM +0200, Jan Zelený wrote: > > On 11. 6. 2014 at 14:07:05, DJ Delorie wrote: > > > Forcing the users to type a different command name to get exactly the > > > same functionality only serves to annoy the user. > >

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Tomas Mraz
On Čt, 2014-06-12 at 10:09 -0400, Chuck Anderson wrote: > On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 02:10:22PM +0200, Jan Zelený wrote: > > > > We are open to ideas. I think in this situation there is no perfect way > > > > how to satisfy everyone. We have thought about this for several months. > > > > Renaming dnf

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Chuck Anderson
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 10:01:22AM +0200, Jan Zelený wrote: > On 11. 6. 2014 at 14:07:05, DJ Delorie wrote: > > Forcing the users to type a different command name to get exactly the > > same functionality only serves to annoy the user. > > I'm sorry but at this point I feel I gotta ask: have you r

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Miloslav Trmač
2014-06-12 9:30 GMT+02:00 Jan Zelený : > > It boils down to this: someone is going to be inconvenienced. I argue > > it's better to inconvenience the minority with special 'yum' needs by > > making them use the 'yum-old' alias, rather than inconveniencing the > > majority by making everyone switch

Re: [fedora-arm] ExcludeArch tracker doesn't appear to be effective

2014-06-12 Thread Dennis Gilmore
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, 12 Jun 2014 11:39:00 +0100 "Richard W.M. Jones" wrote: > Of the ones I know about ... > > > avgtime > > Written in the 'D' language which doesn't have support for ARM > upstream. > > > grub2 > > ARM (32 bit) boots using u-boot. Aarch64 m

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Chuck Anderson
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 02:10:22PM +0200, Jan Zelený wrote: > > > We are open to ideas. I think in this situation there is no perfect way > > > how to satisfy everyone. We have thought about this for several months. > > > Renaming dnf back to yum might seem like the best option at first (it was > >

Re: [fedora-arm] ExcludeArch tracker doesn't appear to be effective

2014-06-12 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 11:58:55 +0100, Peter Robinson wrote: I pulled git and have the following for ExclusiveArch: %{arm}: joystick-support While ARM doesn't have traditional joystick ports there have been some people hook them up via GPIO and the like, enabled. Would these likely end up

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Vít Ondruch
Dne 11.6.2014 17:20, Jan Zelený napsal(a): On 11. 6. 2014 at 09:02:29, Rahul Sundaram wrote: Hi On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 8:52 AM, Matthew Miller wrote: This is kind of sentimental, and I think possibly Seth would not have liked to have a big deal made of it, but... I guess I'm going to anyway.

Re: [ACTION REQUIRED] Retiring packages for Fedora 21 v2

2014-06-12 Thread Ales Ledvinka
python-gudev orphan, aledvink, sochotni Taken. Anyone who did miss the opportunity and still want it? Just let me know. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fe

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Vít Ondruch
Dne 11.6.2014 20:18, Felix Miata napsal(a): On 2014-06-11 14:07 (GMT-0400) DJ Delorie composed: Forcing the users to type a different command name to get exactly the same functionality only serves to annoy the user. And in this particular case, the change is from a nice single finger word it

Re: Slipping F21

2014-06-12 Thread Petr Pisar
On 2014-06-11, Tomasz Torcz wrote: > On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 11:14:41PM +0200, Emmanuel Seyman wrote: >> * Reindl Harald [11/06/2014 17:44] : >> > >> > um F20 has Kernel 3.14, recent mesa, KDE 4.13 soon, recent LibreOffice >> > and so on - what are you missing that justifies "move move, go on move

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
> > We are open to ideas. I think in this situation there is no perfect way > > how to satisfy everyone. We have thought about this for several months. > > Renaming dnf back to yum might seem like the best option at first (it was > > our original plan too) but when you carefully and deeply think ab

Re: rfc: xserver rebase in F20 (was Re: Slipping F21)

2014-06-12 Thread Sérgio Basto
Hi, On Qua, 2014-06-11 at 12:40 -0400, Adam Jackson wrote: > On Wed, 2014-06-11 at 17:19 +0100, Sérgio Basto wrote: > > On Qua, 2014-06-11 at 12:09 -0400, Adam Jackson wrote: > > > On Wed, 2014-06-11 at 17:56 +0200, drago01 wrote: > > > > > > > Oh and xserver really .. I am the one that gets c

Re: [fedora-arm] ExcludeArch tracker doesn't appear to be effective

2014-06-12 Thread Peter Robinson
> I pulled git and have the following for ExclusiveArch: %{arm}: > > joystick-support While ARM doesn't have traditional joystick ports there have been some people hook them up via GPIO and the like, enabled. > mcollective-qpid-plugin > perl-qpid These were both legacy hangover from before qpid-

Re: [fedora-arm] ExcludeArch tracker doesn't appear to be effective

2014-06-12 Thread Richard W.M. Jones
Of the ones I know about ... > avgtime Written in the 'D' language which doesn't have support for ARM upstream. > grub2 ARM (32 bit) boots using u-boot. Aarch64 machines will boot using grub2 (or is that grub2-efi? - you know better than I do :-) > hfsplus-tools As discussed in this thread.

Re: rfc: xserver rebase in F20 (was Re: Slipping F21)

2014-06-12 Thread Sérgio Basto
On Qua, 2014-06-11 at 23:36 +0200, Simone Caronni wrote: > Hello, > > > On 11 June 2014 19:11, Sérgio Basto wrote: > > > Hi, why not begin by a xserver rebase in copr ? > > > > Personally, because I don't feel like doing the work twice. > But if > > some

EMEA sponsorship program for Flock

2014-06-12 Thread Jiri Eischmann
Hi, the EMEA regional community decided yesterday to organize a small sponsorship program for EMEA contributors who would like to attend Flock 2014 that is going to take place in Prague on Aug 6-9 and haven't received (and will not receive) any sponsorship as speakers. The overall amount of money

Re: Slipping F21

2014-06-12 Thread Emmanuel Seyman
* Tomasz Torcz [11/06/2014 23:20] : > > So we won't get 5.20 in stable Fedora for a year? More or less (we don't have a schedule for F22 yet). Emmanuel -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedo

Metainfo files for addons/plugins/extensions that extend desktop applications

2014-06-12 Thread Richard Hughes
Recently I added the addon component type to AppStream[1] which is an XML standard that is used by Fedora and lots of other distros to create metadata for various software center applications such as GNOME Software and KDE's Apper. By creating a metainfo.xml for each plugin, these are then shown n

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Reindl Harald
Am 12.06.2014 10:51, schrieb Miroslav Suchý: > b) you (the-sysadmin) are lazy and put it on back-burner > and do s/yum/yum-legacy/ and you have to do that work > from a) anyway one year later stop people calling lazy because they are not accepting replacements which are not drop-in Fedora would

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Miroslav Suchý
On 06/11/2014 06:13 PM, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote: If the idea is interesting it does imply that each person having scripts depending on yum has to: * s/yum/yum-legacy/ - Deploy to prod and run as before * s/yum-legacy/dnf/ - Test and ensure it has a consistent behavior w/ yum (that the scri

Re: F21 System Wide Change: Fedora 21 Make 4.0 Update

2014-06-12 Thread Peter Robinson
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 12:50 AM, Omair Majid wrote: > * Jaroslav Reznik [2014-04-14 08:32]: >> = Proposed System Wide Change: Fedora 21 Make 4.0 Update = >> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/F21Make40 > >> == Detailed Description == >> The purpose of this update is to synchronize Fedora wit

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread drago01
On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 10:03 AM, Jan Zelený wrote: > On 11. 6. 2014 at 18:55:37, Miloslav Trmač wrote: >> 2014-06-11 16:08 GMT+02:00 drago01 : >> > That makes no sense. First of all if it obsoletes yum it will get >> > pulled in during upgrades and imo it *should*. We don't really want to >> > en

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 11. 6. 2014 at 18:55:37, Miloslav Trmač wrote: > 2014-06-11 16:08 GMT+02:00 drago01 : > > That makes no sense. First of all if it obsoletes yum it will get > > pulled in during upgrades and imo it *should*. We don't really want to > > end up in a situation where half the users > > are using the

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 11. 6. 2014 at 14:07:05, DJ Delorie wrote: > Forcing the users to type a different command name to get exactly the > same functionality only serves to annoy the user. I'm sorry but at this point I feel I gotta ask: have you read my earlier replies? Nothing will change for you, the yum command

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 11. 6. 2014 at 18:09:25, Michael Scherer wrote: > Le mercredi 11 juin 2014 à 11:37 -0400, Chuck Anderson a écrit : > > On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 05:21:30PM +0200, Jan Zelený wrote: > > > On 11. 6. 2014 at 08:52:34, Matthew Miller wrote: > > > > On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 02:44:10PM +0200, Jaroslav Re

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 11. 6. 2014 at 18:53:36, Miloslav Trmač wrote: > 2014-06-11 15:02 GMT+02:00 Rahul Sundaram : > > I strongly agree with this for practical reasons. There is no good > > rationale for moving away from yum as the name of the command except some > > of the command line changes which happened with

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Replace Yum With DNF

2014-06-12 Thread Jan Zelený
On 11. 6. 2014 at 15:03:12, Przemek Klosowski wrote: > On 06/11/2014 11:20 AM, Jan Zelený wrote: > > The transition period is one reason why we want to keep the name dnf. We'd > > basically like to keep current yum around for users that have various > > scripts and stuff depending on it so they ha