On Ma, 14 oct 14, 17:56:58, Steve Litt wrote:
>
> Because you don't want to inextricably drag a giant monolith into your
> Desktop Environment just to do a few things.
If you compare systemd with a Desktop Environment I'm not quite sure
who's the giant ;)
> And how were they handling
> this tas
On Ma, 14 oct 14, 22:56:15, The Wanderer wrote:
>
> Not to mention that just offhand I'm not sure I'd even know how to turn
> off basic tab completion - whereas turning off programmable tab
> completion is pretty much just a matter of not sourcing the
> tab-completion files in the effective bash e
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> Check out what single company has 30% of the gatekeepers. Surprise,
> surprise.
Damned for their success. We want Linux to be successful, but woe betide any
company that actually gets us there...
--
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On Ma, 14 oct 14, 18:11:31, Anders Wegge Keller wrote:
>
> I'll never hear from you again, as you are clearly getting a kick out of
> fuelling the flames.
I can assure you it is not my intention to fuel the flames, though this
doesn't mean I couldn't be doing it anyway, inadvertently.
I hereby
On Mi, 15 oct 14, 15:34:22, Andrew McGlashan wrote:
>
> I'm not so sure that squeeze-lts will be supported well enough for long
> enough. Hopefully wheezy gets good support with a wheezy-lts.
From https://wiki.debian.org/LTS
Companies using Debian who are interested in aiding this effort
On Mi, 15 oct 14, 15:00:22, Andrew McGlashan wrote:
>
> At a later date, everything changes ... some things later than other
> things. I guess that gnome's version for 7.6 is too old to /need/ systemd.
As I've already said in another post, Gnome (the Desktop Environment)
doesn't need systemd, b
On Ma, 14 oct 14, 21:57:30, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> Whenever I do an
>aptitude update
> it seems to work OK, except for a series of messages at the end:
...
> Notice that this happens with *two* mirrors.
>
> Is there something I should do to stop this?
You could try reporting this to debian-mi
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 04:07:25 +1100
Scott Ferguson wrote:
> Given that your only contribution to the list is outright and offensive
> hypocrisy why should you not be rightfully dismissed as an abusive and
> offensive poster who contributes nothing to the subject. I do know you
> and your work - an
On 14/10/14 22:56, Steve Litt wrote:
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 00:15:40 +0300
Andrei POPESCU wrote:
As far as I understand none of the upstreams are actually requiring
systemd itself (or more accurately systemd-logind), but the
interfaces it is providing.
I fail to see the distinction.
As long as
Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
Check out what single company has 30% of the gatekeepers. Surprise,
surprise.
Damned for their success. We want Linux to be successful, but woe
betide any
company that actually gets
On Mi, 15 oct 14, 10:41:12, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
>
> Maybe you want.
> But I think that most users just want it to work fine and efficiently, which
> does not necessarily imply being sold massively around the world.
>
> The fact is, that linux is actually a success, but it has nev
On Tue 14 Oct 2014 at 19:10:05 -0400, Harry Putnam wrote:
> OK, here we go.
>
> mailx -v -s "TEST "141014_184452" 2xd1 rea...@jtan.com < /tmp/tstmsg.txt
Two mails are being sent.
> 550 5.1.1 <2...@2xd1.local.lan>... User unknown
This one didn't make it.
> Why does it go to a dead letter
On 15/10/14 18:43, Anders Wegge Keller wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 04:07:25 +1100 Scott Ferguson
> wrote:
>
>> Given that your only contribution to the list is outright and
>> offensive hypocrisy why should you not be rightfully dismissed as
>> an abusive and offensive poster who contributes
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
> Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
> >On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> >>Check out what single company has 30% of the gatekeepers. Surprise,
> >>surprise.
> >
> >Damned for their
On 10/14/2014 1:58 PM, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Well, this really is OT for debian-users, but Turns out that SMTP
> WAS/IS intended to be reliable.
Reliable, absolutely. 100% reliable? That simply isn't possible when
people are involved in the equation (people mis-configure servers -
whether
On 10/14/2014 12:03 PM, Tanstaafl wrote:
> The 'silly statements' reference was about your suggestion
> that it is in any way shape or form 'ok' to *accept* mail to invalid
> recipients then send it to dev/null.
Incidentally, yes there may be some circumstances where this could be
considered ok..
Jonathan Dowland:
> Next step, adjust the daemon to depend on this. In my example,
> transmission-daemon supplies a .service file in the package. Copy this to
> /etc/systemd/system, and add a line (the line prefixed +):
>
> > [Unit]
> > Description=Transmission BitTorrent Daemon
> > After=networ
Le 15.10.2014 12:09, Brian a écrit :
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
wrote:
Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
>On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
>>Check out what single company has 30% of the gatekeepers.
Surprise,
On 15/10/14 22:08, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
>
>
> Le 15.10.2014 12:09, Brian a écrit :
>> On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
>>> >On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrot
Tanstaafl wrote:
On 10/14/2014 1:58 PM, Miles Fidelman wrote:
Well, this really is OT for debian-users, but Turns out that SMTP
WAS/IS intended to be reliable.
Reliable, absolutely. 100% reliable? That simply isn't possible when
people are involved in the equation (people mis-configure se
Folks,
So, it's been suggested here that one might write a preseed file to
install sysvinit-core instead of systemd - but for the life of me, I
can't figure out how to do that.
What I've been able to determine so far:
1. There is now an essential metapackage called init that depends on one
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On 15/10/2014 6:02 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> ConsoleKit, unmaintained.
But fixed, for kFreeBSD
A.
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Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (MingW32)
iF4EAREIAAYFAlQ+ZOQACgkQqBZry7fv4vtv5gEAqxefTmCV1PLqwNWgJOGeFwGD
zc00RNvDgol9E3
On 10/14/2014 3:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
> On 10/14/2014 12:03 PM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>> On 10/14/2014 11:17 AM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>>> On 10/14/2014 8:05 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
If you think I'm kidding, please by all means go make these silly
statements on the postfix list and I'll ju
On 10/14/2014 3:20 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
> On 10/14/2014 11:24 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>> However, once a message has been accepted - ie, *after* the DATA phase
>> is complete, it should never be bounced, it should be delivered - or,
>> worse, quarantined, or worst case, deleted (ie, itf it is lat
Comments inline below:
On Wednesday, October 15, 2014 06:37:57 Scott Ferguson wrote:
> On 15/10/14 22:08, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
> > Le 15.10.2014 12:09, Brian a écrit :
> >> On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
> >>
> >> wrote:
> >>> Le 15.10.2014 09:
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 07:49:08AM -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> 1. There is now an essential metapackage called init that depends on
> one of systemd-sysv, or sysvinit-core, or upstart. (parenthetical
> question: What distinguishes a metapackage from a virtual package?
> Or perhaps, more precis
Le 15.10.2014 12:37, Scott Ferguson a écrit :
On 15/10/14 22:08, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
Le 15.10.2014 12:09, Brian a écrit :
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
wrote:
Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
>On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12
On 10/15/2014 at 04:08 AM, Martin Read wrote:
> On 14/10/14 22:56, Steve Litt wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 00:15:40 +0300 Andrei POPESCU
>> wrote:
>>> And it also seems to make sense (why should every Desktop
>>> Environment implement it's own solution for this?).
>> And how were they handl
On 10/14/2014 at 04:15 PM, Olav Vitters wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 06:18:01PM +0200, lee wrote:
>
>> Considering that the users are Debians' priority, couldn't this
>> issue be a case in which significant concerns from/of the users
>> about an issue might initiate a GR? Wouldn't it speak l
On 10/14/2014 at 03:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
> On 10/14/2014 12:03 PM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>
>> On 10/14/2014 11:17 AM, Jerry Stuckle
>> wrote:
>>> Wrong on two counts. First of all, the false notion "Security
>>> through obscurity *never* works". This has nothing to do with
>>> security.
>>
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 9:01 PM, Miles Fidelman
wrote:
> Tanstaafl wrote:
>>
>> On 10/14/2014 1:58 PM, Miles Fidelman wrote:
>>>
>>> Well, this really is OT for debian-users, but Turns out that SMTP
>>> WAS/IS intended to be reliable.
>>
>> Reliable, absolutely. 100% reliable? That simply is
Hi, folks!
Sorry about the title. I'm just addicted to movie titles from the 60s.
(-:
I am seeing this during the boot sequence on a Debian testing
installation. Sometimes it is actually left showing on TTY1 after the DM
(lightdm in this case) comes up, and sometimes not.
From TTY1
...
syst
Steve Litt writes:
> Check out what single company has 30% of the gatekeepers. Surprise,
> surprise.
Better Red Hat than just about anybody else.
--
John Hasler
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA
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with a subject of "unsubscribe
2014/10/15 1:47 "Brian" :
>
> On Tue 14 Oct 2014 at 12:06:11 -0400, Henning Follmann wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Oct 14, 2014 at 11:02:10AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> > > On Tue, 14 Oct 2014 08:05:06 -0400
> > > Henning Follmann wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Tue, Oct 14, 2014 at 07:56:40AM -0400, Marty wrote:
Thanks to those who've provided scripts and pointers to apt-
capabilities. But... both out of curiosity and practicality - to the
Debian developers out there - are there any tools on the SCM or build
servers that run dependency graphs across the package database?
Miles Fidelman
Andrew McGla
On 2014-10-15 16:14 +0200, Jape Person wrote:
> I am seeing this during the boot sequence on a Debian testing
> installation. Sometimes it is actually left showing on TTY1 after the
> DM (lightdm in this case) comes up, and sometimes not.
>
> From TTY1
> ...
> systemd-gpt-auto-generator[152]: Fail
On 10/15/2014 8:14 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
> On 10/14/2014 3:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>> On 10/14/2014 12:03 PM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>>> On 10/14/2014 11:17 AM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
On 10/14/2014 8:05 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
> If you think I'm kidding, please by all means go make these silly
>
Ahoj,
Dňa Wed, 15 Oct 2014 11:09:53 +0100 Brian
napísal:
> On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
> wrote:
>
> > Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
> > >On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> > >>Check out what single company has
On 10/15/2014 10:17 AM, The Wanderer wrote:
> On 10/14/2014 at 03:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>
>> On 10/14/2014 12:03 PM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>>
>>> On 10/14/2014 11:17 AM, Jerry Stuckle
>>> wrote:
>
Wrong on two counts. First of all, the false notion "Security
through obscurity *never*
Patrick Bartek wrote:
Just got latest upgrade of Chrome Stable (38.0.2125.104-1) for my Wheezy
64-bit (Openbox WM only) directly from Google repo. Pepperflash player
(15.0.0.189) now working.
And it only took a month and a half. ;-)
B
with libc6 from Jessie?
Hugo
--
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On Wed, 15 Oct 2014, Jape Person wrote:
> From dmesg
> ...[4.853751] systemd-gpt-auto-generator[154]: Failed to determine
> partition table type of /dev/sda: Input/output error
> [4.854298] systemd[151]:
> /lib/systemd/system-generators/systemd-gpt-auto-generator failed with error
> code 1.
Ahoj,
Dňa Wed, 15 Oct 2014 10:31:02 +0300 Andrei POPESCU
napísal:
> Using Debian package dependencies this is expressed as
> Depends: libpam-systemd by those packages that actually require those
> interfaces
>
> $ aptitude search '?depends(libpam-systemd)'
Not always right results:
aptitude
On 10/15/2014 at 12:11 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
> On 10/15/2014 10:17 AM, The Wanderer wrote:
>
>> On 10/14/2014 at 03:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>>> Then what is that if it isn't "obscurity"?
>>
>> "Security by obscurity" isn't "no one knows the password" or "no
>> one knows the account name"
On 10/15/2014 11:34 AM, Sven Joachim wrote:
On 2014-10-15 16:14 +0200, Jape Person wrote:
I am seeing this during the boot sequence on a Debian testing
installation. Sometimes it is actually left showing on TTY1 after the
DM (lightdm in this case) comes up, and sometimes not.
From TTY1
...
sy
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 10:02:03 +0300
Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> On Ma, 14 oct 14, 17:56:58, Steve Litt wrote:
> >
> > Because you don't want to inextricably drag a giant monolith into
> > your Desktop Environment just to do a few things.
>
> If you compare systemd with a Desktop Environment I'm not
On 10/15/2014 at 12:06 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
> On 10/15/2014 8:14 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>
>> On 10/14/2014 3:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle
>> wrote:
>>> But you just said it was OK to delete emails.
>>
>> Please don't misquote me. I said it was the *worst case*, meaning,
>> only marginally better tha
On 10/15/2014 12:25 PM, The Wanderer wrote:
> On 10/15/2014 at 12:11 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>> You're limiting it too much. From Dictionary.com:
>>
>> obscurity
>> noun, plural obscurities.
>> 1. the state or quality of being obscure.
>> 2. the condition of being unknown:
>> ...
> That's a def
On 10/15/2014 12:06 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
> On 10/15/2014 8:14 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>> On 10/14/2014 3:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>>> But you just said it was OK to delete emails.
>> Please don't misquote me. I said it was the *worst case*, meaning, only
>> marginally better than *bouncing*
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 08:11:10 +0100
Jonathan Dowland wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> > Check out what single company has 30% of the gatekeepers. Surprise,
> > surprise.
>
> Damned for their success. We want Linux to be successful, but woe
> betide any compa
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 09:08:26 +0100
Martin Read wrote:
> On 14/10/14 22:56, Steve Litt wrote:
> > And how were they handling this task before systemd?
>
> They were using ConsoleKit, which was orphaned upstream some time
> after systemd-logind came along.
I rest my case.
SteveT
Steve Litt
Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 07:49:08AM -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
1. There is now an essential metapackage called init that depends on
one of systemd-sysv, or sysvinit-core, or upstart. (parenthetical
question: What distinguishes a metapackage from a virtual package?
Or p
Joel Rees wrote:
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 9:01 PM, Miles Fidelman
wrote:
Tanstaafl wrote:
On 10/14/2014 1:58 PM, Miles Fidelman wrote:
Well, this really is OT for debian-users, but Turns out that SMTP
WAS/IS intended to be reliable.
Reliable, absolutely. 100% reliable? That simply isn't
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 23:37:37 +0900
Joel Rees wrote:
> 2014/10/15 1:47 "Brian" :
> >
> > Give me swearing in posts rather than innuendo and attempted
> > character assassination of a group dedicated workers.
>
> Do you realize that a lot of your posts, jumping on anti-systemd
> topics, might app
On 10/15/2014 11:53 AM, Don Armstrong wrote:
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014, Jape Person wrote:
From dmesg
...[4.853751] systemd-gpt-auto-generator[154]: Failed to determine
partition table type of /dev/sda: Input/output error
[4.854298] systemd[151]:
/lib/systemd/system-generators/systemd-gpt-aut
On 2014-10-15 17:53 +0200, Don Armstrong wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Oct 2014, Jape Person wrote:
>
>> I'm also having the drive checked by smartmontools at boot time and
>> have received no warnings.
>
> You're basically not supposed to get I/O errors on drives like that. I'd
> try running smartctl -a /d
On 10/15/2014 12:50 PM, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> I'll close by noting that this branch of discussion started with a focus
> on silently dropping spam, and whether that's a violation of standards.
Actually, no, this branch started with a focus on whether or not it is a
good idea to break SMTP by a
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014, Sven Joachim wrote:
> I don't think there is actually an I/O error here, looking at the code
> systemd-gpt-auto-generator makes this error up:
>
> ,
> | errno = 0;
> | r = blkid_probe_lookup_value(b, "PTTYPE", &pttype, NULL);
> | if (r != 0) {
> |
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On 16/10/2014 3:22 AM, Slavko wrote:
> But e.g. my dbus package doesn't depends on systemd at all:
>
> LANG=en aptitude show dbus | grep Depends -A2
> Depends: libaudit1 (>= 1:2.2.1), libc6 (>= 2.17), libcap-ng0, libdbus-1-3 (>=
> 1.7.6), l
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:42:58PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> > They were using ConsoleKit, which was orphaned upstream some time
> > after systemd-logind came along.
>
> I rest my case.
There's nothing at all (not even Red Hat) preventing anyone (even you!) from
stepping up and taking over devel
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 12:29:23 -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> any thoughts re. conflicts between what's in, say
>
> tasksel tasksel/first standard, web-server
> and
> d-i pkgsel/include string sysvinit-core systemd-shim
I don't believe there are any. I think what happens is that standard
and web
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 12:53:52 -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 23:37:37 +0900
> Joel Rees wrote:
>
> > 2014/10/15 1:47 "Brian" :
> > >
>
> > > Give me swearing in posts rather than innuendo and attempted
> > > character assassination of a group dedicated workers.
> >
> > Do you
On 10/15/2014 01:38 PM, Don Armstrong wrote:
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014, Sven Joachim wrote:
I don't think there is actually an I/O error here, looking at the code
systemd-gpt-auto-generator makes this error up:
,
| errno = 0;
| r = blkid_probe_lookup_value(b, "PTTYPE", &pttype, NU
On 10/15/2014 12:34 PM, The Wanderer wrote:
> On 10/15/2014 at 12:06 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>
>> On 10/15/2014 8:14 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>>
>>> On 10/14/2014 3:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle
>>> wrote:
>
But you just said it was OK to delete emails.
>>>
>>> Please don't misquote me. I said it was t
Tanstaafl wrote:
On 10/15/2014 12:50 PM, Miles Fidelman wrote:
I'll close by noting that this branch of discussion started with a focus
on silently dropping spam, and whether that's a violation of standards.
Actually, no, this branch started with a focus on whether or not it is a
good idea to
On 10/15/2014 12:40 PM, Tanstaafl wrote:
> On 10/15/2014 12:06 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>> On 10/15/2014 8:14 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
>>> On 10/14/2014 3:28 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
But you just said it was OK to delete emails.
>
>>> Please don't misquote me. I said it was the *worst case*, me
Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:42:58PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
They were using ConsoleKit, which was orphaned upstream some time
after systemd-logind came along.
I rest my case.
There's nothing at all (not even Red Hat) preventing anyone (even you!) from
stepping up and ta
On 15/10/14 17:30, Steve Litt wrote:
Pre-cisely. I see Red Hat's fingerprints all over that unmaintained
status. If not for Red Hat, somebody would have picked up ConsoleKit.
After all, as shown in
http://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/software/whos-writing-linux ,
there's plenty of money floating a
On 14 October 2014 17:10, Don Armstrong wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Oct 2014, Marty wrote:
>> It seems like free software employment and market share come with
>> increasing risk to objectivity and technical quality.
>
> People have to eat. Almost everyone who works on Debian has someone who
> pays them.
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 03:16:38PM -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> In theory. But in practice, folks make practical decisions as to
> expenditure of time and resources. For example, once Debian
> committed to systemd, Ubuntu followed suit - I expect that upstart
> will promptly whither and die.
Y
Thanks Brian.
See follow-up question embedded below.
Brian wrote:
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 12:29:23 -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
any thoughts re. conflicts between what's in, say
tasksel tasksel/first standard, web-server
and
d-i pkgsel/include string sysvinit-core systemd-shim
I don't believe
On 10/12/2014 09:30 AM, Gary Roach wrote:
On 10/11/2014 06:28 PM, Don Armstrong wrote:
On Tue, 07 Oct 2014, Gary Roach wrote:
After cloning my bad drive to a new one and installing the new drive
(see previous messages titled excessive CPU usage) i am left with the
following problem:
Kate and l
On 10/15/2014 07:08 AM, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
Le 15.10.2014 12:09, Brian a écrit :
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
wrote:
Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
>On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:51:07AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
>>Check ou
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On 16/10/2014 6:49 AM, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
> reported bugs will get less attention nowtoo). But the consolekit
> deprecation happened a long time before the tech-ctte decision
> about systemd. Some one/people could have picked it up long ago.
> I
On Thu, Oct 16, 2014 at 07:22:55AM +1100, Andrew McGlashan wrote:
> ConsoleKit has been fixed for kFreeBSD build, I expect fixing it in
> normal Debian/GNU wouldn't have been harder than choosing systemd.
It really needs (needed) adopting upstream, not just in Debian, because it's
upstream where p
Martin Read writes:
(snip)
> * The set of people hostile to systemd seems to include a lot of people
> who don't see much need for the likes of ConsoleKit either.
(snip)
This is actually a rather good point. The machines I am most
conservative about, and wanting to make sure that they boot well
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 15:15:24 -0400
Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>
> It is either OK to delete an email or it is not. You can't have it
> both ways.
It is *not* OK to silently delete an already accepted email, it does
indeed break SMTP as a reliable protocol ('reliable' as in: 'either we
deliver it
On 10/15/2014 12:39 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
We've actually been in this place before. Wonderful Linux company
Caldera became SCO (oversimplification, but you know what I mean).
Wonderful Linux company Corel changed their CEO, and promptly accepted
money from Microsoft and dropped all their Windows
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 03:34:40PM -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Thoughts?
I'm drawing blanks at the moment, but I'm glad you are looking at this.
I'll see if I can poke about a bit Tomorrow.
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On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 15:13:27 -0400
Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Tanstaafl wrote:
> > My position is that:
> >
> > 1. email to invalid recipients should be rejected at the RCPT-TO
> > stage,
>
> Easier said then done - at least when a server does relaying, but
> clearly ideal when possible.
>
It's
On Mi, 15 oct 14, 09:46:47, The Wanderer wrote:
>
> I suspect that the answer is "they just didn't provide the functionality
> which ConsoleKit, and later systemd-logind, now enable them to provide",
> but I'm not aware - in a clear-understanding, defined-boundaries sense -
> of exactly what that
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 09:43:00AM +0200, Anders Wegge Keller wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 04:07:25 +1100
> Scott Ferguson wrote:
>
> > Given that your only contribution to the list is outright and offensive
> > hypocrisy why should you not be rightfully dismissed as an abusive and
> > offensive
2014/10/16 5:46 "Ric Moore" :
>
> On 10/15/2014 12:39 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
>
>> We've actually been in this place before. Wonderful Linux company
>> Caldera became SCO (oversimplification, but you know what I mean).
>> Wonderful Linux company Corel changed their CEO, and promptly accepted
>> money
On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 21:44:30 +0100
Joe wrote:
Hello Joe,
>It is *not* OK to silently delete an already accepted email, it does
Unfortunately, it happens; Send an email with a large attachment(1) and
there are quite a few servers that will silently drop it. The worst of
it is you can never kno
On Mi, 15 oct 14, 18:22:28, Slavko wrote:
> Dňa Wed, 15 Oct 2014 10:31:02 +0300 Andrei POPESCU
> napísal:
>
> > Using Debian package dependencies this is expressed as
> > Depends: libpam-systemd by those packages that actually require those
> > interfaces
> >
> > $ aptitude search '?depends(lib
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:42:58PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Oct 2014 09:08:26 +0100
> Martin Read wrote:
>
> > On 14/10/14 22:56, Steve Litt wrote:
>
> > > And how were they handling this task before systemd?
> >
> > They were using ConsoleKit, which was orphaned upstream some time
On 10/15/2014 12:34 AM, Andrew McGlashan wrote:
That's a problem in itself. There should be room for real discussion as
is taking place here on the debian-user list, without fear of having
posts filtered.
I agree, but they (the moderators) have a vested interest when someone
posts something
On Mi, 15 oct 14, 21:37:57, Scott Ferguson wrote:
> As far as I'm aware Debian has *never* been sold anywhere, nor are
> there plans to - did I miss another meeting down the docks?
http://www.debian.org/CD/vendors/
No, that's not meant as a joke. As far as I understand, this is about
the only w
On Wednesday 15 October 2014 22:44:18 Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> On Mi, 15 oct 14, 21:37:57, Scott Ferguson wrote:
> > As far as I'm aware Debian has *never* been sold anywhere, nor are
> > there plans to - did I miss another meeting down the docks?
>
> http://www.debian.org/CD/vendors/
>
> No, that's
On 10/15/2014 05:06 PM, Joel Rees wrote:
2014/10/16 5:46 "Ric Moore" mailto:wayward4...@gmail.com>>:
>
> On 10/15/2014 12:39 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
>
>> We've actually been in this place before. Wonderful Linux company
>> Caldera became SCO (oversimplification, but you know what I mean).
>>
Ric Moore wrote:
On 10/15/2014 12:34 AM, Andrew McGlashan wrote:
That's a problem in itself. There should be room for real discussion as
is taking place here on the debian-user list, without fear of having
posts filtered.
I agree, but they (the moderators) have a vested interest when someone
On Mi, 15 oct 14, 12:29:23, Miles Fidelman wrote:
>
> 3. Is there a way to list all packages with priority "standard" -
> preferably via the package repo or one of the staging servers rather
> than having to first setup up a jessie installation and pulling in the
> source list?
You don't need
2014/10/16 5:59 "Andrei POPESCU" :
>
> On Mi, 15 oct 14, 09:46:47, The Wanderer wrote:
> >
> > I suspect that the answer is "they just didn't provide the functionality
> > which ConsoleKit, and later systemd-logind, now enable them to provide",
> > but I'm not aware - in a clear-understanding, defi
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 15:34:40 -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> So where in base system is systemd installed?
>
> This is the list of packages in base (from the source for the jessie
> version of debian-installer/build/pkg-lists/base as of yesterday):
[A little snipping]
I'd suggest that the prin
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:30:26PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
>
> I completely understand not reinventing the wheel, but if all you need
> is a spoke, you don't construct an interface to a whole wheel just to
> get your spoke.
A wise old owl lived in an oak
The more he saw the less he spoke
The les
2014/10/16 8:14 "Chris Bannister" :
>
> On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12:30:26PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> >
> > I completely understand not reinventing the wheel, but if all you need
> > is a spoke, you don't construct an interface to a whole wheel just to
> > get your spoke.
>
> A wise old owl lived i
On 10/15/2014 04:19 PM, Ric Moore wrote:
On 10/15/2014 07:08 AM, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
Le 15.10.2014 12:09, Brian a écrit :
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
wrote:
Le 15.10.2014 09:11, Jonathan Dowland a écrit :
>On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 12
wande...@fastmail.fm:
I have a similar lack of awareness and/or understanding about all of
> the *kit packages / projects / tools / what-have-you, actually; I'm
> not positive I even know how many there are, much less all of their
> names.
This should help:
Put yourself in the position of som
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 11:34:05AM -0400, Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Thanks to those who've provided scripts and pointers to apt- capabilities.
> But... both out of curiosity and practicality - to the Debian developers
> out there - are there any tools on the SCM or build servers that run
> dependenc
Andrei POPESCU writes:
> On Du, 12 oct 14, 18:47:09, lee wrote:
>> Andrei POPESCU writes:
>>
>> > On Mi, 08 oct 14, 16:01:37, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
>> >>
>> >> The tech-ctte exploration was extremely thorough, entirely transparent
>> >> and I
>> >
>> > In addition, the tech-ctte took specia
On 16/10/14 00:14, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
>
>
> Le 15.10.2014 12:37, Scott Ferguson a écrit :
>> On 15/10/14 22:08, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Le 15.10.2014 12:09, Brian a écrit :
On Wed 15 Oct 2014 at 10:41:12 +0200, berenger.mo...@neutralite.org
wro
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