On Mon 03 Jun 2019 at 21:07:51 (-0700), Patrick Bartek wrote:
> Unfortuanately, as all those ancillary components are not
> independent but interrelated, you're going to get unexpected
> systemd "gotchas" just as I did with wicd. I solved it by picking
> another wifi manager which really has no r
On Sun 02 Jun 2019 at 22:23:25 (-0700), Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Sun, 2 Jun 2019 00:29:30 -0500 David Wright
> wrote:
> > On Wed 29 May 2019 at 11:01:58 (-0700), Patrick Bartek wrote:
> >
> > > Is Debian slowly becoming systemd proprietary? It would be a great
> > > loss to Linux and its phil
On Mon, 3 Jun 2019 04:21:18 -0400
Kenneth Parker wrote:
> I wish to add one thing to this Discussion. Mention was made, more than
> once, that wicd "might" require Systemd.
It's not wicd that has the systemd dependency, it's one or a few
wicd Recommends that do. Block those from installing and
On Mon, 3 Jun 2019 09:43:36 +0200
didier gaumet wrote:
> Le 03/06/2019 à 07:23, Patrick Bartek a écrit :
> [...]
> > The install includes lots of choices [...] So, why not
> > init?
>
> I think a Debian maintainer had answered in the past something like
> while not using systemd himself, he ad
On Mon, Jun 03, 2019 at 10:17:00AM -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
> Greg Wooledge wrote:
[...]
> > Now, open your eyes. The real goal of these zealots [...]
> Thanks for announcing that people who care what init system they
> are running are zealots [...]
Folks. Can we just get along?
To the one s
Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 03, 2019 at 09:11:37AM -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
> > Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > > Almost nobody cares about init systems.
> > >
> > > Yes, you and your 3 friends care DEEPLY and PASSIONATELY about this. I
> > > get that. But there's only 4 of you, not 4000.
> >
On Mon, Jun 03, 2019 at 09:11:37AM -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
> Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > Almost nobody cares about init systems.
> >
> > Yes, you and your 3 friends care DEEPLY and PASSIONATELY about this. I
> > get that. But there's only 4 of you, not 4000.
>
> Greg --
>
> is that the sort of
Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 02, 2019 at 10:23:25PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > The install includes lots of choices like print server, server or
> > desktop system, GUI, laptop utilities, etc. that are "bloat-worthy" and
> > can be installed after the main install has completed. I kno
On Sun, Jun 02, 2019 at 10:23:25PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> The install includes lots of choices like print server, server or
> desktop system, GUI, laptop utilities, etc. that are "bloat-worthy" and
> can be installed after the main install has completed. I know. I used
> to do it back in
didier gaumet wrote:
> Le 03/06/2019 à 07:23, Patrick Bartek a écrit :
> [...]
> > The install includes lots of choices [...] So, why not
> > init?
>
> I think a Debian maintainer had answered in the past something like
> while not using systemd himself, he admitted the perceived percentage of
>
I wish to add one thing to this Discussion. Mention was made, more than
once, that wicd "might" require Systemd.
Besides using Debian Stretch on one system (where I am happily learning
Systemd), I use Devuan Ascii (on an older machine with limited ram).
This is "official notification" that wicd
Le 03/06/2019 à 07:23, Patrick Bartek a écrit :
[...]
> The install includes lots of choices [...] So, why not
> init?
I think a Debian maintainer had answered in the past something like
while not using systemd himself, he admitted the perceived percentage of
Debian anti-systemd users was not so i
On Sun, 2 Jun 2019 00:29:30 -0500
David Wright wrote:
> On Wed 29 May 2019 at 11:01:58 (-0700), Patrick Bartek wrote:
>
> > Is Debian slowly becoming systemd proprietary? It would be a great
> > loss to Linux and its philosophy if true. But that looks to be the
> > direction Debian is headed.
On Wed 29 May 2019 at 11:01:58 (-0700), Patrick Bartek wrote:
> Is Debian slowly becoming systemd proprietary? It would be a great
> loss to Linux and its philosophy if true. But that looks to be the
> direction Debian is headed.
>
> Once I suggested on this list when systemd first debuted with
On Sat, 1 Jun 2019 14:30:38 +0200
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2019-05-29 20:47:06 +0300, Reco wrote:
> > Hi.
> >
> > On Wed, May 29, 2019 at 05:39:05PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > On 2019-05-28 11:18:39 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > > On Tue, 28 May 2019 20:39:53 +0300
> > >
On 2019-05-29 20:47:06 +0300, Reco wrote:
> Hi.
>
> On Wed, May 29, 2019 at 05:39:05PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2019-05-28 11:18:39 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > On Tue, 28 May 2019 20:39:53 +0300
> > > Reco wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 09:49:45AM -0700, Pa
On Tue, 28 May 2019 12:28:49 -0400 (EDT)
bw wrote:
> In-Reply-To: <20190528071022.45725f73@debian9>
>
> ah... sorry, here's the culprit, hard depend on systemd
>
> dbus-user-session
>
It doesn't even have to be hard. Any association no matter how soft
or distant an app has with GNOME or any
Hi.
On Wed, May 29, 2019 at 05:39:05PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2019-05-28 11:18:39 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > On Tue, 28 May 2019 20:39:53 +0300
> > Reco wrote:
> >
> > > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 09:49:45AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > > On Tue, 28 May 2019 18:56:44
On 2019-05-28 11:18:39 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Tue, 28 May 2019 20:39:53 +0300
> Reco wrote:
>
> > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 09:49:45AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > On Tue, 28 May 2019 18:56:44 +0300
> > > Reco wrote:
> > > apt/apt-get already by default set NOT to install Recommen
On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 06:03:39PM -0400, bw wrote:
> In-Reply-To: <20190528202437.ro7qososkbvmd...@randomstring.org>
>
> >bw wrote:
[ Dan Ritter ]
> >Debian is not supposed to be a highly opinionated distribution, unless
> >the opinion is "there should be lots of options". Claiming that "once
bw wrote:
> In-Reply-To: <20190528110506.12328afe@debian9>
>
> Patrick Bartek
> ...
> >> It's a good topic, if you think this is a bug, please report it.
> >
> >I don't think it's a bug. Just a dependency issue caused by the way
> >systemd is designed.
>
> I hear what you are saying, and it al
On Tue, 28 May 2019 20:39:53 +0300
Reco wrote:
> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 09:49:45AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > On Tue, 28 May 2019 18:56:44 +0300
> > Reco wrote:
> >
> > > Hi.
> > >
> > > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 07:10:22AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > > On Mon, 27 May 2019 21
On Tue, 28 May 2019 12:19:22 -0400 (EDT)
bw wrote:
> In-Reply-To: <20190528071022.45725f73@debian9>
>
>
> Patrick Bartek
> >On Mon, 27 May 2019 21:00:36 -0400 (EDT)
> >bw wrote:
> >
> >> In-Reply-To: <[] 20190527163821.6e4b5d95@debian9>
> >>
> >> ...
> >> >Based on my past experience
On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 09:49:45AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Tue, 28 May 2019 18:56:44 +0300
> Reco wrote:
>
> > Hi.
> >
> > On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 07:10:22AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > On Mon, 27 May 2019 21:00:36 -0400 (EDT)
> > > bw wrote:
> > >
> > > > In-Reply-To: <
On Tue, 28 May 2019 18:56:44 +0300
Reco wrote:
> Hi.
>
> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 07:10:22AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > On Mon, 27 May 2019 21:00:36 -0400 (EDT)
> > bw wrote:
> >
> > > In-Reply-To: <20190527163821.6e4b5d95@debian9>
> > >
> > > ...
> > > >Based on my past experi
Hi.
On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 07:10:22AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Mon, 27 May 2019 21:00:36 -0400 (EDT)
> bw wrote:
>
> > In-Reply-To: <20190527163821.6e4b5d95@debian9>
> >
> > ...
> > >Based on my past experiences and research with systemd, I now
> > >always have do simulated in
On Mon, 27 May 2019 21:00:36 -0400 (EDT)
bw wrote:
> In-Reply-To: <20190527163821.6e4b5d95@debian9>
>
> ...
> >Based on my past experiences and research with systemd, I now
> >always have do simulated installs with everything just to be sure
> >nothing untoward happens. The Subject Title was ap
Quoting arne (2019-05-28 04:37:46)
> On Mon, 27 May 2019 09:29:46 +0200
> Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
>
> > Quoting Patrick Bartek (2019-05-27 03:49:06)
> > > Needing to convert this box from wired ethernet to wireless, I
> > > searched for a suitable network manager and wicd looked good: No
> > >
On Mon, 27 May 2019 09:29:46 +0200
Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
> Quoting Patrick Bartek (2019-05-27 03:49:06)
> > Needing to convert this box from wired ethernet to wireless, I
> > searched for a suitable network manager and wicd looked good: No
> > desktop environment dependencies (I use a window
On Mon, 27 May 2019 13:00:37 -0400 (EDT)
bw wrote:
> In-Reply-To: <20190527090258.213ecf5a@debian9>
>
> >From: Patrick Bartek
> >My post WAS initially a report of anamolous behavior during
> >an install. I had read of other systemd quirks. (If no one knows, how
> >can it be fixed?) The last
On Mon, 27 May 2019 09:29:46 +0200
Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
> Quoting Patrick Bartek (2019-05-27 03:49:06)
> > Needing to convert this box from wired ethernet to wireless, I
> > searched for a suitable network manager and wicd looked good: No
> > desktop environment dependencies (I use a window
Quoting Patrick Bartek (2019-05-27 03:49:06)
> Needing to convert this box from wired ethernet to wireless, I
> searched for a suitable network manager and wicd looked good: No
> desktop environment dependencies (I use a window manager Openbox and
> single lxpanel), compatibility with Openbox, e
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