> > I've added everyone's suggestions because I think they were good, here's
> > the updated section on a subpage:
> >
> > https://wiki.debian.org/PlanetDebian/ProposedChanges
> >
> > If I get two +1's I'll go ahead and change it.
>
> +1
>
> Cheers, Phil.
>
> P.S. with the caveat that I'd prefe
Greetings!
I'm a planet admin although, as you suggest, I think this is outside
of the area of documented policy.
> Imagine that I get a note from a random developer saying they have
> removed my blog from planet. I understand what they are saying enough
> to believe it is not vandalism; they h
> AFAIK Matthew Garrett hasn't been "active and directly involved
> participant in the Debian development community" for years. What is
> the reason for keeping his blog on planet.d.o?
I remember that this was talked about, with Matthew, some years
ago. At the time, a least one person argued that
> Hello Andrew,
>
> * Andrew Karppinen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005-07-04 21:47]:
> > Why are there are no screen shots on the Debian site? I think some screen
> > shots would help. People can make a visual connection to what it could
> > look like. It may generate more interest in the project. I
> How is Debian related to the "Debian Core Consortium"? Why are they
> using the name "Debian"?
>
> In principle, I don't have anything against Debian spinoffs, but
> they shouldn't use confusing names that suggest they are more Debian
> than Debian itself (or something like that).
>
> Or is t
> Martin Michlmayr wrote:
> > "Trusted Debian" was an open source project too and yet the Debian
> > project felt their use of the "DEBIAN" mark wasn't appropriate. There
> > is an effort going on to update the trademark policy (which will also
> > make it clearer that it's not just about busines
> I would encourage SPI to contact their counsel regarding this and that
> anyone involved in the creation of this new entity not be involved in
> any decisions by SPI on if the submark should be granted.
I forwarded the first message in this thread to the spi-trademark list
and Greg Pomerantz, S
> Out of curiosity, does Debian's trademark policy currently say
> anything about use of the Debian mark by customized Debian
> distributions (in contrast with Debian derivatives)?
No. The assumption I've personally operated under was that Debian
referred not to a single lump of code but to the t
> I am not sure we should tell Ian Murdock how to use his and his
> wife's name. Don't send a request until we have consensus on
> that. If we do it, it should be VERY polite.
At this point, it's not even clear to me what the name of the project
will be, what the project will do or how or by whom
Ian,
Greg Pomerantz tells me that guys still haven't talked yet about the
DCC and the Debian mark. I'll contact you off list with this phone/etc
since I don't have yours. I'd personally really like to get you guys
on the same page (or see what issues remained) before we tear this
apart on the list
> In general, I'm disappointed to see so little "how do we harness
> this new effort?" and so much "how do we stop them?"
I don't think anyone here is trying to *stop* the effort. In fact, I
don't believe people have said much critical about the plans for the
group at all. I'll be among the first
> Benj. Mako Hill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > [...] a group of us decided a number of years ago to keep
> > consumers (and developers) from being confused by ensuring that
> > "Debian" referred only to our project and to our products. [...]
> > Ther
> There is a desirable position more liberal than the current
> almost-no- -commercial-use do you agree?
I think we should be as permissive as we can be and as close the
spirit of sharing and reuse in free software while still keeping our
users from being confused and while operating within the r
> This latest round was provoked by the DCC announcement. I participated
> in the DCCA meeting yesterday evening. The organization has agreed to
> call themselves the Debian Common Core Association in order to make it
> more clear that they aren't in control of Debian.
That doesn't really seem al
> Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> >Greg Pomerantz tells me that guys still haven't talked yet about the
> >DCC and the Debian mark.
>
> What happened about this? I'm not involved in any way, but I'm quite
> interested.
AFAIK, Greg Pomerantz (SPI's lawyer
> * Mako Hill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005-08-15 14:20]:
> > David, can we get something on the agenda for this? I do not have a
> > proposal but I would like to sound folks out and, if possible, have
> > Greg there as well.
>
> A proposal would be premature anyway imho.
In a more general sense, su
> Matthew Garrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > My suggestion would be that the Debian trademark should be restricted to
> > novel names and not used in descriptive terms. "Microsoft Debian" ought
> > to be permitted - "Debian T-shirts" should not.
>
> Does the Debian trademark cover clothing as
> On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 02:38:38PM +0200, Peter Vandenabeele wrote:
> > So a naming in the sense of "Debian Commercial Support Association"
> > or something along those lines would seem to make it clearer to me
>
> ... or just stick to the original "DCC" as "Debian Commercial
> Consortium".
M
> > ...
> > anyone. As long as it is clear that they are an external (commercial or
> > non-commercial) entity, I would expect no problem to implictely or
> > explicitely granting many more groups derived rights to the trademark
> > "Debian". Only the wording "core" used in combination with the tr
> Just out of curiosity, what interests do you think the DCC Alliance
> has that aren't in ours? If you don't know, have you asked?
The goal of the project seems to be create a large binary-compatible
core upon which folks can certify their software. Basically, this is
really only useful to prop
> Are you saying that it is better and easier to create a fork than
> work on improving Debian?
The reality of the situation is that there are at least 129
distributions derived form Debian and the number is going to
grow. Some of those forks can be rolled back into the fold with a
little effort
> On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> >I agree with Anthony points out.
>
> I do not.
That's alright. If we all agreed already it wouldn't be worth talking
about. :)
> >Forks *can* improve Debian.
>
> s/can\(.*\)./might perhaps\1, if .../
>
> I can't see how making the topic disappear from public view by
> moving discussions to spi-trademark would particularly help raise
> awareness.
In terms of the DCC, the decision is ultimately going to be to Don. In
terms of a trademark policy, the decision to accept that policy it
will ultimate
> So, it looks to me like help is most needed with educating about
> the debian trademark, drafting the more general trademark policy
> and summarising to SPI's board and members. Corrections welcome.
Yes. Help would be welcome in all of these areas. Of course, this need
not be a complete listl;
> Don Armstrong and I are going to be at the FSF's GPLv3 launch
> conference[1] in Boston, Massachusetts on 16 and 17 January.
I'll be there as well and will be happy to represent and communicate
Debian's questions and comments as well. :)
Regards,
Mako
--
Benjamin Mako Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> The way I see it, Debian produces an modular OS. the
> modularity of the product is, by and large[0], packages.
.. snip ..
> [0]. There are people who contribute to Debian other than as
> package maintainers, but they do have the same rights of
> uploading as anyone else.
> The problem is more one of 'how do we identify those people that aren't
> a Developer, but that do contribute regularly'.
There are a number of ways of doing this although, like NM, it's
ultimately a human process that is carried out in the context of
guidelines. Ubuntu has separate categories
> Most developers seem to agree that there are bugs in our process for
> integrating new members into the project, but that's not the same as
> saying that non-DDs should be allowed to vote
Clearly not.
> voting rights are one of the few privileges that are reserved only for
> developers, and ar
> I was also informed of pootle (http://translate.sourceforge.net/) which is
> another free option.
My sense is that pootle is a bit more advanced in terms of features and
such. I'd love to see something like this set up.
Regards,
Mako
--
Benjamin Mako Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mako.cc/
> How is "making long-term, sustained, and significant contributions to
> Debian" _not_ "engaging in development"?
If you think that Debian's long-time pro-bono legal counsel is
engaging in development, I think we're just getting bogged down in
semantics. I'm saying we should be able to take sign
> Scripsit "Benj. Mako Hill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > I think that the fact that the upload keyring is the same as the
> > voting keyring is bad. Contributors are told they can't vote until
> > they learn C compiler flags.
>
> Who tells contri
> On 4 Apr 2006, Benj. Mako Hill spake thusly:
>
> >
> >> The problem is more one of 'how do we identify those people that
> >> aren't a Developer, but that do contribute regularly'.
> >
> > There are a number of ways of doing this altho
> And maybe I'm too heavily steeped in Debian culture to take an
> objective view, but I don't see any reason why translators,
> documentation writers, artists, et al. should look at the term
> "developer" and conclude it's not for them.
First, none of these groups usually think of the work that
> > (1) We as a project (and an NM project) are hesitant to give these
> > people developership since it means they can upload to the
> > project which introduces a set of potential risks and problems
> > (one more account to compromise, etc).
>
> I'm sorry. If we can't trust these people
> > I'd like to see those who have made long-term, sustained, and
> > significant contributions to Debian enfranchised. That could mean
> > broadening the category of developer through changes to NM or it
> > could also mean another enfranchised category of contributor. That's
> > what I read as t
> As a final note, the templates are just that, templates. An AM is
> relatively free to tailor the process to the job that the applicant is
> actually performing. This is a bit more time consuming for the AM, but
> it's ideal for applicants who are involved in non-traditional roles in
> Debian.
> * Benj. Mako Hill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006:04:06 15:35 -0400]:
> >
> > > Scripsit "Benj. Mako Hill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >
> > > > I think that the fact that the upload keyring is the same as the
> > > > voting
> > AMs, the DAM and other people in the project are more hesitant to
> > grant developership to people with non-standard forms of
> > contributions. Sometimes, it's simply harder to test for these
> > because there aren't templates or even qualified AMs!
>
> Sure; it's basically a case of no one
> I agree with the sense and letter but have a few factual, grammar and
> other minor corrections, which I'd like to formally propose as
> amendments. I'd appreciate it if you'd accept them. I propose each
> change as a separate amendment so you may accept some or all of them;
> they're numbered
> At last count, the following had sconded the previous draft, I hope
> there is no problem with the changes made with this version.
I have no problem with these changes.
Regards,
Mako
--
Benjamin Mako Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mako.cc/
signature.asc
Description: Digital signature
> While we are at it, is there also a policy for *personal* blogs?
>
> It seems to me it is not just a DD blogs aggregator, we also have people
> working on debian related SoC projects and non-DD maintainers.
Yes. I talked to some SoC students and their mentors about this before
they were added.
> Hi Mako,
>
> can you please define a policy whether non-personal blogs should be on
> planet.debian.org or not?
Sure. I'll write something up on wiki.debian.org. I've put a first
very quick bit up already and folks are welcome to edit or add:
http://wiki.debian.org/PlanetDebian
Just for co
> I think planet.d.o should include any debian-related blogs onto
> it (including their non-debian content, if the author wants),
> but exclude people/things that spam it with repeat posts
> or over-long material like entire press releases. I'd let
> non-English posts on, as long as they're UTF-8
> Daniel Baumann wrote:
> > Pierre Habouzit wrote:
> > > OH YEAH!
> > >
> > > seconded++
> >
> > Ack, and when there are anyway changes on the way.. joeyh, how about
> > moving your upstream-planet[0] to something as
> > upstream.planet.debian.org (and DebianTimes/DWN to
> > {groups,teams,press,
> I'd prefer keeping PlanetDebian pure as a aggregator of personal blogs.
I don't really have strong feelings about maintaining some sort of
purity of planet as for personal blogs.
I do, however, don't want to do anything that sacrifices planets
current role of providing a great personal space.
> According to the minutes from the meeting on 2006-09-09 [1], it seems
> that the candidate dates for Debconf7 lie in the middle of June. For
> some of us, this is a problem, as June is probably one of the most
> problematic months for going for many people, especially for those who
> are studyin
> Due to a loop hole in the constitution, any group of 6 Debian
> developers can delay any general resolution indefinitely by putting
> up their own amendment, and every 6 days, making substantiative
> changes in their amendment (they can just rotate between a small
> number of very di
> On Tue, Jan 30, 2007 at 01:14:18PM -0500, Michael Schultheiss wrote:
> > According to http://www.debian.org/intro/organization, Mako is the
> > Debian Accountant:
> > Accountant -- <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > member Benj. Mako Hill
> > I'm not su
[ I posted a variant of this message onto my blog a few days ago. I
thought I would throw it out here as well. Apologies for people that
see it twice. ]
At DebConf7 in Edinburgh, I'm going to moderate a panel on Debian
derivatives. At DebConf5 I put on a similar sort of panel. Here's the
desc
>
> The people who like my blog can add it to their feed readers directly.
> I believe I've followed the rules for PD, but there's no point
I believe you've followed the rules as well. As you mentioned on your
blog, planet is for active participants in Debian, not for posts about
Debian only. The
only pushing the advice of our lawyer who, while perhaps
not the person who knows how best to keep our website simple and
streamlined, is the person who knows best know how to keep our
trademark in our hands.
Regards,
Mako
--
Benj. Mako Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mako.yukidoke.org/
pgpU7DzqPN9Sf.pgp
Description: PGP signature
w and the limits of what is
legally enforceable.
Regards,
Mako
--
Benj. Mako Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mako.yukidoke.org/
pgpC65r0ip9Eh.pgp
Description: PGP signature
a footnote would be
> called for.
Yes, but one could drop the "Swirl Factory" or "D-Labs" completely and
stick in a footnote saying the project was Debian based and it would
be equivalent. The point of the "Debian Labs" model is that highlights
a week and a half ago as
part of a larger project to define, at this sort of level, the
relationship between Debian, SPI, and several types of affiliated
organizations. Of course, I'd very much welcome help and I'll contact
the people who responded to this off-list to see about collab
ot posted for some reason. This information was always supposed to be
public and published and I'm sure it was simply an oversight that it
wasn't. I'll send a follow-up to spi-www to get this fixed.
I hope this allays some of the fears people. Neither I, nor anyone
else, is try
On Sat, Sep 20, 2003 at 07:20:46PM -0700, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> What I have done is attached a text version of the resolution that SPI
> passed creating the committee.
I totally lied. It's attached here.
Regards,
Mako
--
Benj. Mako Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mako.yukidoke.or
comings in this regard will be fixed during the migration.
The other custom distributions have set up their homes at:
http://www.debian.org/devel/
I imagine it will be in a similarly predictable place.
Regards,
Mako
--
Benj. Mako Hill
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://mako.yukidoke.org/
pgp7foVt8MN5G.
On Sun, Oct 05, 2003 at 05:07:14PM -0400, Simon Law wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 05, 2003 at 01:25:18PM -0700, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> > Since there are already people working on this, I think that the most
> > constructive thing will be to follow up on the DPL's announcement i
On Mon, Oct 20, 2003 at 09:35:10PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> On 2003-10-06 20:53:56 +0100 Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> >trademark law doesn't allow us the same latitude for selective
> >enforcement that copyright law does
>
> Can you be more specific, please? I was recently chal
On Tue, Oct 21, 2003 at 11:48:35AM -0700, Brian Nelson wrote:
> "Benj. Mako Hill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > On Mon, Oct 20, 2003 at 09:35:10PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> >> On 2003-10-06 20:53:56 +0100 Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >&g
On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 04:58:22PM +, Dylan Thurston wrote:
> IANAL, but I believe that according to US law there are limits on who
> non-profits can give money to: if the lab is not a non-profit
> corporation, SPI could not (in my understanding) give money to the
> lab. OTOH, SPI could surely
On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 05:15:30PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 05, 2003 at 03:47:15PM +1000, Martin Michlmayr - Debian Project
> Leader wrote:
> > * Anthony Towns [2003-09-20 17:07]:
> >
> > > By contrast, I wouldn't have a problem in principle with, eg, "HP
> > > Debian Labs".
> >
On Sat, Sep 20, 2003 at 03:43:18PM -0700, Derek Neighbors wrote:
> Is the only currently discussed benefit use of the "Debian"
> trademark? If so, do you want to consider other benefits? Some
> thoughts that come to mind would be allowing them some greater say
> in project issues. However, perso
On Sun, Oct 12, 2003 at 04:07:51PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 11, 2003 at 10:58:30PM +0200, Matthias Urlichs wrote:
> > > Charitable organisations have to fulfill a particular set of rules; like
> > > being educational, helping the homeless, that sort of thing.
> > True, but generall
Sorry to be replying to this so late but the part of this thread that
is living on drew me back into this where I realized I had not
answered.
On Sun, Sep 21, 2003 at 05:21:34PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> >I am curious about why? You state you don't want to see it, but
> >don't give any supporting ar
On Tue, Nov 04, 2003 at 11:28:47PM +1100, Martin Michlmayr - Debian Project
Leader wrote:
> * Michael Banck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2003-11-04 11:54]:
> > > - I talked to Bradley Kuhn to discuss the relationship of Debian
> > > and the FSF.
> >
> > I'm interested to know what came out of this, i
On Tue, Dec 23, 2003 at 10:36:09AM +0100, Paz wrote:
> just a simple question but I cant find it anywhere, I got debian
> installed at home and wanna edit the debian logo for self use but I
> would like to know wich font the debian word is in in the official
> debian logo.
I believe all the info y
On Fri, Jan 23, 2004 at 10:47:10AM +0100, Michael Banck wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 08, 2004 at 06:19:55PM +0100, Michael Banck wrote:
> > Could everbody interested please fill out that small query below and
> > send the answers to me?
>
> Thanks a lot to everybody who participated. I recieved around a h
On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 12:43:59PM -0800, Jonathan Walther wrote:
> I'd take a bullet for my wife, my mother, my sisters, but never for
> a feminist.
Just in case there is a misunderstanding here, this is what dict-wn
has to say about feminism:
feminist
adj : of or relating to or advocating
On Tue, Mar 16, 2004 at 09:18:48PM +0100, Josip Rodin wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 16, 2004 at 02:44:31PM +0100, Amaya wrote:
> > - On a talk at Madrid, Miguel de Icaza who is a close friend of mine
> > BTW, used female secretaries as examples of clueless users.
>
> Well, that's probably because that's
On Mon, Apr 12, 2004 at 07:16:02PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> Anyway, do you really want to persecute businesses who promote
> Debian to their customers?
What we want to avoid is having people use the Debian mark to
capitalize off the goodwill created by the Debian project to sell
their own service, s
On Mon, Apr 19, 2004 at 03:24:37AM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> On 2004-04-17 10:16:22 +0100 Benj. Mako Hill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >On Mon, Apr 12, 2004 at 07:16:02PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> >>Anyway, do you really want to persecute businesses who promote
> >>Debia
On Wed, Apr 21, 2004 at 03:51:29PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote:
> On Tue, Apr 20, 2004 at 10:52:50PM +0200, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> > > I think neither rendition of the site that I saw was likely to make
> > > someone think that they were buying from Debian. It would be
As per a request, I put up a page on the unofficial Debian wiki to
collect data about local Debian groups. I started it off with a
template for adding new groups and data from the Seattle group. If
know of or are part of a local Debian group (user/developer, whatever)
please go stick data on the gr
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