you can still translate it?
Well, many standards documents are as depressing and hard to read as modern
poetry...
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Do with it what you will.
Dancing Horse Hill Make money from it if you
nk we differ in where we draw the line, and that is essentially
> opinion. What do others on the policy list think?
I agree with Manoj.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
hole thing in his own words.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
nding.
Something to consider: Unlike the GPL, most licenses do not include their
own license. Most packages come from upstream in a single tarball,
including the file containing the license, which is considered to apply to
all the files in the tarball. Does it not, then, apply to itself? If so,
thi
xplicit that a DFDG license is itself DFDG it is sufficient to
include in it a statement such as "The terms of this license apply to the
license itself" or "You are free to distribute copies of this license or
any part thereof".
> I believe the consensus (which I agree) is that
, cd, and ftp archive should be enough. And on
> the CD and ftp archive, they should sit in the verbatim section where
> they belong.
Yes, but in the case of software published under licenses of the above
mentioned type, I think we must see to it that that copy is there, even if
the machine is
cific reference to any work other than itself.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
ny reason why the above license would be either
unenforceable or a bafflement to the legal profession.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
self.
If this is true (I don't think it is, but IANAL either) the licenses might
as well just stay in main.
> Could someone that can get the advice of a IP lawyer check this out
> please.
Yes. Please.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
ch agreed on verbatim but that there was
still some disagreement as to whether it should viewed as part of main.
I think it should.
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Do with it what you will.
Dancing Horse Hill Make money from i
should do what Manoj said and try our best to comply to law.
And in order to do so we must try our best to figure out what the law is.
Didn't someone mention recently say something about hooking up with an IP
lawyer for some pro bono work? We need a copyright policy document.
--
John Hasler
d copying permission, it is ok to copy parts
unless UC has specifically forbidden that.
> If it were copyright violation to change this license, then ANY package
> under a "BSD style" license which isn't the full advertising clause
> version of the BSD license would not be
ften than they would if they were allowed
to derive from the GPL, and that is very important. Software published
under defective licenses often cannot be distributed at all.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
ss of any given work.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
tribution
> conditions. [Consider perl, for instance.]
True, but that isn't what we are talking about.
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Do with it what you will.
Dancing Horse Hill Make money from it if you can; I
y are just programs.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
Alex Yukhimets writes:
> There are some traditions of UNIX that I would hate to see broken.
/usr/X11R6 itself breaks UNIX tradition.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
manoj writes:
> In conclusion, I think this is a stunningly bad idea.
I agree with manoj for the reasons he cites, but I also think /usr/X11R6 is
an ugly kludge and we should try to keep stuff out of it when we can.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
x27;t think it is going to easy to
get rid of, though.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
cy.
> If needed, we can make it clear that the package does not carry the full
> wieght of policy.
That would be best. Otherwise it might be seen as implying that only
certain methods of creating packages are approved.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
et any sort of permission or license from
KDE because, under the law, there is no such animal. The permission must
come from every single author. This principle applies to all multi-author
works.
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Ben Gertzfield writes:
> Looks good to me other than those changes.
Same here. Ship it.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
important enough to justify a long debate, but it does need to be settled.
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Do with it what you will.
Dancing Horse Hill Make money from it if you can; I don't mind.
Elmwood, Wisconsin
ot;
I don't really see why we need it, though.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
t the standard of measure be the
> program lintian. Any package with lintian *errors* be rejected.
Didn't we hash this out a long time ago and conclude that lintian should
not attempt to enforce policy?
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
d not create symlinks in /dev. Policy
refers specifically to device files.
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Do with it what you will.
Dancing Horse Hill Make money from it if you can; I don't mind.
Elmwood, Wiscon
that, I'm no expert and this one is a
> bit grey..
> Any comments on this one?
I think you are right.
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Do with it what you will.
Dancing Horse Hill Make money from it if you can;
ervers
are legal and that others can easily generate legal mirrors and CD's. If
we put servers in the US, Japan, Britain, and Germany how many entries
would the restrictions file would have? Maybe a dozen or so?
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
could contain
unrestricted packages with dependencies that are missing due to local
restrictions, and the install software could warn the user about this and
suggest strategies.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
discriminate against those who have inherited packages?
Either you are the maintainer or you are not.
> ...and uploaders of NMU's...
That sounds like a good idea.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
Arto Astala writes:
> there was a related discussion about origin field in deb, so Debian
> produced debs would have origin SPI
Please choose something other than SPI. How about Debian?
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
x27;SPI' as meaning that the package was produced by
Debian.
I repeat: Why not Debian? Why should the origin field in a deb that
originated with Debian not say 'Origin: debian'?
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Do with
Hey there, I found a great retail site with all kinds of products. Home
decor, office decor, travel, outdoors, kitchen, etc... Take a look around
at http://www.merchandisewholesale.com just click on the images of the
product to enlarge it for a better view.
Sincerely,
John
I just looked at ed and found to my surprise that it is neither essential
nor required. I would think that it ed would be common enough in scripts
of all sorts to at least qualify as required.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
and
> awk and sed are already essential, I do not see a pressing need to change
> the status quo.
If nobody is using it and everybody knows they shouldn't, I see no need to
change at all.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
A. P. Harris writes:
> I think the best ultimate solution is to eventually put X games in
> /usr/X11R6/games.
What reason is there for anything not part of the X distribution to go in
/usr/X11R6?
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PRO
Hamish writes:
> Not being an emacs user myself, I find info hard to use.
Being an emacs user myself, I also find (standalone) info hard to use.
I use emacs info, but I still like man pages.
--
John HaslerThis posting is in the public domain.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
afraid to remove them. I realize that these sorts of files are
harmless, but droppings like this are *ugly*.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
*. No software should send anything off the
system without authorization.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
Mark Baker writes:
> Speaking as a user, I'd much rather edit a script, where I can see what it's
> doing, than a config file.
No, you are speaking as a programmer. Many users find scripts utterly
incomprehensible.
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
he greatest number of users?
I don't think it is reasonable to send out mail the very first time they
fire up pppd. What if their mail configuration is screwed up?
> I think 'ls -F /etc/ppp/ip-up.d/' is easier and going to be more
> intuitive.
What's intuitive about that?
--
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
Package: debian-policy
Version: 4.5.1.0
Severity: minor
At the moment, debian/rules is required to be a Makefile, but it's not
exactly defined. In the absence of an explicit statement it seems most
reasonable that it would be inherited from POSIX, but use of GNU extensions
are liberal even in the
I think that if a company uses
its resources to maintain free software for Debian, it is fair that the
company name be listed as the official maintainer.
John
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
he source, it is in fact kind of difficult to wade
through the documents to find how to get and unpack debian source files.
I hope apt-get source remedies this.
John
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
y platform' . Finally, it makes life much
easier for both of the developers involved.
John
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
On Mon, 19 Oct 1998, Ian Jackson wrote:
ian>John Lapeyre writes ("Re: Bug#27906: PROPOSED] Binary-only NMU's"):
ian>> I just want to register my vote for allowing this.
ian>
ian>We are not voting.
This was an example of colloquial discourse.
ian>> I
A couple of those packages are mine, and it was just laziness
or oversight. In these cases they are bugs.
John
--
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
h a situation.
I am not proposing throwing people out for having bugs in their packages, or
even for having lots of them. Rather, what I am proposing is a way to
prevent people that ignore their responsibility from becoming a hindrance to
the quality and freshness of Debian.
Thanks,
John
fix this, can anyone help?" to debian-devel)
> But we probably don't want to throw out developers because of that. What
Of course not.
What you are talking about and what I am talking about are two different
things.
John
On Thu, Jan 28, 1999 at 05:25:22PM +0100, Hartmut Koptein wrote:
> > In light if this, I ask if we have some mechanism for either removing a
>
> Not removing ... could we set these developers to an status 'hold' or a
> similary
> one?
When do we finally remove someone? When they haven't logge
On Thu, Jan 28, 1999 at 05:30:03PM +0100, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
> Le Thu, Jan 28, 1999 at 09:13:04AM -0600, John Goerzen écrivait:
> > Again, as I said in my message, I'm not proposing removing developers that
> > maintain packages with bugs, or packages with very old
. There should be policy against ignoring bugs for an excessive amount of
time without good reason (eg, vacation)
2. Having that, there should be policy allowing the dismissal of people that
gratitiously violate policy.
>
> On 28-Jan-99 John Goerzen wrote:
> > Again, as I said in my
On Thu, Jan 28, 1999 at 09:29:41AM -0800, Darren Benham wrote:
> Project Leader Delegates (currently the New-Maintainers) have the "authority"
> to remove people from the project. It's up to their sole discression what is
> considered removable. Of course, if they "abuse" that authority, the
> r
On Thu, Jan 28, 1999 at 11:13:43AM -0800, Darren Benham wrote:
> > 2. Having that, there should be policy allowing the dismissal of people that
> > gratitiously violate policy.
>
> It's implicit. Do we need to make it explicit? What is "gratitiously"?
> Who'll make the accusation? Where will
On Thu, Jan 28, 1999 at 10:22:12PM -0600, Steve Greenland wrote:
> Hmmm. Both cron and nvi have some very old bugs. I haven't sent anything
> to the submitters in quite a while w.r.t. those bugs. I agree that they
> are bugs, but I also think that they are fairly obscure (no one else
> has complai
x27;t
make a different to others; they can't even get to that area.
Thanks,
John
On Mon, Feb 01, 1999 at 06:24:22PM +, Jules Bean wrote:
> That solution works well for me.
>
> Although I'd call it /usr/lib/listar, probably. (Did we dump
That's what I meant; /usr/lib/listar/restricted-executables/ or some such.
> /usr/libexec? Oh well, I'm sure there was a reason..).
On Mon, Feb 01, 1999 at 11:41:09PM +, Julian Gilbey wrote:
> An example of a package which already does almost exactly the same is
> the secure-su package, which diverts the standard su to
> /bin/su.orig/su or something like that, making /bin/su.orig mode 700,
> so that noone except for root h
On Wed, Feb 03, 1999 at 06:08:19PM +, Ian Jackson wrote:
> > at least of declaring their packages orphaned and up for adoption. If not,
> > I would like to ask that we consider drafting a policy for such a situation.
>
> I disagree very strongly with the implication that being a Debian
> dev
On Wed, Feb 03, 1999 at 06:21:14PM +, Ian Jackson wrote:
> In fact, you don't mean that it needs to run setuid. It merely needs
> to be run _as_ a particular uid. There are several ways of achieving
> this other than setuid. Two that I can think of that I'd recommend to
> you are:
>
> * us
ff the passing of -B8BITMIME or -BBINARYMIME to mailers.
Elm now does those conversions internally. This closes bug
#17103.
-- John Goerzen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sun, 22 Feb 1998 09:21:30 -0600
> not to run such a braindead MTA.
I think it does a disservice to people if Debian's default mail reader does
not work with Debian's mail servers.
On Fri, Feb 12, 1999 at 02:20:11PM -0500, Shaleh wrote:
> We were branded as idiots and people going against progress. People are still
> whining that we do not have Xfree 3.3.3 packaged.
>
> This "have to be bleeding edge" thing is getting old.
Having a luddite tendency does no good either.
R
Richard Braakman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Strange. I usually debug binaries compiled with -O2 -g, and I've
> never had any problems doing so. How could it be "all but useless"
> for you?
Because -O2 can cause the compiler to reorder instructions, move some
things out of loops, etc. Steppi
be nice. In the
archives, QA is simply described as 'quality assurance'. A long
description available with the detailed tasks listed would probably stir
some activity.
John
--
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
llowed into main. Why?
The Linux kernel and LILO requires non-free software (PC BIOSes) to
boot. Yet they're both in main.
Please don't reject something simply because it's from AOL. You need
to treat everything the same, and perhaps when you try to apply your
actions universall
in main, and have been for some time. That
was the only obvious answer that suggested itself, but if you have a
different one, by all means let us know.
> do with what the software is or who it comes from. If samba couldn't
> connect to anything but a Microsoft server and it was a NEW
ill be has a free server available: netcat. This renders
other distinctions meaningless, I think.
There's nothing to stop me from typing TCP/IP stuff to it. In fact, I do
this with the SMTP protocol from both ends on a fairly regular basis.
--
John Goerzen Linux, Unix consulting &am
x27;t mean that netcat as a SMTP
server is devoid of use. It means simply that your needs are
different than mine. I do not try to force my needs on you; please
reciprocate in kind.
-- John
--
John Goerzen Linux, Unix consulting & programming [EMAIL
tment of packages. Presumably you
and the other ftpmasters are abiding by the same set of policy
guidelines; therefore presumably there exists a discrepancy in the
interpretation or else this is an isolated incident from the others.
--
John Goerzen Linux, Unix consulting & programming [EMAIL
ource code, and you should have all you need to
write something to communicate with it from the other end.
--
John Goerzen Linux, Unix consulting & programming [EMAIL PROTECTED] |
Developer, Debian GNU/Linux (Fre
full
implementation of the client library; ie, xfree86.
--
John Goerzen Linux, Unix consulting & programming [EMAIL PROTECTED] |
Developer, Debian GNU/Linux (Free powerful OS upgrade) www.debian.org |
+
The 954,963rd digit of pi is 3.
I would say that if we are going to be putting effort into something,
that the effort be put into code audit instead of StackGuard. That
would be more likely to find and fix problems, and would not be so
restricted in scope.
--
John Goerzen Linux, Unix consulting & programming [EMAIL P
is scenario
> really do anything for free software? You're allowed to eat, but not to
> cook. This shackles you to the restauranteurs.
>
--
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
would just take a while
for the distribution to come into line with policy; this is normal.
--
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
very
difficult). Working with my g-friend under a dead-line, we have
occaisionally had been forced to boot win98. But this is only a side
issue...
--
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
the adoption of Debian (or linux)
a much more attractive proposition. This may eventually help lead more
quickly to the adoption of an open word processing standard.
--
John Lapeyre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tucson,AZ http://www.physics.arizona.edu/~lapeyre
ly want to run these libraries at runtime, i.e.
some graphics viewer needs libjpeg62, but they do not want to compile or
develop with this libraray and so they don't want the devel stuff... does it
sound sensible?
--
John Travers
"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exist
a convenient place to put
a flag which says 'ask me (the user) before enabling any daemons'
John Lines
. Anything beyond that should be asked
> for.
No, this is silly. When you install a package, it is for use. If you
don't intend to use it, why install it?
Incidentally, can we do something about the insane CC line please?
--
John Goerzen Linux, Unix consulting & programming
> --force-legal to override.
>
> You could even get rid of non-free this way. Or am I being too ambitious
> here ?
Yes
John Lines
the Debian userspace to other kernels. A
license that restricts architectural ports is unequivocally foolish, one
that restricts kernel ports is often perceived as less foolish, though
IMHO it's just as foolish.
On 17 Dec 1999, Henning Makholm wrote:
> John Galt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> w
onsider, or - if they
really have thought of a better way to do things - have the policy changed
so that everyone else can benefit from their brilliance.
John Lines
My personal opinion is that this would not really serve our goals to
promote Free Software. A better solution for us, in general, is to
educate the PHBs.
I'll supply the cattle prod if you supply the power stapler. :-)
-- John
Chad Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> My compan
he package, presumably
with the correct owner and permissions without my having to do as much
administrative work, but I can appreciate that other people may have different
requirements.
John Lines
Div0rce isn't aan 0pti0n?u
https://docs.google.com/document/d/13STSR-ziNdpuJ4MPyaTdR15SdDw93lsHxKFZTIbBdhA/edit
-
To stop reuceiving mesusages from us pleasue send an email to oeqz0215 [at]
gmail [dot] com with the worud REMOVE in the suubject line.
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to
Has anyone submitted the non-US tree to Treasury so that it can be
reviewed and exported legally? Unless somebody's done that, the current
export control laws still prevent export of it...They've been LOOSENED,
not eliminated.
On Sat, 20 May 2000, Raul Miller wrote:
> > > Ok, nothing illegal ab
c.gov,
typical bureaucratic garbage, I'm guessing (but a PITA to hand paste--#$%^
synaptics touchpads...).
On Sat, 20 May 2000, Raul Miller wrote:
> On Sat, May 20, 2000 at 07:46:11PM -0600, John Galt wrote:
> > Has anyone submitted the non-US tree to Treasury so that it can be
>
.
-- John
Julian Gilbey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> John,
>
> You originally proposed the following amendment to policy:
>
> There is no mention of the UUCP-style locking required for serial
> lines to prevent multiple communications programs from attempting to
>
=-===-==---=--=---'
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
--
John Goerzen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> www.complete.org
Sr. Software Developer, Progeny Linux Systems, Inc.www.progenylinux.com
#include <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Hi,
I know there is a www-data policy somewhere, but I can't seem to find
it in any policy document. Can someone tell me where to look?
Thanks,
John
anoj Srivastava <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >>"John" == John Goerzen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> John> I know there is a www-data policy somewhere, but I can't seem to find
> John> it in any policy document. Can someone tell me where to look?
ng of what
configuration files the package uses (and where they are), and where it
stores data (i.e., does it use space in /var) would be a big help.
John Ackermann
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
John Ackermann N8UR
Dayton, Ohio, USA
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.febo.com
-BEGIN PGP PUBL
ained one of the ones which could be leveraged to obtain all privileges.
I used to regard the levels of privilege as being similar to the safety catch
on
a gun. It does not provide you with much protection if someone takes control of
the gun away from you, but it will stop you shooting yourself in the foot.
John Lines
to log the output of an
external program. Requiring dpkg-log prevents that.
-- John
> install it unless it isn't installed already.
>
> The famous dpkg-needs-metadata-per-file thing..
>
> Wichert.
>
>
--
FINE, I take it back: UNfuck you!
Who is John Galt? [EMAIL PROTECTED], that's who!
of us with low drive space, violating DFSG 5, and discriminate
against making a small footprint distribution, violating DFSG 6. The
cat's out of the bag on DFSG 8 ATM, and there's no way it's going back in.
--
FINE, I take it back: UNfuck you!
Who is John Galt? [EMAIL PROTECTED], that's who!
bstantial size for
a non-technically derived fix, is it?
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
--
Customer: "I'm running Windows '98" Tech: "Y
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
--
Customer: "I'm running Windows '98" Tech: "Yes." Customer:
"My computer isn't working now." Tech: "Yes, you said that."
Who is John Galt? [EMAIL PROTECTED], that's who!
On Fri, 1 Dec 2000, Marcus Brinkmann wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 30, 2000 at 10:26:22PM -0700, John Galt wrote:
> > >
> > > > In the Real-World application, though, installing 300+ copies of the GPL
> > > > is absurd, and, quite frankly, a waste of space. Which se
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