On Fri, 5 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> > That's why I feeled obliged to add the remark that I greatly appreciate
> > the work of the SkoleLinux people and that they probably did more for
> > Debian than any CDD is out of any question.
>
> In the above sentence you seem to refer to Skolelinux as a CDD
On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 09:00:05PM +0100, cobaco wrote:
> -> if you don't allow temporary solutions while low priority debconf
> question get included, than there currently are no CDD's as
> custom configuration is necessary to support a CDD's target group
> out-of-the-box.
Thi
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On 2003-12-05 17:10, Tom wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 11:36:20AM -0400, Ben Armstrong wrote:
> > Then that discussion needs to be resolved so that a solution can be made
> > that is in Debian main.
>
> It's useful to try to clarify the terms so peo
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On 2003-12-05 16:36, Ben Armstrong wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 03:20:45AM -0600, cobaco <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > _ideally_ there are no changes. In practice there will be.
>
> Why?
because it takes time to change things in Debian, example:
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On 2003-12-05 13:01, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Fri, 5 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> > On 2003-12-05 11:16, Andreas Tille wrote:
> > > their fine work. I really love what they do and SkoleLinux is one of
> > > the most impressive derivatives of Debian, but
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On 2003-12-05 17:13, Ben Armstrong wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 09:23:52AM -0600, cobaco <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On 2003-12-05 11:06, Andreas Tille wrote:
> > >Debian-Edu *is* a CDD because
> > > it is completely inside Debian and
> >
> > h
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On 2003-12-05 16:48, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Fri, 5 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> > hm, as far as I know Debian-edu is nothing more then a couple of
> > task-packages at this point (and some education packages that got added
> > to the archive)
>
> I do
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On 2003-12-05 16:43, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Fri, 5 Dec 2003, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> > More importantly, Skolelinux has done more than almost any CDD in
> > terms of contributing back to Debian in both code and in
> > methodology. Their method of s
On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 09:23:52AM -0600, cobaco <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 2003-12-05 11:06, Andreas Tille wrote:
> > Well, at least for my understanding SkoleLinux is not a "Custom Debian
> > Distribution" exactly because they have packages which are not integrated
> > in Debian. This is no
On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 11:36:20AM -0400, Ben Armstrong wrote:
> Then that discussion needs to be resolved so that a solution can be made
> that is in Debian main.
It's useful to try to clarify the terms so people can speak the same
language, but as soon as you categorize anything somebody's go
On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 03:20:45AM -0600, cobaco <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> _ideally_ there are no changes. In practice there will be.
Why?
> For instance:
> In skolelinux there's currently a package called locale-config-skolelinux
> which sets up de default locale for all users. This package i
On Fri, 5 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> hm, as far as I know Debian-edu is nothing more then a couple of
> task-packages at this point (and some education packages that got added to
> the archive)
I do not compare the quality of Debian-Edu or SkoleLinux - I just want to
use the right term. Yes, Skole
On Fri, 5 Dec 2003, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> I will personally move forward with this as soon as I get access to
> CVS.
Thanks. This would be much appreciated.
> Andreas, perhaps you missed this message:
>
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/debian-devel-announce-200309/msg00
On Fri, Dec 05, 2003 at 11:16:56AM +0100, Andreas Tille wrote:
> Please see my previous mail and try to accept that while absolutely
> incomplete the common entry point for CDDs is:
>
> http://www.debian.org/devel/
>
> under the topic "Projects".
Right, this page is (1) out of date and (
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On 2003-12-05 11:06, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> > > There are no changes to Debian, because CDDs reside completely in
> > > main / testing /unstable as any other package.
> >
> > _ideally_ there are no changes. In practi
On Fri, 5 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> On 2003-12-05 11:16, Andreas Tille wrote:
> > their fine work. I really love what they do and SkoleLinux is one of the
> > most impressive derivatives of Debian, but it just does not (yet) fall
> > under our definition.]
>
> huh ?! How do you figure that?
Pleas
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On 2003-12-05 11:16, Andreas Tille wrote:
> their fine work. I really love what they do and SkoleLinux is one of the
> most impressive derivatives of Debian, but it just does not (yet) fall
> under our definition.]
huh ?! How do you figure that?
Sko
On Thu, 4 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> hm, here are the names I can remember:
>
> Petter , me, (Kurt Gramlich, Maximillian Wilhelm, Frank Matthieß -> not on
> devel as far as I know) from Skolelinux
>
> Mako, Enrico who organized the meeting
>
> David Martinez (I think), and one or two others from Me
On Thu, 4 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> > There are no changes to Debian, because CDDs reside completely in
> > main / testing /unstable as any other package.
>
> _ideally_ there are no changes. In practice there will be. For instance:
> In skolelinux there's currently a package called locale-config-s
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On 2003-12-03 21:58, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> > hm, I've added a definition to the wiki:
> >
> > A Custom Debian Distribution (CDD) is a version of Debian that is
> > tailored
>
> I do not like the term "version". I
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On 2003-12-04 10:41, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> > Can you say who the flavors people, the metadistros people and the
> > subproject people were? I'd like to make contact with all of these to
> > get more detail
On Thu, 2003-12-04 at 11:42, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
> I could almost cut and paste your email into the wiki it was so clear
> (at least Debian parent(super) project -> CDD -> Flavor).
>
> I hope I haven't misunderstood you,
No, I was just in a hurry and expressed myself inadequately.
The discuss
> I don't mean any offense to you or your terms but I think that the
> major source of the confusion is not the the imprecision of the terms
> because (as other have pointed out) all terms are imprecise. The major
> problem is the *number* of these terms. Adding one or two more, even
> with their
On Thu, 2003-12-04 at 20:23, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 13:44, VEROK Istvan wrote:
> > Subsets can also have subsets, or a subset may even come from the
> > confluence of other subsets, so there is no need to name one level a
> > "custom Debian distro" and another level a "flav
On Thu, 4 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> Can you say who the flavors people, the metadistros people and the
> subproject people were? I'd like to make contact with all of these to
> get more details about their respective projects and their view on this.
Here on debian-devel. (Can you hear me
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 13:44, VEROK Istvan wrote:
> Subsets can also have subsets, or a subset may even come from the
> confluence of other subsets, so there is no need to name one level a
> "custom Debian distro" and another level a "flavor".
I'll elaborate more in a later post, but I just want to
On Wed, Dec 03, 2003 at 12:44:17PM +0100, VEROK Istvan wrote:
> Due to the unclear connotations, there is a great deal of confusion over
> the terms "internal project", "subproject", "flavor", "custom Debian
> distribution" and the like. To clarify my own thinking, I started using
> just "subset"
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 16:02, Benj. Mako Hill wrote:
> If you apt-get install the subproject-howto you will get something
> talking *only* about creating a custom Debian-distribution -- not
> about creating a subproject for any other sort of work. The folks at
> the BOF saw a real lack of interactio
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 22:44, VEROK Istvan wrote:
> On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, Andreas Tille wrote:
> > On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> >
> > > In my view (as I said), it would be logical to name a further
> > > subdivision of that product "flavor".
> > I like this interpretation of the term
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 20:01, cobaco wrote:
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>
> On 2003-12-03 12:24, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> > On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 12:17, Andreas Tille wrote:
> > > On Tue, 2 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> > > > The term suggests that the distribution is "
On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, cobaco wrote:
> hm, I've added a definition to the wiki:
>
> A Custom Debian Distribution (CDD) is a version of Debian that is tailored
I do not like the term "version". I'd prefer a "subset of Debian". You
get a CDD together with main but you get a helping hand to cope wit
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On 2003-12-03 12:24, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 12:17, Andreas Tille wrote:
> > On Tue, 2 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> > > The term suggests that the distribution is "not-Debian", which is
> > > unneccessary and confusing.
>
On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
>
> > In my view (as I said), it would be logical to name a further
> > subdivision of that product "flavor".
> I like this interpretation of the term flavor and it would be easily
> applicable for Debian-Med to
On Wed, Dec 03, 2003 at 01:24:24PM +0200, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> If some of the people who participated in the Debcamp Custom
> Distribution BOF (see
> http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-nonprofit/News/2003/20030717) are
> listening, perhaps you could elaborate? (Cc'ing Mako Hill since he
> was
On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> It might be hard, impossible and undesirable to reverse the decision to
> use the term.
Exactly.
> I think the term can be correctly understood if you
> present it as I have in some recent postings to this list:
>
> Debian is the super-project.
>
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 12:17, Andreas Tille wrote:
> On Tue, 2 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> > The term suggests that the distribution is "not-Debian", which is
> > unneccessary and confusing.
>
> As non native speaker and also in general I try to avoid joining stupid
> naming discussions. Bu
On Tue, 2 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> Actually, I'd like to see the term "Custom Debian Distribution" be set
> aside because a "custom" something is created each time someone modifies
> an original. Debian Enterprise certainly is an original. By the time a
> capable sysadmin has installed
On Wed, 3 Dec 2003, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> In my view (as I said), it would be logical to name a further
> subdivision of that product "flavor".
I like this interpretation of the term flavor and it would be easily applicable
for Debian-Med to flavors like:
- Medical practice
-
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 01:32, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
> > Debian is the super-project.
> > Debian Enterprise is a Debian Subproject that creates
> > a Custom Debian Distribution,
>
> Subproject and custom debian distribution, here, are the same thing. No
> point "officially" having t
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 09:21, Joerg Wendland wrote:
> Fabian Fagerholm, on 2003-12-02, 22:58, you wrote:
> > Debian is the super-project.
> > XYZ is a Debian Subproject,
> > which provides the flavors A, B and C.
> >
> > Opinions?
>
> I like that though my in opinion flavors should
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 07:58, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> Debian Enterprise could, for example, have an
> install-time option to set up a file and print server, an
authentication
> server, or a web server. Those would be _flavors_, in my view. Despite
> all that has been written and referenced on this
On Wed, 2003-12-03 at 07:58, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> Debian Enterprise could, for example, have an
> install-time option to set up a file and print server, an authentication
> server, or a web server. Those would be _flavors_, in my view. Despite
> all that has been written and referenced on this
Fabian Fagerholm, on 2003-12-02, 22:58, you wrote:
> Debian is the super-project.
> XYZ is a Debian Subproject,
> which provides the flavors A, B and C.
>
> Opinions?
I like that though my in opinion flavors should only exist as
specialized installers, specialized kernels and pack
On Tue, 02 Dec 2003 22:58:28 +0200, Fabian Fagerholm wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Recently, when thinking about the terminology surrounding Debian
> Subprojects, I thought about the term "flavor". I always liked that
> term, because I find it very descriptive.
>
[...]
> So I suggest the following terms:
>
Hi,
Recently, when thinking about the terminology surrounding Debian
Subprojects, I thought about the term "flavor". I always liked that
term, because I find it very descriptive.
I wrote to Zenaan Harkness concerning Debian Enterprise
(http://debian-enterprise.org/), and I suggested that such a s
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