Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

- Original Message - From: "Tom Cooper" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "computer-go" Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2007 3:42 PM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros At 12:42 28/07/2007, you wrote: At 02:58 28/07/2007, Arend wrote: On

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

as the size of the smallest possible bet. s. - Original Message From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: computer-go@computer-go.org Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2007 12:11:21 PM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros Let's recalculate the ga

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

Let's recalculate the game space size for poker. For a given hand there are N possible actions. For a given hand and a given action, there are m posssible bets. Then the game space size is N*M*(no. of hands). DL AOL now

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

At 12:42 28/07/2007, you wrote: At 02:58 28/07/2007, Arend wrote: On 7/26/07, chrilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: This is a remarkable result. I think poker is more difficult than Go and of course chess. I am as surprised by this statement as everyone else. Of cour

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

PROTECTED]> To: computer-go Sent: Sat, 28 Jul 2007 6:42 am Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros At 02:58 28/07/2007, Arend wrote:? ? ? >On 7/26/07, chrilly ><<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:? >This is a remarkable result.

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

At 02:58 28/07/2007, Arend wrote: On 7/26/07, chrilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: This is a remarkable result. I think poker is more difficult than Go and of course chess. I am as surprised by this statement as everyone else. Of course you have to develop some mixe

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

On 7/26/07, chrilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > This is a remarkable result. I think poker is more difficult than Go and > of > course chess. I am as surprised by this statement as everyone else. Of course you have to develop some mixed strategies, try go guess implied pot odds, folding equity

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

On 7/26/07, Jeff Nowakowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Ah, an opponent model. Where's the poision? > > http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/quotes#qt0250635 > > Too much rock, paper, scissors in poker for my tastes. BTW, there's a rather sophisticated Rock Paper Scissors player named "Iocane Po

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: computer-go@computer-go.org Sent: Friday, July 27, 2007 3:26 AM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros I don't understand this. For a given hand the odds of winning can be easily calculate

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

As I understand it, bots can try to estimate and play at the Nash equilibrium. In some sense, that is optimal. Alternatively/additionally the bot can deviate from equilibrium play based on opponent modelling. Finding the NE is hard. I think that is why the rules are restricted, to make it easier

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

r-go@computer-go.org Sent: Friday, July 27, 2007 4:26 AM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros I don't understand this. For a given hand the odds of winning can be easily calculated for poker and the best play can be formulated accordingly. It's like to pr

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

I don't understand this. For a given hand the odds of winning can be easily calculated for poker and the best play can be formulated accordingly. It's like to program a com[uter to win a coin toss. I would be surprised if any side win big. The only thing a computer can to is to model opponent's

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

- Original Message - From: "steve uurtamo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "computer-go" Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 7:29 PM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros i think that you might be confusing two important things: i) the diffic

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Chris Fant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes On 7/26/07, steve uurtamo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> There is certainly more money to be made in poker than in go. >> > Yes, but its also more difficult. do you mean this in a casual, unsubstantiated way, or in an exact wa

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

> Both. > Its probably not so difficult to make a simple bot. But it is also not > difficult to make a simple UCT player. But I am sure, that reaching the > level of Polaris is more difficult than writing the best Go-programm. I have > the feeling, that Polaris is a very serious project. Its cer

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

On Thu, 2007-07-26 at 18:14 +0200, chrilly wrote: > Chess/Go... can be played in an autistic way. There is no need for an > opponent model. Ah, an opponent model. Where's the poision? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093779/quotes#qt0250635 Too much rock, paper, scissors in poker for my tastes. C

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

Already invented. There is the Alberta Poker-Server. Chrilly - Original Message - From: "Chris Fant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "computer-go" Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 6:16 PM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros Someone star

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

Someone start a CGOS-like poker server for bots. ~10 person tables, No Limit Texas Hold-em. ___ computer-go mailing list computer-go@computer-go.org http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

- Original Message - From: "steve uurtamo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "computer-go" Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 5:17 PM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros There is certainly more money to be made in poker than in go. Yes, b

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

On 7/26/07, steve uurtamo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> There is certainly more money to be made in poker than in go. > >> > > Yes, but its also more difficult. > > do you mean this in a casual, unsubstantiated way, or in an exact way? My feeling is that there are a lot of people making a lot o

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

>> There is certainly more money to be made in poker than in go. >> > Yes, but its also more difficult. do you mean this in a casual, unsubstantiated way, or in an exact way? s. Moody friends. Drama

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

I think you mean Darse Billings. Yes, sorry, I can not remember names. There is certainly more money to be made in poker than in go. Yes, but its also more difficult. Chrilly ___ computer-go mailing list computer-go@computer-go.org http://www.c

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

On 7/26/07, chrilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: This is a remarkable result. I think poker is more difficult than Go and of course chess. My hypothesis (its just a hypothesis) for the success is. There is someone - Dave Billings - who worked for many years very consequently on the topic. And he is

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

> This is a remarkable result. I think poker is more difficult than Go and of > course chess. for people, or computers? poker is a much smaller game than go. s. Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to ple

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

i" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "computer-go" Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 11:44 AM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros think poker is more difficult than Go and of course chess. I have only studied poker AI basics and coded game rules, learned play

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

- Original Message - From: "chrilly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "computer-go" Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 10:32 AM Subject: Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros This is a remarkable result. I think poker is more

Re: [computer-go] U. of Alberta bots vs. the Poker pros

This is a remarkable result. I think poker is more difficult than Go and of course chess. My hypothesis (its just a hypothesis) for the success is. There is someone - Dave Billings - who worked for many years very consequently on the topic. And he is able to motivate a lot of other good people