Re: Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

(trying to keep this on-topic...) On May 18, 2009, at 9:21 PM, Steve Steinitz wrote: On 18/5/09, Bill Bumgarner wrote: sticking a SQLite database on a network filesystem and trying to go multi-user is... just don't do it. Oops, too late for me. Its been in production at a busy retail shop

Re: Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

Hi Bill, Thanks for your high-level assessment. I've long admired your technical skills and writing, so it is with much respect that I offer some counterpoint. I'm compelled because I have a vested interest and I love Core Data. On 18/5/09, Bill Bumgarner wrote: sticking a SQLite datab

Re: Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

If you're trying to say what you think CoreData 'should' be - then take it up with Apple. (which is not this list, by the way) This whole thread is depressing. Is anyone out there who is trying to say that CoreData should be an object database capable of reading the docs? If so, what part o

Re: Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

>Core Data solves that through the use of a SQLite backing store. SQL based >data storage is the standard means of achieving incremental retrieval >and storage of data in our industry. If Core Data talked to standard databases like Oracle etc, then I can see that as a selling point. But sinc

Re: Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

Yah, it's getting there. It's just not there yet. The data modeling still isn't quite up to ORM standards we had nearly 30 years ago. When we dink with PHP and Python which have handy APIs, it can get to be frustrating. Just provide input via the bugreporter and comments to the docs, and st

Re: Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

I'm going to can the excerpts from other posts for a moment and bring this back around to helping to solve Cocoa development problems. Though you might have to scroll down a bit to get there... :) There are actually four different specific technical issues that have been discussed concrete

Re: Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

On 18 May 2009, at 14:04, Chris Idou wrote: The database situation on Cocoa is not great. Apple should spend some of that cash hoard building or buying an object database. If anyone wants an interesting project, the db4o object database which is written in Java and GPLed comes with a pr

Databases on Cocoa (was Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

really easy to write objective-c bindings for, but its commercial and much too heavy weight for most of our purposes. From: Andreas Grosam To: Cocoa-Dev List Sent: Monday, 18 May, 2009 10:47:44 PM Subject: Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa On May 18

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 18, 2009, at 4:01 AM, Michael Ash wrote: Perhaps you should have taken more than a first glance. For example, here: http://developer.apple.com/documentation/Cocoa/Conceptual/CoreData/Articles/cdBasics.html#/ /apple_ref/doc/uid/TP40001650 "Core Data is not a relational database or a

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 11:42 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: > On May 16, 2009, at 5:09 PM, Michael Ash wrote: > >> On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Andreas Grosam >> wrote: > > I really can‘t believe this. It would be a great faux-pas!  Do I really > miss > something? Is this limitati

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 17, 2009, at 11:42 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: This framework might be more useful in this case: It has similar features and a similar API like Core Data but does not have the limitation. It does look pretty powerful. --Andy

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 17, 2009, at 12:42 PM, Robert Claeson wrote: I think that Andreas understand the current design goals of CD perfectly well, Actually I missed the parts that others have quoted that seem to indicate Andreas knows *less* about it than I thought. FWIW: Instead of thinking of Core Data

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 16, 2009, at 2:48 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: (I've never worked with Core Data) Please do, and then come back with a more informed -- perhaps even useful -- critique. Given the complexity of Core Data (and the occasionally interspersed warnings, that this stuff is no "entry level")

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On 17 May 2009, at 17:32, Andy Lee wrote: On May 17, 2009, at 11:42 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: On May 16, 2009, at 5:09 PM, Michael Ash wrote: [...] Whining about how it doesn't support massive multi-user applications makes absolutely no sense. Now, I'm starting to wonder whether you had ever

EOF clone GDL2 (was: Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa)

Am 16.05.2009 um 12:33 schrieb Kyle Sluder: On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 5:48 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: Given the complexity of Core Data (and the occasionally interspersed warnings, that this stuff is no "entry level") it sounds silly that it would not support database servers, that is, suppor

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 17, 2009, at 11:42 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: On May 16, 2009, at 5:09 PM, Michael Ash wrote: [...] Whining about how it doesn't support massive multi-user applications makes absolutely no sense. Now, I'm starting to wonder whether you had ever designed a database application (or framew

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 17, 2009, at 8:42 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: On May 16, 2009, at 5:09 PM, Michael Ash wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Andreas Grosam > wrote: I really can‘t believe this. It would be a great faux-pas! Do I really miss something? Is this limitation anywhere documented? You say

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 16, 2009, at 5:09 PM, Michael Ash wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: I really can‘t believe this. It would be a great faux-pas! Do I really miss something? Is this limitation anywhere documented? You say "limitation," the rest of the world says "design p

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: >>> I really can‘t believe this. It would be a great faux-pas!  Do I really >>> miss >>> something? Is this limitation anywhere documented? >> >> You say "limitation," the rest of the world says "design principle." > > A design "principle"? Ca

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 16, 2009, at 12:33 PM, Kyle Sluder wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 5:48 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: Even more, it would in no way an exaggerated asset if it would seamlessly support to create application servers, leveraging DO, and creating web applications with minimal code changes

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 5:48 AM, Andreas Grosam wrote: > Given the complexity of Core Data (and the occasionally interspersed > warnings, that this stuff is no "entry level") it sounds silly that it would > not support database servers, that is, supporting multi-user, locking and > transactions.

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On May 15, 2009, at 5:16 PM, Ilan Volow wrote: Apple hasn't addressed the need for Cocoa to interact with database servers, so you'll be on your own in this dept. (I've never worked with Core Data) Given the complexity of Core Data (and the occasionally interspersed warnings, that this st

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On 15 May 2009, at 16:16, Ilan Volow wrote: I'm working on a Cocoa-based ERP that uses PostgeSQL on the backend. Invoicing is among the things it does. Yes, it is possible to do write such a thing, though you will have to work out a preferred way to (un)persist your data objects to/from th

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

WebKit+CSS is almost there for business reports, IMHO and I've had some success in going this route. The main stumbling block I've encountered is that WebKit (as far as I can tell) still lacks support for a lot of the CSS3 paged media functionality, so I end up doing PITA workarounds for st

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

I'm working on a Cocoa-based ERP that uses PostgeSQL on the backend. Invoicing is among the things it does. Yes, it is possible to do write such a thing, though you will have to work out a preferred way to (un)persist your data objects to/from the database (or use someone else's framework t

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

> The main > disadvantage that plain Cocoa has over a 4G package such as 4D is the > lack of a decent, priceworthy reporting front-end that can be used to > easily and quickly design all sorts of printouts that has to be made. Good point. -- Scott Ribe scott_r...@killerbytes.com http://www.kil

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

On 15 May 2009, at 14:51, Scott Ribe wrote: In the end though, once you learn Cocoa and master your chosen database & access technology, you may find that although initial coding takes a little more time than 4D, that is far more than made up for in decreased debugging time from not worki

Re: Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

Welcome, I was a 4D developer for 20 years before bailing. (Reliability was my motivation, not so much cost). Anyway, of course you can write an invoicing program in Cocoa. You have a lot more choices to make up front because there is no tightly integrated database backend. If you're always going t

Invoice program made in Objective c/Cocoa

Hi I am a 4D developer for almost 15 years. In the beginning of this year I am studding the idea of chancing my range of Invoice Programme made in 4D to XCODE/Objective-c 2.0/Cocoa. One of the reasons is the very expensive cost that 4D has when you work in Client/Server Mode. And the consta