This imposes too high a burden on any programmer who cares about
safety.
Don't buy it. That's the whole point of BigInt contagion. If fact
and foo are correctly written this will work.
It only takes one library to screw up, and the whole stack falls down.
Screwing up can occur because of o
Hi,
2010/6/18 Wilson MacGyver :
> ^ was deprecated in 1.1 as per release note below
> The ^ reader macro has been deprecated as a shortcut for meta in the
> hopes that it can eventually replace the #^ reader macro.
No, it's not that gray: in 1.2 (so in clojure master, and all new
branches like pr
On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 2:10 AM, Mark Engelberg wrote:
> Elaborating on Anthony's explanation, let's say you call (fact (foo n)).
>
This imposes too high a burden on any programmer who cares about safety.
>
Don't buy it. That's the whole point of BigInt contagion. If fact and foo
are correctl
^ was deprecated in 1.1 as per release note below
The ^ reader macro has been deprecated as a shortcut for meta in the
hopes that it can eventually replace the #^ reader macro.
On Jun 18, 2010, at 2:20 AM, Howard Lewis Ship wrote:
> I've noticed a few issues upgrading from 1.1 to 1.2; I see tha
I've noticed a few issues upgrading from 1.1 to 1.2; I see that ^coll
is no longer supporter; you now have to use (meta coll) instead.
Some of the notes on new 1.2 features imply that ^ has changed
meaning; it now looks like it's the type hint, rather than #^ ? Is
this true? I've checked around
On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 2:10 AM, Mark Engelberg wrote:
> This imposes too high a burden on any programmer who cares about safety.
Rich Hickey's branch work boil down to:
1) double/long crowd get to stop eating bark
2) BigInt crowd loses free lunch
I'd say this is a bona fide community compromi
I've been using Lein in earnest the last couple of days, prepping for
a talk on Clojure for OSCON. I'm hitting enough issues to make me
think that 1.2 needs a bit of TLC before a release.
Don't get me wrong; I like Lein, how easy it installs, and how focused
it is. I'm just finding that, despite b
On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 11:01 PM, David Nolen wrote:
> What's the problem?
> David
It's a composability issue.
Elaborating on Anthony's explanation, let's say you call (fact (foo n)).
Do you know what values of n, when passed to foo, produce a value
large enough that fact will produce an excepti
On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 1:44 AM, Antony Blakey wrote:
> > On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 12:24 AM, Antony Blakey
> wrote:
> This proposal is IMO a very bad idea.
>
Why do you need know? You're assumption is built on someone writing a
writing a bad library (one that doesn't handle long & BigInt that sho
Hi,
On Jun 18, 1:35 am, viksit wrote:
> (loop for x in '(a b c d e)
> for y in '(1 2 3 4 5)
> collect (list x y) )
>
> ((A 1) (B 2) (C 3) (D 4) (E 5))
>
> Are there any good (and idiomatic) methods to achieve this using a
> Clojure loop construct?
user=> (map vector [:a :b :c :d :e]
On 18/06/2010, at 2:26 PM, David Nolen wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 12:24 AM, Antony Blakey
> wrote:
>
> That's fine for fact, but as a consumer of library functions, how do I know
> when I should pass in bigints? How do I know when an intermediate value, for
> my particular combination
... which, I acknowledge, might be very hard work, possibly
involving every such function having 2 polymorphic variants, one
generic boxed form and one unboxed form, automatically selected and
call-site-cached like OO dispatch.
That's pretty much what Common Lisp compilers do. The compiler
Hmmm, here's an idea:
How about inside of a static function with type annotations, all
literals are automatically converted into long and doubles, otherwise
behavior stays the same.
So:
(defn ^:static fib ^long [^long n]
(if (<= n 1)
1
(+ (fib (dec n)) (fib (- n 2)
is automatically co
On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 9:20 PM, David Nolen wrote:
> The problem is that it distinctly *not* easy to write fast numeric code in
> Clojure. It requires expert Clojure knowledge.
Right, but with just the prim branch and a shorthand for long literals, you get:
(defn ^:static fib ^long [^long n]
(
I don't want to commit to a full-fledged response on this issue (yet),
but:
On the other hand, the mental burden for someone who wants BigInts
in the new system is very low - you'll get a trivial to track
exception.
Assuming that I understand your implication (that ArithmeticExceptions
At first read this all looks awesome to me, and I'd love to see prim/
num/equals in 1.2!
Type hinting math has been a pain, I rarely need bigints and would be
happy being explicit about them when I do, and I can't think of
obvious cases where I'd need (equals? [2.0] [2]), which I gather will
no lo
On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 12:24 AM, Antony Blakey wrote:
>
> That's fine for fact, but as a consumer of library functions, how do I know
> when I should pass in bigints? How do I know when an intermediate value, for
> my particular combination of parameter values, is going to overflow?
>
If the lib
On 18/06/2010, at 12:30 PM, Rich Hickey wrote:
> You raise several points, I'll take them in turn. First, things are not as
> dire as you state. Certainly one could write a version of fact that hardwired
> bigints as you showed. But you need not - here's the original naive
> definition:
>
> (
>
> The problem is that it distinctly *not* easy to write fast numeric code in
> Clojure. It requires expert Clojure knowledge. On the other hand, the mental
> burden for someone who wants BigInts in the new system is very low - you'll
> get a trivial to track exception.
>
>
Also, when done, it do
On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 11:57 PM, Mark Engelberg
wrote:
> I assume that most Clojure users really like its dynamic nature. If
> this is true, then for most of us, the common case is to NOT annotate
> our code with types. Certainly I like the idea of making it as easy
> as possible to write fast
On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 5:34 AM, Rick Moynihan wrote:
> I read through both the tutorial and the readme, and both seem to be
> pretty clear (though I'm not a new user). They're certainly an
> improvement on what came before, and it seems to be a pretty solid
> introduction. Perhaps though, there
On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 4:24 AM, Manfred Lotz wrote:
> I had a problem with lein that it did not compile all of my files and
> after quite a while I discovered that I had to tell lein about it in
> projects.clj by adding a :namespaces statement.
>
> Well, don't know if this is the intended solutio
Thanks for the responses.
Going back to the naive factorial function:
(defn fact [n]
(if (zero? n) 1 (* n (fact (dec n)
Right now,
user=> (fact 40)
8159152832478977343456112695961158942720
Under the proposed changes,
user=> (fact 40)
java.lang.ArithmeticException: integer overflow
On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 11:00 PM, Rich Hickey wrote:
> In the end, this does put the interests of two sides of the community at
> odds. Only one set of interests can be the default. Part of the point of
> this discussion is to measure the sides (so speak up people!).
I am squarely on the side o
On Jun 17, 2010, at 9:55 PM, Mark Engelberg wrote:
It's great to be discussing the possibility of enhanced primitive
support.
I like most of the proposals. But this part troubles me:
# For bigints, specify bigints
* new literal bigint format 42N
# bigints contagious, no more auto-reduct
It's great to be discussing the possibility of enhanced primitive support.
I like most of the proposals. But this part troubles me:
# For bigints, specify bigints
* new literal bigint format 42N
# bigints contagious, no more auto-reductions
* (\+ 0N 21 21) => 42N
One of the big reasons
Sean,
On Jan 10, 12:29 pm, Sean Devlin wrote:
> Conrad,
> What's your use case that requires for and not map? I haven't seen
> something like this yet, and you've got my curious.
Stumbled across this thread after looking for some CL loop
equivalents. For instance in CL, the loop macro provides,
Indeed, it appears that enclojure and NetBeans 6.9 do not mix well.
I've updated the "getting started" wiki page (http://www.assembla.com/wiki/show/clojure/Getting_Started_with_Netbeans_and_Enclojure
) with a note to reflect this, and point directly at the 6.8 download
page.
FYI, there is a
> I'm a little confused over when to use a var vs. a ref vs. an agent
> vs. an atom. For writing small (<200 lines) single-threaded programs
> when do I want to use each one?
Vars are intended for global data that is not normally modified,
except that they can be re-bound thread-locally.
http:
Regarding your def question, it never makes sense to use def inside of
a function.
In Javascript, you might do this:
{
var a = 1;
var b = 2;
...some statements that might use a and b...
}
Nothing outside of the curly braces can use those definitions of a and
b. The let form is a simila
Ah -- well that makes sense then. Bravo!
Rob
On Jun 17, 2:15 pm, Rich Hickey wrote:
> On Jun 17, 5:10 pm, Rob Lachlan wrote:
>
> > I think the enhanced support for primitives is fantastic. I'm looking
> > forward to doing more numerical work in clojure.
>
> > Quibble: Using a multiple-recurs
On Jun 17, 5:10 pm, Rob Lachlan wrote:
> I think the enhanced support for primitives is fantastic. I'm looking
> forward to doing more numerical work in clojure.
>
> Quibble: Using a multiple-recursive algorithm for calculating
> fibonnaci values.
>
> user> (defn fib-2 [n] (if (>= n 1)
>
I think the enhanced support for primitives is fantastic. I'm looking
forward to doing more numerical work in clojure.
Quibble: Using a multiple-recursive algorithm for calculating
fibonnaci values.
user> (defn fib-2 [n] (if (>= n 1)
(loop [i 0 f0 0 f1 1]
(
On Jun 16, 6:29 pm, Lee Spector wrote:
> Starting from scratch, both to try it myself and to know what to tell my
> students in the fall, when I'll want them all (regardless of background) to
> be able to set up a reasonable Clojure environment without hassles. I've
> never previously used ne
I'm a little confused over when to use a var vs. a ref vs. an agent
vs. an atom. For writing small (<200 lines) single-threaded programs
when do I want to use each one?
Also, since you can use def to change a binding how do I know for sure
that some function is not generating side-effects? I mean
You don't want to encode the whole URL, just the keys and values in
the query string. Something like this:
(defn encode-params [request-params]
(let [encode #(URLEncoder/encode (str %) "UTF-8")
coded (for [[n v] request-params] (str (encode n) "=" (encode
v)))]
(apply str (interpose
Hi,
I'm in the California bay area and am interested in participating in
ICFP 2010, programming exclusively in Clojure. Is anyone in the area
interested in participating, collaborating, or learning?
Mike
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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Clojure" gro
On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 6:21 PM, Timothy Washington wrote:
> Hey all, something very weird happens when trying to use the http-agent. If
> I execute a) or b) in a browser, I get the desired result XML.
> a) http://RESTful/path/to/xml
> b) http://RESTful/path/to/xml?_wrap=no&_query=declare default
I will take a look at this tomorrow morning. Can you please file an
issue for it on github?
Cheers,
Aaron
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 17, 2010, at 9:11 AM, Filipe M R wrote:
Hello everybody!
I followed the instructions given...everything ok till when I try to
build the labrepl project, i
Hi.
I have just started learning Clojure and I am really enjoying
myself. However, I am still getting to grips with the workings of its
concurrency model, so please excuse me if my question seems too
obvious.
I have some code that reads data from a file, parses it and generates
a CSV file. The fl
After reading your posts and thinking "wouldn't it be nice to just
kick off a thread and not care about the return value" I recall Rich
using/liking [1] the Java Executor framework [2]. I looked at
clojure.lang.Agent and saw it used there, too. It's tricky because I
wouldn't want to lean on Java
I've been doing some work to enhance the performance, and unify the
semantics, of primitives, in three branches. I've started to document
this work here:
https://www.assembla.com/wiki/show/clojure/Enhanced_Primitive_Support
Feedback welcome,
Rich
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You received this message because you are su
Hi,
Seems real interesting !
What I was not able to understand by reading your blog post, is which
subset of clojure you ported to the client side ?
Is it just a declarative API for the widgets part, or will it be
possible, as with GWT java client side code, to embed logic,etc ?
will it be pos
Hello everybody!
I followed the instructions given...everything ok till when I try to
build the labrepl project, it builds till 37% and then stops with this
output
[ERROR]Transitive dependency resolution for scope: compile has failed
for your project.
[ERROR]Error message: Failed to resolve artif
I will release an open source version of Gwt-Clojure next week.
My approach to building web applications is based on "frame
technology" which has been used commercially in mainframe code
generation for nearly 30 years. You build a library of data structures
(frames) that describe an application an
Hi Phil,
I read through both the tutorial and the readme, and both seem to be
pretty clear (though I'm not a new user). They're certainly an
improvement on what came before, and it seems to be a pretty solid
introduction. Perhaps though, there should be some mention of how the
clojure and contri
Thanks all. I've now installed NetBeans 6.8 and modulo a couple of update
cycles on components everything went smoothly and I'm now running
NetBeans/Enclojure.
Perhaps the getting started instructions ought to include a comment about the
required NetBeans version.
-Lee
On Jun 17, 2010, at
> Mostly I'd like feedback on the tutorial:
> http://github.com/technomancy/leiningen/blob/master/TUTORIAL.md
This sentence:
"Libraries for the JVM are packaged up as .jar files, which are
basically just .zip files with a little extra JVM-specific metadata
that contain either .class files (byteco
Hi Phil,
On Wed, 16 Jun 2010 21:24:55 -0700
Phil Hagelberg wrote:
> I'm pushing for a Leiningen 1.2.0 release really soon now, and part of
> that effort is sprucing up the documentation. I've revamped the readme
> and added a tutorial for folks just getting started. Of course,
> self-editing is
> But if you've got some time to look over the readme, that would be
> great too: http://github.com/technomancy/leiningen/blob/master/README.md
Unnecessary (and ironic! :)) repetition of the word "around" in this sentence:
If you use Ant, you end up copying around a lot of the same tasks
around b
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