Re: [RE-wrenches] Haticon Mid and Ends

[Bill Loesch]

James,
Glad you received at least one potential source for product, so far.
With all due respect, why do you need to replace the clips?
Any take away for others so as to not have this same issue?
Thanks,

--
Bill Loesch
Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar
314 631 1094



On 10/5/2015 10:13 PM, Ray Walters wrote:

Contact S Flex in Denver
http://www.sflex.com/htdocs/index.php/us/contact-information
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760
On 10/5/2015 7:37 PM, James Rudolph wrote:

Aloha Wrenches,
Does anybody know where I can get Haticon mid and end clips? The lead 
time with my distributors here is not feasible with my schedule.


I believe we need 40mm and 31 mm ends.

These are for old installs where the customer is re-roofing and we 
need to remove and re-install the arrays. (Canadian Solar and 
SolarWorld modules)


Mahalo,

*
James B. Rudolph*
*Haleakala Solar* *
*
*Director of Operations Oahu*
*NABCEP Certified PV Installer # 091209-155
*
*
*
*
*

*
*


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--
Bill Loesch
Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar
314 631 1094



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Re: [RE-wrenches] PV testing

[Chris Mason]

If you use the PV150 tester, it will do this test, giving you the Isc for
each panel you test. The Isc should be the same for all panels given the
same irradiance. It does all the other tests at the same time, and you can
record the results to an Excel format report, including the irradiance at
the moment of the test.
As you can string test, which will identify any strings with bad panels, I
think this should be a minimum for any commissioning report.


On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 12:57 AM, David Coale  wrote:

> Hi Wrenchers,
>
> I have found on the older panels, especially the AstroPower line, the
> problems tend to be bad solder joints.  This shows up as a series
> resistance.  As such, the open circuit voltage and short circuit current
> will read good.  It is not until you put an external load on the panel that
> you will see any problems.  If you want to draw out a simple circuit with a
> voltage source, a current source and a series resister, you will see this
> quite clearly.
>
> On these older systems I am just looking for the few bad panels to be
> replaced or fixed (more info on fixing if requested).  I am not looking to
> find the MPP output or the corrected performance of the panel with all the
> relevant parameters accounted for.  A very easy way to do this is to just
> have one or two 50 watt 12 volt halogen bulbs as a load and measure voltage
> and current across each pane with this load.  I try one bulb and then two
> bulbs in series and use whatever set up gives me the highest wattage
> reading and then use this load for the rest of the testing.  Bad panels
> (AstroPower) tend to be 1/2 the output relative to the good panels, or
> almost no output at all depending on where the bad solder joint is.
>
> If you have a bunch of panels you can take down the measurements and then
> sort through them and get the best panels for your system (I have an excess
> of panels at this point).  It is helpful to have an irradiance meter to
> make sure you are testing all the panels with about the same input for
> comparison.  The panels of course have to have about the same angle to the
> sun and similar temp to make the comparison valid.  I usually have the
> panels in the shade and then pull them out for testing so that the temp is
> all about the same.  They can also be tested in place if you can access the
> leads for testing.
>
> I have built a tester with several bulbs and a toggle switch that will let
> you easily switch between Voc, Isc and with a load using two meters, one
> for voltage and one for current to make the readings at the same time.  No
> fancy testers required for just finding the few bad panels.
>
> David
>
> On Oct 5, 2015, at 7:46 AM, Starlight Solar Power Systems wrote:
>
> > Bill,
> >
> > In the shop I have two electronic loads that I use nearly every day with
> batteries and PV modules. One is a programmable 150W, 360V that can be set
> for constant power, current or voltage (like this:
> http://www.amazon.com/Programmable-Electronic-Load-360VDC-CSI3710A/dp/B00D7QGSV4).
> It’s small enough to take to the field. The other is a 2kW model that I use
> for battery load and discharge testing. It’s too big to move.
> >
> > I also use the Daystar DS-05A (seen here:
> http://www.amazon.com/Daystar-DS-05A-Solar-Digital-Meter/dp/B00YVTXZJ4/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1444055204&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=Daystar+PV+irradiancePV)
> irradiance meter to calculate power by holding it in the same plane as the
> module to determine actual irradiance striking the surface.
> >
> > Another tool I use is a simple instant read, non contact infrared
> thermometer to check the cell temperature under test.
> >
> > With these tools and a little information, I can measure instant power
> and calculate module degradation. Others have suggested higher cost tools
> but these low cost tools have been reliable for many years.
> >
> > Larry
> >
> > On Oct 4, 2015, at 7:56 PM, frenergy  wrote:
> >
> > Wrenches,
> >
> >  As time passeth, we're bumping more into older PVs/arrays that have
> questionable outputs.  After minimizing the variables (dust, temps, sun
> angle, wiring, expected deterioration with age, etc) and still coming up
> with low numbers.  Testing individual PVs' Voc and Isc don't seem to tell
> the whole story as they often look good.
> >
> >  Would not a definitive test be to wire a suspect PV to an
> inexpensive mppt CC (oxymoron?) and then to an orphaned battery.  The
> battery would have to have a mondo (surplus) rheostat paralleled to it to
> maintain a steady voltage during the test.  With appropriate metering in
> place, you would then have Vmmp and Immp as the rheostat is tweaked to hold
> a steady batt voltage and the CC finds the knee.
> >
> >  Help me here.  I know its a little spendy to cobble up but the
> value of nailing an offender might be worth it.  Am I missing something?
> Is it common for inverters to fall off in output gradually?
> >
> > Bill
> > Feather Riv

Re: [RE-wrenches] PV testing

[David Coale]

An Isc test will not find a series resistance problem.  You have to put a real 
load on the panel or string to find this type of problem.

David

On Oct 6, 2015, at 4:58 AM, Chris Mason wrote:

> If you use the PV150 tester, it will do this test, giving you the Isc for 
> each panel you test. The Isc should be the same for all panels given the same 
> irradiance. It does all the other tests at the same time, and you can record 
> the results to an Excel format report, including the irradiance at the moment 
> of the test.
> As you can string test, which will identify any strings with bad panels, I 
> think this should be a minimum for any commissioning report.
> 
> 
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 12:57 AM, David Coale  wrote:
> Hi Wrenchers,
> 
> I have found on the older panels, especially the AstroPower line, the 
> problems tend to be bad solder joints.  This shows up as a series resistance. 
>  As such, the open circuit voltage and short circuit current will read good.  
> It is not until you put an external load on the panel that you will see any 
> problems.  If you want to draw out a simple circuit with a voltage source, a 
> current source and a series resister, you will see this quite clearly.
> 
> On these older systems I am just looking for the few bad panels to be 
> replaced or fixed (more info on fixing if requested).  I am not looking to 
> find the MPP output or the corrected performance of the panel with all the 
> relevant parameters accounted for.  A very easy way to do this is to just 
> have one or two 50 watt 12 volt halogen bulbs as a load and measure voltage 
> and current across each pane with this load.  I try one bulb and then two 
> bulbs in series and use whatever set up gives me the highest wattage reading 
> and then use this load for the rest of the testing.  Bad panels (AstroPower) 
> tend to be 1/2 the output relative to the good panels, or almost no output at 
> all depending on where the bad solder joint is.
> 
> If you have a bunch of panels you can take down the measurements and then 
> sort through them and get the best panels for your system (I have an excess 
> of panels at this point).  It is helpful to have an irradiance meter to make 
> sure you are testing all the panels with about the same input for comparison. 
>  The panels of course have to have about the same angle to the sun and 
> similar temp to make the comparison valid.  I usually have the panels in the 
> shade and then pull them out for testing so that the temp is all about the 
> same.  They can also be tested in place if you can access the leads for 
> testing.
> 
> I have built a tester with several bulbs and a toggle switch that will let 
> you easily switch between Voc, Isc and with a load using two meters, one for 
> voltage and one for current to make the readings at the same time.  No fancy 
> testers required for just finding the few bad panels.
> 
> David
> 
> On Oct 5, 2015, at 7:46 AM, Starlight Solar Power Systems wrote:
> 
> > Bill,
> >
> > In the shop I have two electronic loads that I use nearly every day with 
> > batteries and PV modules. One is a programmable 150W, 360V that can be set 
> > for constant power, current or voltage (like this: 
> > http://www.amazon.com/Programmable-Electronic-Load-360VDC-CSI3710A/dp/B00D7QGSV4).
> >  It’s small enough to take to the field. The other is a 2kW model that I 
> > use for battery load and discharge testing. It’s too big to move.
> >
> > I also use the Daystar DS-05A (seen here: 
> > http://www.amazon.com/Daystar-DS-05A-Solar-Digital-Meter/dp/B00YVTXZJ4/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1444055204&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=Daystar+PV+irradiancePV)
> >  irradiance meter to calculate power by holding it in the same plane as the 
> > module to determine actual irradiance striking the surface.
> >
> > Another tool I use is a simple instant read, non contact infrared 
> > thermometer to check the cell temperature under test.
> >
> > With these tools and a little information, I can measure instant power and 
> > calculate module degradation. Others have suggested higher cost tools but 
> > these low cost tools have been reliable for many years.
> >
> > Larry
> >
> > On Oct 4, 2015, at 7:56 PM, frenergy  wrote:
> >
> > Wrenches,
> >
> >  As time passeth, we're bumping more into older PVs/arrays that have 
> > questionable outputs.  After minimizing the variables (dust, temps, sun 
> > angle, wiring, expected deterioration with age, etc) and still coming up 
> > with low numbers.  Testing individual PVs' Voc and Isc don't seem to tell 
> > the whole story as they often look good.
> >
> >  Would not a definitive test be to wire a suspect PV to an inexpensive 
> > mppt CC (oxymoron?) and then to an orphaned battery.  The battery would 
> > have to have a mondo (surplus) rheostat paralleled to it to maintain a 
> > steady voltage during the test.  With appropriate metering in place, you 
> > would then have Vmmp and Immp as the rheostat is twe

Re: [RE-wrenches] PV testing

[Ray Walters]

I agree, many module failures only show up under load.  I just use a 
clamp on meter while the modules are still wired to the batteries.
The PV150 can capture operating current and power as well, so it should 
be able to identify most module fails.  I'm just not sure if it can do 
this without a load.  I don't believe it's an actual IV tester.


R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760

On 10/6/2015 10:09 AM, David Coale wrote:
An Isc test will not find a series resistance problem.  You have to 
put a real load on the panel or string to find this type of problem.


David

On Oct 6, 2015, at 4:58 AM, Chris Mason wrote:

If you use the PV150 tester, it will do this test, giving you the Isc 
for each panel you test. The Isc should be the same for all panels 
given the same irradiance. It does all the other tests at the same 
time, and you can record the results to an Excel format report, 
including the irradiance at the moment of the test.
As you can string test, which will identify any strings with bad 
panels, I think this should be a minimum for any commissioning report.



On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 12:57 AM, David Coale > wrote:


Hi Wrenchers,

I have found on the older panels, especially the AstroPower line,
the problems tend to be bad solder joints.  This shows up as a
series resistance.  As such, the open circuit voltage and short
circuit current will read good.  It is not until you put an
external load on the panel that you will see any problems.  If
you want to draw out a simple circuit with a voltage source, a
current source and a series resister, you will see this quite
clearly.

On these older systems I am just looking for the few bad panels
to be replaced or fixed (more info on fixing if requested).  I am
not looking to find the MPP output or the corrected performance
of the panel with all the relevant parameters accounted for.  A
very easy way to do this is to just have one or two 50 watt 12
volt halogen bulbs as a load and measure voltage and current
across each pane with this load. I try one bulb and then two
bulbs in series and use whatever set up gives me the highest
wattage reading and then use this load for the rest of the
testing. Bad panels (AstroPower) tend to be 1/2 the output
relative to the good panels, or almost no output at all depending
on where the bad solder joint is.

If you have a bunch of panels you can take down the measurements
and then sort through them and get the best panels for your
system (I have an excess of panels at this point).  It is helpful
to have an irradiance meter to make sure you are testing all the
panels with about the same input for comparison.  The panels of
course have to have about the same angle to the sun and similar
temp to make the comparison valid.  I usually have the panels in
the shade and then pull them out for testing so that the temp is
all about the same.  They can also be tested in place if you can
access the leads for testing.

I have built a tester with several bulbs and a toggle switch that
will let you easily switch between Voc, Isc and with a load using
two meters, one for voltage and one for current to make the
readings at the same time.  No fancy testers required for just
finding the few bad panels.

David

On Oct 5, 2015, at 7:46 AM, Starlight Solar Power Systems wrote:

> Bill,
>
> In the shop I have two electronic loads that I use nearly every
day with batteries and PV modules. One is a programmable 150W,
360V that can be set for constant power, current or voltage (like
this:

http://www.amazon.com/Programmable-Electronic-Load-360VDC-CSI3710A/dp/B00D7QGSV4).
It’s small enough to take to the field. The other is a 2kW model
that I use for battery load and discharge testing. It’s too big
to move.
>
> I also use the Daystar DS-05A (seen here:

http://www.amazon.com/Daystar-DS-05A-Solar-Digital-Meter/dp/B00YVTXZJ4/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1444055204&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=Daystar+PV+irradiancePV)
irradiance meter to calculate power by holding it in the same
plane as the module to determine actual irradiance striking the
surface.
>
> Another tool I use is a simple instant read, non contact
infrared thermometer to check the cell temperature under test.
>
> With these tools and a little information, I can measure
instant power and calculate module degradation. Others have
suggested higher cost tools but these low cost tools have been
reliable for many years.
>
> Larry
>
> On Oct 4, 2015, at 7:56 PM, frenergy mailto:frene...@psln.com>> wrote:
>
> Wrenches,
>
>  As time passeth, we're bumping more into older PVs/arrays
that have questio

Re: [RE-wrenches] Haticon Mid and Ends

[James Rudolph]

Aloha Bill,
They tend to freeze up out here in the middle of the pacific once they sit
for a few years.

Mahalo Ray!

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 11:14 PM, Bill Loesch 
wrote:

>
> James,
> Glad you received at least one potential source for product, so far.
> With all due respect, why do you need to replace the clips?
> Any take away for others so as to not have this same issue?
> Thanks,
>
> --
> Bill Loesch
> Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar314 631 1094
>
>
>
> On 10/5/2015 10:13 PM, Ray Walters wrote:
>
> Contact S Flex in Denver
> http://www.sflex.com/htdocs/index.php/us/contact-information
>
> R.Ray Walters
> CTO, Solarray, Inc
> Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
> Licensed Master Electrician
> Solar Design Engineer303 505-8760
>
> On 10/5/2015 7:37 PM, James Rudolph wrote:
>
> Aloha Wrenches,
> Does anybody know where I can get Haticon mid and end clips? The lead time
> with my distributors here is not feasible with my schedule.
>
> I believe we need 40mm and 31 mm ends.
>
> These are for old installs where the customer is re-roofing and we need to
> remove and re-install the arrays. (Canadian Solar and SolarWorld modules)
>
> Mahalo,
>
>
> * James B. Rudolph*
> *Haleakala Solar*
> *Director of Operations Oahu*
>
> *NABCEP Certified PV Installer # 091209-155 *
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
> --
> Bill Loesch
> Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar314 631 1094
>
>
>
> --
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-- 

*James B. Rudolph*
*Haleakala Solar*
*Director of Construction*

*NABCEP Certified PV Installer # 091209-155*
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Haticon Mid and Ends

[Ray Walters]

They need anti-seize lube on the threads.  Also, I would not use power 
tool/ impact drivers to tighten them, they not only can over torque 
them, they spin too fast which causes the bolt threads to gall. Check 
with S Flex, I believe they are using a coating on their hardware now 
that alleviates the galling.


R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760

On 10/6/2015 12:32 PM, James Rudolph wrote:

Aloha Bill,
They tend to freeze up out here in the middle of the pacific once they 
sit for a few years.


Mahalo Ray!

On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 11:14 PM, Bill Loesch > wrote:



James,
Glad you received at least one potential source for product, so far.
With all due respect, why do you need to replace the clips?
Any take away for others so as to not have this same issue?
Thanks,

-- 
Bill Loesch

Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar
314 631 1094 



On 10/5/2015 10:13 PM, Ray Walters wrote:

Contact S Flex in Denver
http://www.sflex.com/htdocs/index.php/us/contact-information
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760 
On 10/5/2015 7:37 PM, James Rudolph wrote:

Aloha Wrenches,
Does anybody know where I can get Haticon mid and end clips? The
lead time with my distributors here is not feasible with my
schedule.

I believe we need 40mm and 31 mm ends.

These are for old installs where the customer is re-roofing and
we need to remove and re-install the arrays. (Canadian Solar and
SolarWorld modules)

Mahalo,

*
James B. Rudolph*
*Haleakala Solar* *
*
*Director of Operations Oahu*
*NABCEP Certified PV Installer # 091209-155
*
*
*
*
*

*
*


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-- 
Bill Loesch

Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar
314 631 1094 




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--
*
James B. Rudolph*
*Haleakala Solar* *
*
*Director of Construction*
*NABCEP Certified PV Installer # 091209-155
*
*
*
*
*

*
*


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[RE-wrenches] DPW Rack Problems

[Ray Walters]

Greetings All;

I have used DP&W's top of pole racks for 20 years, but I've had my share 
of trouble, too.

First the lead times are horrible, sometimes pushing 2 months.
Second, the cost is approaching the cost of the modules, especially for 
high wind ratings.

Third, they just can't seem to wait till the paint is dry to pack the racks.
Several times I've had to sand and repaint the main strong back, because 
foam, paper, or plastic wrap had stuck to the paint.
This last time was the worst, and I was offered $50 for my troubles and 
embarrassment in front of the customer.
They said I should have shipped it back.  How much sense does that make: 
round trip freight shipping, and 2 more weeks lost?

Here's a page of the manual completely stuck in the paint:


Come on DP&W, you guys used to stand by your work.

--
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760

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Re: [RE-wrenches] DPW Rack Problems

[Kirpal Khalsa]

RayWe have had the same problemsBut we didn't get offered the $50
for our time and labor.
We called and complained...it seemed on deaf ears.
AlsoThey advertise pre -antiseized bolts on some of their
rackingbut it is certainly not so with their top of pole racks.Some
times the gimble bolts have anti seize and and sometimes not.lack of
consistency is a head ache
We are exploring alternatives..

Sunny Regards,
Kirpal Khalsa
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
Oregon Solarworks LLC
www.oregonsolarworks.com
541-218-0201 m
541-299-0402 o

On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 1:14 PM, Ray Walters  wrote:

> Greetings All;
>
> I have used DP&W's top of pole racks for 20 years, but I've had my share
> of trouble, too.
> First the lead times are horrible, sometimes pushing 2 months.
> Second, the cost is approaching the cost of the modules, especially for
> high wind ratings.
> Third, they just can't seem to wait till the paint is dry to pack the
> racks.
> Several times I've had to sand and repaint the main strong back, because
> foam, paper, or plastic wrap had stuck to the paint.
> This last time was the worst, and I was offered $50 for my troubles and
> embarrassment in front of the customer.
> They said I should have shipped it back.  How much sense does that make:
> round trip freight shipping, and 2 more weeks lost?
> Here's a page of the manual completely stuck in the paint:
>
>
> Come on DP&W, you guys used to stand by your work.
>
> --
> R.Ray Walters
> CTO, Solarray, Inc
> Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
> Licensed Master Electrician
> Solar Design Engineer303 505-8760
>
>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] DPW Rack Problems

[Howie Michaelson]

These have all been a long standing problem for us as well, getting
regularly worse!

Howie

On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 4:22 PM, Kirpal Khalsa  wrote:

> RayWe have had the same problemsBut we didn't get offered the $50
> for our time and labor.
> We called and complained...it seemed on deaf ears.
> AlsoThey advertise pre -antiseized bolts on some of their
> rackingbut it is certainly not so with their top of pole racks.Some
> times the gimble bolts have anti seize and and sometimes not.lack of
> consistency is a head ache
> We are exploring alternatives..
>
> Sunny Regards,
> Kirpal Khalsa
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> Oregon Solarworks LLC
> www.oregonsolarworks.com
> 541-218-0201 m
> 541-299-0402 o
>
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 1:14 PM, Ray Walters  wrote:
>
>> Greetings All;
>>
>> I have used DP&W's top of pole racks for 20 years, but I've had my share
>> of trouble, too.
>> First the lead times are horrible, sometimes pushing 2 months.
>> Second, the cost is approaching the cost of the modules, especially for
>> high wind ratings.
>> Third, they just can't seem to wait till the paint is dry to pack the
>> racks.
>> Several times I've had to sand and repaint the main strong back, because
>> foam, paper, or plastic wrap had stuck to the paint.
>> This last time was the worst, and I was offered $50 for my troubles and
>> embarrassment in front of the customer.
>> They said I should have shipped it back.  How much sense does that make:
>> round trip freight shipping, and 2 more weeks lost?
>> Here's a page of the manual completely stuck in the paint:
>>
>>
>> Come on DP&W, you guys used to stand by your work.
>>
>> --
>> R.Ray Walters
>> CTO, Solarray, Inc
>> Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
>> Licensed Master Electrician
>> Solar Design Engineer303 505-8760
>>
>>
>> ___
>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
>>
>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
>>
>> Change listserver email address & settings:
>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
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>> www.members.re-wrenches.org
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>>
>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] DPW Rack Problems

[Shasta Daiku]

Glad it’s not just me. My supplier jokes that I have bad TPM karma. 5 of the 
last 6 racks had major problems that shut my projects down until replacements 
could be made and sent. Snotty customer service too. It’s a bummer since I’ve 
been using their racks since their beginning.

Michael Morningstar

> On Oct 6, 2015, at 2:59 PM, Howie Michaelson  wrote:
> 
> These have all been a long standing problem for us as well, getting regularly 
> worse!ut
> 
> Howie
> 
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 4:22 PM, Kirpal Khalsa  > wrote:
> RayWe have had the same problemsBut we didn't get offered the $50 for 
> our time and labor.
> We called and complained...it seemed on deaf ears.
> AlsoThey advertise pre -antiseized bolts on some of their rackingbut 
> it is certainly not so with their top of pole racks.Some times the gimble 
> bolts have anti seize and and sometimes not.lack of consistency is a head 
> ache
> We are exploring alternatives..  
> 
> Sunny Regards,
> Kirpal Khalsa
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> Oregon Solarworks LLC
> www.oregonsolarworks.com 
> 541-218-0201  m
> 541-299-0402  o
> 
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2015 at 1:14 PM, Ray Walters  > wrote:
> Greetings All;
> 
> I have used DP&W's top of pole racks for 20 years, but I've had my share of 
> trouble, too.  
> First the lead times are horrible, sometimes pushing 2 months.
> Second, the cost is approaching the cost of the modules, especially for high 
> wind ratings.
> Third, they just can't seem to wait till the paint is dry to pack the racks.
> Several times I've had to sand and repaint the main strong back, because 
> foam, paper, or plastic wrap had stuck to the paint.
> This last time was the worst, and I was offered $50 for my troubles and 
> embarrassment in front of the customer.
> They said I should have shipped it back.  How much sense does that make: 
> round trip freight shipping, and 2 more weeks lost?
> Here's a page of the manual completely stuck in the paint:
> 
> 
> Come on DP&W, you guys used to stand by your work.
> -- 
> R.Ray Walters
> CTO, Solarray, Inc
> Nabcep Certified PV Installer, 
> Licensed Master Electrician
> Solar Design Engineer
> 303 505-8760 
> ___
> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
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> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
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