simple send only command line jabber client in python?
I want to be able to send jabber messages from an subversion post-commit hook script. All I need is a simple library to connect to a server and send a message. I looked at all the half-finished and overly complex projects and can't find anything that fits the bill. What I did find I can't get to work correctly, probably because everything is 2 years old and out of date. Any ideas? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: simple send only command line jabber client in python?
thanks, I found that but I can't get it to work with the server I am using. I installed the lastest verison of the Jive Messaging Server and it just won't authenticate against it. All my desktop clients work with it, I can't get xmppy to work on OSX or Linux. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Help! Host is reluctant to install Python
find a new host, if they can't handle simple tasks like this or simple security tasks like limiting permissions, how can you be sure anything else they do is secure or correct? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boss wants me to program
you need to find another place to work -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: The ONLY thing that prevents me from using Python
lazy newbie programmers, that is what the world needs more of for sure! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Obfuscator for Python Code
i guess you didn't find anything using Google? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python compiled?
there are "noob" questions and there are uneducated questions, yours are of the latter ( actually yours are STATEMENTS not questions ), and just trolling for what it is worth, if you would take the time to read what Python is and why it is you would not be asking these "questions". -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: DrPython debugger
you havent tried Komodo then :-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: DrPython debugger
oh I forgot about PyDev also, which is Free! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Why doesn't IDLE editor windows have horizontal scrollbars?
you assume wrong, most people DONT use it that is why it is in the crappy state it is in there ARE MUCH BETTER ALTERNATIVES, just pick one -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
having troubleing finding package for Twisted 1.3 for Mac OS X 10.3.x
just got a Powerbook and need to do twisted development on it, but I can't find a simple straight foward instructions on installing Twisted 1.3 on it. Also the package manager at undefined.org has 1.1.0 and it doesn't work with 10.3.x ( pre-installed Python ) any help is welcome -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: having troubleing finding package for Twisted 1.3 for Mac OS X 10.3.x
nope I was hoping there was a more "mac" way of doing that :-) I will research that and see what I can get to work, I am born-again Mac user ( last machine was a 7200 ) just got a PowerBook so I am in re-learn mode again ( am familiar with Unix that is why I wanted the PowerBook as a change of pace ) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: why python is slower than java?
yeah, but a lie unanswered by the truth becomes the truth. you state opinon as fact and someone comes along reads your statement that Python is so much slower and believes it is true because there is no disententing voice to say, wait just a sec, this guy is clueless and has no idea what he is talking about and here is why. learn how to ask questions instead of stateing opinions as fact and you might get a better response. if you had said, is Python really as slow vs Java as these 3 year old benchmarks seem to suggest, and then post what your own findings were and that might prove DISCUSSION instead of posting in a Trolling sort of way. No matter how many times you say you are not trolling and continue to post trolling style posts will make it true. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: opinions comments needed for improving a simple template engine.
the ONLY way to tell what is slow is to actually profile each of the operations, that said, start with examining object creation / memory allocation. string concationation usually does both . . . -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: how do I "peek" into the next line?
reads are not destructive there is nothing to "put back" becuase it is never removed to begin with. just change your logic and thing of about what you really need to do -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python IDE
TruStudio for Eclipse is nice for those everything must be free socialists. ActiveState Komodo is probably the best commerical Python IDE and the ActiveState Python plugin for Visual Studio is great for those that do VS. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Request for Help in OpenSourcing a Project
www.sourceforge.net -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: how do I "peek" into the next line?
read the orginal poster's SPECIFIC question he make only reference to a FILE or STDIN which can't be destructively read, either way he don't not requre the look-ahead to do what he wants. So my advice is still valid. Think about it in a different way. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python IDE
no it was a sideways remark at all the software socialists that thing EVERYTHING should be free, never said anything about Eclipse, just the people that insist ALL software should be free. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
How to fix this error in the example in 6.1.4 Files and Directories
the following code is from the Python 2.3.5 docs (
http://www.python.org/doc/2.3.5/lib/os-file-dir.html )
import os
from os.path import join, getsize
for root, dirs, files in os.walk('python/Lib/email'):
print root, "consumes",
print sum([getsize(join(root, name)) for name in files]),
print "bytes in", len(files), "non-directory files"
if 'CVS' in dirs:
dirs.remove('CVS') # don't visit CVS directories
every time I try and run it I get the following error
print sum([getsize(join(root,name)) from name in files]),
^
the only change I made was the path supplied to os.walk()
I think this has to do something with the list comprehension syntax
and I am trying to learn that part, using this example which seems to
be broken.
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: How to fix this error in the example in 6.1.4 Files and Directories
I am running 2.3.5 -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: How to fix this error in the example in 6.1.4 Files and Directories
can't see the forest for the trees, that seems to be the problem, thanks for pointing out the obvious ( that I couldn't see ) :-( -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Determine ip address
import socket print socket.gethostbyname( socket.gethostname() ) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Faster os.walk()
I am trying to get the number of bytes used by files in a directory. I am using a large directory ( lots of stuff checked out of multiple large cvs repositories ) and there is lots of wasted time doing multiple os.stat() on dirs and files from different methods. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Faster os.walk()
du is faster than my code that does the same thing in python, it is highly optomized at the os level. that said, I profiled spawning an external process to call du and over the large number of times I need to do this it is actually slower to execute du externally than my os.walk() implementation. du does not return the value I need anyway, I need files only not raw blocks consumed which is what du returns. also I need to filter out some files and dirs. after extensive profiling I found out that the way that os.walk() is implemented it calls os.stat() on the dirs and files multiple times and that is where all the time is going. I guess I need something like os.statcache() but that is deprecated, and probably wouldn't fix my problem. I only walk the dir once and then cache all bytes, it is the multiple calls to os.stat() that is kicked off by the os.walk() command internally on all the isdir() and getsize() and what not. just wanted to check and see if anyone had already solved this problem. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Faster os.walk()
ding, ding, ding, we have a winner. One of the guys on the team did just this, he re-implemented the os.walk() logic and embedded the logic to the S_IFDIR, S_IFMT and S_IFREG directly into the transversal code. This is all going to run on unix or linux machines in production so this is not a big deal. All in all we went from 64+k function calls for 7070 files/dirs to 1 PER dir/file. the new code is just a little bit more than twice as fast. Huge improvement! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python as a Server vs Running Under Apache
as great as mod_python is, there are lots of restrictions and limitations to what youc an do with it because of limitations of apache itself, and I am refereing to apache 2.x as well as 1.x, like others are saying if you don't need apache specific things it will just be one more thing to work around the design constraints it causes, twisted will be you best bet -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python as a Server vs Running Under Apache
there are lots of things you can't do or can't do easily or can't do at efficiently in Apache using python as cgi or as anyone would more likely assume mod_python. anything that requires any shared state or shared resources in Apache is next to impossible. Doing similar things in an app server or network application framework like twisted is trivial. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Accessors in Python (getters and setters)
Ed Jensen wrote: > Diez B. Roggisch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Ah, you mean like in JAVA > > Java is not an acronym. That is: it's "Java", not "JAVA". > > > where the compiler prevents you from accessing > > private variables, but the runtime allows access to these very variables > > via reflection? > > Java does not allow access to private members via reflection. Actually it does. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: function v. method
danielx wrote: > Bruno Desthuilliers wrote: > > danielx wrote: > > > At first I was going to post the following: > > > > > > > > > > > (snip) > > > > > > > > > > > > but then I tried this: > > > > > > > > res = Foo.__dict__['func'] > > res is dan > > > > > > True > > > > > > And it all started to make sense. The surprising thing turned out to be > > > not so surprising: When the expression Foo.func gets evaluated, we get > > > a method which is just a wrapper around dan. Therefore, f is not dan! > > > This is still a little bit of magic, > > > > FWIW, the function class implements the descriptor protocol... Here's > > the "magic". > > > > > which gets me thinking again about > > > the stuff I self-censored. Since the dot syntax does something special > > > and unexpected in my case, > > > > "unexpected" ? Did you ever wondered how the instance or class was > > passed as first arg when doing method calls ? > > Not knowing what's going on during method calls is exactly what > motivated me to post. > > > > > > why not use some more dot-magic to implement > > > privates? > > > > What for ? What makes you think we need language-inforced access > > restriction ? > > I knew someone would bring this up. The motivation would not be to > provide restriction, but to help maintain clean api's. If you intended > for users to use only a subset of the methods in your class, why not > help them learn your api by presenting the stuff they can use not along > side the stuff they should not? > > Obviously, such things would be omitted from your docs, but users also > learn by interacting with Python, which is really one of Python's great > virtues. When supporting documents aren't sufficient to learn an api > (I'm sure this never happens, so just humor me), you can always turn to > interactive Python. This is exactly what it's there for. If nothing is > hidden, a user could be easily mislead to believe he can use a method > when he really shouldn't. > if you prefix with a single underscore, that tells the user, DON'T MESS WITH ME FROM OUTSIDE! I AM AN IMPLEMENTATION DETAIL! and it gets ommited from all the doc generation if you prefix with a double underscore, then they have to go even FARTHER out of their way to shoot themselves in the foot. Python takes the stance of "personal responsiblity" when it comes to access control. Which in NO WAY dimishes its "robustness" or anything else. just read the DailyWTF.com, incompentent people will abuse any language features in any language, and will figure out how to break programatic access control no matter how it is implemented. Matter of fact, Java which in another thread someone was ADAMANT that did not expose private anything from reflection ( and was wrong ) specifically allows you to access all the private members, functions, everything. You just need to tell it to turn all the "safeties" off. >From the api: public void setAccessible(boolean flag) throws SecurityException Set the accessible flag for this object to the indicated boolean value. A value of true indicates that the reflected object should suppress Java language access checking when it is used. A value of false indicates that the reflected object should enforce Java language access checks. Setting the accessible flag in a reflected object permits sophisticated applications with sufficient privilege, such as Java Object Serialization or other persistence mechanisms, to manipulate objects in a manner that would normally be prohibited. so anything added to Python to enforce "access control" would immediately be forced to provide some means to over-ride the checks for pickle and the like. Not to even mention the argument that it would break crap loads of existing code base. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: function v. method
Antoon Pardon wrote: > Suppose I am writing my own module, I use an underscore, to > mark variables which are an implementation detail for my > module. > > Now I need to import an other module in my module and need access > to an implementation variable from that module. So now I have > variables with an underscore which have two different meanings: you don't understand what "implementation detail" means, it means it is NOT part of the public API and no client code should ever use it. If you reference _vara in your code and it is in someone elses module you don't understand YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO DO THAT! > 1) This is an implemantation detail of this module, It is the > users of my module who have to be extra carefull using it. Users of your module should NEVER KNOW any of the _ or __ stuff exists to begin with. > 2) This is an implemantation detail of the other module, > I should be extra carefull using it. You should NEVER use it. > And I find variable starting or ending with an underscore ugly. :-) > > -- > Antoon Pardon But like my previous post states, you can mark stuff private in Java all you want, you can still access. Having the compiler or runtime enforce that just adds an extra step to turn that enforcement off. You can do the same thing, in C++. So WHY does a language need this enforcement. And the "large code base" needs the "robustness" is not a valid argument. Since Apple has proven this NOT to be the case with Cocoa which is in Objective-C and "knows about access control but doesn't really use them" Anyone that things a language HAS to have these constructs enforced by the compiler or runtime, lacks disipline. Python has exactly what every other language EFFECTIVELY has, a common way to document or "tag" what is _private but might need "Friend" access, and what is REALLY __private. If you don't like this, then that is your problem go use a language that gives you that false sense of secuirty, don't expect it to change. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: An optparse question
T wrote: > I have a short program using optparse.OptionParser that prints out help > message with -h flag: > > % myprog.py -h > usage: myprog.py [options] input_file > > options: > -h, --help show this help message and exit > -v, --verboseprint program's version number and exit > -o FILE Output file > > > My question is, is there a way to print a blank line (or any string) > before "usage: myprog.py [options] input_file" ? I tried using > callbacks without success. I think somehow I need to modify the > behavior of optparse.OptionParser.print_usage() function? you can make the usage line anything you want. ... usage = 'This is a line before the usage line\nusage %prog [options] input_file' parser = OptionsParser(usage=usage) parser.print_help() ... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: function v. method
Gerhard Fiedler wrote: > On 2006-07-22 16:32:38, danielx wrote: > > ...and source code... > >>> > >>> *shudders* What happened to all the goodness of abstraction? > >> > >> Abstraction as you seem to use it requires complete docs of the interface. > >> Which is what you said you don't have... So the original abstractor broke > >> the abstraction when publishing insufficient docs, not the one who looks > >> into the sources to find out what actually happens. > > > > Absolutely. I didn't mean the user was breaking abstraction (let's not > > blame the victim). I was saying that we should really have more > > sympathy for him. > > I have all the sympathy in the world for him... after all, he's me :) > > But one reason why I try to write (and insist on as much as possible from > people writing for or with me) self-documenting code is that wherever you > have documentation and code separated (which is the case of API docs), you > can bet (without losing) that sooner or later code and doc will diverge. > This has a probability that approaches 1 :) > > So, I agree with you that good API docs are a good thing, as they tell me > everything I need to know without having to wade through tons of > implementation details that may be interesting but don't serve my immediate > need (of having to use the API). But reality seems to be (and mine so far > definitely is) that these docs, even the good ones, are not completely in > alignment with the reality of the code. (We all know that code has bugs... > and the API always describes, at best, how the code /should/ work. It never > describes how it actually works, including the bugs (this > notwithstanding the bugs that have been elevated to features and henceforth > been described in the API docs). > > So... the final authority /is/ the code. I don't see an alternative. For > me, good abstraction doesn't mean I don't have to read the sources; good > abstraction means (among other things) that I can read the sources easily. > > Gerhard having auto generated docs, which means the documentatin is in the code as doc strings, javadoc, reflex, or whatever format is the BEST way of doing API documentation, period. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: function v. method
Antoon Pardon wrote: > On 2006-07-21, fuzzylollipop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Antoon Pardon wrote: > > > >> Suppose I am writing my own module, I use an underscore, to > >> mark variables which are an implementation detail for my > >> module. > >> > >> Now I need to import an other module in my module and need access > >> to an implementation variable from that module. So now I have > >> variables with an underscore which have two different meanings: > > > > you don't understand what "implementation detail" means, it means it is > > NOT part of the public API and no client code should ever use it. > > > > If you reference _vara in your code and it is in someone elses module > > you don't understand YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO DO THAT! > > Why do you assume that in my example the other module is > not understood? > > >> 1) This is an implemantation detail of this module, It is the > >> users of my module who have to be extra carefull using it. > > > > Users of your module should NEVER KNOW any of the _ or __ stuff exists > > to begin with. > > > >> 2) This is an implemantation detail of the other module, > >> I should be extra carefull using it. > > > > You should NEVER use it. > > Well that may be your view, but AFAICS it is not the view of > the python community. Because each time some mechanism is > proposed for real private variable, people oppose it, they > want people to have access to what are supposed to be > private variables. > > -- > Antoon Pardon actually you are really way off base, the _ and __ convention IS the INTENDED way of doing private and "really private" documentation of members in Python. I didn't make this up, it is in the official Python documentation. You need to read my previous response for COMPREHENSION one more time. There is LESS THAN ZERO value in having a runtime enforcement of member access control. Python does have ALREADY have an OFFICAL mechanism for private members, prefix your names with _ or __. Both are ommited from autogenerated docuementation and both are OFFICALLY not supposed to be used. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Announcing Switch, the CSS Preprocessor!
Dave wrote: > Powered by Mod_Python, Switch CSS is a full featured, production ready > > The sourceforge project link follows. We could really use some tire > kickers... This group was invaluable in the early development process, > so we're announcing it officially here, and on mod_python first. > > https://sourceforge.net/projects/switchcss/ > > Thanks, > Dave Worley Is there any documentation or anything available? The sourceforge home page is empty? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Anyone have a link handy to an RFC 821 compliant email address regex for Python?
I want to do email address format validations, without turning to ANTLR or pyparsing, anyone know of a regex that is COMPLIANT with RFC 821. Most of the ones I have found from google searches are not really as robust as I need them to be. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python to use a non open source bug tracker?
Giovanni Bajo wrote: > Hello, > > I just read this mail by Brett Cannon: > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-October/069139.html > where the "PSF infrastracture committee", after weeks of evaluation, > recommends > using a non open source tracker (called JIRA - never heard before of course) > for Python itself. > > Does this smell "Bitkeeper fiasco" to anyone else than me? > -- > Giovanni Bajo No just ignorance you your part! Jira is given away for free to open source projects that want to use it. And it just happens to be one of the best issue trackers on the market, free or paid or opens source or not. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: 10GB XML Blows out Memory, Suggestions?
K.S.Sreeram wrote: > Diez B. Roggisch wrote: > > What the OP needs is a different approach to XML-documents that won't > > parse the whole file into one giant tree - but I'm pretty sure that > > (c)ElementTree will do the job as well as expat. And I don't recall the > > OP musing about performances woes, btw. > > > There's just NO WAY that the 10gb xml file can be loaded into memory as > a tree on any normal machine, irrespective of whether we use C or > Python. So the *only* way is to perform some kind of 'stream' processing > on the file. Perhaps using a SAX like API. So (c)ElementTree is ruled > out for this. > > Diez B. Roggisch wrote: > > No what exactly makes C grok a 10Gb file where python will fail to do so? > > In most typical cases where there's any kind of significant python code, > its possible to achieve a *minimum* of a 10x speedup by using C. In most > cases, the speedup is not worth it and we just trade it for the > increased flexiblity/power of the python language. But in this situation > using a bit of tight C code could make the difference between the > process taking just 15mins or taking a few hours! > > Ofcourse I'm not asking him to write the entire application in C. It > makes sense to just write the performance critical sections in C, and > wrap it in Python, and write the rest of the application in Python. you got no idea what you are talking about, anyone knows that something like this is IO bound. CPU is the least of his worries. And for IO bound applications Python is just as fast as any other language. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: 10GB XML Blows out Memory, Suggestions?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Paul, > > This is interesting. Unfortunately, I have no control over the XML > output. The file is from Goldmine. However, you have given me an > idea... > > Is it possible to read an XML document in compressed format? compressing the footprint on disk won't matter, you still have 10GB of data that you need to process and it can only be processed uncompressed. I would just export the data in smaller batches, there should not be any reason you can't export subsets and process them that way. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: 10GB XML Blows out Memory, Suggestions?
Fredrik Lundh wrote: > fuzzylollipop wrote: > > > you got no idea what you are talking about, anyone knows that something > > like this is IO bound. > > which of course explains why some XML parsers for Python are a 100 times > faster than other XML parsers for Python... > dependes on the CODE and the SIZE of the file, in this case processing 10GB of file, unless that file is heavly encrypted or compressed will, the process will be IO bound PERIOD! And in the case of XML unless the PARSER is extremely inefficient, and I assume, that would be an edge case, the parser is NOT the bottle neck in this case. The relativel performance of Python XML parsers is irrelvant in relationship to this being an IO bound process, even the slowest parser could only process the data as fast as it can be read off the disk. Anyone saying that using C instead of Python will be faster when 99% of the time in this case is just waiting on the disk to feed a buffer, has no idea what they are talking about. I work with TeraBytes of files, and all our Python code is just as fast as equivelent C code for IO bound processes. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: 10GB XML Blows out Memory, Suggestions?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Thanks guys for all your posts... > > So I am a bit confusedFuzzy, the code I saw looks like it > decompresses as a stream (i.e. per byte). Is this the case or are you > just compressing for file storage but the actual data set has to be > exploded in memory? > it wasn't my code. if you zip the 10GB and read from the zip into a DOM style tree, you haven't gained anything, except adding additional CPU requirements to do the decompression. You still have to load the entire thing into memory. There are differences in XML Parsers, IN EVERY LANGUAGE a poorly written parser is a poorly written parser. Using the wrong IDIOM is more of a problem than anything else. DOM parsers are good when you need to read and process every element and attribute and the data is "small". Granted, "small" is relative, but no body will consider 10GB "small". SAX style or a pull-parser has to be used when the data is "large" or when you don't really need to process every element and attribute. This problem looks like it is just a data export / import problem. In that case you will either have to use a sax style parser and parse the 10GB file. Or as I suggested in another reply, export the data in smaller chunks and process them separately, which in almost EVERY case is a better solution to do batch processing. You should always break processing up into as many discreet steps as possible. Make for easier debugging and you can start over in the middle much easier. Even if you just write a simple SAX style parser to just break the file up into smaller pieces to actually process it you will be ahead of the game. We have systems that process streaming data coming from sockets in XML format, that run in Java with very little memory footprint and very little CPU usage. At 50 megabit a sec, that is about 4TB a day. C wouldn't read from a socket any faster than the NBIO, actually it would be harder to get the same performance in C because we would have to duplicate all the SEDA style NBIO. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: 10GB XML Blows out Memory, Suggestions?
Fredrik Lundh wrote: > fuzzylollipop wrote: > > > SAX style or a pull-parser has to be used when the data is "large" or > > when you don't really need to process every element and attribute. > > > > This problem looks like it is just a data export / import problem. In > > that case you will either have to use a sax style parser and parse the > > 10GB file. Or as I suggested in another reply, export the data in > > smaller chunks > > or use a parser that can do the chunking for you, on the way in... > > in Python, incremental parsers like cET's iterparse and the one in Amara > gives you *better* performance than SAX (including "raw" pyexpat) in > many cases, and offers a much simpler programming model. > > thats good to know, I haven't worked with cET yet. Haven't had time to get it installed :-( -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pros/Cons of Turbogears/Rails?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Looks like you mixing comparisons. > Ruby: > + More mature system. More stable? More features? uh, no, Python predates Ruby by a good bit Rails might be "older" than Turbogears but it still JUST went 1.0 officially. It can't be called "mature' by any defintition. > + Much better documented. This is a biggie. Rails has no documentation, period. The authors acknowledge this openly. > + Built-in Rubydoc system would make documenting the > system easier. (IMHO, developers almost always > underestimate the need for good documentation that > is written along withe the system.) Is there a > Python doc system that has received Guido's blessing > yet? D'oxygen would seem an obvious choice. Pydoc IS standard. This has been around for a long time. > + Better coordination with Javascript helper code? Again, is this a Python vs Ruby or Turbogears vs Rails post, you seem highly confused on the distinctions between language vs framework. > I was initially leaning towards Rails due to maturity, > but the most recent version of TurboGears seem to have > fixed a lot of the "ad hoc" feeling I got from previous > versions. But I'm still very much up in the air. > again, Ruby can't be considered 'mature' by any definition. > Thanks, > Ken > > P.S. If I wanted to provide an image by streaming the > file data directly over the connection, rather than by > referring to an image file, how would I do that? I'd > like to build code that would allow images to be assembled > into a single-file photo album (zip or bsddb file), and > so can't refer to them as individual image files. ?? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pros/Cons of Turbogears/Rails?
Paul Boddie wrote: > > fuzzylollipop wrote: > > > uh, no, Python predates Ruby by a good bit > > > Rails might be "older" than Turbogears but it still JUST went 1.0 > > > officially. > > > It can't be called "mature' by any defintition. > > Version numbers are a fairly useless general metric of project > maturity, taken in isolation. > But 1.0 releases do mean something, it means the DEVELOPER of the package things it is just now ready for general consumption. That means something regardless of what the number is. Matter of fact, all major version releaese mean that, it is generally understood thing. x.0 means this is now ready for non-beta general use. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pros/Cons of Turbogears/Rails?
Ray wrote: > fuzzylollipop wrote: > > uh, no, Python predates Ruby by a good bit > > Rails might be "older" than Turbogears but it still JUST went 1.0 > > officially. > > It can't be called "mature' by any defintition. > > But at least in most developers' perception ... nobody is talking about perception -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pros/Cons of Turbogears/Rails?
Paul Boddie wrote: > fuzzylollipop wrote: > > Paul Boddie wrote: > > > > fuzzylollipop wrote: > > > > > uh, no, Python predates Ruby by a good bit > > > > > Rails might be "older" than Turbogears but it still JUST went 1.0 > > > > > officially. > > > > > It can't be called "mature' by any defintition. > > > > > > Version numbers are a fairly useless general metric of project > > > maturity, taken in isolation. > > > > But 1.0 releases do mean something, it means the DEVELOPER of the > > package things it is just now ready for general consumption. That means > > something regardless of what the number is. > > In various open source circles, the mere usage of 1.0 may indicate some > kind of stability, but not necessarily maturity, or at least the desire > of the developers to persuade users that the code is ready for them to > use. nope in GENERAL usage, 1.x means that the developer is designating a version that is feature complete and stable. I never ever mentioned comparing version numbers between differing packages. MY POINT was the developers of Rails JUST RECENTLY decided that it was ready for general consumption compared to all the PREVIOUS Rails releases. And NONE of these frameworks has been used to power anything along the scale of what I work with on a daily basis. And speaking from experience, autogenerated "Active Object Pattern" frameworks dont' scale. And Rails is no exception. It didn't work 10 years ago when all the ORM vendors were selling ridiculously price "point and click" database application builders, what makes people think it will now? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pros/Cons of Turbogears/Rails?
Sam Smoot wrote: big rant snipped since Google Groups has what I responding to: > So if you decide to reply, might I suggest spending a few minutes with > Google to get your facts straight next time? Oh, and keeping an eye on > the actual topic might be a good idea too. I got my facts straight, Ruby is not tested in production environments. And I am speaking from a BIG internet site scale. Apache is mature, there is a definition of mature tested in the wild in production, and you qualified your opinion by excluding edge cases, the internet is NOTHING BUT EDGE CASES. Just look at the SMTP and HTTP RFC's they are nothing but edge cases. And read the entire thread, I am the one that specifically stated that the original poster was confused on what he was asking about. Let me make it really clear. Neither Ruby NOR Rails is "mature" by ANY REASONABLE definition. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: IDE
Aravind wrote: > hi, > > i am a newbie to python but used with some developement in c++ and VB. Can > anyone suggest me a good IDE for python for developing apps...? i've seen Qt > designer.. some of my friends said it can be used for python also but they r > not sure. > > pls help... > > thanks in advance Active State Komodo Runs on Windows, Linux and Mac OS X there is even a cheap $29 personal version available. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is there a maximum length of a regular expression in python?
this should really be posted to http://www.thedailywtf.com/, I wonder if they have a german version of TheDailyWTF.com? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Dealing with marketing types...
get your resume in order and start looking . . . -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Dealing with marketing types...
i think he was actually referering the the architecture astronauts that Joel Spolskyl was talking about -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Dealing with marketing types...
I was completely serious, he is _NOT_ going to win this one. He has already lost. I have been on both sides of this scenario, the "new guys" were brought in and will win since they are the new "experts from out of town". There may be some other _VALID_ business reason that management has already made up their mind to hire these Java people. Probably because they want to sell the company or merge with someone or something and having a Java product would make them more attractive. There are 2 things he can do. 1. Get your resume ready and approach the CEO or whomever and say. Why is this happening? Since I can guarantee you they have already decided to port this app to Java. 2. Be quiet, keep his head down, learn Java fatt, start agreeing with the new party line and get on the bandwagon if he really wants to stay at this company ( I wouldn't ) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Dealing with marketing types...
I agree about the stiffing the guys that brought you to the party, that was 100% the DotCom plan, offer crap salary and tonnes of "options" then fire/replace all the people that worked for _FREE_ practically when the next round of funding comes in, rinse, repeat. Either way . . . I think the guy needs to move on. I know I would. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Dealing with marketing types...
man this is the worst advice I have ever heard, you can't "walk away with code" someone else paid you to write. Regardless of what your perceived slight is. NEVER take code you were paid to write unless you have it in writing that you can, you will lose that one everytime. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
What is wrong with the Python home page?
I am using FireFox 1.5.2 on OS X 10.4.6 and the www.python.org ends up being only text with just the nasa picture with the guy in the space suit. It looks like the CSS is hosed or something. And trying to go to the module docs for the current release is broken as well -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: which is better, string concatentation or substitution?
niether .join() is the fastest -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
How to log only one level to a FileHandler using python logging module.
I want a FileHandler to only log a single level say for example logging.INFO, and nothing else. do I need to create a custom Handler for this or is this doable with some magic that is not documeneted somewhere? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Simple DAV server?
webfolders is broken, I have worked on webdav support at the isp level ( for millions of customers to use ) webfolders is NOT something you should base compliancey on. It is broken so badly that we decided to just not even test against it. We provide our customers with our own application with which to map drive letters to mount webdav our webdav store so we don't have to even worry about Web Folders not working. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
