Re: Yes..., I can destroy your system!
Mario Torre wrote: Il lun, 2003-01-20 alle 22:09, Derek Martin ha scritto: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Sun, Jan 19, 2003 at 02:58:41PM -0800, zhiren wrote: Really interesting! Let me prove it, so you can see it for yourself: 1. Let's create a file name asdf in your home folder; 2. Then (1) start OpenOffice, (2) Alt-T-M to open the macro dialog, and enter this code: Sub AViciousCode Shell( "rm -rf ./asdf",2) end sub 3. Now run it to see your asdf file has gone! That's kinda ugly. You should post this to bugtraq, if you haven't already. This only work if you are using OO under Linux/Solaris, but I think should be trivial to implement something that can detect the operating system, though. What if the user is running on a M$ platform with Cygwin or has a W32 port of rm ? It should still work, right. ...snip... -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: how do I install to Hw RAID (Promise 20265 Fasttrak 100)
Hi There was some discussion about this a while back. There were some tests done and IIRC the promise controler had better performance when used as a standard IDE controller using the linux software raid. Again IIRC the raid "firmware" on the card actually just enables a BIOS extension and the raid runs in BIOS. Since the raid is not running in hardware on the card, but uses the system processor, this could be defined as software raid. The fact that it comes from an eprom and runs as a BIOS program does not negate the fact that it uses the system processor. True hardware raid does all of its processing on the card itself with it's own processor. This type of raid card is equivilent to a soft modem in the modem category. If you want a good ATA RAID card, the best I have researched are from 3ware. 3ware also actively supports linux and there drivers are in the maintained in the kernel source. There have been benchmark tests and the 3ware ATA RAID cards blew everyone out of the water in RAID mode and in JBOD mode. Guy Charles A. Crayne wrote: > On Thu, 16 Jan 2003 17:03:54 -0500 Michael George <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > :Are you sure that the FastTrack 100 TX2 is actually software RAID? If > that's :the case, why wouldn't one just put one drive on each of their MB > ATA :controllers and run software RAID on the system? > > It is NOT software RAID from the point of view of the linux kernel, and > there is a separate hardware controller for the IDE RAID arrays [which can > be disabled by a physical jumper] than there is for non-RAID IDE drives, > but Peter feels that since it takes a device driver to make the RAID array > look like a single drive, then it should be called software RAID. > > -- Chuck > > > -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Yes..., I can destroy your system!
Hi You are correct to a point. Any user in on a windows platform that has is in group administrators is dangerous. QUICK TIP: To run programs as root, when required you can use "sudo". EXPANDED: When running as root, edit "/etc/sudoers" and grant yourself privledge to certain commands or all commands. Then when running as a regular user you can execute the enabled commands like this : sudo /sbin/ifconfig If the commands have pipes or redirection then theres a trick required. EXTRA TRICK: sudo bash -c "cat /etc/hosts >/dev/null" This is how you can run commands requiring pipes "|" or redirection ">". Limiting users access to "special" commands can help with security and flexibility conflicts, this is done the best using sudo. Guy Buck wrote: Hello everyone, I found this thread interesting reading. I am one of those "ordinary Win*DOH*s" users referred to earlier in the thread. I started using windows with vs 1.0 or so. I think I skipped 2.x and then used 3.0 and every version since then as well as every version of nt since 4.0. I manage a small network that is served by Windows 2000 Pro (not server) and will have to upgrade it to handle more users in the next 6 months or so. In the meantime I am trying to learn enough to setup a Linux server instead of continuing with m$. One of the contributors mentioned earlier about not running things as "root". The only book I have for Linux is Red Hat Linux 7.2 Bible. Well, I haven't learned very much about Linux yet, but the book taught me to create a user account and do all work from the user account and not to use the root user at all. It says, rather, to use the superuser command as needed. As a result of what I learned from the book, I have gone back to all my XP/2000 computers and changed all users back to "user" and setup special admin accounts for those occasions when it is required to use admin privileges. I discussed this issue on the NT listserv and learned that while it isn't a perfect solution, using "user" privileges offers a lot of protection even in NT based windows. There is definitely a learning curve to cross over from windoze to Linux. As I have 8.0 questions, I will be posting them here. Buck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Jesse Keating Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 6:49 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Yes..., I can destroy your system! On Sunday 19 January 2003 14:58, zhiren wrote: 1. Let's create a file name asdf in your home folder; 2. Then (1) start OpenOffice, (2) Alt-T-M to open the macro dialog, and enter this code: Sub AViciousCode Shell( "rm -rf ./asdf",2) end sub 3. Now run it to see your asdf file has gone! There are other problems, such as the fact that OO.o will only run macros from a file opened within certian directories. /home/$username is one of them, but not any subdirectories. So, unless you download the email message to your home directory, and _then_ open it, you won't have a problem. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Yes..., I can destroy your system!
Hi Yes that is correct, but most new users do not know how to use vi or most alternate console text editors. I usualy alias pico to "pico -w" then export EDITOR as pico, because I prefer it for quick editing. I use vi for bulk editing. Since most new users probably have not installed pine, what I do probably wouldn't have helped. When I run visudo after I have made these changes visudo uses 'pico -w' to do the editing rather than vi. NOTE: Pico's "-w" option turns off automatic wraping which can be a pain when editing config files. Using a GUI text editor to copy/modify one of the examples is fairly straight forward, as I intended my suggestion to be. Rui Miguel Seabra wrote: On Tue, 2003-01-21 at 19:06, Guy Fraser wrote: EXPANDED: When running as root, edit "/etc/sudoers" and grant yourself privledge to certain commands or all commands. Then when running as a regular user you can execute the enabled commands like this : sudo /sbin/ifconfig Enhanced editing: visudo That command will edit /etc/sudoers AND check for syntax on exit. Very helpful. Rui -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Excellent signature
Gregory L. Hering wrote:
Dear Rob,
If you already know this, this may sound patronizing, but that's not my
intent...
The article is not about preventing the spread of viruses (unless you
consider Microsoft Corporation a virus).
Yes, and why not.
They are simply complaining about proprietary formats. They are
attempting to 'spit into the wind' by refusing M$ documents and calling them
'secret' (in a somewhat vain attempt at forcing a 'cloak and dagger' motif
on them).
The fact that the compatability of word versionss changes yeary is what I
personaly can't stand.
And if the 'virus' being spread is a Word Macro virus, then converting
it to HTML would (I think) effectively render it harmless since the browser
won't invoke the same macros. Don't quote me on that one; I'm no expert.
Html is a document formatting 'language'. Unless it contains ActiveXScript or
JavaScript it should be harmless.
I also doubt that Bill Gates would laugh at a widespread effort to
refuse his company's formats, even if it was for a 'stupid' reason.
I doubt he even cares, unless millions of people stop using word it won't make
much of a difference to him. Besides M$ could drop off the planet tommorrow
and he would still have enough money to buy his own country for his family to
live in for generations without want for anything.
I would agree the idea of encouraging people to send plain text messages
or HTML messages. It is certainly more portable that Word. Here, here! Go
for it. Microsoft, however, is like spam: you can't ever get rid of it
completely but you can filter it out at your mail server. :-)
I have given up trying to get people to send RTF,CSV{SpreadSheet/DB} or HTML
because most people are just too stupid to figure out how to do it. If the
document isn't usable with AbiWord,Gnumeric or OpenOffice, I just ignore the
message, or reply that I don't use M$ ..., so you will need to provide me with
the information in ... format. If they can't figure out how to do it then they
can call M$ for help.
Greg
---%<...snip...
PS Read the BOFH series for further tricks on dealing with M$ fools.
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Re: Excellent signature
Rob Unsworth wrote: ---%<...snip... To use that sig, I would be advocating the use of HTML in mail, as the mail itself or as an attachment. I oppose both. True that, but at least you don't have to go out and buy a new version of office every year to keep up with each new perversion of Word,... just so you can get information from other people. Regards, Rob Guy -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Excellent signature
Mr. Adam ALLEN wrote:
On Thu, 2003-01-23 at 20:24, Kevin Waterson wrote:
This one time, at band camp,
Now that is a funny sig. If you saw American Pie ;)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Unfortunately the ignorant masses I work with insist on me using lotus
notes because it is 'secure', the company is also a slave to the Microsoft
machine even though their flagship console can and does run Linux. This
signature which I saw on Kevin Waterson's mail should get the message
across. Or at least until some manager tells me to 'tow the line'
The more people who use it, the better it works
Dell are amazing for this, I ordered a PSU for the laptop since mine had
nearly set on fire
Reading my mail with pine over ssh, and I receive an e-mail with all the
content in a word document. They were quick enough to replace it with
pdf's after I'd complained...
It baffles me to why they didn't send out platform neutral PDF's in the
first place, or more novel just put the content in plain text?
Absolutely, PDF creates bloated documents that require a lot of CPU to compile
there output {It is just a variety of PostSCript}. Besides PDF documents are
not that easy to read from the console, are they. I used to have a job where I
maintained hand written postscript Logos,Templates and Programs {FYI PS is an
interpreted programming language}, but most machine generated PS or PDF is
almost impossible to "read" even for me.
HTML,SGML,XML are all "tag" based document formats like WP and Ventura at
least used to be. "Reading" these formats is usaualy at least possible from a
command line. IIRC rtf {Rich Text Format} is also tag based but I could be
wrong, anyway it is a very well supported import export format for word
processing software. If your Spread Sheet/DB application can't import and
export csv then it is just plain no good.
Guy
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Re: Excellent signature
I only send mail in ascii as far as I know.
I use mozilla with default text delivery, so the fonts should be set on your
side not mine. {0-0}
Guy
jdow wrote:
> From: "Guy Fraser" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
---%<...snip...
>
>
> What has that got to do with not using HTML in mail? The intent is to use
> plain text in email to the extent possible. (It is also not polite to set
> your own font size in the email. I need to get my trained mouse out to read
> the screen with his teeny tiny eyes for reading teeny tiny print and it's
> hard to understand his squeaking even though I have taught him Morse code.
>
> {^_^}
>
>
>
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Re: Excellent signature
jdow wrote:
---%<...snip...
>
> I have a simple solution, Guy. If I cannot read the message in an editor as
> dumb as Notepad without significant effort on my part I toss it unread. I
> note that this has applied to an increasing number of messages on these Red
> Hat lists. Sometimes I get moved to be snotty and reply in a ransom note
> style with the real answer in white on white microprint. If I can't read
> the question, why should the questioner be able to read my reply without a
> lot of work? It seems fair to me.
>
> {^_^} (As I muse about EBCDIC translations for people who send HTML or
> RTF etc.)
>
>
>
Some people actualy get mail from sources outside of these lists for work.
I often need to accept formatted documents and SpreadSheet/DB files. I would
rather have them sent as an attachment then have to parse and reformat data
from a text message.
Since I use a linux workstation at work and at home, I don't have notepad, I
prefer Nedit.
Using Mozilla is the best of both worlds because if I get HTML formatted mail
I can read it, as long as it is not white on white {but thats just silly}.
When I reply to an HTML message Mozilla nicely converts it to text so that my
reply is in ascii.
Guy
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Re: Messenger Popups - Secure you Machine
Adam and Christina Koch wrote:
Unless you really need this service, say your admin has it set up to notify
users of certain events, you can just turn off the service in windows and
the problem(s) should be alleviated.
If you turn off these services you will no longer be able to add, remove or
modify user accounts.
Adam
I can't tell what all of them are, but here are the ones that popups
come in on:
135, 137, 138, 139, and 445 (I am not sure about 136). Block these
ports and I believe you block all the popup messages.
---%<...snip...
Port State Service
123/udpopenntp
135/tcpopenloc-srv
135/udpopenloc-srv
137/udpopennetbios-ns
138/udpopennetbios-dgm
139/tcpopennetbios-ssn
445/tcpopenmicrosoft-ds
445/udpopenmicrosoft-ds
500/udpopenisakmp
1024/tcp openkdm
1025/tcp openNFS-or-IIS
1026/tcp openLSA-or-nterm
1032/udp openiad3
1900/udp openUPnP
5000/tcp openUPnP
Ouch!
That's not too good.
I am not sure but I think that XP Home also has some half decent firewall
capabilities. I would disable access to all of these ports except for machines
that need to share files with or remotely administer that machine. If you
install a firewall that is compatable with UPnP it can be used to open ports
on your firewall for UPnP compatable games and software. I personaly disabled
UPnP support on my firewall and the service in XP {for when I need to run it}.
I also have Norton Internet Security installed, call me paranoid, but I have
yet to get a popup on my machine. The only port a have forwarded through my
firewall is TCP/22 so that I can ssh into my machine from work, further more I
have firewall rules that "drop" packets rather than "reject" packets so there
is no feedback that the port is even being listened on.
I firmly belive in layered security. At work each server has multiple layers
of security in addition to some border security and intrusion detection system.
The problem I run into is that being an ISP many things have to be left open
to the public in order for the internet to be able to access some required
services.
This is a sample scan from my workstation to one of our servers.
(The 1146 ports scanned but not shown below are in state: closed)
Port State Service
22/tcp openssh
80/tcp openhttp
Nmap run completed -- 1 IP address (1 host up) scanned in 1 second
From a machine that is not specificly allowed to see either of these ports,
no open ports are seen. Most machines have anti-spoofing rules setup as well
as TCPwrapper ACL's in addition to per service configuration Access Control
Lists at the application level. All applications are kept up to date and no
service that is not required is even installed.
Another trick you can use is to remove utuilities and applications that would
allow a compromised server to be used to find other servers on your network or
sniff traffic. That includes programming languages,compilers and especialy
(x)inetd. Run server applications stand alone chrooted when possible. Use
remote syslogging, so that if someone breaks in they can't cover there tracks
by deleting log files.
Securing a single machine can take a while, but is well worth the effort. The
harder it is for someone to discover your machine, and break into it the less
likely they will try. It is more likely they will look for an easier target.
Finally M$ started to catch on with Win2K Pro/Advanced and included some less
retarded firewall infrastructure. Maybe they will allow port ranges to be used
soon.
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xmms and Redhat 8.0
Hi Has anyone else noticed that .wav files play really fast. Guy -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Problem with installing RH 6.2 on a new Dell PC
Hi What exactly is the problem? The motherboard, audio and video chipsets have all changed significantly since 6.2 came out. I would suggest using some older hardware. Guy Freddy Jensen wrote: We are having problems installing RH 6.2 on a new Dell PC. It almost looks like the PC hardware is newer than what is supported by RH 6.2 (email attached below). The h/w is a Dell Optiplex with plain IDE (no scsi). Has anyone seen this before? Help and advise will be greatly appreciated. Thanks -- Freddy Jensen, Sr. Computer Scientist, Adobe Systems Incorporated 345 Park Avenue, San Jose, CA 95110-2704, USA, Ph: (408) 536-2869 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED], URL: http://www.adobe.com -- == Begin forwarded message == Subject: Installing Linux Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 09:43:40 -0800 I finally tried something that you probably didn't try. There is a "text" mode that you can choose initially that uses a older style of interface. When I went through the installation process with this it eventually reported "Exception occurred" and showed a traceback. The deepest levels of this seemed to be: todo.getCompsList() in file package.py getCompsList in file todo.py line 467 I am guessing that "py" indicates a "python" script file (yet another scripting language). It seems that the more GUI approaches were failing without any indication of this crash. I tried some variants, and this error always occured. This could indicate a HW incompatibility between "python" and the CPU of the machine (??). == End forwarded message == -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: smbclient frontend
Here is an /etc/fstab entry that allows access to a share at boot: This is supposed to be on one line but will likly be wrapped. //server/share /home/user/share smbfs credentials=/home/user/.credentials 1 1 where : /home/user/.credentials contains : ---%<...snip... username = shareuser password = sharepass ---%<...snip... and Directory /home/user/share exists. You can read the mount man page for more options. I use this method to make shares appear to be local, then I put a link on the desktop for the staff to access the share. Guy Stephen Mah wrote: Anyone know of a smbclient frontend that works on 8.0? Some of my users want to use it to browse smb shares. -thanks -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: smbclient frontend
Hi If the share is on a machine running samba make sure you are typing the password created with the smbpasswd utility. The smb password is not nessisarily the same as the unix password. Guy Stephen Mah wrote: when I type: smb://server/share, I'm prompted for a username & password. However, it's not accepting my pw. I know I have the right password. I even tried server\username and [EMAIL PROTECTED] as my username. Are there any known issues with Konqueror 3.0.3-14(using KDE 3.0.3-8.3)? -steve Samuel Flory wrote: Michael Wardle wrote: On Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:42:28 -0800 Stephen Mah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Anyone know of a smbclient frontend that works on 8.0? Recently both the Konqueror and Nautilus file managers have added seemless support for SMB browsing. Try entering: smb://server/share in the location bar. Otherwise, there's a few options, the one that comes to mind is LinNeighborhood, but a search on Google or FreshMeat should find some more. Better yet smb:// will let you browse the network. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Triple Boot :)
Hi
If you have ME and XP installed and not conflicting you are ready to go.
You can use the partition with ME installed on it for files available to
all configurations.
Both XP and RH 8 can read FAT32.
Don't partition the second drive before installing RH 8.
Install RH 8 with at the very least 3 partitions :
/
/boot
and a swap partition.
The ME partion can be assigned at this time as well to lets say /winme .
The boot loader should recognise at least one of the windows systems,
hopefully the XP installation. XP should allow dual boot into ME or XP.
NT and 2K does allow booting into other windows installations.
The files under XP's NTFS will not be available.
I use XP and RH 8 on one of my machines and use FAT32 partions to hold
files I want to be accessable to both.
I have tried some pretty nasty multi boot configurations before. If you
are adding to a machine that has important files, make sure to back them
up. You never know, I recently accidentaly reformatted my /home partition
when moving back to RH 8 from the RH 8.0.92 Beta{Phoebe}. :-(
Guy
Galea Gilbert wrote:
Hi gurus,
I am installing the home machine as I told you in previous emails with the
following 3 OSes:
Windoze ME (FAT32)
Win XP (NTFS)
RH 8 (EXT3)
I have followed your advice and put the 2 windoze oses on the same
hard disk
which is a primary master. First I installed ME on a FAT32 partition
then XP
on an NTFS partition and everything is fine. Now I would like to partition
the primary slave into 2 partitions one for the RH installation (ext3) and
another which is readable from win XP and RH. Is this possible?
Gilbert
...snip...
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Re: smbclient frontend
Hi I tried konqueror with smb://server/share, I gave it the username and password, and it let me in. My software is completely "up2date" as of 2003 Mar 27 09:00 Mountain time. Guy Stephen Mah wrote: Guy Fraser wrote: Hi If the share is on a machine running samba make sure you are typing the password created with the smbpasswd utility. The smb password is not nessisarily the same as the unix password. Guy Stephen Mah wrote: when I type: smb://server/share, I'm prompted for a username & password. However, it's not accepting my pw. I know I have the right password. I even tried server\username and [EMAIL PROTECTED] as my username. Are there any known issues with Konqueror 3.0.3-14(using KDE 3.0.3-8.3)? -steve Yes, the server is running samba. I'm using the smbpasswd. The strange thing is that when I switch to gnome to try nautilus, it works with the same url, ie: smb://server/share. The username & password prompt is exactly the same. The same thing under kde is not working for me. Has anyone tried this, or has time to do a quick test? I tried this on several RH8 workstations, running kdebase-3.0.3-14 with samba-client 2.2.7-4 and 2.2.5. thanks steve -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Crack for MD5 Passwords?- correction
John the Ripper does not care what crypt is used AFIK. It tries to authenticate using dictionary and brute force attack methods when it is successfull it prints the match. Guy Aaron Konstam wrote: On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 04:21:48PM -0600, Aaron Konstam wrote: On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 02:11:15PM -0500, John Kodis wrote: On Mon, Mar 24, 2003 at 04:26:44PM -0600, Ronald W. Heiby wrote: Does anyone know where I can find a copy of Crack that runs on RH 8.0 and deals with MD5 passwords? Crack doesn't seem to be well maintained these days. You might try a program called "john the ripper", which handles md5 hashes and will build successfully with minimal effort. -- John KodisGoddard Space Flight Center [EMAIL PROTECTED] Greenbelt, Maryland, USA Phone: 301-286-7376 Fax: 301-286-1771 -- I use John the Ripper and I don't remember a claim that it will do Md5 passwds. Can someone confirm this? --- I was wrong John the Ripper says it does MD% and several other encryption formats. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: [psyche] Re: [psyche] Best way to update to RH9 from 8.0 ?
Ah Huh. That why my wine is broken. The last RH 8.0 glibc from up2date is 2.3.2-4. I had been using wine to access our FileMaker Pro 6 Server with FileMaker Pro 5.5 until it broke. I certainly hope RH reverses the "upgrade". The biggest complaint I made about 8.0.93 was the lack of wine. This is a true pain in the ass, now I may have to put windows on my workstation or convince the powers that be to purchase VMWare, unless that is screwed up too. This sounds like something M$ would do, not RH. Since RH 7.3 things have been going to shit in a hurry. Up to RH 7.3 thins just kept getting better and better. First elm was dropped along with sawfish, now wine and who knows what else. I hope a list of dropped application accompanies the list of new features, so long time users can decide what to do. Due to many of the "lost features" in RH 8.0 I could not stop the switch to FreeBSD for servers at work. I hope I am not forced to abandon RH on my workstation and at home, but if RH does not smarten up I will have to. RH is almost futile at doing MultiMedia now, esd is not an option for most capture, DVD and video playback applications. Trying to get alsa to build is next to impossible, most of the libraries it need either are not included and some won't compile with out being fixed to work with RH. I have to stop now, or I will start to really rant. Guy Raul Acevedo wrote: Interesting that it breaks so much. The CodeWeavers email alerting users that the Red Hat glibc errata breaks wine mentioned that CodeWeavers is trying to persuade Red Hat to issue a glibc errata that fixes the security problems but doesn't go from 2.2 to 2.3, hence not also breaking wine and everything else. Keep a look out for that... Raul Edward S. Marshall wrote: > On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 11:01:52AM -0800, Raul Acevedo wrote: > > If you use wine, or CodeWeavers CrossOver Office or Plugin, you may want > > to wait a bit before upgrading. The recent glibc errata update breaks > > wine. > > It breaks a lot more than just Wine. PHP's gdbm functionality no longer > works (probably a more general problem with gdbm vs. glibc, but I haven't > had time to troubleshoot it), and trawling through bugzilla indicates a > few other things (Netscape Communicator, some pthread symbol issues, etc) > are having indigestion with this release. > > I've been strongly advising anyone I have the ear of to hold off on that > errata release if they can get away with it (ie. they can tolerate the > associated risk for their application). > > -- > Edward S. Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > http://esm.logic.net/ > > Felix qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas. > > > > -- > Psyche-list mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: [psyche] Re: Red Hat 9
You must be talking about home users without any important data. Many servers and workstations run until they can not be feasibly maintained, or there is a compelling reason to upgrade. Joe Klemmer wrote: On Tue, 2003-03-25 at 19:22, Gerald Henriksen wrote: Starting with Red Hat 8.0 errata are only provided for 12 months after release. The only products with errata periods longer than 12 months are the products in the Enterprise line. With the average Joe User of Linux being used to upgrading every 3 or 4 months how does hading 3 or 4 times as much time for support a bad thing? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: [psyche] Re: Red Hat 9
Joe Klemmer wrote:
On Thu, 2003-03-27 at 18:27, Guy Fraser wrote:
You must be talking about home users without any important data.
Many servers and workstations run until they can not be feasibly
maintained, or there is a compelling reason to upgrade.
Well, since we are discussing RH's Personal/Professional product, it
goes without saying that we're not talking about systems that should be
running any of their Enterprise offerings. RH 9 is for desktop usage
and for development usage and for that standard web/file/app servers.
These are the ones that are already used to and have been using the 4 to
6 month upgrade cycle. Systems like major database and critical
production servers haven't been running RH personal/professional anyway
(usually running Solaris or AIX or some such). Now that RH has an
Enterprise line you will see Linux moving into this area of the data
center. For small and medium size businesses there won't be much of a
change with the new breakout of the OS offerings.
That is why the company I work for has migrated all but two RH servers
to FreeBSD. I am in the
process of upgrading an application I wrote for those servers, to be
more enhanced while updating
it to compile on FreeBSD and RH without any errors. When finished those
two machines will be
migrated ino a single more robust machine running FreeBSD. My
workstation will prbably be next
if wine does not get fixed by RedHat Next Month. We have already
replaced all our Sparc and Alpha
boxes with Intel/AMD machines running FreeBSD. I was the only UNIX
administrator left that
is fluent in the other many flavors of *NIX/Linux platforms we once ran.
Moving to FreeBSD has
been an improvement over OSF/1,True64, Solaris, SCO, BSDI and all other
Linux Platforms.
I disagree that Solaris and AIX are better solutions, having used them
and payed for them over and
over again, with their often slow patch support, they were overly
burdensome. We have been running
FreeBSD for over 15 Months now and I am happy with the release rate of
patches and easy to use
software ports system. Proprietary UNIX systems often have many queer
libraries and functions not
reqiured for Programming with Linux or FreeBSD. I prefered programming
on linux, due the more
POSIXly correct libraries and functions, but FreeBSD is still better
than Solaris and OSF/1 for
programming. I do prefer the more 'standard' directory hiearchy of FreeBSD.
It really pissed me off when RH dropped elm. My god is nothing safe,
from the wrath of replacing
usefull small utilities with new sophisticated {or was that
siphilisticated} programs like mutt.
Next thing you know pico or vi will be dropped leaving only emacs
{bloat, bloat} editor.
Most servers do not run on enterprise class machines and standard or
proffesional Red Hat Linux
was just fine.
Guy
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Re: Red Hat 9
Brent Fox wrote:
On Tue, 2003-03-25 at 18:29, Gerald Henriksen wrote:
You cannot expect a
company or joe user to upgrade their operating system every year
(which is now necessary given the 12 month limit on bug/security
fixes).
You also cannot expect Red Hat to provide errata forever on a product
that our users get either for free or in a $40 box.
Creating and releasing errata costs developer time, QA time,
documentation time, and RHN/FTP bandwidth. Some people seem to be under
the impression that our cost of doing errata is zero, but it just isn't
so. Our resources are not infinite, so we're going to do longer errata
support for the products that customers pay more for.
Cheers,
Brent
What about the extra US$60/year for the entitlement, US$60/year x 500 =
US$30,000. For each 500 entitlements, a persons salary can be paid for a
year.
I buy the proffesional boxed sets, but even at ~US$80/set RH probably
doesn't make much per box, especialy when you consider that many people
will use each box to install on multiple machines, and it is not
recurring income unless boxed sets are purchased at regular intervals.
Of course not every one buys an entitlement, but I do for my home machine.
I wouldn't mind upgrading once or twice a year if stuff I used was not
constanly being dropped. I was very annoyed when elm was dropped, then
sawfish now wine. The lack of ALSA support means constantly having to
fight to get multimedia support.
Another pain in the butt was the decision to disclude all mp3 support
from the distribution even from boxed sets. Why couldn't a floppy have
been included in the boxed set with the mp3 decoder {$.75 license paid.}
I think I know why but it is still annoying. Fixing the mp3 issue was
not very difficult. I have purchaed some software and will be converting
my mp3's to ogg format, but I doubt my DVD player will play ogg's. By
the way, I rip my own mp3's from my own media and I don't share it {I
believe in paying for goods and services.}
The points I would like to make are that if RH is aiming Standard and
Proffesional distributions for desktop users;
1)Then stop discarding the software that desktop users need and use.
2)Include software that allows desktop users to take advantage of their
multimedia needs, ALSA would go a long way since most multimedia
software packages will not compile with out it.
3)Rather than supporting Activists, RH should be lobbying software
developers to develop linux versions of their software that run natively
in X. My Corel Office 2000 is now broken becuase it used a modified
version of wine to run. If programs are being ported to Apple's OSX then
Linux should be a fairly easy move, but they need to be convinced. RH
could make money by helping them.
4)Thank you to RH for the good work they have done up to RH 7.3, but
smarten up blue curve is nice but sawfish worked great.
Guy
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Re: Red Hat 9
Brent Fox wrote: On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 16:36, Kevin Waterson wrote: This one time, at band camp, Brent Fox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: ...snip... By the "products that customers pay more for", I mean the Enterprise line. We won't release errata or updates for 7.3 after the End Of Life period arrives. With the RHL line, there's no distinction between paying customers and unpaid customers once the product goes EOL. However, you will most likely be able to find updated packages through community sites like freshrpms.net. They just won't be the official Red Hat packages. You can also download the SRPMS for the Enterprise line and compile them yourself. Sounds reasonable if I can get the SRPMS using a regular entitlement. Or, like most of our users, you will upgrade to a more recent version of RHL because the software improves so rapidly and you can do so for free. As long as the programs I use have not been thrashed or tossed out. It all comes down to this: Should we spend our time creating errata for versions that are 18 months old or should we focus on creating new features for the next release of RHL? We think that it's best for us and our users to focus on driving the RHL line forward as fast as we can. If you really need a version that you can run for 5 years, then buy the Enterprise line and pay us for that level of service. We'll see on monday hopefully whether RH 9 is going forward or if it is a step sideways like RH 8. The look of the GUI has improved, but some things I liked about 7.3 were discarded, and in the past week I have had my Corel Office and FileMaker Pro stopped working thanks to the glibc update that was not warned about breaking wine. My boss is pissed about that, I just hope he doesn't make me put windows on my workstation before wine is fixed. Good thing I had been saving in Word/Excel formats other wise Open Office would not have come to the rescue of the Corel Office loss. Cheers, Brent -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Best way to update to RH9 from 8.0 ?
If all your documents are in your home directory and it is on a seperate partition like I have, the full install is the way I would go. I do a custom install, so that I can determine what gets installed and make sure my "home partition" does not get formatted. Cédric Chausson wrote: Hello all, I am interested in updating to RH9. I have two options : _ Doing a full install _ Doing an update instal Up until now I have always used the full install option and not the update possibility. But I have installed a lot of programs and configured a lot of things so I'd like to loose as less as is possible. So I was wondering is the update installation option really feasible. I seem to remmeber having seen written that it did not work really good ? Comments, experiences ? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: WineX
Gerald Henriksen wrote: On 27 Mar 2003 21:58:29 -0800, you wrote: Would I be able to get around this (wine not working) if I built from source? No. The problem is that the current versions of wine and some other apps will not work with the new thread system that is in glibc 2.3 Until the wine developers come up with a fix the only way to run wine is to remain with Red Hat 8.0 and do not update glibc as per the errata (though check to see whether the security fix is necessary for you or not, if it is necessary then choose between the fix or wine). Security fix... yeah that's the idea. Hey if the software you need to use for your job doesn't work, then job security is the issue isn't it. I wonder how many companies are like mine, where the people with Linux Desktops are SOL and I was the person who convinced the powers that be, it would be a productivity improvement. Now non of the people with linux can access our customer database. I have the weekend to come up with a feasible solution to getting access to the FileMaker Pro DB form the linux workstation, because we can not have people sitting around because they can't do their work. The feeble excuses from the guy's who appear to work for Red Hat just doesn't cut the mustard when my job is on the line because they messed around with somthing that should not have been messed with. While I am sending this message I am downloading versions of FreeBSD, SUSE and Debian. I am under the gun and I hope the people at RH who made this major up are as well. I would like to bet I am not the only person who's job is on the line over this. I am extremely angry about this issue. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: WineX
Thank you very much. You may have saved my job. This version even works better that the one RH had. Frank Jahn wrote: Uninstall the RH wine packages and then install the wine-20030318-1rh8winehq packages from http://sourceforge.net and it will work. Frank -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: RH 9.0 - changelog?
Eric Burke wrote: Hiya, On Fri, Mar 28, 2003 at 02:36:16AM +, Brian Johnson wrote: Could someone point me to a reference on what has changed for the new version? It's not yet available. Wait until the announcement on April 7 and the release notes will be publicly available, and you can get the chnagelog from every individual package when they've been uploaded. Well yes and no. The release notes for the 8.0.94 Beta, which has since become RH 9, can be found at http://rpmfind.net/linux/redhat/beta/phoebe/en/os/i386/RELEASE-NOTES Very interesting. RH is up to it again! ... The following packages have been deprecated, and may be removed from a future release of Red Hat Linux: - pine - License-related issues ... - lilo - Grub is the recommended bootloader I absolutely hate grub! Now this sucks big time! Now that pine is gone, there will be no pico. All I am left with is vi. I hate emacs, which is bloated and overly complicated for simple editing. I wonder when vi will get tossed? After all only savy users use it. Like the ones who have been supporting RH for close to a decade now. I feel like a broken record, ever since 7.3 the standard Unix utilities have been disappearing. For proffesional unix administrators like me this is more than just annoying. It is people like me who have been helping and supporting RH since 1995 that are being rejected by many of these changes. RH 9 may be my last release, then I may have to switch my support to another distibution or BSD version. Getting new fickle customers at the cost of loosing long time supporters who helped RH get where they are does not make sense. A brand name is a marketing tool but word of mouth from respected unix "guru's" goes much further. When I suggest one product over another, many people listen if I suggested that RH is now out and XX is what I am now supporting, and can migrate customers without much difficulty, within one release cycle I could estimate ~ 100 systems could be moved away from RH. I support almost a dozen operating systems and RH has been my prefered Linux distro on PC's but I won't support something that has been putting my job on the line and dropping support for legacy software. Where will RH be, when all the free proffesional support disapears from these lists and the overall community. I have had to start moving servers to FreeBSD since RHN changed policies and RH 8 dropped many server related software packages. In the past 6 monthes I have had to move ~30 business critical systems away from RH because management was concearned with the direction RH started to go. Around 18 monthes ago we took over another company with FreeBSD servers, and they have performed as well as the RH servers, so management decided we would start to move servers when RH changed policies. I was reluctant then but now it is looking like it was probably a good decision. If we wanted to buy enterprise software we may have stayed with Solaris or moved to AIX or HPUX, their is NO compelling reason to RHEL over other solutions for Enterprise level equipment. This should give you a good idea, and has a listing of which packages are left out, changed, and why. And before anyone lights the match, 8.0.94 was the latest beta, and includes most of the discussed changes, so an obvious assumption is that is what became RH 9. If I am wrong there then someone from RedHat can correct me, as all flames will be sent to /dev/null. This is not directed at you or this article specificly. Well now that I have a fix for wine, I better get busy and fix the 10 machines that broke last week. Regards, Eric Burke -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: RH 9 - new glibc
Because there market share seems to be more important to them than their long time supporters. Doug B wrote: If I understand correctly, it seems the reason to jump a major version is because the new glibc breaks binary compatability. OK... that makes sense. Why then would RedHat introduce a new glibc into RH 8 that breaks compatabilty with some programs (wine comes to mind and apparently VMWare)? Shouldn't they have patched the glibc version that shipped (and worked) rather than break RH 8 with a new version? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: RH 9 - new glibc
Edward S. Marshall wrote: On Fri, Mar 28, 2003 at 11:01:09AM -0500, Bill Rugolsky Jr. wrote: Do you know for sure that it breaks things? I'm about to install it today ... I can verify some PHP breakage (phpwiki's use of gdbm seems to do a number on the glibc upgrade, while other dba_XX() backends seem to be unaffected; rolling back fixes it). Search bugzilla.redhat.com for bugs filed against glibc, and you'll see a few others (wine, Netscape Communicator). Good thing I have already migrated all my web servers to FreeBSD then. $ rpm -qp --changelog glibc-2.3.2-4.80.src.rpm | head -14 That's the one. Most of my servers and desktops are fine with it, but I have a webserver that has to have a working phpwiki using gdbm storage, and I've had to roll that one back to glibc 2.2. Once RHL 9 comes out, I'll see if I have the same problem there (since I've got at least one machine ready to be my guinea pig for the release ;-). (This is a call for help, btw: if anyone else is seeing this particular issue, I would love a little help putting together a reproducable test case that doesn't involve half the phpwiki source code, to help the RH folks track this down a little faster. Time to start reading through the glibc 2.3 changelog...) -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: security updates ?
I don't know if you can trust security updates any more. The last glibc security update almost made me loose my job because it wrecked software that was required by our support staff to do their jobs. Ed Wilts wrote: On Mon, Mar 24, 2003 at 01:45:35PM -0500, Allan M. Stewart wrote: I'm working in an environment where management is overly sensitive to changes. We've been developing and QA'ing on a 8.0 install basically straight out of the box. Our fielded systems will have a minimum install with very few extras. Certainly SSH will need to be updated. Probably several others. What I would like to do is check the installed RPMs for updates and find out which ones are security related. Those kind of updates should be easily justified. Is there an easy way to check only for security updates? It would be very time consuming to do searches on every installed RPM. The best method is to use up2date. Register the system (it's $60 per system per year). You've then got the option to be e-mailed whenever a relevant update is released, check online for the status of all your systems, or run up2date --list manually and look at the output. up2date typically reports on only security updates - Red Hat does not usually provide routine bug fixes via RHN. Please note that 8.0 will be unsupported after December 31 of this year. You should start planning a version 9 rollout soon (it will be publicly available in early April). Personally, I'm going to be migrating my production systems to Enterprise Edge Server to get the longer lifecycle for security errata. To review the RHN choices, see http://www.redhat.com/software/rhn/offerings/ -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Spam ? (RH9)
They already have it in RH 8, wrecking applications in it's wake but still it's there already. Markku Kolkka wrote: Viestissä Maanantai 24. Maaliskuuta 2003 22:44, Daevid Vincent kirjoitti: Well, I do know that it's incredibly arrogant and misleading to jump from v8.0 to v9.0 without any intermediate steps. NOBODY in the software world does that without some serious serious feature additions. RH9 will be nothing more than some normal updates. Xfree 4.3, a (still broken) Apache 2.0/PHP, a slightly newer KDE/Gnome, and what else? NPTL (native Posix thread library), which causes enough binary incompatibility to make it a new major release. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Spam ? (RH9)
Now that is just moronic. Just becuase one company is a bad corporate citizen, does not give all corporate citizens the right to act badly. Keith Winston wrote: ...snip... Microsoft plays the same games with certs and trys to force both their certified engineers and customers on the upgrade treadmill to churn up revenue. This is why I stopped pursuing vendor specific certifications and opted for the Linux Professional Institute certs instead. They cover cross platform tools and concepts and NEVER expire. See http://lpi.org This is not to say that Red Hat doesn't make a fine distro and I use it in many cases, but I am just as comfortable with Debian, SuSE, or Slackware. Best Regards, Keith -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Spam ? (RH9)
Randall J. Parr wrote: Thanks for this reference. We can only hope for changes that address this. I have long been a Red Hat support and have proven it by spending my time and money for their certification. I must say I am starting to feel a bit jerked around. Me too, this glibc thing of late almost cost me my job. Now I have to scramble to research alternative operating systems for our support staff, that can be trusted not to cause people to not be able to do their jobs due to neglegence. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Spam ? (RH9)
Now that is total M$ crap! Pay me huge bucks and maybe I will support the comunity that put me where I am. Gerald Henriksen wrote: On Mon, 24 Mar 2003 16:56:17 -0800, you wrote: Yes, I was aware of that BUT please understand, the change to rapid expiration of specific versions means we have to update more often to be able to stay abreast of the flood of security updates AND new updates to Not if you move to the Enterprise line where the pace of change is actually slowed down and the errata are offered for years (see http://www.redhat.com/apps/support/errata/ and more particularly for the Enterprise errata periods http://www.redhat.com/apps/support/errata/rhlas_errata_policy.html ). -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Subject: Re: Red Hat 9
Marcie Laux wrote: Message: 13 Subject: Re: Red Hat 9 From: Joe Klemmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 25 Mar 2003 22:17:54 -0500 Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Tue, 2003-03-25 at 18:29, Gerald Henriksen wrote: > While I agree some of the decisions Red Hat has made have been > necessary and even good (even if Red Hat has screwed up the > implementation and public relations aspects of at least some of them) > they are also apparently ignoring a lot of their existing and (at > least until now) loyal customers. This is crap. > I certainly can't recall messages on any of the Red Hat mailing lists > or any survey asking for Red Hat to price their Linux product at the > same price levels Microsoft charges, yet that is exactly what Red Hat > has done (and in at least 1 case when you extend the price over a 3 or > 4 year lifetime of a product Red Hat is actually more expensive than > Microsoft). More crap. > The base Red Hat product line (8.0, 9, whatever next) is no longer > suitable for business or the average home user. You cannot expect a > company or joe user to upgrade their operating system every year > (which is now necessary given the 12 month limit on bug/security > fixes). Even more crap. > To get a reasonable period of security fixes you have to move up to > the enterprise line of products, which starts at a minimum of twice > the price and has more restrictive licensing terms. Ditto. > So your average person at home now has a choice of Windows XP at $300 > or Red Hat Enterprise Workstation at $300 ($60 a year after the first > year for access to security fixes). Guess what, XP comes with full > multimedia capabilities including MP3 and DVD, as well as a full range > of software available for purchase including games, tax software, etc. > Which would you choose? And by the way, so far at least Microsoft > still offers free security fixes in the base price. This is a very long message that is the epitome of FUD. Let's leave this $#|t out of the redhat lists. The truth hurts doesn't it. -- Farewell neighbor. Thank you for giving us a safe place for so many years. Fred Rodgers - 1928-2003 Ok I agree, this list is for productive help for each other and enough of the whining crap. If you want to whine go to windoze. I for one am tired of reading a bunch of garbage. Just a sysadmin's thoughts,, Marcie Well, well, well. There you go, another pseudo system administrator. I have been supporting multiple unix platforms since 1984, and RH since 1995. The issues coming up now should be very relevant to RH. If I had to go to my boss and tell him that our low cost workstations were now going to cost $300 + $60x2 = $420 each every 2 years... the delayed fix for wine will seem like a bump in the road of my career. If you don't want to read this "thread", and you are a real systems administrator, then surely you should be able to make a procmail or mail client filter so you don't have to see them. Just a sysadmin with 19 years of experience's thoughts, Guy -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: SV: Spam ? (RH9)
Marie-Thérèse Lorentzen wrote: ...snip... Well, I do know that it's incredibly arrogant and misleading to jump from v8.0 to v9.0 without any intermediate steps. NOBODY in the software world does that without some serious serious feature additions. RH9 will be nothing more than some normal updates. Xfree 4.3, a (still broken) Apache 2.0/PHP, a slightly newer KDE/Gnome, and what else? What planet are you on? Let's see, off-hand I can thing of two much bigger jumps; Solaris 2.7 to Solaris 8 & Slackware 4.x to Slackware 7.x. I think you're being a little touchy or something. -- Farewell neighbor. Thank you for giving us a safe place for so many years. Fred Rodgers - 1928-2003 How does that make sense to you? Standard software release formats are in the format : version.major.minor-patch Odd majors are generaly for beta releases but patch levels ending with a 'b' are used as an alternative. Of course this scheme is not a required standard, but is generaly followed by most developers. Depending on the significance of the change, the numbers can leap frog but this should be reserved for extreme cases only. Just because Solaris 2.7 to Solaris 8 was a bigger jump than 2.7 to 3 there were significant changes and the version number was going to change regardless. 8.0 to 8.5 is a large "major" change, but 8.0 to 9.0 is a "version" change, normaly reserved for significant overhauls, not something that has been already updated in the current version. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: RH 9 - new glibc
OK then Ed and Jessey.
What target is RH targetted for?
If it isn't sutable for a corporate desktop and it doesn't support off
the shelf software that home users want where does it belong?
By the way, I can read and know the difference between depeciated and
removed. Usualy when somthing is depreciated that means it is going to
disapear sooner than later.
I have supplied patches for cistron radius, sendmail, init scripts and
file-utils to name a few. No I don't submit them directly to RH unless
it is applicable. I have also assisted RH by encourageing people to use
RH and buy the boxed sets for their machines.
Jump off your high horse. Pico is a good editor for quick simple
changes, for all else I use vi(m).
You and Jesse are complete morons if you think all developers use emacs
or some stupid IDE suite. By the way using vi,pico or nedit, the
programs I write compile with out any warnings at all, they also use
malloc extensively to eliminate "buffer/string" overflows. The software
I develop is NOT GPL due to my company's policy, but I am allowed to
provide some snippits of code to help others. Lately most of what I have
been doing is with Cistron,PostgreSQL and PHP, but my contibutions to
the open source community have helped many people and developers improve
their products including a couple of patches for RH.
So, for you and Jesse to come down on me, is insulting and not called for.
Being a developer my self I do know what things cost, but to say that
developers cost at least US$100,000/year and that they have to spend
more than 4 days on every package every release is ridiculous, or should
I say ; Sign me up! I have on a number of occasions tested and built my
own (S)RPMS for software not supported by RH, and I don't remember
spending 4 days on any of them unless I was enhancing the software to
provide more robust features and providing patches to the developers at
the same time.
Having developed and maintained mission critical software for the
companies I have worked for for the past 10 years on platforms from DOS
3.X to numberous Unix and Unix like platforms, I am not some slouch. I
have managed a variety of networked systems since 1984, including
helping build many cross platform networks that did not natively support
any common protocols. I have used many editors including micromonitor
ones I wrote for 6502 and z80 type contoller/convertors I built from
scratch {Electronics Engineering was what I graduated with}.
I don't give RHCE/MCSE/... any thought when hiring people, every single
person we have hired with such credentials has not been able to meet the
job requirements, that experienced people without the certifications
have been excellent at.
Ed Wilts wrote:
On Sat, Mar 29, 2003 at 12:28:52AM -0800, Eric Burke wrote:
The bottom line is for a corporate desktop, RH no
longer serves the purpose.
The bottom line is that RH9 is not targetted for the corporate desktop.
That's what Red Hat Linux Enterprise AW is for. If you're trying to use
a product that's not designed for your application and it doesn't do the
job, why are you complaining?
Once compatibility is broken by adding
something no one else is doing, all else is out the window. Sorry, but
the whole NPTL gains nothing...no speed...nothing.No other Linux distro
is using it or planning on it. That in itself breaks compatibility and
the products usefulness.
For your application, AW is the right tool (or at least one of the right
tools). NPTL is not in AW.
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Re: security updates ?
Hmm, I am pretty sure wine was included with RH 8.0. Ed Wilts wrote: On Sat, Mar 29, 2003 at 12:39:47PM -0700, Guy Fraser wrote: I don't know if you can trust security updates any more. The last glibc security update almost made me loose my job because it wrecked software that was required by our support staff to do their jobs. If you're running non-Red Hat packages on your systems, then you should test before you do a large rollout. I have not heard of any Red Hat supplied package breaking due to the glibc security update. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Subject: Re: Red Hat 9
Jesse Keating wrote: On Saturday 29 March 2003 12:08, Guy Fraser uttered: Well, well, well. There you go, another pseudo system administrator. I have been supporting multiple unix platforms since 1984, and RH since 1995. The issues coming up now should be very relevant to RH. If I had to go to my boss and tell him that our low cost workstations were now going to cost $300 + $60x2 = $420 each every 2 years... the delayed fix for wine will seem like a bump in the road of my career. Simantics. The company I work for was not expecting to have constant recurring costs that were not existant when I convinced them to go with Red Hat. Get your math right. RHEL WS is $149/y. Period. You buy RHEL WS from Red Hat and download the isos, it's $149 a year. So it's $300 every 2 years, so on and so forth. Perhaps the bigger issue here is, why did you roll out a glibc upgrade w/out testing it first? If it broke in your test environment, then you wouldn't I trusted RH not to cause such a huge problem. I personaly do not do the upgrades, but it was through my encouragement that RH was installed to reduce overhead costs, when everyone who had upgraded glibc and things broke it was put on me to get the systems fixed after the other people could not get their apps that run under wine to work. have had any job problems, as you never would have rolled it out across the company. Change control needs to happen, even if you're getting software updates from a trusted source. I certainly didn't allow this glibc update to be rolled out untested. Somewhere in my 3 years experience I picked that nugget up, so I would expect that in your... 19(?) years exp you would have picked it up too? Perhaps it wasn't the move to Linux thats threatened your job, rather lack of competence to properly test a major software upgrade before you rolled it out. Like I said above RH rolled the software out, and I am not responcible for updating the technicians workstations. But with the recent changes at RH the company has reluctantly purchased some entilements at my request. Having given my company the speil about how RHN was the way to go because the software goes through a QA proccess before it is released. The company is pissed that they had to forkout cash for what was free, and then within months a large percentage of the group was unable to work, that was a huge cost in salaries and customer affecting delays. Having not fully cooled down over the entitlements, then wine gets trashed... Management was not impressed, and was looking for a scape goat. And yes, had an admin rolled out a glibc in our environment, without properly testing it (IE run it through a change control board), and had it broken critical things, the admin would have been fired on the spot. And I hope the QA person who let glibc at RH does. I am sure that on Monday I will be asked to come up with an Alternative to RH even though I have fixed wine. The errata suggests that all RH releases are affected by the change not just RH 8/9, I don't know if it affected the RHEL series. I had not upgraded glibc any of our 3 remaining RH servers, because the security fix would not have fixed any known issues for those machines, and like you say it was not passing the test on my development machine. By the end of next month we had already planed to replace the remaining 3 RH servers with FreeBSD anyway. Two of them on Monday, the replacements have been undergoing testing for the past month and are ready for the switch. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: WineX
Jesse Keating wrote: On Saturday 29 March 2003 09:38, Guy Fraser uttered: I wonder how many companies are like mine, where the people with Linux Desktops are SOL and I was the person who convinced the powers that be, it would be a productivity improvement. Now non of the people with linux can access our customer database. I have the weekend to come up with a feasible solution to getting access to the FileMaker Pro DB form the linux workstation, because we can not have people sitting around because they can't do their work. The feeble excuses from the guy's who appear to work for Red Hat just doesn't cut the mustard when my job is on the line because they messed around with somthing that should not have been messed with. While I am sending this message I am downloading versions of FreeBSD, SUSE and Debian. I am under the gun and I hope the people at RH who made this major up are as well. I would like to bet I am not the only person who's job is on the line over this. I am extremely angry about this issue. Uh, can't you just roll back the glibc update? Yes I suppose I could, but who knows what that could break since other packages have been released since glibc, and may have dependancies on it. I had thought of that, but I did not know it was the glibc that had stopped wine from working. Since I was not upgrading the machines my self I was not sure what the techs had upgraded that caused the problem, until I checked the list today. After the 3rd tech had experienced the problem, I was asked to help, having realized it was being caused after running up2date I requested that nobody run up2date until the problem could be resolved, by that time two more people had run up2date. Between laptops and machine scheduled for donation, we able to get people limping along until Friday. I have calmed down, now that I have uploaded to the software share server the new version of wine and upgraded it on the techs machines. The issue is resolved now, but it will take Management time to cool down. I have written a memo to Management and the techs with RH explaining the problem. And have suggested that all updates are verified on one machine before they will be allowed on any others, to aleviate future issues. One of my managers has repsonded that he thought thats what we were paying RH for, and I don't have reasonable responce for him other than that is what I thought as well. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: WineX
I hear you. I'll probably find out Monday if we will have to switch to something else, but I am fairly confident we will not be moving away from RH on all machines in the near future, unless it may be running under VMWare on another platform for testing purposes only. Colburn wrote: The feeble excuses from the guy's who appear to work for Red Hat just doesn't cut the mustard when my job is on the line because they messed around with somthing that should not have been messed with. Had to pull RH8 from my work machine and regress to M$ because it was so buggy. Imagine the embarrassment! Still have my stuffed penguin on top of my monitor ... ;-) Only way I will be able to get Linux back on my desk now is to buy a laptop, install Linux, and run it side-by-side with the M$ box proving compatibility without chronic failures (in spite of the constant failures of M$) long enough for them to trust it again. Won't be doing this until I test RH9 thoroughly here at home. doc -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: RH 9.0 - changelog?
Oisin C. Feeley wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2003, Jesse Keating wrote: On Saturday 29 March 2003 11:32, Guy Fraser uttered: The following packages have been deprecated, and may be removed from a future release of Red Hat Linux: - pine - License-related issues ... - lilo - Grub is the recommended bootloader I absolutely hate grub! Now this sucks big time! Deprecated, not removed. Lilo _may_ be removed in the future, probably once grub can do everything lilo can do. It already does quite a lot that lilo Just out of interest, what is it that LILO can do that GRUB cannot at present? I've enjoyed the switch from LILO to GRUB, but I only use it for relatively simple things. Thanks for any info, Oisin Other than the change for changes sake, I can't see a reason for it. I am used to lilo and have had more problems with grub than lilo has ever given me. Besides I could not see how grub was better than lilo with out having to research the configuration and command syntax it uses. Mostly I just don't want to have to learn how to use grub and some new editor just to make quick simple changes. Lilo and pico work well, and so did elm. I have not even tried mutt or joe because I had programs I prefered so never installed them. They were suggestions people sent me for pine and elm replacements. I don't know about the licence issues RH claims to be at issue. It probably has somthing to do with the RHEL licensing, that conflicts with GPL or something like that, but that is just a guess. Other linux and BSD distributions don't seem to have a problem. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: security updates ?
Download the current RPM from SourceForge. Then remove wine as root: rpm -e wine Next install wine as root: rpm -i /path/to/downloaded/wine... Then run your app just like you used to. If you have never been able to get wine to install any software, then you probably need to add your self to group wine then logou and log back in. Set up your wine config files in ~/.wine/ and your off to the races. Mike Watson wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Saturday 29 March 2003 04:32 pm, Guy Fraser wrote: Hmm, I am pretty sure wine was included with RH 8.0. Yes it was although I'm still trying to figure out how to get it working! :-) Mike W Ed Wilts wrote: On Sat, Mar 29, 2003 at 12:39:47PM -0700, Guy Fraser wrote: I don't know if you can trust security updates any more. The last glibc security update almost made me loose my job because it wrecked software that was required by our support staff to do their jobs. If you're running non-Red Hat packages on your systems, then you should test before you do a large rollout. I have not heard of any Red Hat supplied package breaking due to the glibc security update. - -- Registered Linux - 256979 NRA Life ARS: WØTMW -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE+hiJL5fq6h2uDDlQRAswpAJ96hqLP2dEgUPen21UJduTzU/WJEwCfcyVb Oz/85I6F5WxibsQsNeZ4b6Q= =fCul -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: RH 9 - new glibc
I will have much homework to do on this issue. I still have a radius server running 4.2, has not missed a beat in years, Dual P133 SPC machine Kind regards Kevin Yikes! Have you run any security scans against it lately? I have just built a new Radius server on FreeBSD and it works great. I wrote an application for the company that parses the detail files and converts the data to csv/tab delimited files/stdout or direct inserts to a table in a PostgreSQL dB. Unfortunatly the software is not allowed to be reased to the public, but I have been able to submit some small parts to Cistron Radius and PostgreSQL developers. The parsing algorythm is very efficient and the company does not want to release it for free. The program was able to import 7.5 million entries into a table in ~23 minutes from ~430 compressed detail files, making a table just over 1GB in size on the first stress test. Today I am putting persistance and redunancy into the DB section for future Real Time Radius to DB accountingrather than the daily updates that have been used since I wrote the original parsing program 5 years ago. I learned enough PHP4 last week to build some array manuipulation functions that generate tables and selection boxes being passed a db connection, an sql statement an a couple options or an associative array. I may be able to contibute them, but I am not sure yet. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Need to link two LANs via a RedHat8.0 dual NIC box
The 192.168.x.x and 10.x.x.x networks are part of a set of "Martian
Networks" they are
not routable outside a local area network {which may include your ISP's
network}.
If you are being assigned these IP's from both of the ISP's and not a
firewall in each
office you are probably out of luck. If even one office is assigned a
static IP address by
the ISP then you can establish a VLAN. You will have to poke a hole
through the
firewall on the end with a static IP to a VLAN 'server' if your firewall
can not natively
act as a VLAN 'server'. Then you establish a VLAN to the 'server' from
the other end
with a VLAN 'client/gateway'. Once the VLAN is set up you route your
traffic through
the VLAN at each end.
I will leave the research on the specifics of this to you. I have never
attempted to do that
in practice, since all of the Neworks I have worked with have had
routable IP addresses.
Guy
Arthur Chong wrote:
We would like to link to a neighbor's LAN from ours.
Here are the details:
Office
1 Office 2
==
ISP 1 <-- GW 192.168.1.254 GW 10.0.0.1 -> ISP 2
192.168.1.54 ---RedHat8.0 Box--- 10.0.0.8
with 2 NICs.
What needs to be setup on the RedHat8.0 box?
We have tried :
echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward
in the rc.local file to enable forwarding.
On the 10 network, on Win2000 box trying to get to a linux box on 192
network -
we tried the route add command on the 10.0.0.0 network to see the
192.168.1.0
network through the 10.0.0.8 gateway.
-> route add 192.168.1.0 mask 255.255.255.0 10.0.0.8
The pings to any linux box on the 192 network times out.
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Re: Red Hat 9 -- April 7th -- Price & Compatibility?
Either you don't use MySQL, PHP4, wine, VMWare ... or you did not run up2date in the last couple of weeks. Marek wrote: Colburn wrote: OK, RedHat will try to resolve the many flaws in RH8 with their new release, RH9 on April 7th. Any idea what they will charge retail for this? (I also paid for my RH8 release, though considering the hundreds of wasted hours trying to get it to do what it promised to do I feel as though I am due a refund and more. Sigh.) Since I have a ton of stuff on the hard disk with RH8 I am thinking it may be wise to purchase a second hdd and to do a clean load. With all of the patches and problems I really don't trust a load of RH9 on top of RH8 to be clean. Is that a reasonable fear? doc Flaws ? and many ? i don't have *any* so far since last October. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: RedHat 9 Has Shipped!
Even with a paid subscription, I couldn't get better that 53KBps, from RedHat, but using bit torrent I was able to get downloads of the 3 binary iso's in about an hour. I am connected to a T3 on a 100bT switched network. Jim McConnell wrote: I just went and Downloaded mine yesterday , was a snap , took 3 hours got great speeds down -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: X Window System, Minimum Installation
Hi I have setup many "headless" servers with a few X-apps, as long as the application's dependancies are met they should work. I always put Nedit on my servers, it also requires "motif" libraries. If you want to know what a program requires to run do somting like this : $ rpm -q --requires nedit openmotif /usr/bin/desktop-file-install rpmlib(PayloadFilesHavePrefix) <= 4.0-1 rpmlib(CompressedFileNames) <= 3.0.4-1 libc.so.6 libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.0) libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.1) libc.so.6(GLIBC_2.1.3) libICE.so.6 libm.so.6 libm.so.6(GLIBC_2.0) libSM.so.6 libX11.so.6 libXext.so.6 libXm.so.3 libXmu.so.6 libXpm.so.4 libXp.so.6 libXt.so.6 $ rpm -q --provides openmotif libMrm.so.3 libUil.so.3 libXm.so.3 openmotif = 2.2.2-12 $ rpm -q --whatprovides /usr/bin/desktop-file-install desktop-file-utils-0.3-3 $ rpm -q --provides desktop-file-utils-0.3-3 desktop-file-utils = 0.3-3 ...and so on... So in total, nedit requires : rpm :-) openmotif desktop-file-utils glibc XFree86-libs I hope this helps, using these methods you should be able to pair down your RPM based system. Guy Hattie Rouge wrote: So if I'm not going to run a desktop on a server, just want to forward X to my remote desktop, all I need is XFree86-libs (and dependencies)? Cool! Hattie Rouge -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jesse Keating Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:33 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: X Window System, Minimum Installation On Thursday 29 May 2003 09:30, Mike Wagner wrote: Hello, I was wondering if anyone could tell me what packages I need to do a basic installation of X. This is going to be on a server and I am going to be tunning X over ssh. I need X so I can install a SNMP agent. I do not even need X to run on the server's display. I just need it to work over ssh. Then just install the XFree86-libs (and it's deps). Thats all you'll need to be able to export X apps from the server out to clients. -- Jesse Keating RHCE MCSE http://geek.j2solutions.net Mondo DevTeam (http://www.microwerks.net/~hugo/) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche> -list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: USER can't use Modem
Add the user to group uucp. That should take care of it. As you can see below only user root and group uucp can access the serial ports. crw-rw1 root uucp 4, 64 Aug 30 2002 /dev/ ttyS0 crw-rw1 root uucp 4, 65 Aug 30 2002 /dev/ttyS1 crw-rw1 root uucp 4, 66 Aug 30 2002 /dev/ttyS2 crw-rw1 root uucp 4, 67 Aug 30 2002 /dev/ttyS3 ... Do NOT change the permissions or ownership, or you will create security problems. Guy Stephen Liu wrote: Hi all folks, Lucent modem (winmodem) === User can't use modem As ROOT kppp works without problem. As USER, request for ROOT password will popup, without ROOT password user is not allowed to run Kppp I made following test As ROOT # cu -l /dev/modem Connected. AT OK ~[localhost]. Disconnected. # But it could not work as USER $ cu -l /dev/modem Connected. It hanged here and I was not allowed to type A temp file was created /var/lock/LCK...Modem to lock the modem I have been looking for a solution for sometimes without result? Permission for modem, lock, tty, ttyLT0 (symbolic linked), user group, and other relevant items, etc. have been checked. Any advice. Thanks in advance. B.Regards satimis -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Getting Latest Mozilla RPMs
Hi
I am running an up2date version of psyche, I built mozzilla 1.4 from the
RawHide Source a day ago It seems to work well. If some one can tell me
where I can upload the binary {i386} packages I would be glad to provide
them.
I built the binaries from source because the rawhide binary packages
would not work.
Guy
Thomas Dodd wrote:
Charles Curley wrote:
On Mon, Jun 09, 2003 at 09:49:15AM -0500, John Mathey wrote:
www.mozilla.org is where I get mine.
I can find tarball packages (http://www.mozilla.org/releases/#1.3.1);
but not RPMs.
ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla/nightly/experimental/gtk2/1.4rc1/i386/
If you want nightly trunk builds they start in gtk2. I usually use the
latest nightly srpms and chnage the build options some.
For the jre visit java.sun.com
It's usually a self extracting archive that extracts to a RPM file you
can install.
-Thomas
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Re: Linksys KVM switch
Hi
I run RH Linux 9 and Windows XP on two machines at home, The box I have
is a D-Link {CAD $130} and it works fine. It uses [press Scroll-Lock
twice then 1 or 2 or ...] commands to control the switcher. The only
problem I have seen is that when windows is shutting down it locks out
the keybord so you have to manualy switch to the other machine, but IIRC
once the widows machine is shut down the keyboard can be used to switch
again. Just to be safe when booting a machine, I always switch to that
machine until the GUI interface is finished loading. I use a logitech
wirless KB and trackball, and have had no problems {other than batteries
dying on my kb and trackball :) }.
Best of luck, I don't think you will have any problems.
Guy
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I'm considering getting a Linksys ProConnect Integrated KVM 2 Port switch to
use on my RH 8.0 box and a Win98 box. Has anyone ever used this switch on a
Linux box? Is there any reason it shouldn't work?
Thanks,
John Guynn
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Re: mysterious routes appearing
Hi
I will annotate the routes in question for you.
djh wrote:
On 24 Jun 2003, Iain Buchanan wrote:
Now I do ifdown eth0 and then ifup eth0 and the routes come back again.
Then I run redhat-config-network and the routes are listed under eth0.
Any more ideas?
route -n:
Kernel IP routing table
Destination Gateway Genmask Flags Metric RefUse Iface
203.16.234.0172.16.0.8 255.255.255.0 UG0 00 eth0
172.16.0.0 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.0 U 0 00 eth0
This is an implicit network route, pointing 172.16.0.0/255.255.255.0 to
the default route on eth0.
203.39.28.0 172.16.0.4 255.255.255.0 UG0 00 eth0
127.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 255.0.0.0 U 0 00 lo
This is the network route for the loopback interface {lo0}, it must
exist or your machine can not run.
0.0.0.0 172.16.0.4 0.0.0.0 UG0 00 eth0
This is your default route also known as your "gateway", if you want to
connect to the internet you must have a "gateway".
The ok routes are obviously 2, 4 & 5. The other two come back all the time!
It should be in /etc somewhere.. grep -r 203.16.234 /etc 2>/dev/null
David.
I think that if you are having connectivity problems it is because you
are not using "publicly routable" ip addresses.
Below you will see that all ip addresses from 172.16.0.0 -
172.31.255.255 are reserved, and therefore not routable through the
internet :
Start
OrgName:Internet Assigned Numbers Authority
OrgID: IANA
Address:4676 Admiralty Way, Suite 330
City: Marina del Rey
StateProv: CA
PostalCode: 90292-6695
Country:US
NetRange: 172.16.0.0 - 172.31.255.255
CIDR: 172.16.0.0/12
NetName:IANA-BBLK-RESERVED
NetHandle: NET-172-16-0-0-1
Parent: NET-172-0-0-0-0
NetType:IANA Special Use
NameServer: BLACKHOLE-1.IANA.ORG
NameServer: BLACKHOLE-2.IANA.ORG
Comment:This block is reserved for special purposes.
Comment:Please see RFC 1918 for additional information.
Comment:
RegDate:1994-03-15
Updated:2002-09-12
OrgTechHandle: IANA-ARIN
OrgTechName: Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Number
OrgTechPhone: +1-310-823-9358
OrgTechEmail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
# ARIN WHOIS database, last updated 2003-06-23 21:05
# Enter ? for additional hints on searching ARIN's WHOIS database.
End
Assuming that 172.16.0.8 and 172.16.0.4 are devices that are able to
route traffic, then you should be OK.
Guy
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Re: More on /etc/aliases forwarding wrong user
This may be simple.
I will guess that you have put otherdomain.dom in your
/etc/mail/local-host-names file.
If you added {IIRC} a Cwotherdomain.dom to your /etc/mail/sendmail.cf,
this would explain it as well.
If you are not using sendmail, I can't help you. I work for a large ISP
and Qmail just can't handle our requirements.
Guy
Tom Rymes wrote:
Well, so far the only progress I have made is determining that I
somehow opened up my mailserver as an open relayugh! That's solved
now, but still no movement on this issue as to forwarding.
The plot thickens here, because it seems that sendmail thinks it
processing mail for both of my domains. (which it isn't. I have two
separate mail servers) Anyway, when I sent an email from a user on my
RedHat box to a user at my other domain, I get an undeliverable
message. The most intriguing part of which is:
- Transcript of session follows -
... while talking to [127.0.0.1]:
My RedHat machine thinks that my other domain is hosted at 127.0.0.1.
This is not the case, and is not a DNS issue, b/c everything works
fine at my other domain. I double checked /etc/hosts and there is no
errant entry there, and a quick grep of the sendmail.cf file reveals
no otherdomain.dom entries there. Any ideas here?
To recap, any mail forwarded to [EMAIL PROTECTED] is actually
delivered to [EMAIL PROTECTED] If I send mail from the
RedHat machine to a [EMAIL PROTECTED] and that username does
not exist on the redhat machine, the mail fails to be delivered. If
the username does exist locally, then it is delivered to the redhat
machine, NOT the other domain's mailserver. Obviously I screwed
somethign up here by accidentally keying my other domain name on the
redhat machine. however, I have no idea where that would be
Thank you for any info, or tips as to where I should look for help...
Tom
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Re: mysterious routes appearing
Oops :-{
Check to see if you are running ;
routed, gated or zebra.
They are all routing deamons, I know someone asked if you were running
RIP or OSPF.
IIRC all three support RIP, but I think gated and zebra support other
routing protocols as well like
IGRP.
As root, check what network services you are running with :
netstat --inet -lp
---sample---
Proto Recv-Q Send-Q Local Address Foreign Address
State PID/Program name
tcp0 0 *:printer *:*
LISTEN 606/lpd Waiting
tcp0 0 *:x11 *:*
LISTEN 879/X
tcp0 0 *:webmin*:*
LISTEN 813/perl
tcp0 0 *:ssh *:*
LISTEN 570/sshd
tcp0 0 *:postgres *:*
LISTEN 700/postmaster
tcp0 0 localhost.localdom:smtp *:*
LISTEN 637/sendmail: accep
udp0 0 *:webmin
*:* 813/perl
udp0 0 *:bootps
*:* 618/dhcpd
udp0 0 mashed.bananas.nut:ntp
*:* 590/ntpd
udp0 0 squishy.tomatos.nut:ntp
*:* 590/ntpd
udp0 0 localhost.localdoma:ntp
*:* 590/ntpd
udp0 0 *:ntp
*:* 590/ntpd
raw0 0 *:icmp *:*
7 618/dhcpd
---end---
RIP runs on {from /etc/services}:
router 520/udp route routed# RIP
Maybe this will be helpfull :-)
Guy
Iain Buchanan wrote:
On Wed, 2003-06-25 at 00:22, Guy Fraser wrote:
Hi
I will annotate the routes in question for you.
[snip]
Thanks for the help, but you explained the ones I already know! As I
mentioned, the three routes that are ok are:
The ok routes are obviously 2, 4 & 5.
172.16.0.0 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.0 U 0 00 eth0
127.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 255.0.0.0 U 0 00 lo
0.0.0.0 172.16.0.4 0.0.0.0 UG0 00 eth0
the 'others' are 1 & 3:
203.16.234.0172.16.0.8 255.255.255.0 UG0 00 eth0
203.39.28.0 172.16.0.4 255.255.255.0 UG0 00 eth0
Its these two that I can't get rid of which is a nuisance, as they were
ok once but now I don't want them.
It should be in /etc somewhere.. grep -r 203.16.234 /etc 2>/dev/null
By the way David, I tried this the other day as well, but nothing came
up... grep seemed to 'hang' though, so I'll try again :(
I think that if you are having connectivity problems
I'm not :) except for the routes that I can't get rid of
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Re: Getting LXR to work...
LXR seems like an neet tool. Which version are you trying to build? I have written many cgi programs and am willing to help, but need to know what source needs to be fixed. Guy Vladimir G. Ivanovic wrote: After much work, I have gotten to the point where LXR (the Linux CrossReferencer: http://lxr.linux.no) is almost working. Instead of seen rendered HTML, I'm seening raw HTTP/HTML, like: HTTP/1.0 200 OK Last-Modified: Fri, 7 Aug 2003 19:34:38 GMT Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Linux 2.4.18 identfier search http://localhost/lxr/";;> ... It's got to be something simple! Any help would be appreciated. What do I have to change to get LXR to work? Thanks --- Vladimir Vladimir G. Ivanovichttp://leonora.org/~vladimir 2770 Cowper St. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Palo Alto, CA 94306-2447 +1 650 678 8014 -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: How can I re-register with RHN.
Thank you all. I figured it out, after listing the files in the up2date package I found a command to register with and using the --force option made it work. Guy Joe Klemmer wrote: On Thu, 2002-10-24 at 20:49, Guy Fraser wrote: The problem is : There is NO freekin "rhn_register"! The functionality is now in up2date. Just "man up2date" and you'll get all the info.
Pan Keeps locking my machine.
Hi
I started to use pan this morning and it keeps locking my machine up.
My machine has:
P4 1.5GHz
1GB Ram
240GB on 4 IDE drives
24/12/40 CD-RW
8x DVD-ROM
1.5Mbps ADSL with a static ip address {no dhcp}.
When the machine locks up the mouse nad keyboard are un-usable. I don't have a
second machine to try and ssh to see what might be wrong remotely.
I have shut down all services except;
at,autofs,cron,iptables,kudzu,ntpd,rhnsd,sendmail and ssh.
The firewall only allows ntp,ssh and dns.
The machine runs fine and is completely "up2date".
The only "problem" I have run into is this stupid pan lockup.
Guy
GUI Complaints
Hi
I like the way the new GUI looks, but looks are not everything.
The task list sucks! You get one icon per application, so no dialog boxes show
up, nor do any secondary windows.
The mouse scope sucks! You can't set the amount of time to raise a window so
if you have the scope set to raise windows automaticly the dialog boxes get
lowered immediatly because the dialog box or secondary windows do not pop up
under the mouse pointer.
The file manager has weird behavior.
1) When in a directory with images the thumbnails show up, but when you double
click the image {bmp,ppm} the stupid thing says it has no image viewer or
somthing like that, but "eog" is in the right click menu, and does display the
image. If you can render a thumbnail, one would hope you could display the image.
2) The mime/application support sucks! You can not add applications or change
the defaults. It would be nice to be able to set the default action, viewer
and editor, or make alternate selections to what the defaults are.
3) It would be nice to be able to select gqview {if installed} as an alternate
viewer/explorer.
4) When moving or copying graphics it would be nice to see thumnails of the
conflicting files, so it is easier to determine if they should be replaced or
skiped.
The *sad thing* about these issues is that they were all, except the 4th issue
about the file manager but it is in gqview, available before.
Is the window manager still sawfish?
Is there a way I can get the old behaviors back without having to wait for
these to be addressed.
Guy
Re: utility to scan through images like "ee" used to do?
Hi You can get gqview to display thumbnails in the file selector, but I am not sure if thats what you wanted. Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: in previous releases, i recall using "ee" to quickly arrow through a directory of image files and have each one pop up, reduced size, on the right where i could decide if i wanted to see it full size. this was a really convenient feature, and one that seems to be missing from "eog". is there another image viewing program that has this feature? that is, one that comes with RH 8.0, rather than just downloading ee? rday
Re: Cyrillic русский язык
It looks like Cyrillic text to me, I am using Mozilla. Since starting to use Mozilla I have seen many different character types, from fonts I didn't even think I had installed, like korean, japaneese, and chinese as well as cyrillic, and greek. I can't read any of it so it is just gobbledegook to me anyway. The only english stuff I could see in the message snipped out below. Guy Mark C wrote: On Wed, 2002-10-30 at 21:24, Curtis Vaughan wrote: ÷ÏÐÒÏÓ Õ ÍÅÎÑ ÔÁËÏÊ. ...snip... RH8 ...snip... OpenOffice ...snip... Is it only me or has this come out as a complete mess? Mark
Re: Pan Keeps locking my machine.
Ahh Hah
I discovered a problem with pan.
I discovered that there were more problems than just pan, my networking seemed
slow overall. I diagnosed the problem to be latency caused by packet loss. I
called my ISP and they discovered that my DSL connection was loosing packets.
They quickly contacted the telephone company and had the problem resolved. Pan
started to work fine without locking up my machine. Then yesterday Pan started
to lockup my machine again. I used 'mtr -n news...' to trackdown the problem.
There was no packet loss but there was higher than normal latencey at one of
the hops on the way to news server. Later on the latency disapeared and Pan
started working properly again.
It appears as though pan has some problem that may be causing it to deplete
the machines resouces when it runs into a slow connection.
Has anyone else noticed this?
Are people with dialup able to use pan successfully?
Is there a way to increase the server timeout?
It could be possible that the server is resetting the connection if too many
sockets are spawned, but pan should be able to work around reset connections
should it not.
Guy
Guy Fraser wrote:
Hi
I started to use pan this morning and it keeps locking my machine up.
My machine has:
P4 1.5GHz
1GB Ram
240GB on 4 IDE drives
24/12/40 CD-RW
8x DVD-ROM
1.5Mbps ADSL with a static ip address {no dhcp}.
When the machine locks up the mouse nad keyboard are un-usable. I don't
have a second machine to try and ssh to see what might be wrong remotely.
I have shut down all services except;
at,autofs,cron,iptables,kudzu,ntpd,rhnsd,sendmail and ssh.
The firewall only allows ntp,ssh and dns.
The machine runs fine and is completely "up2date".
The only "problem" I have run into is this stupid pan lockup.
Guy
Re: Virtual PC
I used to use VMware, it is great, but is now fairly expensive.
I have had success installing programs using wine on RH 8.0.
NOTE: There is a trick to make it work.
First thing you have to do is add your logon to group "wine", then log out and
log back in. You can now access "/usr/share/wine-c", which is what the default
install of wine believes to be your "C:" drive.
Next put in the software CD and when it is mounted ; cd /mnt/cdrom
Next in the install folder, often the cd's root, run ; wine setup.exe
The software should install under "/usr/share/wine-c/Program Files" by default.
To run the software type :
wine "/usr/share/wine-c/Program Files/{programsfolder}/{program.exe}"
Where {programsfolder} = the folder the program is installed in under
"Program Files" and {program.exe} is the name of the executable program.
Example//
wine "/usr/share/wine-c/Program Files/Claris Corp/FileMaker Pro 4.0/FileMaker
Pro.exe"
{All supposed to be on one line}
or
wine /usr/share/wine-c/Program\ Files/Claris\ Corp/FileMaker\ Pro\
4.0/FileMaker\ Pro.exe
{All supposed to be on one line}
NOTE: Paths and commands with a " " space must have the " " escaped or double
quotes must be around the path and command.
Guy
Dan Clowater wrote:
Well I know there is wine - but I have had no real luck getting anything
to work well with it. Is there a way to run a virtual windows session -
much like wabi was on Solaris, or Virtual PC on the mac? Perhaps I am a
dufas and doing something wrong... so any suggestions would be
groovetastic! ...where'd that come from? LOL
Thanks
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Re: Why you should not buy Promise products if you use Linux
Hi I checked some things out and from what I can tell, the 3Ware card is the best overall with linux support, and is priced well. The card has a cpu on board that handles the I/O so the cpu on your motherboard doesn't have to. I believe it has a scsi driver and works like a scsi raid controller. 3Ware also has software for linux to monitor and maintain the raid using a browser, and can be configured to email someone if there are any problems. At ~ $120 US for an IDE RAID 0,1,10,5,JBOD controller that supports hotswap and hotspare it is a great deal. I will certainly be getting 3Ware in the future and maybe even just to replace some other solutions we are currently using. Guy Dan de Haan wrote: Out of curiosity, has anyone here used the Adaptec 2400A? Is this also a "software" RAID card? I haven't used it, but It is a hardware RAID card. There was a article published recently comparing soe hardware RAID cards, including the 2400A. You can see it at: http://tech-report.com/reviews/2002q4/ideraid/index.x?pg=1 -Dan -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Xinetd Redirect Problems
Why bother with a redirect, just run your sshd with a "-p 21" option.
Guy
Greg Gatlin wrote:
I updated my xinetd to the newest version with up2date and my redirect is
no longer functioning.
I upgraded to xinetd-2.3.7-5.
My redirect is so I can get to my box from work. They block port 22 and
leave 21 open.
Here is my xinetd configuration that worked before the upgrade:
service ssh-ftp
{
disable= no
port = 21
protocol = tcp
flags = REUSE
socket_type= stream
wait = no
user = root
redirect = 10.0.0.25 22
}
I have tried many different combinations, xinetd will not open port 21
unless I specify a service in the definition.
It is not the firewall.
I installed anonftp and xinetd opened port 21.
I changed sshd to listen on port 21, xinetd opened port 21.
Did something change that I need to add to the configuration?
I scoured xinetd.org and didn't find any clues.
Thanks,
GREG
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